.Mac.

Just wanted to chime in and bring up something that I hope might worthwhile? So we have an intern at work who is a computer guy and a big SW fan and yet, to my surprise, had never even heard of this project. So I talked about the goals of the edit, its history, and where things are now, and just to further convince him of the level of work being put into this, I went back in here to show off some of the more recent comparisons which Ady posted. Needless to say he was of course very impressed and so going forward I do hope he will watch Ady’s career with great interest, but (now getting to the point) he did make a good suggestion, to which I agree, about a particular detail concerning two of the shots on the Death Star during the final battle.

In the following two gifs, the camera is stationary and fixed on the Death Star, and we also know that the Death Star is currently moving while orbiting around Yavin, so what he pointed out was shouldn’t we see a subtle movement of the stars in the background in shots like these?:

https://i.postimg.cc/j2WMdn1d/2.gif
https://i.postimg.cc/BbGCs72N/5.gif

I know the above shots are quick, and someone could also try arguing that the Death Star is moving in a direction that is just away from the stars so they would only appear still in space, etc., but I have to still very much agree that seeing a subtle star movement could be a nice touch and in line with other fixes made. I do think, though, for any of the shots where the camera is moving n’ rolling all around, the eyes won’t really pick up on whether or not the stars are shifting, just only whenever the camera is static. I’m sure Ady is likely nearing the homestretch for the edit and probably even getting anxious for it to be finished (especially with the recent health conditions that have come up [which I was very shocked and sorry to recently read about, but especially relieved to hear it seems to have subsided!]), so no worries at all if not, but just thought this idea was, at the very least, worth a mention and consideration if, Ady, you agree and only if it was easy to implement 😄

Enthusiastically raises hand
I noticed and that too is one of my favorite fixes 😉 Other great mentions are seeing the correct number of X-Wings in a shot as well as proper backgrounds behind pilots, especially, as little as it might be, the trench now appearing behind Red Leader as he says “This is it”. And I love the choice to have Vader make all the kill shots in the trench - it just makes sense.

As always, thank you Ady for sharing this update with us! Hoping you had a great Christmas and now soon to be New Years 😄

I noticed something and just curious if was intended or not:

The green and blue flashy lights on the left-hand side of Red Leader’s dash, at 51sec and 1min2sec, appear normal for the edit. But then, at 1min15sec and 1min22sec, those same lights are suddenly devoid of color. The red and yellow lights appear untouched, though. Anyone else see this too? If intentional, I must be missing the reason why 😄

Perfection! I was hopeful that could be the end result, eliminating the droid entirely. You did that so quickly like all it took was just the snap of your fingers 😃

Thank you for sharing the comparison reel, Ady, and as always it looks incredible! Watched it several times now and even once with your original ANH:R playing for comparison also. It’s fun to see how your talents have grown over the years and I can’t imagine it looking even better than this, so now, truly, “your skills are complete” 😃

Loved seeing all the various fixes and enhancements in the clip but one of my favorites (and I’m surprised nobody else mentioned it) is the occasional glow effect you’re implementing with some of the laser bolts, especially noticeable during the trench run; I think a small but substantial detail like that goes a long way for making them look even more real and therefore further immerses you in the action!

Well we didn’t see a K2 security droid walking by during that elevator scene but my fingers are still crossed that we still might get a surprise for either the full version of the scene or in a hallway elsewhere on the Death Star 😉 Ooh, or maybe (also) a couple/few K2 droids at the end of the hallway during the “Han chasing storm troopers scene” (no idea if you’re planning to keep the SE edit or revert it to be simpler and more like the original).

oh_riginal said:

…The only thing that still bothers me is when the rebels are flying away after the Death Star explodes, the Falcon always looked like it was flying crooked, like it’s not facing completely forward. I don’t know if I’m explaining it well enough, but the trajectory and the ship’s angle don’t seem to match…

NeverarGreat said:

You know, something that’s always bugged me about ANH and its Special Edition is that in the final shot of the ships headed back to Yavin after the Death Star’s destruction, the Falcon model enters frame from the left but then moves into the center of the frame without substantially changing orientation. https://youtu.be/tYZuOSZj2wg?t=483

The Falcon model clearly starts turning left as it enters frame, as expected, but then it stops turning and just continues almost straight forward with its nose pointed well to the right of Yavin and its engines firing to the left. It’s a really bizarre movement that I would have thought Lucas would have changed in the SE like he did in so many other weird model shots.

