Monroville

DarkFather said:

One change that came to mind while I was talking with vaderios:

Vader's helmet flaps in the breeze during the last moments of his duel with Luke. It makes Vader's helmet seem too flimsy. I don't know if anyone here is even capable of changing that, but it's worth noting.

This was brought up about 50 to 150 (?!) pages ago, but the thing is, I'm not sure if anything was decided one way or the other.  My thing (as well as a lot of other people) is that when the helmet is lowered in the Vader's chill-out chamber (or would that be his "iPod"?), you hear that suction sound, indicating that that sucker is on there to STAY.

Soooo wouldn't it make sense to "lock" Vader's wobbly helmet in the Bespin duel due to what we've seen in said previously mentioned scene?

Oldfan said:

Monroville, I really like your idea about the Taunton's eyes. Just the mock-ups you provided seem to add alot more life to them, and I hope Adywan considers it.

Thx!  That's the thing: puppets can go either way.  They can work or fail on just how much work is put into them, specifically in the face and the eyes. 

One bit that sprang to mind:

During the whole sequence when Veers looks through his periscope, orders maximum fire power, shoots and destroys the shield generator, here are some ideas:

(1) try to include not just the dead AT-ATs in the background, but multiple burning holes where snow speeders have been shot down.  Maybe extra rebel trooper bodies on the ground too if possible.
(2) do something with Veers periscope view, so it actually targets and shows four circles as to where the four AT-AT guns should be fired.
(3) when the guns fire, have them actually "build up" a bit like the game R-TYPE and make the beams more intense (less red, more white -maybe even bright if that's possible)

Here is an example (visually this may be too much, but I refer to something similar to the audio effect):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cn5NzvM2kMA&feature=related
from 2:40 to 2:45


(4) when the shield generator explodes, naturally replace the explosion, but add a shockwave that may even push clouds away and/or hint at the shield itself collapsing.  You could nix the weird AT-AT shot at the trooper right before the shield shot, and just have the trooper fall down from the shockwave.

Monroville said:

Also also remember that when Luke took off the helmet in JEDI, the front face mask was still in place, which means Vader would still be using his mechanical breathing apparatus to... well, breath.

EDIT - it looks like the front IS attached to the rest of the helmet, as you can kind of see here (you can see it better when watching the movie):

I agree, the mask should stay on but the helmet should be lowered even if it does make out that Vader is a really lazy git for not using his hands (maybe the helmet needs to be locked onto the collar and mask, Luke does take some time removing it in ROTJ).

 

Now I wasn't saying anything should be CHANGED; I was just pointing out that the front of the mask was (could be) attached to the rest of the helmet.  Again, he is in a (hyperbolic) chamber, and no doubt the particular room and chamber are sterile and designed for his comfort, being that Darth did kind of design the place for himself.

So I say just put an airlock to his chamber.  I think the elevator with a small foyer would be best - it could be close to the bridge without being AIRPLANE 2 ridiculous about it, and if Vader needs a sterile environment so his wounds wouldn't get infected, he wouldn't have a single open door to the bridge (and all the germs).

You could have the scene play out as:
the area Piett is at there is a closed door.  You see some small lights on the side or above the door to indicate a seal has been made (along with the appropriate air intake sound FX), the door opens up and in walks Piett, with another set of doors already closed behind him.  Maybe something could be done with the lighting around the chamber (something bluish?) to indicate ambient lighting (most people meditate with low lights on, not flourescents).

- in regards to the front mask remaining on the helmet, it goes either way for me.  In JEDI, the front is a separate piece from the helmet part.  Yet again, when you watch this scene, you can see that there is something attached to the helmet that couldn't be anything other than the front face mask.

- in regards to Vader and his condition and abilities, the back story I always read (at least during STAR WARS: ANH up to EMPIRE) was that Vader became the way he did THROUGH the hunting of Jedi Knights.  As in: Obi Wan didn't mess him up in one fell swoop so much as each Jedi he hunted and killed got their licks in and took a piece of Vader - thus all the scars and physical damage was done over many physical and mental fights over many battles.



In regards to the Hoth rebel base entrance, uh YEAH, they are quite a bit different.  That IS supposed to be the same cannon (heh, heh, notice.. not canon): see how when Han is riding in there are rebel troopers carrying that box with the cables, and then in the second picture that same box is placed in front of the cannon they were placing it by in the Han shot?  Not to mention, why have 2 cannons directly in front of each other?

If anything the cannon on the left needs to be moved waay back to match the distance of the right-side cannon, and get rid of BOTH of those ugly white mound things on the left sides around the cannons - just ugly matte work.  You know, those troopers on the right need to be smaller too (I know the cannons aren't THAT big, but there is a slight size issue being that the soldiers are supposed to be a little behind the gun, not beside it.

-Angel

Vaderios:

I think the look is right, but just make the entrance on the right image (your edit) a little smaller.  The left shot IS supposed to be a little farther away (than the Han taun-taun shot), but the "cut" of the cave is still a bit different and the placement of the left gun turret is WAY off.

