NeverarGreat

That movie sure has a lot of whispering in it.

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Ah, this Falcon talk is bringing me back. If the Falcon is in it, it could be that Anakin made the Kessel run in it during the Clone Wars, and nobody has ever beaten his time. At the time, you see, he was a navigator on a spice freighter out of Kessel. Of course, it wasn't named the Millennium Falcon back then, and it had a different owner. But Obi-wan puts this info together in the cantina in ANH, and his knowing smiles upon hearing this information and seeing the ship that Anakin flew before he knew him tell us all we need to know.

That's the Star Trek Into Darkness approach to writing the movie, I guess.

In my opinion, Dune Messiah isn't particularly great, at least compared to the superlative Dune. However, Children of Dune actually ties all three books together in a way that seems like it was designed as a multi-generational epic. I read God Emperor of Dune, but it takes place thousands of years after Children of Dune, so it really begins a new cycle of the tale. While interesting, I put it down after reading it and wasn't inspired to pick up the next book in the series. So I'd say read through Children of Dune and then stop. It's a perfectly good stopping place, and ties everything up admirably.

Are you sure? My only source for the original post is a photograph of a Greek translation, so I'm not sure what the intent of the author was. We may never know, I'm afraid.

Have you read Dune Messiah and Children of Dune? I actually think that Children of Dune is as good if not better than Dune.

I read The Lord of the Rings as a child, and it felt like reading a translated mythological history of an ancient civilization. However, reading Dune felt like stepping into an actual temple built by the founders of an ancient civilization. Frank Herbert had such reverence and devotion to his own world that I don't think that anyone will ever top his accomplishment.

So yes. I do think that you should re-read Dune sooner or later.

That's a good beginning Darth, and if we had never seen Tatooine or the homestead or the binary sunset before, I would have no problem with it at all. Problem is, we see Tatooine twice in the OT, and three times in the Lucas Prequels. That's an awful lot of time to be spent on a planet where even Luke says there's nothing to see.

I think that if we are going to focus on Anakin as the protagonist of these movies, it should be after he becomes a Jedi, and even after he has been trained by Obi-wan. The reason is that the OT can be viewed as an exploration of Anakin's past. We begin on the planet of Anakin's birth, meet his brother, then meet the man who trained him, then travel to Alderaan like Obi-wan (and perhaps Anakin) did in the Clone Wars, and have Luke be trained as a Jedi, except that this time he is trained by Yoda, not Obi-wan, and this makes the difference in him not turning to the Dark Side. To repeat these beats in the prequels seems unnecessary. Of course, the only story left to tell at that point is how Anakin the Jedi became Darth Vader, and we don't really want to spoil the surprise, so we've brainstormed ourselves into a corner.

Alternately, as has been suggested, it could be about Obi-wan, and how he was a hotheaded Jedi who eventually cooled down and became the serene mentor we know in the OT. The trilogy could begin with the outbreak of the First Clone War, and could even end at the end of the First Clone War, when he is rescued by Anakin who is piloting a spice freighter and happens to be in the area. He is tired of war by this point, and Yoda has told him to pass on what he has learned, so he promises to train Anakin to take his place in the Jedi Order, and he is able to retire from war in peace.

OR DOES HE???? ;)

Perhaps Anakin left Obi-wan after a period of training to become a full Jedi, like Luke did with Yoda. Everyone imagines the adventures of Anakin and Obi-wan, but it could be that Obi-wan fought in the first Clone War (whatever that is) and helped Bail Organa in that war, and then retired to train Jedi, like Yoda. He trained Anakin during the next outbreak of war, which threatened the Republic, and Anakin rushed off to become a Jedi while he stayed behind and assumed a mentor role, going to find Anakin only when it was clear that he was turning to the dark side, in an attempt to dissuade him from fighting. This is referenced in ROTJ:

"Come away with me."

"Obi-wan once thought as you do. You don't know the power of the Dark Side. I must obey my master."

The chancellor of course would have taken over Anakin's training at this point, and is sending him on dehumanizing missions and pushing him further than his physical body can take.

To the navigator idea, it would be good to reference this as Anakin's beginning. Obi-wan could have discovered Anakin when he was navigating a spice freighter, and it was there that he realized that Anakin was a great pilot.

Beru isn't really a presence in the OT, and I assume that the reason she isn't talked about was that Owen was the only one who knew Anakin before he left.

No need to add disclaimers to ideas here, Darth. It's actually similar to an idea I had at one time to have Skywalker be a name given to Anakin when he performed a "miracle" of piloting for a primitive species. Your idea is better though.