Of course, I imagine it would be difficult for Ady to fix this issue since it would require rigging and filming a whole new model (practically or digitally) to put in that shot.

Yeah you guys aren’t alone about this. What helped me all these years, justifying the MF’s semi-awkward movement, is thinking that it is simply doing a little space drifting right there, lol. If Ady decides to do a touch-up on it after all, that’d be awesome, but if not, I’ll continue my space drift theory 😄

As for the “red Artoo” talk, I wasn’t bothered by the color change but understand the comments about it and agree maybe there could be another better way. Very curious now to see the alternate idea you’re already exploring for improving that shot, Ady. I’m supposing it’ll be easier to replace it with something new than removing the “red artoo” entirely.

It all looks great in that clip, Ady! Had a big smile noticing R2 is getting some extra “happy feet” in (as well as it being a continuity fix). Always looking forward to seeing more and hoping everything is proceeding as you have foreseen so far!

And just thinking aloud here: Not sure if you’ll showcase some beforehand or keep them a surprise until the release, either way, very intrigued to see what you might have up your sleeve for any drastic changes/editing.

Always looking forward to and excited to seeing all of your updates, Ady! Excellent work in the recent video!

There is something I am hoping to bring up, though, and it’s regarding that first shot with Tarkin. I love how in the original it is an artistic shot with a clear view of Alderaan - it’s aesthetically pleasing even if inaccurate. Now, with the changes that were made here - which I do understand is for continuity - the unfortunate matter is (in my humble opinion) too much of Alderaan is obscured by control panels which, visually, isn’t nearly as striking of a shot as the original. So an idea to help this could be: How about shifting the right-side technician and his panels slightly over to the right? Just enough so the audience can always see Alderaan in its entirety. Or, would it be easier and better to make Alderaan appear larger (as large as the original and make it consistent from there) so that way it’ll still stand out even if some panels partially get in the way? Or both ideas? If this panel shift were to be made, it should be pointed out there is a similar shot later during the battle of Yavin when Tarkin says “You may fire when ready”, however, I don’t think a change to the panels there has to be necessary (even for continuity - but can be anyway if wanted). I don’t know if I’m the only one who thinks this, but just wanted to share anyway 😃

As I speak, in line and just about to see TLJ a second time, and will be seeing it yet again tomorrow. This movie, just as the case was for TFA, definitely requires more than one viewing to put my thoughts together and make up my mind how I feel about it overall.

For anyone curious about my first impression, though, I did have mixed-feelings all around - a great many things I really liked, but also a great many things I didn’t. A few examples: I enjoyed the talk between Yoda and Luke, but man, I couldn’t believe how wrong Yoda’s face looked in the first couple shots (it was too ‘pudgy’ with other off-looking facial features - almost as bad as the TPM creepy puppet, honestly), but as the scene carried on, he did somehow start to look better to me; I was fine with how Snoke died, but I’m not yet sure I liked how so suddenly he was taken out without learning a single new, interesting thing about him, so to me he was a wasted opportunity and just a one-dimensional baddy; I liked that Finn got the chance to have a proper face-off with Phasma, but hated how once again her character was treated; if only their fight and her (definite) death were in VII instead - that would’ve been far better for both characters (Now I just hope she died for good because it’s been embarrassing how her character has been treated in both films); I liked that they attempted to give Leia some strength with the Force, but the execution of it was so cheesy to me (when she was ‘flying’ in space back to safety with that ‘Peter Pan pose’); I absolutely loved the Rey and Kylo dynamic, but I wish I cared more for the Finn/Rose; I liked certain aspects about Luke, but certain other things did feel disjointed from how we knew him in the OT (I was really hoping for a better reason reason for his self-imposed exile while the First Order and Snoke rose to power, instead of just feeling guilty about Ben). Those are just some of my initial likes and dislikes that come mind, but sometime after my third viewing, I’ll give a proper review and cover more.