Could you redesign both the entrance shots (above your mod-ed image) to:
(1) get rid of that stupid white mound on the left side of both gun turrets (just add more of the cave to go behind the turrets - hell, I think it would help the left turret stand out better)
(2) push the left turret and power box back a good 10 to 20 feet (in the second image)
(3) maybe move the distant troopers on the right more towards the center to give the impression they are directly walking out of the cave.  It would also serve to put the right side turret "behind" them perspective wise.
(4) I still think we should be able to see a lot better and a lot more detail INSIDE the cave entrance.  I know the blast doors are a good 20 feet from the cave entrance, but we should be able to see more stuff than just a black blob.

EDIT - actually, the opening you have done would probably be about right, considering that it has to be big enough for the rebel transports to get out of.  The original opening is waay to small for those transports to fit through it.  Then again, this may be the "fighter" entrance/exit, and there may be a back door or roofway access ala Mos Eisley for the bigger ships.

Something else I thought of: would it be cool to have the turret heads slowly move (especially in the second shot with the rebel trooper on top - as in: the turret is moving with his scan - have it pointing off to the right [almost profile shot] and slowly turn towards the direction it is pointing in now)?

first WAMPA attack scene:

(1) just throwing this one out there.  Is it awkward that the Wampa is backhanding Luke with his right paw (thumb down)?  I remember in someone's alternate edit, they moved the thumb to the top of the hand, so the Wampa would be smacking Luke off with his left hand instead.



(2) this is the main problem with the Taun-Tauns: they have dead eyes that always look straight ahead.  When Han gets onto his Taun-Taun to look for Luke, it has the same dead expression in every scene and is again looking straight ahead.  Even if nothing is done (or can be done) with the head itself (though I still think an ear twitch or two would give it some extra life), just allowing the eyes to move and look at what is around it would add a lot.

When Luke is swiped off, the eyes could be made larger and have them look in the direction of the Wampa.  In the following scene when the Wampa is strangling/snapping the neck of the Taun-Taun, the eyes could be widened to look frightened.  Here are some examples:

 

 

(3) you may have mentioned this before, but will there be consistency in the Ben apparitions between EMPIRE and JEDI (consistent transparency, sparkly glow or no sparkly glow, etc)?



(4) I know the bacta tank is getting a "red" treatment, but here is something interesting:

 
apparently it WAS red in some shots.

(5) I spotted another gaffe I guess.  When this snow speeder is moving to take off, there is some sort of wire trailing after it.  You can see it better when you watch the movie:

(6) in the shot where we first see the AT-ATs on the horizon, maybe you could replace the dots with tiny AT-ATs and connect them to the ground (this would be especially cool for the 720p version).



Also, when comparing the above shot with the one below, the AT-ATs need to be moved more to the right or the background needs to be changed to look like the above shot (there is no hill on the left-hand side)



(7) after watching EMPIRE again, I can see the snow speeders come FROM the mountain as opposed to coming overtop it.  While I know you plan on adding more snow speeders in the distance (to further increase the scope), would it be conceivable to add some rebel troopers in the lower right, as well as maybe on trooper in the gun turret waving the snow speeders on?  Another possibility being an added trooper in the foreground turning around to see the oncoming snow speeder fleet.



(8) when Veers approaches the shield generator, should we be able to see something of the rebel line?



And lastly (for the moment):

(9) when the MF goes into the "tunnel" and the front lights turn on, could there be beams of light coming out?


 

doubleofive said:

How does one get permission to use Vader's Personal Elevator?  How could Vader be caught unawares if his wall dings that someone is headed down to see him?  Just playing devil's advocate here (and I really like the hallway idea).

That one is easy: it's like the "basement" button in the Arkham Asylum elevator in BATMAN BEGINS.  Only someone with the password or the key can unlock the button and use it, whereupon when someone uses it an automatic signal is sent to Vader in his chamber (so he knows someone is coming).

Also in regards to Vader's chamber, I would personally choose the elevator with airlock.  Vader doesn't have to be 2 feet away from the bridge, being that with an elevator or hallway he could still be anywhere from 1 to 10 levels below the bridge and still within the command tower.  I think the "privacy" factor is a more pertinent reason to change the background behind Piett than anything else.

Also also remember that when Luke took off the helmet in JEDI, the front face mask was still in place, which means Vader would still be using his mechanical breathing apparatus to... well, breath.

EDIT - it looks like the front IS attached to the rest of the helmet, as you can kind of see here (you can see it better when watching the movie):

adywan said:

it isn't as easy as taking the head off the Taun-Taun from a separate section to make him react. the two shots have to match and with all the movement its virtually impossible

WAMPA ATTACK:
I understand the CGI blood thing, but you could still add sound FX like breaking bones, and the eyes on the Taun-Taun could be done using the same program you used on the cantina creatures.  As far as having the "Taun-Taun" spin its head to the left in the scene with Luke getting hit, you could use some of the other shots with Luke and Han on their Taun-Tauns, since the heads are pointing to the left.

