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Laserman

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Join date
11-May-2004
Last activity
6-Sep-2007
Posts
903

Post History

Post
#77848
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/77848/action/topic#77848
Time
Khamul, It is a piece of cake to write a virtuadub filter to do what you want, but it doesn't really work all that well as you inevitably end up with detail disappearing from somewhere else, Its fast enuf to paint them out with combustion anyhow.

If you want a *really* boring job, then roto out 4 puppeteers from a scene with a pig puppet climbing up a mountain of suitcases a frame at a time by hand for 1421 frames, and then have the scene cut down to 240 frames in the final release.
Post
#77845
Topic
StarWarsLegacy.com - The Official Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/77845/action/topic#77845
Time
Um, yeah the dialogue changes are something I am wrestling with too. I am hoping to get some time in our theatre to run the two reels we have to see what was and wasn't in there, Mverta what are your thoughts on that?
I'm currently trying to fix all the stutter frames (At the point when lightsabres turn on an off, the R2 shots, anywhere the camera was obviously stopped) and am pretty happy with the results - are you fixing those or do you think its going too far? I am now working on fixing the 'ghosts scene' at the end of Jedi - that is proving very difficult. I am basically fixing anything that breaks the suspension of disbelief (i.e. stuff that I noticed that bugged me/disappointed me the first time I watched the movie). I would absolutely like to get rid of 90% of the band in Jedi - I absolutely wanted to throw up the first time I saw the stupid blue elephant....but I hate the new sequence even more (something I thought impossible until I saw it, and the stupid blue elephant is STILL THERE) But I'm sure that one is just me.

oh and BTW I didn't take any offense from anything anyone said here at all.(And I love the site) Its my opinion (not that it matters a bean) that Mverta's restoration project is for real, and personally I don't care if its not - it doesn't effect me or anyone else here in any way. As for people being on a high horse about stuff, I don't really understand that comment at all, unless it meant that demanding to see what someone is doing is not cool - in which case I agree

I think everyone that is having a go is pretty easygoing about it, and its something that literally anyone could have a go at doing - that is the really cool thing about it. Some people are sharing/distributing/selling what they have done, and some are not - and that is their personal choice too, and should be respected. If you want the perfect restoration, have a go at it yourself! You will enjoy it and might end up with a new career! (and I promise no off topic ramblings from me anymore!)
Post
#77530
Topic
StarWarsLegacy.com - The Official Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/77530/action/topic#77530
Time
Jeez guys, let up!
If someone hounded me like that to post a clip, it would never happen!

He has already stated over and over again that it is entirely a project for his own use, and that it won't be released -- really really.

He is nice enough to share some techniques and insights into how he is going about it. I vote to have NO-one, ask, hint, or beg for clips or copies of this project here. Its walking a fine line for all of us doing this stuff, and pushing the limits with posting clips etc. just makes it more likely that the heavies will attempt to shut us all down.

Even if it was all a big con, the techniques and methodology he has posted so far is all good stuff (Well, maybe except for the component output from the LD player, but we agree to disagree on that one) , so we all win.

Everytime I see a veiled hint to give someone a copy here, it makes me cringe, so could we all stop mentioning it.

I think its now clear that...
a) Everyone would love a copy of the finished product (Duh!)
b) It's not gonna happen

Oops I've turned into a ranting maniac... Just my 2c. Now back to your scheduled programming....

Post
#75992
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/75992/action/topic#75992
Time
I can't emphasise enough the importance of not messing with the brightness/contrast of the original capture. You NEED to capture the full gamut of the original... ALL the greyscale, only then can you correct it in a way that gets the blacks right with still keeping the detail.
Plus, the laserdisc is all over the place in some scenes as regards to black levels, capture those too dark and you can never get that detail back!
Post
#75208
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/75208/action/topic#75208
Time
OK guys, some explanation is probably in order here going on the confused questions...

1) The laserdiscs are very 'bright' compared to the official dvd release and to most of the bootlegs. Laserdisc transfers in general tend to be lighter, and most laserdiscs do not put out 'superblack' or 0IRE.

2) I believe the video posted was the direct capture from laserdisc - So if they look grey and bright exactly the same as the laserdisc, this is a good thing. It means that all the available detail from the laserdisc has been captured as a master to work with, This is what you *should* be aiming for when starting off on this process.

3) This doesn't mean that the final result will look like this. With colour correction tools available in most packages, you can adjust a cetain 'black level' down to absolute black, restoring the blackness of space for example without really affecting the stars, or losing shadow detail. You can also adjust the gamma settings to change the levels of part of the spectrum of the image, so you can get a wider dynamic range, with nice inky blacks without crushing them or losing your whites. In combustion you can colour correct just parts of an image etc.

In other words, you want to capture the footage 'as is' and work with it from there - you don't want to do it *as part of the capture process* as this means you are throwing away information you may wish to restore later.

Many of the current bootlegs suffer from crushed whites and blacks, i.e. You lose detail in Vader's cloak, and on the stormtroopers armour for instance - as all darkish areas become black, and all quite white areas become uniform white.
Although this makes them look 'punchier' it really degrades the image. The idea is to get black back down to true black, white up to true white and keep all the detail in the gradients in between - that way you get the punch AND the detail.
I believe that's what mebe is trying to do. If I am talking out of my rectum mebejedi, please jump in!
(Hmmm that didn't come out right....)
Post
#74959
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/74959/action/topic#74959
Time
The real question is:
Does it still look 'too light' when mastered to DVD, and do the combing artifacts appear 'when played on a TV with a dvd player'

Mastering to DVD changes to levels quite a bit, and the artifacts you are seeing on the computer *may* be caused by your player. The real test is to put them out to DVD and check them on a TV set.