I got the feeling from watching Return of the Jedi that it was the Anakin part of Anakin Skywalker's name that evoked Vader's ire. "I know that you were once Anakin Skywalker, my father." Luke added emphasis to Anakin, not to Skywalker. So I think that it may be better to have Lars as the name that Owen and Beru took when they went into hiding, Owen's real name being Skywalker. Of course, the name Lars is never mentioned in the OT proper, so it can be assumed that their names are Skywalker, but it makes sense that they don't use those names in public. It wouldn't make sense for Luke to keep the name Skywalker if it was given to him by Obi-wan, for Owen would never tell him that it was his name, disliking Anakin as he did.

Nobody seems to recognize the name Skywalker in the OT. Even Leia, who knows the history of Obi-wan Kenobi, doesn't seem to understand the significance of Luke's name. Lando is totally ignorant of it as well, and he may have been around 20 years old at the time of Anakin's fall (though I think that the time of his fall should be pushed back at least ten to fifteen years in this rewrite). This seems to suggest that Skywalker was not a well-known name in the galaxy, or at least people didn't attach significance to it. I'm guessing that Anakin Skywalker is the name that his parents gave him, because I doubt that Anakin would be a name chosen by him as a Jedi title. Remember also that according to ANH, Anakin was not a Jedi when he left Obi-wan, so Obi-wan could not have given him any Jedi name.

I like the idea that Yoda gave Ben his Jedi name of Obi-wan. This makes sense in the context of the story. However, if we're examining all of the evidence, it suggests that Anakin Skywalker, the name given by his parents, was changed by Anakin himself to Darth Vader, going beyond the single first name change and creating a new identity, twisting the ways of the Jedi. Darth is not a title, it is his literal first name. "You can't win Darth."

I'm not familiar with your project, do you have a thread somewhere?

As for releasing this project, it began as just an experiment to see if the entire movie could benefit from a single change of color and lighting settings. I think that this experiment was a success, because I can't find a single scene that did not improve in some way from this change. The settings have been made available here on this thread so that anyone who wishes to recreate this effect can do so. It would be very cool if someone with more patience and expertise than myself uses this as a starting point for their own restoration from the DVD or better yet the Blu-ray, as it is from the same video file.

I hope this information is useful. Incidentally, here is one more configuration which I found after uploading the screenshots, that I think is the best so far:

Adjust:

Lighting: Contrast 30, Exposure 100

Applied Effects:

Image Control: Brightness -5, Saturation 78

Channel Mixer:

98

46

-38

0

5

122

-20

-2

-10

24

89

-3

I assume that the Republic has been rotting for a long time, so it would make sense that the systems would be fighting for their political autonomy. The Republic could shut down communications across the galaxy in preparation for the transition into Galactic Empire, so each system would be very isolated. For these systems to then rise up against the Empire, even isolated and with no hope of success, may justify the term "clone wars".

Sorry Frank for not getting back to you, I've been working on what will be the final version, at least for me.

Here's the link to the 60 or so screenshots for that version:

http://s649.photobucket.com/user/NeverarGreat/library/Star%20Wars%20Color%20Correction%206%206%2013%20Exposure?sort=3&page=1

or if that doesn't work:

http://s649.photobucket.com/user/NeverarGreat/slideshow/Star%20Wars%20Color%20Correction%206%206%2013%20Exposure

Password: starwars

This final shot now has the same lighting and color settings as every other shot in the movie. This was possible because of Premiere Elements 11 which I bought yesterday, and I found new settings for contrast and exposure that worked wonders for the lighting. The color settings have been adjusted as well, most notably increasing the lightness of the foliage in the above shot.

These settings minimize certain persistent problems with the movie, such as pink flashes:

Blue flashes:

And the general strange color casts of the movie:

The settings for the project in Adobe Premiere Elements 11:

Final Movie Settings:

Adjustments:

Lighting:

Contrast 20

Exposure 70

Effects:

Image Control:

Brightness -1

Saturation 75

Channel Mixer:

100

50

-45

-2

3

126

-20

-5

-10

24

90

-6

And here's a shot that showcases many of the problems of the movie:

Sorry about the picture heavy post. I just want to show you all the screenshots, so go to the link!

^This.

The first movie could be about a war fought in a single system, but by the second film there are identical conflicts in many star systems, all connected by some larger force in the galaxy.