The whole idea is to make the Taun-Taun act more like a living creature.  Be it deer or horses, usually when a predator, person or loud noise occurs around most animals (including us), we all tend to see what it is.

The extra Wampa hand and arm could be done by copying the arm and flipping it.  The thumb may have to be repositioned.

Well, it's not something that HAS to be done, just something to give the Taun-Taun more life to it by allowing it to react more like a living creature.  While it may be hard to do the synching, also keep in mind that the "Luke swipe" scene only lasts a second or two.  If you had the Taun-Taun spin its head to the left, it wouldn't have to be super-perfect since all we would need to see would be the motion blur.

Anyways, just a suggestion.

EDIT - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAr4PIAZiqQ

at 3:40, the Taun-Taun does turn its head kinda.  Maybe if the eyes were wider like how horses eyes are when they are scared, as well as have the eyes look to the left in the direction of the Wampa.

Tomorrow I am going to edit this post with some Photoshopped images to help show what I'm talking about.

adywan said:

Savage said:

In order to get a sense of isolation, all that needs be done would be to remove the extra officers and insert a different matte background.  The actual stairs and hallway need not be changed.  As is it looks almost like a small hallway between rooms, so why in the hell are three officers just standing around?  Regardless, I'm not bothered by the existing shot.  If any changes are done, it may be easiest just to isolate Piett and replace the entirety of the background.

i'm actually in two minds about this now. i'm starting to like the idea of having it a bit more isolated. hmmmm, what to do. lol

You could just create an airlock - have a set of doors behind Piett.  That way his chamber could be anywhere in proximity to the bridge and the double doors would give him the privacy.

Some extra ideas on the airlock concept:
(1) have the doors behind Piett do the "super fast closing" like the detention block cell doors or the stormtrooper station on the DS.
(2) the area Piett is in is dark or lit with "emergency lighting" until the SFC doors close up, whereupon the lights in the airlock chamber slowly light up to full power.

Also, have you thought about doing anything with the INSIDE of Vader's meditation chamber?  You know, a disco ball, a CENTIPEDE console game... ?    >:)

Seriously though, could anything be done to spice it up a bit (even if it is just some lighting or lights - something to indicate to Vader when someone is coming into his room - not that he couldn't sense them with the Force or anything)?

For example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkywRUAd0_w&feature=related

at 3:06, maybe some small monitors could be added to the blocky white panels on either side of Vader, in essence to show him the activity on all the other SDs in the fleet.

You know, thinking about the comments of Vader's chamber being right beside the bridge, how funny does it make the "You're in charge now, Admiral Piett" scene if Ozzel was right outside the door!  Makes me think of AIRPLANE 2 and Shatner's scenes on the moon.  Maybe that WASN'T a viewscreen Vader was looking through!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHKd80asXy4

DarkFather said:

You seriously want to tell me that Vader would be perfectly okay with a bunch of random-ass Joes having such a chance to glimpse him without his helmet on, or to have regular sneak peeks on the private meetings going on within?

Who said he would have to walk that far to get to the action of things anyway? It could be an extra room separating the main decks from his private chamber. It's not like it has to be a mile long corridor or anything.

Vader could just be a few floors down in the command tower.  I would still think that there would be an airlock of sorts being that Vader would have to have something akin to a pure oxygen environment due to his physical damage and need of the suit.

WAMPA ATTACK:
I understand the CGI blood thing, but you could still add sound FX like breaking bones, and the eyes on the Taun-Taun could be done using the same program you used on the cantina creatures.  As far as having the "Taun-Taun" spin its head to the left in the scene with Luke getting hit, you could use some of the other shots with Luke and Han on their Taun-Tauns, since the heads are pointing to the left.

The whole idea is to make the Taun-Taun act more like a living creature.  Be it deer or horses, usually when a predator, person or loud noise occurs around most animals (including us), we all tend to see what it is.

The extra Wampa hand and arm could be done by copying the arm and flipping it.  The thumb may have to be repositioned.

Adywan said:
The mountains don't need to be changed. its the canon that's throwing out the scale in this shot. i may change the contrast of the background to give it more distance

SNOWSPEEDER REVEAL:
I have to disagree with you on your statement here.  It is not the gun tower that throws it off, but the mountain range which is part of a used backdrop.  If you look at that "hill", it is the same or similar to alot of the distant mountain shots in a lot of the AT-AT attack sequences.  Being that you can see 2 snowspeeders coming over the "mountain", either those snowspeeders are HUGE or that is a tiny mountain range.

