It was actually chilling for me to see the teaser and with how they revealed the Death Star, very cool! I wonder was that planet we were on supposed to be Endor, as though they built both of them there?
It was just confirmed that first standalone SW film, Rogue One, will be about a band of Rebels stealing the plans of the first Death Star.
^ That is EXACTLY what I had thought of too (among the thousands of other things). It's a very nice nod to that classic image if you ask me :)
WOW that new trailer!! Loved every second of it... and some man tears (again) were confirmed.
"Chewie, we're home." Yes, yes we are XD
Those are badass pictures! I really like the detailing on Kylo's mask and it's awesome seeing the different kinds of troopers and their various weaponry. I'm pumped!
Very cool :D Can hardly wait to see much more from where that came from really soon!
Thank the maker! I still wish I could be going to the celebration to see and experience everything firsthand, but this is undoubtedly the next best option.. as long as the internet will survive :)
generalfrevious said:
Or just play Jedi Rocks over the Lucasfilm logo. At least that would be a slight improvement over what is there now
Shirley you can't be serious.
Masirimso3 said:
That's fine, however in my opinion the duel of Bespin would work very well with action music, a portion of used it did too, the middle portion, with The Clash of the Lightsabers. Without Duel of the Fates it still works but not much would change. Duel of the Fates gives more excitement to it in my opinion.
While music can sometimes make a scene more exciting, other times though (depending on the mood and what's happening in a scene), no music can have its own positive reward and therefore be the better choice. In the case of Luke's initial confrontation with Vader in the freezing chamber, no music there makes the scene more ominous in an already haunting environment. Our ears really hone in on all the details around - the steam and other subtle background elements, Vader's breathing, then the duel itself - it's a very thrilling experience of its own really :)
Of course I understood perfectly well you were talking about Bane's overall garb, but since you first SPECIFICALLY spoke of his hat, that's why I SPECIFICALLY chose to defend that - I hope you understand that now.
Then I did eventually bring up the design of the Duros species too (it was different enough from discussing that hat and attire) since that would ALSO be included in the overall "campy", "caricature", "design" argument you brought up, so I opted to defend that as well.
That's how it was for the rest of the debate too: You mentioned his character to be boring and non-threatening, so that's why I even tried to give you examples in TCW to defend why I felt that's untrue, whether or not in your mind you consider that moot.
You didn't seem to think this character can be ported over into the live-action medium, so then I tried expressing how I strongly believe that's actually untrue and how the live-action version would also appear DIFFERENTLY (on so many levels) than how we know it in TCW.
Anyway, I have no problem with you having your own opinions about Cad Bane, but because you stated several negative opinions about a generally-like character, well, naturally I was curious why. I wanted good reasons why YOU felt that way, and then I was dishing out several of MY counterarguments for the other side of the coin. It was up to you if you'd let it sway you and perhaps even cause you to reconsider some of your own opinions, which is always a possibility...
But anyway, this debate has of course gone on far too long than it really needed, and it's becoming rather stale at this point - it's just too bad that it doesn't seem like anything was accomplished by it all. Let's end it with that.
brash_stryker said:
The same goes for my campy comment. You took me out of context and showed that picture of a sinister looking Duros to contradict me, but it's without the campy cowboy getup which is my main point of contention, though the fact that he's a bright blue alien with it doesn't help matters.
I showed that picture so that you may actually see the tone and look for what this potential Duros in live-action may be similar to, since you've been expressing all along how you don't like its "campy" design. As I did, fill in the rest with your imagination.
Star Wars draws a lot of inspiration from earth stuff. Of course it does, that's unavoidable. I just think a cowboy hat is too blatant a homage. It just looks silly in my opinion. Especially on a blue alien. Though it seems this is the very reason you think it DOES work, and I respect your opinion. I'm definitely not going to get into any argument based on your speculation as to the fictional reasons Duros might wear hats though.
Okay, fair enough if the hat really bugs you that much. I still feel it all works fine, not blatant as you feel it is, but just as the other western influences were referenced in the OT.
I've never once said that characters from animation can't be ported over to other mediums. You seem intent on making out I have, but I can't find anywhere where that's even implied. I merely expressed it about this particular one.
Yes you have, it's exactly one of the arguments you made in your first post that started this whole debate in the first place. Here it is for reminder:
I dont understand why anyone finds these cartoon characters compelling. They're laughable caricatures; completely fine for the medium they're presented in, but have absolutely no place in a live action, more serious movie.
