It you’re going for “whole Skywalker family” why not add Shmii and Padme?
Let’s add the whole Skywalker family, and also try to fit in the ST with Legends
ESB better fight, RotJ better story moment
Personally, however, I prefer the RotJ duel because of what’s at stake in the moment. The scene isn’t really about the physical fight itself. It’s a spiritual battle between Light and Dark. The sword swinging is really just a backdrop to the struggle in both Luke and Anakin’s hearts against the absolute evil of the Emperor. And I always get chills when Luke shouts “Never!” and the chilling music starts. The choir that sings both during Luke’s outburst and when Anakin is about to save his son is really stunning.
Me too! I also love the music - the weird synthesizer when Vader (holding Luke’s lightsaber BTW!) is looking for Luke in the shadows, then the chorus when Luke unleashes his anger.
Is that synth? I never noticed that.
I don’t like the way TROS handled things, but at least now there’s a good case to be made that things are different now, as opposed to after ROTJ.
That’s a fair point and I agree. But I don’t think the state of the galaxy post-TRoS is differentiated enough from RotJ for there to be a significant difference between Rey or Luke rebuilding the Jedi, or Poe or Leia rebuilding the Republic, or whatever comes next.
Maybe spinoff material can pick up the slack for TRoS, but I don’t think an Episode 10 should rely on ancillary media to be understood.
Episode 9 should have addressed how to build a new society, not just a New New Republic, and how it would avoid the flaws of the Republic that led to the Empire and the First Order. But that’s a little bit off topic. What matters is that what comes next for the galaxy after Episode 9 - it should put an end to this particular conflict. They should have thought about how to prevent another fascist from taking power where their parents did not. Especially because the Last Jedi did address these issues, so it’s not like it’s an idea completely removed from the sequel trilogy.
I don’t want Star Wars to address anything political. It is a Space Opera where people have laser swords. It is escapist fantasy. The Prequels tried to have “ideas”, and these were just unwelcome and out of place in a popcorn blockbuster.
The complaint about the politics in the prequels is a bit of a misnomer. Political storylines are interesting, and (although I personally wasn’t a fan) it’s been well received. IIRC, even at the time. But don’t quote me on that. The Parliamentary Procedure in the prequels was the bad part.
Putting some depth into how the Republic fell and the Empire rose from its ashes, that’s interesting. “Tabled, this motion is… Or is it?” is not.
Yeah, that’s pretty accurate. The Star Wars sections of this site are still pretty active, but Off Topic has yet to revive. Maybe one day… But that doesn’t mean it’ll be as fun as it used to be. No moderation meant things got pretty delightfully ridiculous at times and there was a repertoire of inside jokes/forum memes that will be lost to time.
I’m not sure if those sections really are that active. There was a time when a new topic would get many responses in a day. Now you might go days without any replies.
To be expected I guess. Star Wars is mostly played out I think.
There is a Woke mentality that had crept into this place too. Tends to stifle any real debate, since real debate might cause offense. And to the Woke mentality being offensive means being hateful, which is being harmfull…and I am going to stop there before random thoughts goes the way of the politics thread.
There’s a lot of new active posters, a lot of them seem pretty chill. Hopefully there will be a third wave on OT.com. But the older posters being gone sucks hard, and the circumstances around their departure were really unfortunate.
I kind of wish they and the mods would reconcile so they could come back, but a lot of them have said they are no longer interested. Oh well. Can’t change that anymore.
Its his story and its in no way collaborative. The stories are his and very personal.
Star Wars is my go to example I use when I want to talk about how movies are a collaborative art form, because of how much the Original Trilogy is not just George Lucas’s work.
The other people who worked on the OT didn’t just help Lucas realize his vision, they created part of the vision themselves. It’s not just that Star Wars would have failed without them, Star Wars just wouldn’t have been Star Wars without Ralph McQuarrie, or Marcia Lucas, or Gary Kurtz, I could keep going.