There are various ways this could be modified:
(1) make the mountains into a snow hill comparable to the ground.
(2) rather than the snowspeeders coming up over the mountains, have them coming FROM the mountains, whereas we can see the fleet of snowspeeders extending much farther in the distance

In this scene (with the first fly-over of the snowspeeders over the hill);



Maybe you could change the hill to something more appropriate, such as a snow mound as opposed to what looks like a Lilliputian mountain range.  Also, would we see the multiple shadows of the snowspeeders on the ground as they fly overhead (I know the angle of the gun turret shadow is pretty long, which wouldn't explain the somewhat "noon-ish" sunlight covering everything - the gun turret shadow would indicate the sun is about the set)

I think it would be pretty cool if you shortened the gun turret shadow (say, maybe a 40° angle shadow on the turret as opposed to 20°), replaced the left hill with more of a snow slope and showed the shadows of the snowspeeders on the slope and ground as they all come over and at us.  It could help add to the sense of speed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkywRUAd0_w&feature=related
Also (at 6:18), shouldn't the snowspeeder shadows be on the lower right of the vehicles, if we go by the shadow in the above picture?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAr4PIAZiqQ
(from 3:35 to 3:52)

Also, in the Wampa attack, would it be conceivable to add a bit of blood to Luke and the Taun-Taun (maybe even show blood fly out of Luke's mouth when he is hit), be it in the initial impacts of the Wampa claw and/or when they fall down into the snow.  An extra or alternative could also be to add some sound FX to indicate Luke's jaw breaking from the hit as well as the Taun-Taun's neck being broken (celery is a good stand by, if not sampling other movies that have some bone breaking sound FX).

Could also consider adding some bass to the Wampa's claw impacts (nothing too Michael Bayish) - just something to indicate a creaure with the power of an 18 wheeler behind it, and it's hitting Luke and his steed full force.  Maybe you could show BOTH of the Wampa's arms and hands as it is choking/breaking the neck of the Taun-Taun.  When we see the Taun-Taun (at 3:42) you could show 2 hands grabbing onto the Taun-Taun's neck and twisting (or at least manipulate the Taun-Taun head to violently turn to the right with a sudden SNAP sound FX)

You could also show the Taun-Taun's eyes get wider when it starts freaking out from smelling the Wampa, and/or even see if you could have the Taun-Taun spin it's head quickly to the left (at 3:40) to face the Wampa when Luke gets knocked off (to look at the sudden movement coming from its flank)

You "could" change the footsteps in the background to go from the the center to Luke, as opposed to directly behind him.  That would give us a better indication of how far he has walked.

I also noticed at the (3:54) scene in the youtube.com link, the entrance of the rebel cave is somewhat different that the one we see in the rebel transport scene.

There are multiple ways to do this:

(1) upload an image to imageshack.com, photobucket or any number of free image hosting sites.  Once uploaded, you should see an URL for a clickable thumbnail.  You can then copy the URL address and insert it into your forum message.  Also make sure to hit the PREVIEW button below - I know that the imageshack.com thumbnail URL link has some extra junk you have to delete

(2) go to google.com or a search engine and look up images.  Once you find an image you like, you can:
(a) click on it, so a separate window will pop up just with that image and it's web address.  Scroll over the address with your mouse, right click and select COPY.
(b) you can right click the image on the web page, go to PROPERTIES, where an image address will pop up.  You scroll over that, right click and copy that.
(c) when you are creating a message, you will notice a grey bar above the white area that you actually type in.  You will see the options for B(old face), I(talics) and U(nderline) on the top left.  If you move over to the center-right side, you will have some other extra options:

- the " symbol creates "block quotes".  This is what those grey boxes are that contain other people's messages; this allows you to separate your comments from others in a nice and clean way that everyone can distinguish from.  This can be HELL since it tend to do random things (like block quote your ENTIRE MESSAGE when you just want the highlighted section blocked off).

- the CHAIN LINK symbol allows you to add a link to any word or phrase you highlight with your mouse.  So instead of having some mile-long website link address in your message, you could type "AT-AT green laser test", highlight those words, click on the CHAIN LINK button, go to another window with say the Youtube video that has said test (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KifI32YTwE), copy that link and insert it into the small box that pops up after you hit the CHAIN LINK button and Wala!  The phrase "AT-AT green laser test" is now blue and underlined, as well as linked to said Youtube page.  Now people can clearly see what the link is about as opposed to a jumble of internet nonsense.

The BROKEN CHAIN LINK button undos any links you may have.

- the GREEN PC MONITOR/ TREE (?) button allows you to edit/insert images.  A small box will pop up, where you can take the web address of your Imageshack, Google image or any web image address and insert it into the top line.  This can be a pain because it takes a good 10 to 30 seconds for the box to pop up.  Once you add the address and click ENTER, the image should pop up within the white area you are composing your message within. 

NOTE: make sure that when you use the BLOCK QUOTE or INSERT IMAGE options to hit the SPACE or ENTER key in the message area about 5 to 10 times to create some extra space below where you are going to create the block quote section or insert the image.  That way you will have some room to write about said quote or image.

(3) if you find an image within the forum that you want to use (or a link to youtube or even an entire message), you can choose the "reply with quote" option or just scroll over the area you want to use, right click with your mouse and COPY.  In this case, make sure you open 2 or more windows, so one can have your message in progress while you use the other window to access the forum for the images and/or messages you want to add to your own.

Hope that helps.