I doubt I'm alone. You also seem unable to differentiate between my dislike for the character in TCW, and my opinion that his appearance makes him unsuitable for Revisited. You've said I'm now "backtracking" or "narrowing down" my reasons for disliking the character. Not at all. I still think the character was one dimensional and boring with cliched lines, voice and no character development whatsoever. But none of that matters when it comes to Revisited as it's only his appearance (which includes his attire) that's relevant there, which is why I've not mentioned any of that other stuff since my initial post mentioning my dislike of TCW.
I don't agree, because I still see potential.
Incidentally though, you're bringing up Bane's actions in the show. These aren't relevant when it comes to our point of discussion - you thinking he would be a good fit for Revisited.
It was relevant since you were claiming how non-threatening a character he was, so I was providing some background examples from the show. I do still think he would be a fine addition for Revisited if treated properly.
When I referred to him having 'Kids' show' written all over him, again, I was referring to his appearance (is it sinking in yet?)
I guess not. I don't see anything about him that has "Kids' Show" written all over him (I'm imagining the live-action version, which I have been trying to get you to do all along).
There are so many things you're quoting out of context I can't even keep track.
Not so. You made your argument(s), and I replied with a counterargument(s) right after it.
Likewise, I mentioned Zabraks and Twileks as examples because it wouldn't be a rubber mask, it would be makeup. Yknow....allowing the actor to....act and emote. And the audience to relate in ways they couldn't otherwise.
People can certainly relate with and sense the emotions Yoda had, so why limit it to just people with their faces exposed? I'm not against seeing more of those kinds, but let's aim higher, let's get more aliens with non-human-looking faces to show in the PT - need to replace much of the bad CG ones.
A rubber mask which is meant to be the character's actual face is not comparable to a helmet/mask with an implied face beneath or a droid without any face at all. There's no point even attempting to compare the two as they are completely different.
Not as different as you think. It doesn't matter so much if the character is wearing a helmet, prosthetics, make-up, or is a droid, the audience can still identify and relate with that character if there's still something about them they can connect with. So while it helps, an emotive face doesn't always have to be there. In the case of Bane, though, he can have an emotive face by digital manipulation on the prosthetic mask.
We don't question that Vader is wearing a helmet. It IS in actuality a helmet and this adds an air of mystery and menace simply because we don't know what's under there.
With a rubber face, there is no mystery. It's the alien's face. More likely than not, it won't be mouthing words properly and won't be emoting. "But aliens might emote differently" I hear you say. Fine. I still think he looks stupid in his cowboy outfit. Or perhaps you think Ady should put in months of work making the face more animated. Well I hate to break it to you, but adding expressions to a Duros, or blinks to a Rodian are one thing, but animating full speech needs existing puppeteering/animatronics to use as a starting point to look good. CG mouth replacements are a lot of work and as far as I know, beyond the scope of this edit.
The person wearing the Duros mask can speak as normal to get the mouth of the mask to make some movement. Ady can then later add in the extra articulation as he did for Yoda in ESB:R. I know easier said than done, but I do believe it can be done convincingly enough and the extra effort to go this route would go a very long way. And who knows what all available resources will be for him by this time, to do things he never thought he could do before.
So because I dislike a cartoon character, that means I'm closed minded. Lol. Ok. You've convinced me. I'll stop looking for excuses and allow the light of Cad Bane into my life. ;)
No, it's because you still don't seem to want to imagine the possibility for a character from TCW (who you originally don't like) to be made to work into a viable and interesting character in a live-action PT film (who you would possibly then like). Just because at first it doesn't sound like a good idea to you, doesn't mean there won't be something you can take away from it and like in the end.
Brash_stryker said:
I'm aware he's the same species as in the cantina, however the Duros in the cantina work as background aliens for me because they're so unusual. It's way too campy a design for a prominent villain in a live action medium.
Well, because of its unusual design wouldn't it therefore be fitting to use it as a potential spotlight character in SW? Bane's already an established and compelling character of this species to boot... now you suddenly backtracked when you say "campy design" *sigh* if given the proper mask/prosthetics and some digital manipulation, how can you honestly claim something like this to be campy?
Again, let me stress, he's fine where he belongs. In a cartoon.
And let me stress again that any character can be made to belong in any medium. He's fine in the cartoon and he could be equally fine in live-action if given a chance.
As for the cowboy hat, yes I have a problem with it. Because it's taken straight from our earth cowboys.