doubleofive said:

Collipso said:

Adywan, do you plan on changing the font used on “RETURN OF THE JEDI” in the title crawl to the font used for The Empire a Strikes Back and A New Hope’s crawls? Sorry for asking again if you have already answered this.

He already fixed the crawls!

https://youtu.be/F51kdD6raUc

And for those who were wondering, that clip does also confirm Ady added a fourth period to the ROTJ ellipsis. As minuscule as it may be, I’m actually glad he felt the same about it 😃

By the way, does anyone know what happened to the user, muddyknees? He used to be an avid contributor to this site during ESB:R and I appreciated his thoughts. Has he just moved on in life? I hope he’s okay.

I remember some time long ago when I was watching ROTJ with a girlfriend and when she saw Salacious Crumb (just like in the gif that Duracell posted), she asked me, “Is that thing some kind of goiter with a head? They look attached.” I just smiled and said, “Nope, it’s worse than that.” I am relieved it sounds like we may be seeing Crumb (and his laughing) less often 😉

Glad to also hear that about the gonk droid; indeed the torture had an uncomfortably childish vibe about it. I had thought it could’ve been improved if just the cartoonish yells were replaced with better, more-robotic sounds, and the mechanisms corrected to actually touch his feet, but I am also all for Ady removing it… would something else have to be inserted in it’s place, though?

And just another random but related story: As a youngster, I used to think that droid was shooting air out from the bottom of its feet, as a defense mechanism, which blew away and prevented the hot plate from touching him 😃

I really like the idea of having Vader say, “Your mother once thought as you do.” This change makes sense, and not coming from a PT standpoint either. It’ll help his character be more dynamic; Vader would originally bring up Obi-Wan too often (“Obi-Wan has taught you well”, “Obi-Wan this”, “Obi-Wan that”), so for the audience to see that he actually remembers someone else in his past life makes him even more compelling. Hopefully it can be done 😃

Relieved to see that the challenge is legit! Donated a couple times last month and was planning to do so again this month and next, so I’m game for this 😄

Thank you so much for your generosity, “1,000 Challenge”!

Well said, Val! Each did contribute a great point, one way or the other.

nhoj3 said:

Can we all please stop discussing future instalments in an OT thread?

With all due respect I don’t come here for spolilers or mild speculation that could turn out to be spoilers.

With respect, it was merely brought up in regards to how Luke’s missing/reappearing hilt in ROTJ might be handled for Revisited. Tried to be careful not going too far, but if I did, I apologize 😃 Not another peep from me about it.

ray_afraid said:

.Mac. said:

About Luke’s saber, though, after he tosses it away in front of the Emperor, we don’t see the hilt attached at his side while he’s pulling Vader to the shuttle (as you’d expect, since he did toss it away), but then it suddenly reappears at the end celebration. So which is it?

I’d rather not see it again after he throws it. It’s such a symbolic moment and it’s ruined if we see that he ran back to rummage around and find it again.

Totally, I’m with you there.

Probably better not to have any tidbits about VIII mentioned in here, ZeeverFett, no matter how small.

About Luke’s saber, though, after he tosses it away in front of the Emperor, we don’t see the hilt attached at his side while he’s pulling Vader to the shuttle (as you’d expect, since he did toss it away), but then it suddenly reappears at the end celebration. So which is it?

All I will say about VIII here is, hopefully his missing/reappearing hilt can be corrected in ROTJ:R based on whether or not we see it again in VIII.

