TM2YC

Finished 'The Sea Devils' and it was very good. After having been put off watching Pertwee's Doctor (Probably watched him the least out of the lot) by his silly haircut, his silly clothes,

and me always associating him more with the brilliant and comic Wurzel Gummage,

I have to say I'm totally won over. It's the way he fixes weak willed human officials with his steely and withering gaze that I liked best. He's got a fine line in dry humour and his fencing duel with The Master was ace:

(FYI the Lightsabers aren't in the original show)

The plot was a bit slow to get going but rapidly accelerated towards an action packed conclusion. All the 16mm location footage and battle scenes courtesy of The Royal Navy were impressive but kinda underlined the cheap looking interior scenes shot on video. Delgado is great as The Master, very calm, very evil and quite serious... the exact oposite of Simm's take really (Still prefer Ainley's mischievous interpretation). Although he was upstaged by Robert Walker's ruthless politician character, who managed to seem more evil just by ordering sandwiches with a smile.

Now started watching Pertwee's first serial 'Spearhead from space'. It looks fabulous having the unique privlege of being shot entirely on film (Not video and film, as was standard). Plus this has the added bonus that all the location sound has the echo of reality lending the show a documentary realism. I always get a little jolt of excitement when a new Doctor picks out his wardrobe. I knew it was coming when a random guy hung a silk cape on the back of a door.

NeverarGreat said:

In the Death Star fight between Obi-wan and Vader, there's one wide shot where they do a really fast back-and-forth. That to me looked like the most realistic depiction of a lightsaber battle. But in all three OT swordfights, there was always one participant who didn't want to end it. In the Vader/Obi-wan fight, Obi-wan didn't want to be aggressive, and it didn't look like Vader wanted to kill him. In Luke/Vader on Bespin, Vader was clearly toying with Luke. And in Return of the Jedi, neither Luke nor Vader wanted to kill the other, so I can understand why the swordfights were slower than in the prequels.

 ^ That right there is exactly why they were so good. Because you are able to talk about the emotions and motivations behind them, they actually meant something to you.

I'd be hard pressed to read anything about what was going on in the minds of Kenobi, Qui Gon or Maul in the Theed duel. It started, it went on for too long and it ended... that's about all I could tell you about it.

Whenever good screen deuls are mentioned, this one from Rob Roy...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVaslN1NiT0

and any fight from Ridley Scott's 'The Duellists'...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhwIrONyEzg

...seem to be thought to be the best and most realistic, by the professionals.

Which always had me thinking if Liam Neeson has experienced the best, he must have been depressingly aware of how awful TPM's choreography was.

btw both were done by William Hobbs, who has also done work on Game Of Thrones.

I think the duel from ANH could have been alot more dynamic. Not faster or more elaborate, it just would have been nice if it had taken place across the tractor beam generator platform or something... rather than a random empty corridor. It would also have added an extra element of tension as Ben would be fighting Vader to prevent him reactivating the tractor beam, so Luke could escape on the Falcon.

DuracellEnergizer said:

Ryan McAvoy said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Alien vs. Predator (2004) - 0.57/10

Think you misplaced the decimal point. ^ Corrected ;-)

LOL. I've only rated it as high as I did because I liked the set design.

 Is it? I can't remember. What made it hurt for me, was that you could still detect trace elements of the first superior comic book...

...buried in the setup/script beneath a billion rewrites and watered down budget based revisions. That ^ comic is even drawn like a film, almost storyboard like with Alien-movie like dialogue. Kinda like Dances-with-Predators meets a John Ford Western, produced by Ridley Scott. The tech design was first class, from the spaceships to the upgraded Predator armour, it all had that classic Syd Mead/Moebius feel. Would be awesome if they adapted that one day. I really wanted to see Machiko and Broken-Tusk go back to back against some Aliens on the big screen,

It would've been an expensive film though, I'm guessing. This was the same story novelised...

Yes, using "Apprentice" or "Pupil" would be preferable.

Oddly enough I'm hoping JJ is gonna 'troll' the SW community sometime later this year by releasing early fake footage/script of Jar-Jar being in it or Luke discussing mediclorians. At least then I'd know JJ is telling us what he wouldn't touch with a barge pole ;-)

DuracellEnergizer said:

Alien vs. Predator (2004) - 0.57/10

 Think you misplaced the decimal point. ^ Corrected ;-)

"Flaws and "could-have-been-done-betters" in the OT" aka "The over thinking things thread"

;-)

3PO is fussy, panicky, self important etc but in the OT he's never dumb. In ESB he repeatedly tries to tell Han vital information and gets ignored, in an ESB deleted scene he sets a trap for Stormtroopers (But that doesn't count), he tries to talk sense into Chewbacca who is intent on killing Lando etc. In ROTJ he negotiates with the Ewoks for their help which arguably has more to do with the victory over the Empire than anything Leia does (Again with Han undermining him).

In the PT he was a clown, worse than that he was a fourth wall defying comedian delivering bad puns in AOTC. In TPM and ROTS he does jack sh*t.

“He says it's nothing, sir. Merely a malfunction. Old data. Pay it no mind.”

3PO know that he is lying to Luke ^ when he says this, he saw Leia giving R2 the message a few hours before. Then as soon as Luke leaves the room (To go have some blue milk) he admonishes R2 for not trusting Luke. If he is saying to R2 "He's our new master, we can trust him" this demonstates he knew R2 wasn't telling the truth to Luke.

So I can't understand why people see a contradiction in the mention of the princess in private and then the denial later on in front of Luke (Who they just met).