Hell, if you look at what happened behind the scenes of the Empire Strikes Back, it’s clearly not just George Lucas’s movie. While Lucas was working on Raiders of the Lost Ark, Irvin Kershner shot the movie in such a way that Kershner’s vision would be the most prevailing in the final cut. Often there was only one or two (usable) takes, and when there were more, there was not that much variation in them. Lucas was essentially unable to make his own movie out of ESB.
This is also why Richard Marquand was hired for RotJ. Marquand was a weaker, much less experienced director, but he wouldn’t have the balls to do what Kershner did. He also micromanaged a lot more with RotJ, as opposed to Empire, where he rarely even showed up on set.
The only way you can look at Empire and say it wasn’t a collaborative project, is if you’re being cheeky and making some comment on how adversarial Kershner and Lucas’s relationship got toward the end.
This is ultimately why I like new Star Wars much better than the prequels. The prequels are what happens when you take everyone but Lucas out of Star Wars. John Williams is the only person (besides Lucas) I can think of off the top of my head who was there for both the OT and PT, but even his input was severely neutered, especially in 2 and 3, although that’s a long story all on its own.
For better or worse, Star Wars is being made by the fans now. The fans may have wildly different ideas of what Star Wars is, they might even have downright dumb ideas of what Star Wars is, but they have a more holistic view of what Star Wars is.
You should probably read what you actually quoted before you reply.
I did read it smile 😃
My unpopular opinion on the ST: TLJ will be redeemed by the passage of time and stand out as the only worthwhile entry of the ST.
Kind of agree. I have a soft spot for TFA and I can forgive it for not doing a whole lot, because of the context of the time it was made in. Its purpose was to bring back trust in Lucasfilm after the Disney buyout and the prequels, and it honestly did its job.
That said, taking the movies for what they are: TLJ is the only Star Wars movie outside the OT that’s in the “Sequels that actually justify their own existence” club. That’s not surprising, though, it’s a very exclusive club.
Its his story and its in no way collaborative. The stories are his and very personal.
Star Wars is my go to example I use when I want to talk about how movies are a collaborative art form, because of how much the Original Trilogy is not just George Lucas’s work.
The other people who worked on the OT didn’t just help Lucas realize his vision, they created part of the vision themselves. It’s not just that Star Wars would have failed without them, Star Wars just wouldn’t have been Star Wars without Ralph McQuarrie, or Marcia Lucas, or Gary Kurtz, I could keep going.
Hell, if you look at what happened behind the scenes of the Empire Strikes Back, it’s clearly not just George Lucas’s movie. While Lucas was working on Raiders of the Lost Ark, Irvin Kershner shot the movie in such a way that Kershner’s vision would be the most prevailing in the final cut. Often there was only one or two (usable) takes, and when there were more, there was not that much variation in them. Lucas was essentially unable to make his own movie out of ESB.
This is also why Richard Marquand was hired for RotJ. Marquand was a weaker, much less experienced director, but he wouldn’t have the balls to do what Kershner did. He also micromanaged a lot more with RotJ, as opposed to Empire, where he rarely even showed up on set.
The only way you can look at Empire and say it wasn’t a collaborative project, is if you’re being cheeky and making some comment on how adversarial Kershner and Lucas’s relationship got toward the end.
This is ultimately why I like new Star Wars much better than the prequels. The prequels are what happens when you take everyone but Lucas out of Star Wars. John Williams is the only person (besides Lucas) I can think of off the top of my head who was there for both the OT and PT, but even his input was severely neutered, especially in 2 and 3, although that’s a long story all on its own.
For better or worse, Star Wars is being made by the fans now. The fans may have wildly different ideas of what Star Wars is, they might even have downright dumb ideas of what Star Wars is, but they have a more holistic view of what Star Wars is.
I’m really not a huge Old Republic fan, but the depth the Old EU went into for such a distant era was really cool.
I don’t think the New EU will ever touch on that era, except maybe a few shallow references. If they did, and tried doing something radical with it, it would piss off Old Republic fans. But if they stayed pretty faithful to the original material, what would the point even be? It’s a Catch-22 that kind of prevents them from touching the era.
They should just bring over the Old Republic stuff and not bother rebooting it. Maybe selectively or with alterations if they want to fit it into the New EU, but largely it would be the same content.