Good points there. I would add that a screenwriter should value their story enough to make it internally consistent. Many a movie has been sabotaged by faulty "movie logic" and convenience.

Isn't political dialogue one of the main gripes with the prequels? Politics should indeed be mentioned, but I would stress that the Republic is a bureaucracy, not something that needs to be particularly understood.

Remember that War is in the title. It should be about that above all else. Probably the Clone War. So what sides are there in this war? Are clones enemies or allies? Alternately, is it about a clone of an important person that the war is started?

On another note, something that should probably be addressed is the fact that practically everyone on Earth knows that the Republic becomes an Empire. This makes having heroes on the side of the Republic tragic by default, at least if we show the fall of the Republic, which is almost required so that the transition to the OT is not incredibly jarring and disorienting: "Evil Empire? What? I thought that we were winning the war?! Did the other side win?" Etc.

I know a guy who knows someone who has an original 35mm Empire print. Yeah, a bit more tenuous, but eh.

I never got the unknown regions. Supposedly there is something that prevents hyperspace travel to these regions, or some other BS, but that doesn't make sense. If ships can fly across the galaxy in a matter of hours, it stands to reason that if some entrepreneurial starship captain wanted to make a name for himself, he would fly his ship right into the unknown regions and start naming planets after himself.

Gaffer wins at everything forever.

Those are some interesting articles. With that Fall of the Republic one, you can definitely tell that it's very Empire Strikes Back centric.

I think we're all on the same page in that we all want to preserve the reveals in the OT. Like Darth Lucas, I would like to structure the story in a way that looks like a pre-77 production, with a simple story that perhaps is tinged with WWII, Cold War, and Vietnam War thematic elements.

The biggest problem with this take on a story is that nobody has the correct point of view to write a story about this. Even people who saw only the original trilogy would have a massively skewed point of view, such as the fan who wrote Fall of the Republic. After several years of this type of thinking, the best solution I can come up with is to take the OT as canon and write a story that is only tangentially related to the OT.

Whether or not the Lucas Prequels ever existed or not is a moot point for me. The story of the OT stands perfectly well on its own. There is no need to explore the backstory of characters like Anakin and Obi-wan, as part of the fun is imagining what they were like "back then". Thus making a story set during the clone wars and avoiding the OT characters would serve the dual purpose of avoiding the specific plots of the Prequels. In the end, the galaxy is big enough for the two of us: the Lucas Prequels, and our rewritten prequels. Because like it or not, we are all influenced by them. Might as well make our story fit into those, so that we respect the creator of this world.

Yeah, it's not a rewrite in the strictest sense, but it would be cool to make our story look like the "original" Star Wars movies, and then have it appear that the OT was made as a sequel to them, and then 20 years later Lucas made some movies exploring the backstory of characters we already knew, and that didn't interfere with the originals, as an interesting side note.

How much of the EU would we keep? Or would it be just the OT? I assume by mentioning the prototype Death Star and Darth Bane that these would keep most all of the EU, but simply present newly filmed prequels with tweaked stories.

Regularjoe gave me an idea. It would be pretty easy to remove all mention of Leia as Luke's sister from the movie, starting with the Ben scene:

"the other he spoke of is your twin sister."

"But I have no sister."

"To protect you both from the Emperor, you were hidden from your father when you were born. The Emperor knew, as I did, if Anakin were to have any offspring, they would be a threat to him. That is the reason that your sister remains safely anonymous."

Ben does not continue, and Luke processes this new information, then looks at Ben (from the final shot in the scene).

Ben continues: "Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor."

Ben could be fading out throughout this scene, and his last line is only a voice in Luke's mind.

Then of course the talk of Leia as his sister is taken out of the Ewok village dialogue, and the throne room scene can stay as is. Leia's talk with Han  goes somewhat differently:

"You love him. Don't you?"

"It's not like that at all!"

This would require some careful cutting to feel genuine.

Or, it could be made to seem like Luke doesn't know who his sister is, and during the Ewok Village dialogue, he suspects that Leia may be his sister. However, he omits telling Leia about his suspicions.

It goes as in the movie until:

"He's my father."

"Your father?"

"There's more. The only hope for the Alliance, if I don't make it back..."

"Luke, don't talk that way."

"It won't be easy for you to hear it, but you must. The Force is strong in my family. My father has it. I have it. My sister has it. In time, my sister'll learn to use that power as I have."

"Then Luke, run away, far away. If he can feel your presence, then leave this place! I wish I could go with you."

"No you don't. You've always been strong."