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

I just want to know why a whole hangar full of troops is just waiting in the wings there. What were they doing?

Yeah, that’s basically my only issue with the change.

I always thought of it as a weekly inspection of sorts, or, “Maybe it’s another drill.”

ray_afraid said:

I don’t think these flipped shots were being pointed out as needing to be flipped back, but that certain elements in the shots can be corrected.

Exactly, that’s how I interpreted it also.

jarbear said:

If Addy was to keep the flipped shots, I assume he would correct all those errors. The birth mark would be easy enough, some of the other ones though would take some more time and precision.

Yep, I agree. It’s clear with ESB:R that he is wanting to fix any of these kinds of inconsistencies where possible, no matter how large or small 😃

@Tantive, Good work! I think these are definitely worthwhile for this thread, and Ady can sort out which ones can or cannot be corrected. You already brought something up that I didn’t notice before 😉

Okay then, things apparently got a bit out of hand up there…

To bring this back on topic, I guess now is as good as any to throw in my 2 cents about the camo/white armor debate from earlier.

I was initially in favor of the idea with some kind of camouflage armor for (most of) the Imperials on the moon of Endor. This is the concept art that got me completely on board with it:

For camo, I thought the above image displays it quite subtly. It’s not in your face with several, vibrant, earthy colors, but it’s enough to serve its purpose. It makes sense, after all, that they’d have something to help hide themselves in the forest. It also goes along with the Empire having multiple armor designs for designated roles/locations, including the shoretroopers (I know, I noticed there are some differing opinions about them, but I liked them just fine).

However, people here not wanting them to have camo armor have made several good points, and for sure I’d agree with most of those points I’ve read. In addition, I’d also add another con with having camo for Imperials: There must be a distinguishable difference between the Rebels (who already do have camo) from the Imperials, otherwise I can see it getting confusing in certain instances for the audience.

But, here’s an alternative idea I haven’t seen brought up here yet: what about introducing the shadow troopers?

These guys have armor like your standard stormtroopers, so no alterations to the armor is needed, except they are black (or I’ve sometimes seen very dark gray). Could be relatively easy, too, to adjust the hue of the originally white armor in an editor (for sure easier than adding camo frame-by-frame). Then for shooting extra scenes during the battle, most of the extra Imperial troopers could possibly already be wearing this type of armor; I’m sure there are many good ones out there created by fans.

I just love the idea of there being a visual difference from the standard stormtroopers and the Emperor’s “best troops” (assuming his dialogue is left as is, and not condensed to be "An entire legion* of troops awaits them). If Krennic has his death troopers, I believe the Emperor would have certainly hand-picked a selection of “best” soldiers to have custom armor too.

So with this idea for having shadow troopers, A) the black (or very dark gray) will hide them a lot better in a forest environment than white (which was the reason for suggesting camo to start with), B) keeps true with the Empire having primarily white/black armor (which goes along with those who made points against camo armor), and C) of course it would add that extra element of ‘badass’ during the battle.

With that in mind, I believe there should still be some regular white scout/stormtroopers on the moon. Could actually be very interesting to see ordinary stormtroopers being overshadowed (pun not intended) by the prowess and aggressiveness of the Emperor’s “shadow troopers”.

(*) This has been brought up before long ago, but should the Emperor say “legion”? Instead should it be just “garrison” perhaps? Legion sounds overly large, unless of course he was purposefully exaggerating to Luke in hopes of getting him riled up any way possible - If so, I’d buy that for a dollar. So I guess I could go either way about this.

SilverWook said:

Much to my surprise there is a Palpatine shuttle paint job already in existence.

Ooh, nice find. I’d like that over the standard white, but maybe if it had some royal red trim?