Now if the hat were a blatant copy of what we commonly see here, like the style we always see John Wayne wearing, then I'd agree with you... but fortunately it isn't. Cad's, while it is inspired by Western culture (everything in Star Wars is inspired by some culture or another), it has its own touches of personality about it that make it its own and not straight from Earth. Plus, the fact that this different hat is worn by an unusual alien, I say it works, he pulls off the look well. He doesn't always have to wear the hat either, but perhaps most often he needs a hat like that of that size because his particular skin is extra sensitive to light? The two Duros in the cantina aren't seen with a hat because they are in the dim-lit cantina, but outside they might have some sort of hat.
So with your side of the argument, does that mean you have a problem with guns and holsters at the hips too? Those are inspired heavily from "earth cowboys" as well. How about Chewie's crossbow, inspired from the Medieval ages? I hope not.
To reiterate, there are so many things in Star Wars taken from all kinds of earthly cultures/time periods, and mixes it up to give them their own twist - the Western culture is certainly not an exception.
Subtlety is something children's shows don't need. However, movies do.
It actually really depends on what the story/director is trying to convey to the audience. Some things can be subtle, other things don't need to be.
My reasoning makes perfect sense. I think it's you that's misunderstood why I see him as a caricature. It's not the expressions/antics inherent to the childish medium that bothers me.
No, you were telling me (paraphrasing) that a character of an animated cartoon could not be put in a live-action film - come on, you can't honestly say that makes perfect sense; it happens all the time, and vice versa (the key thing is doing it right, which has happened before and can be done here as well).
Well at least now you appear to be narrowing it down to just disliking his hat and character design... we may be making some progress yet...
As you've made clear, these can be changed for a movie, and I completely agree.
You sure didn't seem to understand and agree with this before...
As I explained above, his design bothers me as it is derivative of OUR world, not a galaxy far far away.
I haven't seen any blue people on Earth, unless you count the Blue Man Group. If it's the humanoid that bothers you, then why are you accepting of Twi'leks and Zabraks that you mention in the upcoming quote? Those are humanoids, in fact there are a whole lot of humanoids in SW.
Also, people relate to other humans, or at at least human faces better when it comes to loving or hating a character (which I think is key in this instance). If there was another character design which could be a human in makeup (a la Twileks or Zabraks) then I'd be more open to it.
We don't necessarily need a human face or a face for that matter to relate to the character. It does also depend on their personality and actions if we love or hate them. Just look at Vader, we don't see his face, only a scary mask most the time and we love him. Look at R2, no human face whatsoever, but we love him. (Just to name a couple.)
As it stands, Cad Bane would have to be CG, or have a REALLY expressive prosthetic mask. Even if I did like his design, it wouldn't work even for a big movie production.
He does not have to be CG, nor should he be. The original Duros in the Cantina weren't CG and Ady, as he's proven in ANH:R, can work wonders with static masks. Greedo looks incredibly "alive" with the digitally manipulated expressions! Find a person with a slim and proper build to fit into a tailored Cad Bane suit, find a good Duos mask/prosthetic and we're off.
It would be like the Neimoidians all over again. They weren't threatening either.
Well that is part of the goal of Revisited, isn't it? To improve on characters where needed?
The fact he's a Duros doesn't change how I feel about it. I'm not going to suddenly like his character design just because he happens to be the same species we see in ANH. Lol.
That's good, because then you'd suddenly be contradicting your argument if you did.
Also, I agree that not everything from the PT was bad, and I do have an open mind already.
If that were true, then I simply don't understand why you have been gathering EVERY possible excuse you can grab onto for not wanting to like the Bane character, and why you choose not to see even the slightest potential he can have in live-action.
I get it. Characters can be adapted from film to cartoons. But you've got to ensure that when the reverse happens, it's not such a childish design that it'll look stupid in live action.
Again, any thing can be great in any medium. It is all dependent on who's in charge of it. I have no doubt Ady can accomplish it amazingly well if he wanted to do this.
In the case of Cad Bane, I believe I'm right.
In other words, you don't believe Ady can successfully do it.
Aurra Sing and all the other movie characters taken across to TCW looked less cartoony in their designs as a result of not having started as a cartoon.
I disagree with your notion. I'd have to say that Palpatine and Dooku were more "cartoony" looking than Bane in TCW (their shaped faces and hair were extremely exaggerated compared to their real counterparts), and those were main characters from the live-action films. But it doesn't actually matter how cartoony they look in TCW, what matters is how any of them look and feel in a live-action film.
