I’m really sad to hear this about oojason. I’ll always remember our fun back and forths on the main forum and the few times we talked in messages. I hope you come back but it doesn’t look like that’s in the cards right now. I wish you all the best, Jason. Thank you for your kindness and teaching me things. Your absence will be felt.
The Saragossa Manuscript by Wojciech Has.
It’s a Polish surrealist fantasy film. It’s hard to get into as I’m not entirely sure I understand it as I’m quite a newbie to surrealism. It will definitely take repeat viewings I think as the first half of the film is mostly fluid but it gets more and more complex in the second half. It’s a story within a story of another story and another after that. It’s very beautifully made and very intriguing despite these things. The music in particular was very beautiful. It’s just a very difficult film to explain in concrete terms as it’s very abstract. I’d recommend though.
Fun Fact: It’s a favourite film of Jerry Garcia from Grateful Dead, Francis Ford Coppola, Martin Scorsese, David Lynch, and Luis Buñuel.
So film historian (and maker of an original trilogy doc, I think - definitely heard his name before) Jamie Benning has been tweeting about our mysterious lava man today, saying it’s been 40 years today since it was filmed before quickly being abandoned. Here’s the initial tweet, and I’l copy and paste from another below:
https://twitter.com/jamieswb/status/1485939204391587845?s=20
“For the role, stunt coord Peter Diamond was dressed in a racing driver’s jumpsuit rigged up with a plethora of
lighbulbs and plugged into the electricity supply. The suit and the glow of the bulbs made it difficult for him to manouevre.”Here is some concept art somebody found:
I don’t have the sources for these but they seem accurate to me.
Great find. Here’s some further information I just found from searching your image. The image is included here too.
Interview with Peter Diamond.
Interviewer: What’s the most dangerous stunt you yourself performed in a Star Wars film? How about the most dangerous stunt by anyone on your team on a Star Wars film?
Peter Diamond: My most dangerous stunt wasn’t even in the Return of the Jedi final cut – Jabba’s palace, I was dressed as a “Lightman.” I had over 100 electric bulbs attached to my body and had to walk across set. The heat was unbearable and I always had the problem of tripping up over the many wires attached to me as I could not see. The most dangerous stunt by any crew was in Return of the Jedi – the double for Han Solo fell off of Jabba’s barge and his harness snapped breaking his legs as he fell into the pit.
And to follow up he also said …
All I can say is that I remember wearing a racing drivers jumpsuit, getting covered in hundreds of tiny light bulbs and plugged into the electricity supply. I had my face covered in them too so I didn’t need special creature make-up because the glow blocked out my face. I was then told to walk past the camera as it pans around Jabba’s palace which I found very difficult to do because of the heat and the cables hanging off the back of me.
Source: https://starwarz.com/tbone/inside-jabbas-palace/
So many great tidbits here on the behind the scenes at Jabba’s Palace.
Paris, Texas by Wim Wenders.
It was such a really good film. Heartwrenching in ways and a lot to contemplate in other ways. It’s very beautifully shot and told. It’s definitely a film that I feel will get better and better with further contemplation and rewatches. I love how it dealt with memory and how relationships between family and the ones we love aren’t always black and white. As well as the difficulties we put on those closest to us. And of course the little boy was so delightful. It was so unexpected to hear subtle Star Wars references in the film. Haha
Fun Fact: It was Kurt Cobain’s favourite film.
Very interesting topic for discussion.
I think you pretty much nailed it. It’s the style that is different. Not only the Original Trilogy but the Prequels as well were all shot in a documentary film style told most often through the point of view of R2-D2. The Sequels forget this established grammar or chose not to use this rule. They followed their own filming grammar to convey the worlds we see and explore. It’s also about rhythm I find as so much of the Sequels is about getting from Point A to B in seconds. Things don’t stay at one part of the story long before we’re onto the next plot thread. Things don’t breathe or happen gradually but instead in a way that doesn’t give us time to establish or know the environments we’re in or the characters.
The Force Awakens in particular I find is very guilty of this. It takes Finn like two minutes to get to Rey. Even The Last Jedi has this problem to an extent as it took Finn and Rose a couple of minutes once they arrived at the casino to find the Master Codebreaker as they stopped looking and BB-8 finds him. On the opposite side of things it took Han time to find Luke. You felt the passage of time and the struggle to find him on Hoth. The same thing with Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon, and Jar Jar travelling to Theed. You could feel the wonder and sense of discovery with the characters. You don’t get that sense of knowing where you are with the Sequels. The Last Jedi I find gets it right sometimes but in a different style to that of the first six films. J.J.'s films are too rushed and more like any other genetic Hollywood action film. That’s not even close to the style of Star Wars.