RicOlie_2 said:

Personally I'm happy with Adywan's fix (changing it to "There'll be no escape this time"). A more major plot point I think could've been better is Darth Vader's character. I think he should have been like he was in ESB the whole time. In ANH he isn't the scary, domineering Sith Lord who kills those who dissatisfy him.

 Totally

RicOlie_2 said:

How did that merit a double facepalm?

 Fast LS duels are one of the many flaws with the PT, slow and talky LS duels are exactly what is right with the OT.

So it's not only, not a flaw but it's actually a highlight, hence the double nature of that facepalm.

(I was joking as well)

but on the topic...

Lucas made the first half of ANH slow as hell on purpose because he didn't think people would be able to follow the story. We all had no problem and loved the film so it's a shame he wasn't more bold and cut out about 15 minutes from the start (All the time spent on Tatooine) and used that extra quarter hour adventuring aboard the Death Star with Leia.

I'd kill for an extra 15 minutes of Leia bickering with Han, Leia insulting Chewbacca, Leia shooting stormtroopers, Leia talking all over Luke and generally shouting orders and being badass.

vacuum said:

liked to have seen the faster duel of luke and vader that they originally rehearsed  for empire.

ISIHAC does Star Wars vs Oscar Wilde live (From about 17 mins in)...

http://youtu.be/UwMdXPtPSd4?t=16m34s

emanswfan said:

I apologize for the massive compression artifacts in both screenshots, not representative of final product.

First is screenshot from the ROTS technicolor duel clip, compared with my new version still WIP.

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/57531

Really happy with this, finally getting rid of that ugly teal and getting even closer to an OT look.  Plus, I think this looks even less digital for sure.

 "Goood, gooood"

Yes way more OT. :-)

Yer no specific sample in mind, maybe some muchies based movie like Dude where's my car or harold and Kumar may have something. Or perhaps Seinfeld?

doubleofive said:

Since ANHRSEHD will more than likely be sourced from the Blu-ray, this will not be a problem.

 Is it just me or does "ANHRSEHD" look like a new swear word?

You could use the above idea ^ in the scene where Mace comes to arrest Palpatine.

He could be ordering food to the office. We could hear just the end of the kid from Domino's on the phone saying "How many chicken wings is that again sir...?" and Palpatine says "Order 66". Then Mace interupts.

But you could use that gag in several places whenever an underling asks Palpatine anything. Use the flower scene from the Room "A dozen red roses"... "No, order 66" etc etc

Yeah but if you cast Stoltz as Luke he'd only get replaced by my suggestion a week into production ;-)

Marty Feldman as Yoda, yes, yes and yes. Couldn't find any mockups but he did play Gollum apparently...

also, Scatman Crothers as Mace Windu (Scatman breaksdown and cries when Lucas makes him do 40 takes of Mace telling Anakin he will not be trained):

Joe Turkel as Grand Moff Tarkin:

Tarking blows up Alderaan...

Leia - "And you call yourselves Human?"

Tarkin "'More human than human' is our motto"

LMAO

and Shelley Duvall as Princess Leia (This would have been genuinely awesome IMO):

(See what I did there)

^ Wow thanks for that Bingowings, very interesting stuff.

I'll have to watch the serials that lead up to The Sea Devils...

Terror of the Autons
The Mind of Evil
The Claws of Axos
Colony in Space
The Dæmons

I'm raiding my local library's Dr Who DVD collection (They've got a few of the above at least). I'll get The Master's debut in 'Terror of the Autons' on my next trip.

DuracellEnergizer said:

Can I go for the gusto and choose actors that weren't even born/adults/still alive when the OT was made, or do I have to limit myself to actors who could have realistically been in the OT?

 F*ck realism.

Lon Chaney, Jr as Chewbacca:

Bingowings, you seem to be the guy to ask (Given your Whovian knowledge and current Avatar):

I started watching 'The Sea Devils' this afternoon for the first time (Not seen a great deal of Pertwee serials to be honest) and I was very surprised (Perhaps even shocked) by the friendly way The Master greats The Doctor and Joe and they seem to like him in return. I thought they were mortal enemies? (I know they weren't back in the early days on Gallifrey).

I'm more familiar with the later 80s Master who was often cheeky and full of mischief but never friendly with The Doctor. Can you elaborate on what serials came before 'The Sea Devils' and what changed afterwards to the character?

btw I noticed 'Irish Jabba' aka Declan Mulholland is in it...

It was his very distinctive staccato Northern-Irish voice I spotted rather than the face, but it is him.

Andre the Giant gets my casting vote ;-) and nice Spaceballs trivia.

What about...?

K-9 as R2D2:

Freddie Mercury as Biggs Darklighter:

Kevin Peter Hall as Boba Fett:

Orion slave girl as Tatooine slave girl:

Elizabeth McGovern (Downton Abbey 2013) as Leia:

Toshiro Mifune (Red Beard 1965) as Ben:

Prince (Under a Cherry Moon 1986) as Lando:

Oliver Reed (Sitting Target 1972) as Han:

Michael J. Fox (Secret of My Success 1987) as Luke:

and Michael J. Fox (Teen Wolf 1985) as Chewbacca.

Peter Wyngarde (Flash Gordon 1980) as Vader:

Can anybody else think of better?

Oliver Reed would have been fantastic as Han, I can totally imagine him delivering the "Kid, I've flown from one side of this galaxy..." line.

Before the prequels I'd always thought Palpatine's appearance was down to the Darkside eating away at his body across the decades like Gollum in LOTR.

The PT could've gone down the Sauron route where he once had the ability to take on a more friendly visage to decieve people.