It was pretty extensive and detailed, and it organically explored tons of far-flung eras in galactic history. Hopefully the New EU gets to that level, but when it comes to that I’m worried it might live in the Old EU’s shadow.
I really don’t like the PT/SE/DVD posters. They’re all so ridiculously busy. Same thing with the TFA poster. I don’t like the “Here’s literally everything that happens in the movie crammed into 2x3 feet” style of poster art.
The real question is how can you have conflict when the galaxy is at peace, i don’t think you can do the Sith/Empire storyline a third time. Nor can you do superweapons again.
Reopening the ending RotJ had was 100% fine, at least in the political side of things. The New Republic failing would have given them the opportunity to dig deeper into a more permanent solution. Especially now, after the prequels and the Old EU and the New EU making the Rebellion out to be an attempt to restore the Republic. Because you can’t just go back to how things were before the dark times, that’s what gave you the dark times.
It kind of makes for an interesting story if the first attempt to stop fascism in the galaxy wasn’t super successful because they weren’t thinking about how to prevent another fascist from taking power, they only thought about taking out the fascist currently in power.
Episode 9 should have addressed how to build a new society, not just a New New Republic, and how it would avoid the flaws of the Republic that led to the Empire and the First Order. But that’s a little bit off topic. What matters is that what comes next for the galaxy after Episode 9 - it should put an end to this particular conflict. They should have thought about how to prevent another fascist from taking power where their parents did not. Especially because the Last Jedi did address these issues, so it’s not like it’s an idea completely removed from the sequel trilogy.
They only really get that ticket to undo the solid ending once. You have one opportunity, and if they reopen Episode 9’s new ending, it would be kind of ridiculous. From a storytelling perspective, it erodes any trust in the finality of an ending, but also in-universe, it makes Rey’s generation look like dumbasses. Leia’s generation gets a pass, they were dealing with something new, but you should have known better.
So, obviously the conflict of a second sequel trilogy can’t be Rebels vs Empire or even Republic vs Empire, but it also can’t be something like Republic vs CIS or Republic vs (Insert political group here), because it’ll make Rey’s generation look like real dumbasses if they didn’t think about how to deal with them either. Maybe if the political group was so foreign to anything the galaxy had seen before (and therefore something so out of the box I doubt most writers would be able to come up with it, because of the similarity between the galaxy’s politics and the real world’s), you could justify it, but I doubt it.
I also think something like Republic vs Cartels would be a bad idea, because it’s implied that the Hutts or the Pykes or Crimson Dawn all kind of only exist because the Republic, later the Empire, allow them to exist. The New New Republic or whatever allowing them to exist also makes Rey’s generation look like dumbasses. Maybe they could simply not be strong enough to take on the criminal underworld, but that feels so weak and disconnected from the conflicts of Episodes 1-9, that I don’t know why you’d even bother calling that trilogy Episodes 10-12. Might as well just call it a small spinoff series.
The same sort of goes for something like a Yuuzhan Vong invasion. It would be so disconnected from Episodes 1-9 that there’s no point in calling it Episodes 10-12, unless you pull some really sketchy “Palpatine did nothing wrong he was trying to save the galaxy” shit.
Plus, with how Episode 9 ends in pretty much the same spot as RotJ, any post-TRoS media involving struggling to rebuild the galaxy, or rebuild the Jedi, or Imperial/FO remnants, really has no reason to be post-TRoS. Post-TRoS Rey might as well be post-RotJ Luke, any story about Rey rebuilding the Jedi would probably be better told with Luke. Same with Finn and Poe and Rose or Jannah or whoever rebuilding the Republic. You’d need a really good reason why it has to be them (and “Oh, in canon Luke/Leia/whoever was up to XYZ when this would’ve had to have taken place” isn’t a good enough reason, most people aren’t reading the New EU and aren’t going to know or care). I don’t think TRoS gives enough of a difference between its ending and RotJ’s ending to justify really anything.
tl;dr: There’s no good conflict for an Episode 10-12. I’ve spent way too long writing this, I have no life.
Not gonna spam the thread with image quotes
I knew I wasn’t losing my mind here.