Cad Bane has kids' show written all over him.
Not exactly true as you put it. Breaking necks, shooting innocent people behind their back, and any other method of killing... Yeah, right.
It's like they looked at the subtle things about Boba Fett and amped it up for an audience that can't pick up on these subtle cues yet.
I'd say the only inspiration from Boba was "we want an awesome bounty hunter just as Boba Fett was". Otherwise, you're comparing apples and oranges here. They may both be bounty hunters, but they have plenty enough of their own idiosyncrasies that make them different from each other.
"We've got to show he's a frontier rogue. Like a cowboy. How do we get kids to understand that?"
"Give him a cowboy hat?"
"Someone get this man a cookie!"
Well, great ideas, I'm sure, have been thought up while cookies were involved.
brash_stryker said:
I haven't watched The Clone Wars more than once. I ultimately found it lame and very kiddy (yes I'm aware it's a kids' show before anyone says it), though I'm aware I'm probably in the minority as most people seem to rave about it.
I agree there were episodes and elements within the overall story that I found to be actually lame and kiddish, but you just answered it yourself, it was aimed for kids... but really, not all of it was. In fact, there were some really serious moments that I dare say are not quite appropriate for some younger kids.
Anyway, I don't think Cad Bane was at all threatening or a particularly memorable character.
I thought he was; he's ruthless and will shoot anyone. Perhaps he could be moreso if he was given the chance with sufficient screen time in a live-action film?
Boba Fett borrowed from the cowboy archetype, down to his gravelly voice, the stirrup sound effect when he walked, and his general demeanour. He was threatening and sinister from how he's presented - faceless, battlescarred armour, doesn't talk much.
Hell yeah :)
With Cad Bane, you have an almost neon blue alien with red eyes, a cliche 'bad guy voice' and wearing a literal cowboy hat.
You make it sound like there's something wrong with a neon blue alien with red eyes. It's alien, very fitting for Star Wars, and the species name is Duros, who are also seen in the Cantina of the original Star Wars, if you remember. I strongly disagree about his voice, that's part of what makes him so interesting and badass - I can't think of a single character who sounds just like him. You have a problem with his cowboy hat and yet just earlier you praised Fett and his cowboy archetype? hmm.
I don't understand why anyone finds these cartoon characters compelling.
It could be because some of them actually have an interesting and compelling character arc - comes down to opinion I guess. Cad Bane's character I found to be the most compelling in the "Hostage Crisis" episode of Season 1. Check it out if you need a reminder, but really, I think he's a treat to see in just about any episode he's in.
They're laughable caricatures; completely fine for the medium they're presented in, but have absolutely no place in a live action, more serious movie.
It's because they are a cartoon is why they're a "caricature". Why can't a character originally created for an animation be in a live-action film? Your reasoning doesn't make sense here. That's exactly like saying live-action characters can't later become animated, or characters from books should not be in live-action or animated films. Yes their expressions and antics may be exaggerated for its target audience in the cartoon, but doesn't mean the same would be true in the live-action.
I understand you may not have meant to take absolutely everything about the character, but personally I see nothing about it that's of any use. He has the same lazy, derivative, and stereotypical character design as some of the CG Prequel villains, except it's even worse.
Again, his character design is based on the pair of Duros in the Cantina of the original Star Wars, not the PT. Do you still feel the same way about the design now? Even if his character is from the PT era, that doesn't automatically make him a bad character either. Not everything that resulted from the PT is bad. Have an open mind, please.
It could in actuality be a completely new bounty hunter too, but the reason I chose Cade Bane is because he's already an established character of this time period that most SW fans are at least aware of, who I think is awesome and with potential, and thought it'd be perfect if we see more of him and less of Jango (making Boba Fett more his own and unique). Aurra Sing is another potential bounty hunter, who was mentioned earlier, and indeed she was originally seen in TPM and later "caricatured" in the Clone Wars show.
Sorry didn't mean to sound like a hard ass in any of this, but some times we gotta stand up for something if we really believe in it and like it :)
brimforge said:
There is always room for more(!) bounty hunters, why should there be only one or two
This greatly depends on the story itself, I guess, if one or several are needed. And there is such a thing as too much (more on that later) ;)
see ESB, there were in fact nearly 10, ok not all had much screentime, but I think if one finds guys with well designed costumes, additional scenes can be inserted for a more logical plot ...