It will feel different because it is different. The films aren’t shot in the same way anymore. They’re shot how the director of said project wants them shot. They’re not in the established style George set up and executed.
Some information about Obi-wan Kenobi teased in this article by Star Wars Sessions, who claim to have sources close to the projects. (I didn’t think it was suitable for the rumours thread, as there’s nothing specific - just stuff to hype you up for the series)
https://starwarssessions.co.uk/2022/01/21/exclusive-details-regarding-obi-wan-kenobi-and-andor/
EXCLUSIVE DETAILS REGARDING OBI-WAN KENOBI AND ANDOR by Matt HudsonRegarding Obi-wan Kenobi, they claim ‘the studio is “raving about Kenobi” (whereas the chatter around The Book of Boba Fett has been muted in comparison). They are going as far as to say that Obi-Wan Kenobi is “being billed as the biggest Star Wars event of the past few years and the next few years also”.’
The source also says “All generations of fans will be catered for…this is truly transitional Star Wars”.” This lines up with what we’ve heard about potential Clone Wars flashbacks, with the characters being closer to their versions in the original trilogy, and perhaps an Inquisitor cameo or two from Star Wars Rebels as well.
That’s my friend’s podcast! I’m hoping he has some inside information as I’d like to experience something that can bring me back to taking baby steps to watching some live action content. This sounds promising if true.
By definition Disney Star Wars is fanfiction because it isn’t from George Lucas. So i’m not surprised.
I haven’t seen Book of Boba Fett it or Mando for that matter beyond the Luke Skywalker episode and the first season episode 1.
Filoniverse is fanfic its always been. Its never been on the level of Star Wars 1-6. Even though Disney elavated it to such a canon status.
By no means is that condemnation the EU was also fanfic and so is the new EU.
I think that only the works from Lucas should be seen as canon, even bad ones.
I like Filoni fanfiction to a certain degree. I enjoyed Clone Wars and Rebels.
I completely agree with you on all of this except The Clone Wars since Dave Filoni has said that George considered it part of his canon alongside Episodes I-VI. Sam Witwer has also confirmed multiple times these are George’s last Star Wars stories. So while I do think they have a lot of the Filoni touch to them and may not always be up to the quality of the films they’re still George’s stories.
I recommend these interviews. They’re very insightful.
Dave Filoni:
Sam Witwer:
Rebels is probably the only Disney era content I like without much stigma. It mostly all works for me and barely doesn’t. I hope to give Bad Batch a chance after I finish The Clone Wars.
I’m not brave enough for watching any further live action Disney Star Wars … currently.
Greig Fraser Discusses His Work On Rogue One: A Star Wars Story
The cinematographer for Denis Villeneuve’s Dune, and Matt Reeve’s The Batman, joins Industrial Light & Magic’s Publicity Group to discuss his work on Rogue One: A Star Wars Story. Greig shares how the early Kenner action figures inspired his love of Star Wars, and the influences he found in 1970s cinema, the works of Andrei Tarkovsky, and the film The French Connection.
I just bought The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings: Illustrated Editions. I’ve never read the series as I’ve only seen Peter Jackson’s film adaptation of The Fellowship of the Ring but I thought now was the time to finally give the books a chance. Especially before I continue with the films. I’m also really keen on getting into J.R.R. Tolkien as from everything I know about him I feel a sense of kinship. These versions of the books seemed like the best investment as Alan Lee who worked on the films did the art. They were a little on the expensive side but I’m really excited.
Added:
The Age of Innocence
Added the complete series of Mad About You, Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the Clones, The Sting, Knives Out, The Saragossa Manuscript, The Hourglass Sanatorium, and the Criterion version of The Age of Innocence.
Stalker
Mirror
Andrei Rublev
The Red Shoes
Nausicaa and the Valley of the Wind
Each for different reasons but each teleported me in hypnotic ways.
I actually agree AOTC is underrated. It feels strange saying that, because for the longest time it was my least favourite Star Wars movie (only dethroned by TROS). I still find it awkward to watch at times, and think parts are badly done, but there are MANY aspects of the basic story premise I think are fantastic. Mixing a romance plot with a detective plot in Star Wars, culminating in an epic display of visual effects in the climactic Battle of Geonosis, is great and I’ve come to respect the movie a lot more than I used to. It’s a very imaginative way to set in motion the rise of the Empire.