Although, I think my first vote would go to a shuttle different from the Lambda-class altogether, like what Palpatine had in ROTS, only with some subtle design/color changes. I know, people often don’t want anything from the PT to be injected in the OT (it’s something George would do, etc.) 😉 but with an open-mind, I thought his ROTS shuttle was one of those things that were actually just fine, and it makes sense the Emperor would have something that’s more unique in design and his own.

And if the Emperor did have something different, what if Vader then had that black Lambda shuttle up above? Something that is clearly marked differently from the other commanders’ shuttles? Or is that taking it too far?

In retrospect, I would’ve really liked it for Krennic to have had a standard white lambda shuttle and Vader to have Krennic’s shuttle 😃

Thank you so much for your kind and supportive words, nhoj3 😄 I’m happy you managed to find time to read it! Right away I could tell you were another person here whose ideas and thought process I’d greatly value, and that’s why I was hopeful you might see what you thought about this 😃

You and others are right, there are ideas in there I admit would be over-reaching and very, very difficult to accomplish (borderline impossible), on top of being controversial too, such as inserting a brand new actor as Madine and shooting whole new shots with him at the helm of his own cruiser, etc… but then there’s always smarter people than I who come along and say, “Well, there is no way that can work exactly in that way, but how about this alternative?” 😃 That’s what I’m hoping for, for this to be helpful and inspirational to Ady or anyone who reads it, and my mind would be blown by the sheer genius if they manage to pull much of these off. Like you said, I didn’t want to hold back with ideas, because no matter how difficult or controversial they may be, there’s no way of knowing for sure what can or cannot be done or what other ideas it might influence 😉

Regarding the lookalikes and voice impersonators, if the interest was there, that actually might not be so difficult. I think that’s how Ady initially found a Darth Vader for ESB:R, was through Facebook? I’m pretty sure he still has a fellow with an authentic 3PO costume too (and a great voice). Putting out a call for certain parts on social media could always be a good idea 😃

TV’s Frink said:

For what it’s worth, I hate this guy’s design.

He’d fit right in at Jabba’s palace, unfortunately.

That’s it, one quarter portion for you then 😉

It’s interesting to me, though, you think that poorly of him. I actually appreciated his design probably because I saw it as an attempt to be the “mediator”, if you will, for the better designs and the poorer ones that have been created in SW. I guess I wasn’t bothered either because I thought the personality of his character was interesting too. But I realize this is a whole 'nother topic for another thread.

So to bring this back on track, Ady’s skills at digital enhancements (like what they did for Unkar Plutt and what he did for the cantina) is of course the way to go for enhancing many of the background puppets in Jabba’s palace 😃

It’s perfectly fine to have the “bad looking puppets” in the background of shots (that is if the shot is important to keep to begin with), but it’s when they are frequently and unnecessarily brought up to the foreground as they are seen laughing, that’s when their costuming stands out and it just looks silly. So yeah, with nostalgia aside, these certain close-up shots can be removed without tarnishing the quality of the scene 😃

NeverarGreat said:

The view of many people on this forum is that there’s something wrong with the Jabba’s palace sequence. It’s more open to debate as to what, exactly, is the culprit, but there are plenty of candidates which have been suggested in the past:

-There are too many poorly designed muppets
-The plan makes little to no sense, or if it does it relies too much on luck (or the Force)
-The palace sequence drags on too long
-There’s a musical number that serves no narrative function
-Characters (such as Boba Fett) are poorly defined or (in the case of Han Solo) overly quippy.
-The palace seems at times like a heavily defended fortress and other times like the Mos Eisley cantina in terms of security
-The action and effects, especially on the sail barge, are stodgy.

The last time I marathoned the entire trilogy, it was abundantly clear that there was something wrong with ROTJ compared to the previous installments. From the first act to the last, I was continually disappointed in how little of the film really resonated. I have faith that Adywan can solve much of the stodgy action and effects on the sail barge, but believe that the problems with the palace sequence go beyond superficial fixes and require editorial changes.