Okay, now I can't see what you're talking about!  >:)

I have the link to Lady Ferry's youtube clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UN8YIR60Ij0

Is it still at the 0:33 to 0:34 area?  If so, where abouts on the model is the glitching located?

ImperialFighter said:

 

I guess this would add to the "curvature of the planet" issue: if you follow the curve of the planet in the revised shot, there should be a little bit of space in the top left of the picture on the upper right of the left window.

Maybe you could bring the curving part in the center window a little to the right or up a little to account for the curve so it won't show in the left window, but this is a slight niggle - I can definitely deal with it (if you're just tired of messing with this shot).

Imp Fighter: no problemo.  You will discover the horror and fun that is "block-quoting"

adywan said:

I'm still debating about the ears but they'll probably end up included.

I noticed something interesting when i was watching SP FX: The making of the Empire Strikes Back today. They have a brief shot of the puppet and its slightly different than the one used in the movie. The film version has more hair added to its cheeks and this covers up the horns. so it was nice to see the puppet with its original horns.

 

You know, if you could just make the wampa to look like this, that would be perfect.

In regards to the ion cannon clip that you posted, I will go over it and see if I can pinpoint the issues brought up and post some screen caps.

I think it's perfectly fine.

Ady: while it would be kinda cool to add some minor detail to the "plateau" shot (with the first shot of the rebel transport), it's not really necessary.  It would be neat in a "train set/ military diorama" sort of way, in that you could see the overhead "blueprint" of just where everything is.



I guess it would be more like this:

(1)
you might not have actual "runways" on Hoth, but the point is that even from high altitude, when you have no clouds and snow to reflect sunlight, large objects like the ion cannon and shield generator would still stand out, and large spread-out things like the trench line would show up as well.


(2) http://www.flickr.com/photos/photophill/3295664805/in/pool-airport_aerial_shots
(this is from low Earth orbit - granted, it is a city, but you can still see details of human activity/presence)

(3) http://www.flickr.com/groups/airport_aerial_shots/

(4) http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&um=1&q=aerial+airport+snow&btnG=Search+Images

Again, while it would be cool to see such detail, overall I think the sequence is fantastic as-is and I would rather you work on the rest of the film.

I think that segment is just fine.  The (x-wing) explosion is far enough in the distance that any debris would be too small to matter.

Would it be conceivable to show the hanger and maybe the ion cannon in the distance behind the rebel transport?   In fact, shouldn't we be able to see the line (where the AT-AT battle takes place) off to the left?

I know this is crude (via Paint) but something like this:

 


Adywan said:
1. These ships are pretty high up in this shot and the scale of everything wouldn't allow you to see anything on the ground. You definitely wouldn't see the hangar entrance or any ships on the ground.

I would have to disagree a little here.  You may not see actual troops moving around and all, but you should still be able to see the hanger opening, the trench line and the ion cannon and shield generator, all due to the fact that we can see the mountain plateau (that I assume is where the rebel transport and 2 x-wings are coming from) and the surrounding ground.  The shot couldn't be more than 3000 to 6000 feet up into the air and taking into account:

(1) no clouds
(2) reflectivity of sunlight on white snow

Large items like the ion cannon and shield generator would definitely be noticeable from this distance considering there is nothing to inhibit our view (be it humidity, smog, clouds, etc).  Spread out items like the trench line (the gun turrets would be mere dots) would stretch out far enough that the pattern could be seen from high up - ala a farmer's field.

Now the ion cannon and shield generator would probably be smaller than the rough sketch above, but they should still be visible to some degree.

Hey Ganamae,

I edited my prior post to include your ideas (or our simultaneous ones); just scroll up and I have some clickable thumbnails.

rcb said:

Monroville said:

That.  Was.  Cool.

If that is any indication on the rest of it, the wait is just going to be that much harder.

 

U said it. damn u ady, u make this even harder! please hurry friend!

 

No, no, no.  Take yer time.  I can wait for Christmas.  I mean, it could come out by Christmas... right?

I mean, it would be a nice birthday present for you-know-who...

In regards to the "Good.  Our first catch of the day"
Well, fishermen usually catch fish and then eat them, so as a hunting term it fits perfectly.

adywan said:

i thought i'd better post this clip as there has been a lot of discussion about this scene. But this will definitely be the last one until the trailer. again the audio is a temp track so please no more comments about the levels of the fx etc. Most of the live action shots aren't the final versions but you'll have to wait until ESB:R is released to see those. Don't want to spoil everything. lol

ION CANON 720p XVID

That.  Was.  Cool.

If that is any indication on the rest of it, the wait is just going to be that much harder.

I guess one extra little bit to add:
on the very opening shot of the rebels outside the mountain hanger opening, the mountain is bluish compared to the white foreground.  I understand this is (1) the matte matching with the live-action shot and (2) a way of making the 2 stand out (though the mountain could be more whitish-grey than bluish), but also, there is a patch of white around the left gun tower.