Right, but there was one who stood out more than the rest in ESB and that was Boba Fett, because he had the most screen time. Of course there could be some other bounty hunters in the PT as background/secondary characters, but my suggestion was there needs to be a main, cool bounty hunter of the PT (a non-Mandalorian to either replace most of or all of Jango - and Cad Bane is a good pick), just as Boba became the main, cool bounty hunter for the OT. The main villains, just like the main heroes, need sufficient screen time too so their character may be fleshed out and become memorable - but if you start to have too many main characters/bounty hunters, it detracts from this.
It's puzzling that those images would get leaked..
Had to say it :)
I could be the only one, but I would really enjoy seeing a live-action Cad Bane for the PT:R. He was unique and easily one of the best parts about the CW series (I know that show has no bearing on the edit, but if something is good, it could/should be used). I guess I really wish, for more variety and other reasons, it were originally an original bounty hunter, such as Cad, who would be the cool bounty hunter in the PT, and left Boba's origin alone and leave him be as the cool bounty hunter in the OT. My thoughts on that :)
I have read that article in the first post and what's on the Vudu page, and I could see certain interviews were new, but other feautures I thought for sure were already a part of the blu ray set (let alone the deleted scenes). I could be wrong, it's just been a long while since I've visited those extras on the blu rays. $90 still sounds a bit much for the bundle I think :/
Anyone yet determine how many of these special features are completely brand new and exclusive for these digital releases?
Otherwise, if not a lot, I cannot see very many people purchasing these digital copies at a whopping $90 for the bundle on Vudu, especially if they may already own the blu rays.
^ Yep, I agree with this.
Plus, while the '04 SE Jabba is leagues and bounds better than the '97 SE Jabba, it still looks very different from the ROTJ Jabba. Also his villainous demeanor is not at all present here as it was in ROTJ. It was cool to actually see Jabba move for once, I'll give it that.
Furthermore, the first proper reveal of the Millennium Falcon should be while Luke is seeing it for the first time. From how it was shot, it's as if it was always meant to be: the camera pans, the orchestra swells, then... we see the MF, followed closely by Luke's "What a piece of junk!" - flawless ;) Having the Jabba sequence beforehand ruins that moment for the audience because we've already casually seen the MF in the background.
As long as the characters are awesome and interesting, I think we'll accept whatever their names are.
...just so long as we don't have to remember anything like Vis'kullrum'sceaneh'turk Gormihuda'necketer ;)
This is supposedly the latest description for the upcoming trailer.
- The run time is just under 2 minutes, about 1:50 seconds.
- Han Solo, Princess Leia, R2-D2 and C-3PO are all in there.
- The planet of Yavin appears.
- Finn (John Boyega) with a blue lightsaber.
- A brief shot of the chrome Stormtrooper, possibly named Captain
- Phasma, played by Gwendoline Christie.
- Kylo Ren’s face is revealed.
- Poe Dameron (Oscar Isaac) shoot down a TIE fighter.
- Finn and Poe walking past a TIE Fighter.
- Multiple shots of Rey (Daisy Ridley).
- A shot of Poe Dameron, R2-D2, C-3PO, and a CGI character that may
- be “Rose” played by Lupita Nyong’o
- BB-8 in the back of an X-Wing.
- Kylo Ren’s Imperial Shuttle flies with TIE Fighters to a Star Destroyer.
- More Star Destroyers.
- The Millennium Falcon.
- X-wing Fighters in a V formation.
- Darth Vader’s helmet sitting on a podium.
- No Andy Serkis.
- No Luke Skywalker.
Since we know the track record for rumored trailer descriptions, I'll only believe it when I see it ;) It's still fun to speculate, though.
Very interesting if true about seeing the Vader helmet sitting on a podium; I can imagine the chills I'd get seeing that. And I'd actually be okay with it if they don't yet reveal Luke in a trailer, just as another way to make us very eager and wanting more (as if we weren't already) :P
I think he looks incredibly great here, which was during the time he was being filmed for TFA.
Tobar said:
But things like the crossguard saber do not bode well.
BB-8 said:
Gotta roll with it.
Ah you're wearing a costume, now I'm understanding your situation :) Is this the 'maiden voyage' with the costume? May we eventually get to see it? ;)
If it were me I think I'd go with Clarion Hotel Anaheim Resort for $159 single/double. I'm also cheap and not too picky :) but it is only 1 block away.