The reason I chose the Wookiee scene to cut is that the scene is really emblematic of the problems in this section of the film. To sum up the scene, Leia is apparently able to bring a high explosive and an uncuffed, violent Wookiee twice her size into Jabba’s audience chamber, no questions asked. It really takes the threat out of Jabba’s security if anyone dressed like a bounty hunter can get in and threaten his life with no repercussions. Even How It Should Have Ended made fun of the thermal detonator.

This, all of this. I see we’re definitely on the same page, NeverarGreat, in terms of what things can be handled better about the Jabba sequence (assuming you agree with that list you just typed), but it seems it’s just how it can be improved is where we differ. I’m still not at all convinced that having Leia be involved with bringing in Chewie is a good idea/plan. I totally do understand your reasoning with your suggestion, it’s just I’d much prefer to steer away from having her giving up Chewie. Her motivation in doing this (based on just your dialogue as it is) would not be deduced to those who aren’t here reading about it, and so it would confuse most audience members because, really, how could there be no other possible way for her to get in without sacrificing Chewie? You never surrender one of your friends in hopes of getting another, otherwise you’re back at square one (or as it turns out, in a worse scenario)! That’s what I hated about this sequence originally.

Plus, you mentioned that the dance sequence serves no narrative purpose, which I totally agree and hope that gets removed too (unless Ady wanted to do a condensed, hybrid of the SE and OUT shots featuring just the dancers with new music [tribal drums/Japanese Taiko-esque] and moved to the intro of Jabba - that I’m completely cool with), and so if that were totally removed, where else would your short scene fit?

So, ideally, I’m of the opinion that the sequences would work best as: Torcher chamber (I know many don’t like this but it’s actually needed to establish the jobs that the droids will be given), then after that a wipe to an establishing, scenic, night shot of the palace outside (without a distracting frog slurping up some thing), then it continues with the shots of Leia sneaking around inside the palace (we don’t have to know it’s her before she takes off the mask either; although, prior to this, a shot of her in disguise that establishes that she is already inside, just like Lando is, would be a good idea).

NeverarGreat said:

.Mac. said:

NeverarGreat said:

.Mac. said:

Do we need to see Leia gain admittance though? Just like with Lando, we didn’t see how he got in; he just is already in, which could work the same for Leia also.

Right, with this idea Leia is already in the palace and has probably been there for a while.

If she has already been in for a while, then that tells me she was already accepted, and so then it still makes zero sense for her to surrender Chewie for no apparent benefit. I understand what you were going for with the idea, but we don’t need to see her get the “You go girl” nod from Fett. My point is she could’ve already been accepted in by Fett and everyone else, just as Lando was.

Also with the removal of this whole scene, we then won’t have to worry about seeing Lando pulling down his disguise and essentially telling the audience, “Hey it’s me guys!”

It doesn’t make sense that she would have been accepted like Lando. Lando was a known scoundrel. It’s reasonable to believe that he would have the cred to be accepted into Jabba’s service as someone who recently lost their gig as a city administrator and has fallen on hard times. Leia, on the other hand, is instantly recognizable as a former senator and member of the Rebellion. There’s no way she’d be accepted sight unseen without a really good disguise and plausible Bounty Hunter credentials. Enlisting Boba Fett to help ‘capture’ Chewie solves this problem. Chewie is her price of admission, even if it’s inconvenient later on.

I like your idea but also think it’s making this more complicated than it needs to be 😃 because there’s no way you’d be able to explain that notion to the audience; they are still just seeing her giving up Chewie. Let’s just expect that the palace doesn’t actually know it’s Lando in disguise, and just the same they don’t know that is is Leia as Boushh. How she got in, it may have been different than Lando’s method, sure, but we don’t have to see how. Besides, how would they confirm if it was Lando or not? Did he have to take off his helmet and say, “Yeah it’s me.”? If so, then wouldn’t Leia also have to take off her mask and explain, “No, I’m not actually Princess Leia. I get that a lot, though.”?