I would see if you could blend the mid-ground in the center and on the right side with the mountain better, and at least make the area behind the rebel soldier and tower on the left bluish (or the whitish-grey if you change the mountain color) behind them.  Maaaybe spice up the hanger entrance or deep inside (so it's not just black with some lights).  I guess this would also apply to all of the shots that are similar to this one (when Han enters on his Taun-Taun, etc)

I guess one more (though this is no biggie):



Would it be conceivable to show the hanger and maybe the ion cannon in the distance behind the rebel transport?   In fact, shouldn't we be able to see the line (where the AT-AT battle takes place) off to the left?

I know this is crude (via Paint) but something like this:

ImperialFighter said:

 

Monroville, I've just realised that your recent 'additional Stardestroyers' suggestions (which tie-in nicely with the 'Fleet approaching Hoth' shot that appears just a little before), did not mention anything about this 'interior' shot, which has been confirmed as being the inside of Captain Lennox's 'Tyrant' Stardestroyer.

I think this was brought up @ 30 to 40 pages ago (its been a while), but my suggestion then was simply put the captain at the FRONT of the bridge as opposed to the side.  Thus, you delete the 2 side guys and replace them with more windows.  You could also rejigger the window the captain is in front of to make it identical in shape to the one Vader looks out of, if need be (you may need to add a bit more of a curve to the window shapes too).  Regardless, this should be an easy fix to keep it a view out the front as opposed to the side of the Tyrant SD.

  Should there be any kind of hint of Hoth's 'Moons' / or neighbouring 'Planets'? added to any of the other Hoth Planet shots, from the different angles that we see, do you think? -    

 

....and I'm just including this other view below too, for additional reference, so that all the Hoth Planet shots are nearby to scroll up and down....  (again, ignore the Stardestroyer element that was added at the time) -

Also , we see yet another good-sized portion of the Hoth Planet (and the space around it), at the point where we see a 'close-up' of the 'Probe' heading towards it, before it starts to burn up in the atmosphere.

In regards to the "moons of Hoth", I would either add them in all of the scenes showing Hoth but no moons, or just delete them and make Hoth a moonless planet.  Either way to retain continuity.

By the way Monroville, although I've now come round to being quite happy to see the existing shot of the 'single Stardestroyer over Hoth' kept, if Adywan chooses to do so (especially with his better colouration)....I'm still going to show my 2 favourite ALTERNATIVE variations for the shot (which lasts approx. 2 seconds), that I'd happily see also, but with a couple of additional comments about some changes -

 

 

 

One last thing, if there's any kind member here that is willing to PM me a step-by-step guide on how I can 'reply with quote' SEVERAL comments from VARIOUS posts, all together into one SINGLE post that I might like to make in future, I'd appreciate it, lol.  I still haven't figured out how I do this, and it would be a very helpful thing for me to know!   Many thanks.  :)     

 

One thing to keep in mind with this sequence is the time duration as well as the music score.  Remember that when this shot happens (right before the top image where captain what's-his-face says: "Good.  Our first catch of the day") you have the EMPIRE march playing fast (to indicate the adrenaline of first contact with the Empire and Rebels) and the visual only lasts maybe 1.5 to 2 seconds.  The above JEDI scene (with the SD moving over us as Vader's shuttle leaves towards the DS-2) lasts a bit longer at 4 to 6 seconds.  If anything I would keep the single Star Destroyer, but maybe do these alterations:

(1) bring it closer to the screen and show it moving/slightly sliding away and to the lower right as Hoth grows slightly bigger to help indicate the Tyrant has increased speed away from the rest of the fleet to intercept the first rebel transport.  The extra bit of added movement should compliment the music in this scene nicely.

(2) in the scene on the bridge (again, just remove the 2 guys on the right and replace them with more windows), again show Hoth slowly getting bigger with maybe a flash (extremely small, but to indicate the rebel transport taking off as well as the shield being opened) and then a slightly moving dot to indicate the RT already moving towards the Tyrant.

(3) this way it would segway nicely with the following shot after the ion cannon scenes, where we now see the rebel transport and escorts in the middle of the screen moving towards us/ the foreground.   This way we can see what the Tyrant's captain is making a comment on and it links the movement in the Tyrant bridge scene to the following RT and escorts with the ion beam shooting overtop of them.

I also concur on switchng the "Tyrant approaching Hoth" SD with the SD "under the Executor".  

Firstly, in addition to my recent post regarding the possibility of showing a hint of 'Moons' / or neighbouring 'Planets' in any of the other various Hoth Planet shots that we see -  I'd forgotten about a couple of other shots at the very start of 'Empire', that might be relevant to this issue, and which it would be worth having screenshots of, to refer to here -

When the introductory 'scroll' ends, and we 'pan down' to the single Stardestroyer dispatching 'Probes', we can see two brown 'Planets' (or 'Moons'?), one big one, and a small one.  We can also see a blue 'Planet' (is this the same one that's seen during Luke's departure from Hoth?), which is a medium-sized one compared to the other two.

It's difficult to judge how far the 'Probe' travels from the Stardestroyer that launches it, but these 'Planets' (or 'Moons') could be in a somewhat nearby proximity of the Hoth Planet too, which reinforces the notion that some extra nearby / or distant elements such as these, could be added to one or two of the other Hoth Planet 'angles' that we see....  There seems to be an abundance of these in the vicinity of the Hoth Planet, overall.