Even if Episode 9 were killer bombad fantastic, I don’t think an Episode 10-12 would be a good idea. But with the Episode 9 we got, it looks like a fourth trilogy would just be at best, a really boring story with characters that were kinda cool in Episodes 7&8 but got neutered in Episode 9, and at worst, literally just a redo of a sequel trilogy.
If we see anything about building a New New Republic while Rey rebuilds the Jedi order (or builds the Schmedi Order or whatever), that’s just a redo of a sequel trilogy, but this time without the OT trio cast. I’m a fan of Episodes 7&8, but if that happened, I’d rather they just decanonize the sequels and not pretend that this trilogy wasn’t a redo. Because they’d have a very hard time convincing me it wasn’t.
The best case scenario I think for a fourth trilogy is if it came out decades down the line, when John Boyega, Daisy Ridley, and Oscar Isaac are very old, and they’d be cameos at best with really minor roles.
I truly think Episode 9 is the last one, though. They really don’t need to make new Episodes like they did before, even if 50 years from now, they run out of stuff to make and want a rebirth of Star Wars like they did with Episodes 1 and 7, I don’t think they need an Episode 10 for that. They can just go out and make a new saga now.
I felt like there might be a need for a thread about more minor fanedits. Stuff that’s worth sharing, requesting, or discussing the creation of, but isn’t big enough to justify creating an entirely new thread over. There’s been a few times where I’ve wanted to make a more minor, conservative fanedit, but with nowhere really to share them, and being too purist to watch it myself, I’ve decided not to. Hopefully something like this can be your reason to actually go and do it.
I imagine a lot of this will be Semi-Specialized Editions or minor tweaks.
Mods feel free to delete this if you think it isn’t necessary.
If Adywan went and prevented the release of the Special Editions and the unaltered movies, I’d begin to question if he did his edits out of love for the movies.
Star Wars opinions are not generational. I don’t know why this is such a common idea when people of all opinions are at pretty much every age.
I think this idea comes from the fact that prequel fans tend to be younger. But people have been saying this for two decades now, and the 12 year old prequel fans of 2001 didn’t grow up into 32 year old prequel fans of 2021, they grew up into 32 year old OT fans. The same thing is happening to the 12 year old prequel fans of 2011 and will happen to the 12 year old prequel fans of 2021.
For the inevitable “I grew into a 32 year old prequel fan” responses: The previous paragraph was a generalization of a larger trend to which there are inevitably many exceptions.
Who exactly the prequel generation is keeps getting pushed back, though. Once upon a time it was the preteens and kids who saw the prequels in theaters with a fresh mind who were the prequel generation. Then it was the kids who grew up with them on DVD in the 2000s. Now it’s the people who watched TCW as kids. The prequel generation is whoever’s in the 12-18ish age range, and it’s been that way, unchanging for longer than the current prequel generation has been alive. I bet it will continue to be pushed back, at least until the prequel generation was born after the Force Awakens came out.
The sequels are too young to call yet, but since there’s a lot of people who cite the generational nature of Star Wars opinions to show that opinions on the sequels will change as the “sequel generation” gets older, it’s also worth mentioning that that’s probably not true.
If the general opinion on the sequels change, it won’t be because of any generational shenanigans.
“This is how liberty dies - to thunderous applause.”
Here I go replying to a 16 year old comment. My sister wasn’t even born yet when this comment was made. Damn.
This is a really cool line (above par for the prequels), but it kind of gives me icky vibes. It feels super misanthropic, and so does George Lucas when he talks about the politics in the prequels. It seems like he thinks dictators come to power because people are stupid and get tricked into dying in an authoritarian hellhole. Unfortunately I feel like I have to say that that’s not how the world works.
I kind of like the implication that the Blackened Mantle gives with this line, Padme’s in shock because she’s now realizing why putting up resistance against Palpatine in the Senate was so difficult: They were in his pocket the whole time. They were working with him. He was rigging their elections, or spreading lies, or just generally pulling strings to get them in power, and they did the same to make him into the Emperor.