I think a lot of my distaste for it in past years comes from the visuals. I think both Coruscant and the interiors of Kamino looked too futuristic in the movie, but I’ve gotten used to those portrayals.
It was near the bottom for me too. There’s definitely some awkward moments here and there but they don’t bother me really too much. They mainly come I find in the beginning of the film when Anakin and Obi-Wan are talking about Padme when she’s asleep but things smooth out from there on out. I like the mixture of romance and detective story too.
That’s fair. I think one thing I love about the designs of both parts of the film is they’re direct homages to THX 1138 and American Graffiti.
Of course Mel’s Diner and Dex’s Diner too but I couldn’t find pictures of the exact shots I was looking for. There’s a lot of thematic and similarities between the films. In a lot of ways American Graffiti is the last night of innocence before the Vietnam War as Attack of the Clones is the last days of innocence before the Clone War. In THX 1138 they’re manufacturing their own repression. Just as in Attack of the Clones they’re doing the same thing.
The list of mirroring goes on and on and on. There’s a through line between all of his films. George didn’t change as much as I think people believe he did.
It was never done in a way where violence took precedence in a senseless way of being violent for the sake of it.
Actually, Ponda Baba’s bloody arm was added solely so the film would have a higher age rating of PG instead of G. Of course nowadays even PG is hardly ever used. Like why is TFA PG-13?
I was talking about post A New Hope when he became further aware of the impact the stories would have on children. It was actually Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru’s corpses that pushed the rating from G to PG.
It’s hard and not hard to say why The Force Awakens was rated PG-13 but part of me does wonder if it’s due to the backlash the Prequels got for their childlike tone at times. People would assume more with a PG-13 rating that things would be back to the more gritty tone of the first film, and it does have its share of moments in a way like Chewie’s bowcaster and Finn touching his dead friend when the blood shows on said friend’s helmet. It’s also in a lot of ways just as much social and cultural attitudes change. Take how Temple of Doom brought about PG-13 to begin with.
I’m very curious as to how Darth Maul would be portrayed as the “Godfather of Crime”. It sounds like such an interesting hook with the fall of the Hutts and Empire. It only makes sense that someone would try exploiting it to gain control over the Republic which is still very much rebuilding. I’m curious how he’d go about trying to exploit it and everything. We know bits and pieces but not enough to know anything definitive.
What does everyone have in mind for what this would look like?
Boba Fett being a crimelord makes more sense now, lol. The story that at one time, at the filming of Empire, Fett was planned to be the main bad guy for Return Of The Jedi seems cool. With the Emperor planned to be featured in the Sequel Trilogy.
lol, touchė. That’s very interesting. It seems like George evolved and developed the story further but with Darth Maul instead of using Boba Fett. He flipped things around a bit. It’s fun discovering things that were early concepts that got used later in different ways. Like the Lurmen were developed for Revenge of the Sith but instead were in The Clone Wars or the countless amount of designs in Rebels inspired by Ralph McQuarrie. Stories grow and evolve as they change.
So hyped! I’m really conflicted though about if I should get it on Switch or PS4. Does anyone know how big of an upscale the Switch version will be on TV play? I don’t know if I want to miss out on the best graphics possible with how stunning it looks. Yet I also love the potential of playing handheld when I’m not home.
It’s funny you should mention the Star Destroyer. That’s the part I’m stuck at even now years later. How do you bring it down with all of the TIE Fighters attacking?
There should be plenty of youtube videos/walkthroughs, I think I reffered to a written guide back when I played it… You will beat that Star Destroyer, just keep at it! ^^
The easy way to do it is to take breaks in between pulling down the destroyer to deal with the TIEs, and then, once enough are gone, it should be easy enough to fully take down the Destroyer before the next squadron arrives.
At least, that’s how I did it.
Thank you both so much for the encouragement and advice on how to do it. I appreciate it. I’ll have to buy a new controller sometime and try again.
This might just be my favourite bit of Star Wars music I’ve heard and discovered lately.
Jedi Master Aayla Secura - Kevin Kiner
There’s something so mystical and pure about it like it’s from an age where life was new and there wasn’t thought of dark times or mindset.