Well, I always thought that the SD in the very beginning (the post-scroll SD) was extremely far away from Hoth, and that the other probots were travelling at hyperspace until they detected a semi-habited world off the beaten path, crash-land, pop out and investigate.  You would still have to either add some moons to the shot showing the probot right before atmospheric entry or delete the moons from the later shots.

Ady: have you considered spicing up the background behind the post-scroll SD?  Considering the similarity between the appearance of Hoth, Dagobah and Bespin (which I think is the one that could be played with the most), maybe you could replace the rather boring backdrop with something else - a nebula or something.  There are plenty of Hubble images to pull from.

Going back to that screenshot above , it comes approx. 55 seconds (and I always look on it as 'real-time') after we last saw the Falcon blast away from the Rebel Base -  just something to think about Adywan, but would we perhaps still see a small 'Hoth Planet' element receding away somewhere in the distance behind?  (the Falcon and the 'Avenger' might have 'veered-away' from a direct 'line-of-sight', at some point during this intervening time, of course.  Who knows?)  But if you DO look on them as having taken a roughly 'line-of-site' route from where the Falcon blasted off from....do you think it would be good to STILL see a hint of it during the shot?

I agree with you here Imp Fighter: to actually see Hoth receding in the background (and have the stars slowly moving towards the back to help give both the Falcon and the SD some increased sense of speed), as well as the rest of the Imperial Fleet would be a fantastic visual (again, keep the Imp Fleet either in the middle ground or background, being that Vader and the rest of the troops would have needed a good 30 minutes to an hour to regroup, board transports and land on their respective ships, while the Avenger and 2 other SDs would have had the opportunity to immediately chase after the Falcon).

It would connect it with the Falcon's escape from Hoth and show an immediacy to the progression of events

Also, I would consider brightening/whitening the Falcon a little bit, to help it look more like the whitish-brown version in ANH but moreso to help it stand out from the similarly greyish SD behind it.

Bingowings said:

To illustrate this point I put Vaderious' interior shot roughly in scale into the window slit of this quite close shot of the head (bear in mind it hasn't been adjusted for shade and it hasn't got window glass and the interior shot is still too big).

You can hardly see a thing.

 

I would still prefer something like the above than nothing at all.   ANYTHING to show that this is not just a model with nothing in it.

Sevb32:
It being a viewscreen would be a cool idea too, but even then that would justify a bluish window or something other than a black bar.

Another idea in regards to the AT-AT heads and windows:

I can understand the "red" going away, due to the difficulty in creating the lighting effects inside the cockpit.  Would you consider adding "bluish-white" windows to the AT-ATs instead, so in the close-ups we can see into the windows and see the cockpit crew (ie the "inside window" shots in ALIEN, be it the bridge or Narcissus)?

In fact, if you considered this, you could keep the bluish view of the original 2004 SEs in regards to all of the "window shots looking out" when we are inside the AT-AT bridge (ie, the internal bridge shots are color corrected, but when we are behind the AT-AT drivers the stuff in the window view is the bluish tint, which would then match the bluish-white of the AT-AT windows on all of the outside head shots)

I suggest this because it would help to give the AT-ATs a sense of scale if we could actually see into the window and thus the model.  It is not so much the red color that is important as the idea of the AT-ATs having a viewable interior to help build the illusion that there are people inside.

Vaderios: is there any way you could do some mock-ups (maybe a mix of the what you created before: keeping the original color-corrected cockpit shot looking out at the fleeing rebels (without the red tint), but adding the extra display alterations and lighting) - both inside and outside the AT-AT head (you could take one of the previous AT-AT head shots and take the Veers shot and shrink it down to fit into the window slat). 

Here are a few more points to consider:

(1) maybe Ady could add a "bit" of the balcony on the left-side of the building Leia and Co. leave from.  Sure you could assume the balcony was on the other side of the building or just out of sight, but that would definitely "cement" the balcony's place by referring to it as an actual part of the building's architecture other than just a thrown in shot.

(2) I like 005's idea of adding in some orangish lighting in the back left areas of the hallway to further insinuate the balcony's existence.

(3) Ady: would you consider showing ships leaving Cloud City or some similar activity outside the balcony shot, as well as some moving clouds?  Maybe even some of those red lights that most buildings have on top to keep airplanes from crashing into them or alarm lights and/or sirens in the distance to indicate the entire city is on alert and being evacuated.

This could also be applied during all of the outside escape shots:
(4) when Leia and Co. are first outside the building and the stormtroopers are shooting at them, in the distance you can see large groups of small to large ships leaving - not so much actually taking off of landing bays, but moving from behind buildings and moving up into the air.  Again, could add faint background sirens.