Probably everyone on this forum
The Last Jedi would have the least amount of changes, structurally. But any reference to the Republic being destroyed, or the First Order taking over the galaxy within weeks, is removed. A reason for why the Resistance fleet doesn’t just escape to Republic space may need to be created. Perhaps the Supremacy is generating a gravity well, or we could add an interdictor to the fleet. Perhaps this could be a place for more radical ideas for the B-plot. When Leia refers to her “allies”, maybe she could be more explicitly referring to the Republic. Maybe they get a transmission from the Republic on Crait specifically saying they cannot intervene.
It could also be an out of the pot into the frying pan situation. The doo doo hit the fan after Hosnian got blown up, even if the New Republic survives they’ve probably got problems of their own. It would be pretty easy to justify the Republic not showing up on the basis that they’re also fighting the First Order, all across the galaxy.
The relationship between Lucasfilm and Disney is sort of like Disney being Lucasfilm’s sugar daddy. Lucasfilm does whatever it wants and pulls from Disney’s essentially infinitely deep pockets to do it. Obviously Disney still owns Lucasfilm and can change that relationship whenever it wants, so Lucasfilm isn’t as free as people say. But Disney isn’t calling the shots.
Imagine a world without piss. I don’t know if I could live without peeing. Often times I have too many soluble waste materials in my body, without peeing I don’t know what I would do to remove them. And don’t even get me started on when I have too much liquid in my body!
Add more random flying bullshowering to the ST to help them fit in with the PT and SEs.
Whenever I go more than 36ish hours without sleep, it feels like everybody’s been replaced by robots who look and act and feel exactly like themselves, completely undistinguishable, but they’re still unthinking, unfeeling robots.
Do that but replace the actors. Revenge of the Sith would be better if the characters felt like they weren’t real. It would be super meta.
Exactly, so it’s not a native framerate. Some people say that 24 to 25 is insignifficant, while some claim they can hear the differance.
With audio, the difference between 25 fps and 24 fps is about a semitone (the difference between C and C#). It’s small, but it’s enough that most people will notice it if they’re familiar with whatever they’re listening to.
The difference between 23.976 and 24 is 1000:1001, an almost 41 times smaller difference. It’s so slight that the human brain can not perceive the difference.
If you’re worried about the numbers involved, the second is an arbitrary unit of measurement. Pick other units of time, and PAL will have non-natural number units of time, or NTSC could have natural number units of time.
If you’re worried about editing or something, what specifically are you trying to do? Put an ST movie onto VHS?
If the OT was released in today’s climate, it would receive the exact same level of ridicule as the prequels and sequels.
Please don’t mistake my comments for hating or trolling. I love all of Star Wars and I do prefer the originals to the prequels and sequels. I’m just saying the originals are often given a pass on certain criticisms. A lot of it has to do with them being well established before social media was prevalent. They are more engrained in our brains. I think a lot of classics would suffer similarly if released today.
This isn’t to invalidate the movies themselves. This is to put in perspective the amount of criticism being handed out regularly to almost everything.
Maybe to a degree. There’s a lot of criticisms that originate from clickbait BS artists who’ll make stuff up for the hell of it. The same would probably happen if the OT came out today (and in the context of being a new installment of an already beloved series).
But I don’t think it’s at all right to say that they’d get the same level of criticism, though. Speaking as a fan of a ton of things outside the OT (especially the Last Jedi), they’re not at all on the same level. The original Star Wars movies were culturally iconic and revolutionary to the film industry, in a way that the prequels and sequels never could be.
They ride off the success of the OT to an undeniable amount, and if it weren’t for the OT I doubt either of them would even be remembered 10 years down the line.
It may be true that there’s a lot of criticisms of stuff that happens in the ST and PT that also happens in the OT, but if I’m going to be honest, a lot of people (especially ones who are fans of every Star Wars movie) will take criticisms of the movies they like, and force them onto the OT.
I think the obsession modern film discourse has with a movie’s quality being determined by its flaws or inconsistencies is unhealthy, though. The OT isn’t the best trilogy because it has the least amount of problems (although I think it does), it’s because it has a ton of good qualities.
They’re a danger to this website, other fanediting communities, and fanediting as a whole.