He meant human heroes killing many human villains. They very purposely didn’t do it much after A New Hope. It became mainly faceless and non human characters in the later films.
No, he didn’t. As I quoted George again in my post:
George Lucas: Yeah, we very consciously didn’t kill very many humans in those movies.
The facts in the “movies” (plural) themselves prove they also did do this after Star Wars (1977).
George forgets the title of his films are “Star Wars”, and also the more bloodshed content in them.
He wants to play down some of the violence in them as he aged, had a family, and maybe wants to leave a moral legacy behind.
Looking for justifications for his retcons and false claims is not new to him.I will not derail your thread further as this is about the many differing and changing incarnations of his Sequel Trilogy, including the times George said they did not exist and never existed, other than his previous vague claims and ideas.
“When writing the movies, I tried to make sure that aliens and droids got killed, but not people.”
I think he implied as much. The only human hero to human villain killing after A New Hope were Anakin/Darth Vader and Luke versus Palpatine where Palpatine dies, Mace Windu versus Jango Fett where Jango dies, Anakin and Obi-Wan versus Count Dooku where Dooku dies, and with villain killing - Mace Windu versus Palpatine where Mace dies.
The violence in his films was always done consciously and its purpose within the narrative always came first. It was never done in a way where violence took precedence in a senseless way of being violent for the sake of it. That’s what he’s trying to say I think. He thought very much of the psychological effects his films would have on children especially. He very purposely held back on letting things stray too far into senseless.
Anyways, you’re right. No need to stop the thread from continuing as George’s Sequel Trilogy.
I’m very curious as to how Darth Maul would be portrayed as the “Godfather of Crime”. It sounds like such an interesting hook with the fall of the Hutts and Empire. It only makes sense that someone would try exploiting it to gain control over the Republic which is still very much rebuilding. I’m curious how he’d go about trying to exploit it and everything. We know bits and pieces but not enough to know anything definitive.
What does everyone have in mind for what this would look like?
George Lucas: When writing the movies, I tried to make sure that aliens and droids got killed, but not people.
Paul Duncan: A lot of stormtroopers died.
George Lucas: That’s right, but you didn’t know they were people. We did kill three humans and that was unfortunate. I was always bothered by it.
Paul Duncan: When was that?
George Lucas: On the Death Star, when Han and Luke go into the prison with Chewie to rescue Leia, they shoot three Imperial guys. The guards drew their guns and fired first, but it’s still a shame.
Paul Duncan: Really?
George Lucas: Yeah, we very consciously didn’t kill very many humans in those movies.
Sorry for going a little off topic, but George Lucas’ quotes in the OP reek of him spouting revisionist rubbish yet again! Unless there is yet another Special Edition coming out sometime soon where no humans die in the Original Trilogy?
George Lucas: “We did kill three humans and that was unfortunate. I was always bothered by it.”
So it was four human Imperials that were killed on-screen in Detention Block AA-23!:
Not forgetting:
There are probably more on-screen human fatalities in the Battle Of Yavin, these are just gifs I quickly found.
There are also probably more ‘people’ dying on-screen just in 1977’s Star Wars too, let alone Empire and Jedi.George Lucas: Yeah, we very consciously didn’t kill very many humans in those movies.
Sure George. Sure.
I love George for creating all this, but how can we believe the things he says given his long history of being loose with facts and the truth, and also making many false claims and retcons.
If he published or released every note, written down idea, scrawls or scripts for the Sequels over the decades, even when he was claiming “there is no VI, VIII & IX. There never has been.”, would anyone believe them without fact-checking or cross-referencing beforehand? Not many would, I think.
He meant human heroes killing many human villains. They very purposely didn’t do it much after A New Hope. It became mainly faceless and non human characters in the later films.
Nah. Star Wars doesn’t have the same Christian undertones as LotR. The Force is modelled more off Eastern traditions.
There’s a lot and more of a Western tradition than you’d think.
The Mortis Gods = Holy Trinity.
Anakin’s Birth = Virgin Mary.
Anakin and Padme Sharing Fruit = Adam and Eve.
Anakin and Luke = Sins and Temptations of the Father and Son.
Etc. Etc.
It’s funny you should mention the Star Destroyer. That’s the part I’m stuck at even now years later. How do you bring it down with all of the TIE Fighters attacking?
I should really try playing it again. I don’t really remember the story all that well but I do remember really liking it and Juno Eclipse as a character.