(5) when we see the Falcon take off, you could show hundreds of specs of light of all the escaping ships (ala something along the lines of the Battlestar Galactica fleet - maybe not so much AS enormous in scale, but something to show an entire city is evacuating and the Falcon is escaping either in the middle of said evacuation or at the tail end of it - hence we can see the vast majority of escapees already far in the distance.

visual references:
Space 1999: Wargames (when moonbase alpha is evacuated)
Deep Impact (I believe there is a scene where multiple helicopters are leaving a city)

(6) when Leia picks up Luke, possibly continue to show in the extreme distance the lights of the hundreds of Cloud City escapees, but maybe have the Falcon do the "immelman" manuveur because there is an escaping ship or two the Falcon has to "loop around" in order to head back to Cloud City.

(7) defintely consider upping the TIE fighter number to 8 or larger, since Vader would definitely not be pulling punches at this moment and would think that he would have them cornered.  The 4 TIES before and during the asteroid sequence could be explained as Vader "herding" them to a hiding place (ie. he was doing an alternate version of the same plan he concocted with Tarkin in ANH - make them think they escaped while making it look good), whereupon he would intercept them, capture them and then set a trap for Luke. 

Now that it is definite that they are all together, there would be entire squadrons of TIES from the Executor itself going full force to herd them directly to Vader.  Now since the TIEs would be there to "herd" them and not destroy them, it would explain a large number (be it 8 to 20) chasing the Falcon and still NOT destroying them. 

It could also help explain why the Falcon wasn't tractored in during that first "Executor hull shot" - so many fighters flying around the Falcon it caused trouble for the lock-on.  An officer would give an order to the TIE pilots to back off, then allowing for a lock-on, whereupon the Falcon makes the hyperspace jump.

While not necessary, it would be interesting to hear the officers frustration in the background of the Executor bridge shots (as if they are coming from the pit crew a good 10 to 15 feet away from Vader, who is in the foreground in all of the bridge shots), something along these lines:

"sorry sir, we're having a hard time locking on.  There's too may fighers around the target"
"(talking to TIE captain) TIE leader, you're too close.  Back off and we can make a lock with the tractor beam"
In fact this dialogue could happen directly before Piett goes to Vader and tells him "they will be in tractor beam range shortly".  You could even overlap the dialogue a little (time the last part of the second sentence to blend with Piett turning to face Vader) - being that it would be quieter and behind Piett, as in the above situation is what provokes Piett to say something to Vader, who has to be wondering why they haven't tractored them already.

Maybe even have multiple background chatter (that is a little fainter so we can't hear specific words, but still indicate a busy bridge) which then goes silent once the Falcon makes the jump.  IE. everyone on the bridge is intent on capturing the Falcon as Vader (be it out of fear of Vader or just pissed at the ineptness of the other SD captains - I would think these people would be a bit more elite serving on the Executor and would have something to prove) hence the bridge chatter to indicate the busy-ness of the crew to make "this" work - which then goes silent to further emphasis the "holy crap, we failed.  What is Vader going to do now?" ambiance.

In fact, if you like this idea, maybe this is how you could have a contest so to speak so 2 lucky people could get audio cameos.  Even if you limited it to those in England (being that  the Imperials do all seem to have a British accent) you could pick either some friends or winners to do said (or similar) dialogue as well as bridge background chatter.

In response to the Bespin balcony scene, could Lady Ferry or someone else post a link to that segment via a video link on Youtube?  I think it is not so much a matter of how that one shot looks per se, so much as how it fits with the rest of the sequence.

Llike Gorilla mentioned, if you see the balcony, but then when you see the same hallway but from a different perspective and there is NO balcony, or in the case where Leia and Co. go outside the door R2 opens and we do not see a balcony from the outside - as in on the side of the buidling that they just came out of- that would pose a problem.  Consistency is the key and making sure that everything "fits" from an architectural point of view; it is the same with the Carbonite chamber and how it fits with the rest of the scenery (regardless of what in particular is done).

Savage:  I understand your POV as well - that's how I thought of the carbonite chamber: it was inside the shaft wall and Luke went into the arm connecting the Fin Pod to the air shaft.  We don't have to see Luke or whoever go down every flight of steps or ladders to understand that a large distance is covered, but in circumstances where you literally go from one set to the other (or you can SEE bits of what looks like the previous set) you try to fit it all together in your mind after the 10th viewing or so.

Can anyone torrent this file then?  If anything, I can do the breakdown for Rapidshare or MegaUpload. 

Second post (posting on this thread in case Ady has deleted his subscription to the others):

Sorry for the "fishing"... it is that those of us on the forums don't know which message other forum members may be watching, so the reasoning is to post at least 2 or 3 different threads in the hope that someone (like yourself) will at least notice one of them.

I am still wondering if the PS3 system firmware update isn't playing a factor in any of this as well.

Regardless, I appreciate the in-depth response and I will test those suggestions out to see if they work on my machine.

PS: is there a way to create a DVD with menus and such AND have the 720p video?  In another question, I was wondering if there was a way to do this and put it into an ISO file, so after download one could use IMGburn to simply burn the ISO to disc and have the best of both worlds (720p image and have a menu with possible extras)