"But why must you confront him?"

"Because there is good in him, I've felt it. He won't turn me over to the Emperor, I can save him. I can turn him back...(Leia stares at him)...I have to try."

But how can anyone fully commit to something that is guaranteed to make no money, to inspire the ire of Disney, and to piggyback on the original idea of another?

Of course, collaboration is important, but Lucas already had the Star Wars screenplay completed before he began collaborating with the film crew. Even when he was asking his friends for advice on the story, it was his story. To do this right, we would need one dedicated individual with a good screenplay that everyone could agree was acceptable before even beginning the next step in the process. And unless the script blew everyone away with its divine brilliance, there would be no agreement on the script level. At least, not unless we rounded up everyone who was interested in contributing to the project and setting a time limit on every aspect of the production.

This is what needs to happen in my eyes before such a movie could work:

1. Find a director. Someone with the time, experience, and resources to manage an entire production.

2. Have this director set up a private blog like Team Negative1 to coordinate the production.

3. Accept script submissions, to be terminated at a definite date and voted upon by members of the forum.

4. Begin a kickstarter campaign on the blog for donations, with reasonable estimates for every aspect of production.

5. Assemble a team from the blog members, including the actors, artists, technicians, etc.

6. Set a timeline for completion, and hold all members accountable to it.

From there I could  see a movie getting made.

The Wordplay articles are very illuminating on the subject of screenwriting:

http://www.wordplayer.com/welcome.html

Also Truby's articles and interviews on Youtube. In this one he attacks the idea of the three act structure of movies:

http://www.truby.com/threeact.html

Absolutely right.

I've got probably hundreds of pages of notes on my computer for possible stories for a prequel rewrite. Everything from going Flash Gordon with Obi-wan as a Hans Zarkov character to Anakin's wife being a Joan of Arc character having visions of the good side of an extremely schizophrenic Anakin/Vader inspiring her to begin the Rebellion. Then there are the more reasonable stories, the ones that cleave close to what the audience would expect from watching the OT.

The problem with making a story about Anakin Skywalker is that the OT played off of the fact that Luke's father was a mystery to Luke to make him fearful. If an audience knows exactly how Anakin was seduced to the Dark Side, no matter how it happened, it would lessen the impact of the OT. For you only fear what you don't understand, and Luke must travel the path to becoming a Jedi not knowing if his actions are a mirror of his father's actions before he fell. In a way, Anakin's story is already told through Luke's journey in the OT. So making Anakin's story the focus of the Prequels is frivolous.

Obi-wan's story is also unfitting as the focus of the prequels, for we already know exactly where he ends up at the end. Also, telling his story requires knowing Yoda and a lot about the Force, making the films not work if they were to be watched before the the OT, or in proper numerical order.

In the end, I think that the prequels can't be about the Jedi or the Force, because to do so would simply repeat a lot of the OT. It would have to be a smaller story, with a main character whom we don't know, with a goal that doesn't have to do with doing something we already know the fate of. For example, having a story about someone fighting for either the Republic or the Separatists will inevitably end in tragedy, so if you want an uplifting tale, that's out.

I'll probably be altering my Stars of War thread soon, so you can read there what I have in mind for a "rewrite" of the prequels. I say rewrite because there are way too many ways to rewrite the prequels, and with a focus on entirely new characters and situations during the same period of the Clone Wars, the existing prequels and EU need not be discarded to have a compelling origin story for the Star Wars universe.

Orci: "I only want to be on Star Trek as long as I’m useful and helpful to what Star Trek is. The minute that I’m a burden on it, then I should not be here. I want the best idea to win. Hopefully, if this movie works, Paramount will be thinking about a third movie and, if I have the best idea, I should win. If I don’t, someone else should win. That’s how much I love Star Trek. The best idea should win, period."

Did he ask anyone besides Lindelof? He could have asked me...

I came up with a Star Trek 09 sequel where the Enterprise uses Spock Prime's knowledge of the future to preemptively meet V'ger thousands of light years from Earth. The Enterprise is seen as an infested organism like in the original, but in this timeline the ship is transported by V'ger to the machine planet that originally accepted Voyager, and Enterprise is given sentience to fulfill the mission that its crew is so unwilling to accomplish:

"To explore strange new worlds; to seek out new life forms and new civilizations; to boldly go where no man has gone before."

Therefore the crew is forced to deal with a ship that will go anywhere in the universe except for Earth and the planets of the Federation.

I think that it's a better story than KHAN! again.