Really though, poor Shaak Ti. She can’t catch a break. Starkiller, Anakin, and Grievous. She either can cheat death and is who Palpatine was talking about in Revenge of the Sith or she has multiple clones roaming the galaxy. Haha
The other night I watched Jedi Crash and Defenders of Peace. I loved the episodes. They were so lovely and beautiful. The atmosphere, music, and characters all worked. Aayla Secura has truly become my favourite minor Jedi. Is it just me or does Tee Watt Kaa remind anyone else of Mr. Miyagi from Karate Kid? At least I find they are in look. Most of all I loved that the arc was devoted to pacifism. It’s honestly been just what I needed to feel that special Star Wars feeling I had as a kid and it’s helped me see that my story ideas for what I’m writing are possible too.
I have to agree with you, jedi_bendu. Rebels is certainly underrated. I don’t love it as much as The Clone Wars but I do think it’s up there as my favourite content of the Disney era. I love how it expands on the Force with Bendu and The World Between Worlds. I also love seeing Darth Maul as a Dark Side master. His death at the hands of Obi-Wan truly made me cry. I never thought I’d cry with him but I did. The Ghost crew is great too. I love how each of them play a role and have different strengths and weaknesses. All and all it’s a fun watch with some good wisdom here and there. I think it helps that Dave Filoni has so much admiration and respect for George. I feel it truly shows. Same with the art design being inspired heavily and taken from Ralph McQuarrie. It is pretty cool to see.
I will also add a vote for Attack of the Clones. It’s not a perfect film but I think over time it’s become one of my favourites in the series. The film is more about the atmosphere it creates and less about the narrative. It’s the calm before the storm. There’s so much going on beneath the surface. Some of my favourite things are how the planets all contrast different and similar ideals. Coruscant has grown commercial, Tatooine is wretched hive of scum and villainy, Kamino is dehumanizing, Geonosis is manufacturing, and Naboo is still idealistic and idyllic. You see it with the gungans conversing with each other outside of the palace. They found their place with the surface dwellers after the Battle of Naboo. They live in harmony and as one society. I love the subtle nods like how Padme tells Anakin she’s relieved her term as queen wasn’t extended. This is contrasted by Palpatine who is staying in office long after his expired. There’s also Ki-Adi-Mundi calling Dooku a “political idealist” while years later we have Obi-Wan call the Clone War an “idealistic crusade”. The Clone War was just that. It was a war rooted in different ideals and beliefs not being able to coexist. It’s interesting seeing really how the Separatists in a lot of ways are the Rebel Alliance but on opposite sides of the spectrum. Plus there’s how the arena is more or less the Roman Colosseum and Anakin is more lead by individualism than Luke later on.
All and all, it’s the little things. It’s a film about what you feel and not so much I find what you think. It’s more quieter and reflective like The Empire Strikes Back. It’s a film about the contrasting of the idealist and realist.
I also recently bought the DVD as I loss my disc two with bonus features years ago. I love the scenes with Padme and her family. I wish they had been included in the film but I understand why they were cut.
I’m sorta kinda back!
My detox away has been just what I needed. I think I’ve come to the conclusion that live action Star Wars isn’t for me anymore unless something truly catches my eye. I may give The Mandalorian, The Book of Boba Fett, and everything else that is out now and coming in live action a chance eventually but right now it’s just not doing anything for me.
That said, I’ve been watching The Clone Wars and in addition to giving me George’s last stories it’s helping me see that my bridge to Star Wars right now belongs to the cartoon universe as I really enjoy and love aspects of Rebels. I also love Droids and Ewoks. The big tests will be when I get to Bad Batch and Visions but I’m cautiously optimistic I’ve found my niche to stay involved in the fandom.
So here’s hoping and seeing where things go from here on out.
I think I need to take a step back from Star Wars to focus on my other interests and pursuits. Lately I’ve noticed I’ve become a bit too possessive over the films and stories that were and it’s contributing to my inability to fully let go. I’m sure I won’t be gone long but if anyone wants to message me feel free to do so as I’ll be back in the not to distant future to answer you and we can catch up on all of the things said. Stay safe and healthy, all. Have a happy Christmas season. May the Force be with you!
Just bought the Switch bundle with Mario Kart 8 Deluxe! I’m really so excited and looking forward to playing games I’ve not experienced since childhood as I’m planning to also add Pokemon Sword, The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wind, and Star Wars: Racer at some point too. It will be great to get Pokemon TV too!