Also, you are better off maintaining the full greyscale range, and adjusting your TVs down to get black where you want it - otherwise you just get crushed blacks and a loss of detail. (Although some people think at first glance it is a better picture all dark, in the dark scenes you can't see anything)
Post
#74956
Topic
StarWarsLegacy.com - The Official Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/74956/action/topic#74956
Time
Well, for me the quality of the SE LD is still far far below the DVD release.
The colour issues and so forth are easily fixed on the DVD, but you just can't recover detail from the laserdisc that isn't there in the first place. So the DVD is still my #1 choice for the bulk of the footage, but I'll take another look at the SE laserdiscs to see if some of the footage to 'put back' is better quality than the faces/Definitive set.
Post
#72974
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72974/action/topic#72974
Time
Yes, combustion is probably one of the most under rated programs out there. It is really similar to the flint/flame units we use - and its a lot of fun. I strongly recommend it to anyone trying to do this sort of work.

Re CCE, to anyone out there playing with it - it does take a lot of playing to get the best results, you really notice it's advantage on scenes that cause problems, but like a lot of things an untrained eye will really only see the difference when displayed side by side with other encoders results.

Check out doom9 or other sites for advanced CCE techniques.
Post
#72759
Topic
Idea: About De-SEizing the DVDs... We need to Vote on Changes!
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72759/action/topic#72759
Time
Well, it doesn't pay to get too hardcore about changes, the laserdisc definite edition and faces set are different to what was shown in 1977. A lot of you probably saw it in cinemas with a mono analogue soundtrack, so even the PCM soundtrack on the laserdiscs would be considered a 'change'.

I think there is just room for multiple versions - I like the clunky garbage mattes and other faults sometimes, it lets you kinda sneak a look at how it all works, but...
If I want to really lose myself, and get carried off into a galaxy far far away, I would rather watch a very clean transfer that was glitch free, in surround in my dark cinema with my 4 metre wide screen. For me some of the changes pull me out of that universe though (like th jabba scene and the anakin ghost).
So that's why I am trying to make an archival version, and an ultra high quality 'Inoffensive De-Specialed Edition' i.e. Glitches fixed, fat sound and the best picture quality possible that I can enjoy on the big screen. This means leaving in things that don't bug me enough to spoil the movie, and taking out those that do.
Unfortunately even playing from the original laserdisc at that screen size the image quality is too poor.
Post
#72713
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72713/action/topic#72713
Time
No, convergence is also for normal TVs, but doing it is difficult, requires opening up your TV and can easily kill you, so don't attempt it unless you know what you are doing.

To check your convergence, put up a very fine white grid pattern on your TV. (fine lines a pixel or 2 wide with say a grid of 16x12 squares)

Have a close look at the white lines, if they are kind of blue on one side and red on the other in places, then your TV needs converging.

You can see the effect sometimes on crisp white text - it will look like it has a red or blue outline around it.
Post
#72711
Topic
StarWarsLegacy.com - The Official Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72711/action/topic#72711
Time
The other thing to remember guys when looking at the original laserdiscs, screengrabs and so forth that most laserdiscs mastered to a black level of 7.5 IRE, whereas DVDs are at 0 IRE.
This means (in simple terms) that a nice prog scan DVD is darker on playback than laserdiscs.
If you have your telly setup for DVD and then watch a laserdisc at the same settings the picture will look overbright, (washed out) and flat, and will have poor black levels.

If you have a laserdisc player and like to watch movies on it, make sure you calibrate your TV for laserdisc playback and it will look a lot better.

(Now back to the topic at hand)

We are going to scan some of the film we have from the 78 ANH 35mm print. Does anyone have any particular frames they want to see for reference?
Post
#72643
Topic
StarWarsLegacy.com - The Official Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72643/action/topic#72643
Time
I'll second the noise problem, most of it is being introduced by your player.
See if you can beg borrow or steal a Pioneer HLD-X9 or its cheaper cousin the Pioneer LD-S9. The pickup on these is far superior, they will play discs even with advanced rot with no sparklies and have by far the lowest noise floor of any LD player out there. The American CLD-99 is another good player, same pickup but not quite as good a comb filter.
But really any of these players will give an image that is so much better than the player you are using that there is just no comparison. Seriously.

If you sniff around a Laserdisc forums (Try AVS) you could probably convince an owner to lend it to you for the few days to get a super clean capture. You will be truly amazed at the difference in quality.

It would be a shame for you to expend so much effort on this only to have your source footage be a long way below par and make the final result that much less than it could be.

As my Ma used ta say - Ya can't polish a turd.
Post
#72641
Topic
***The MeBeJedi feedback thread ***
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72641/action/topic#72641
Time
Cool!
(Yeah I know I am a calibration Nazi) I was serious about at least putting the greyscale settings test pattern on the disc so that people at least have the contrast brightness set correctly.
My friends have all had to put up with me calibrating their TVs at some point in time, and although they bag me out about it, most of them have been amazed at the result (I do a convergence alignment as well, which really scares them!)

Actually Avid Pro 4.5 has a great frame by frame correction tool that would be perfect for sparkle removal. It's a shame your set suffers from it so badly.
Just on another note, I watched my DE set on my home LD player and got about half a dozen sparklies in ANH, on the LD player at work there are *none*. So it looks like some players laser pickups are better at reading crappy areas on the disc than others.

I am very keen to make a DVD-9 for ya, especially if you encode using Cinemacraft encoder - it should look very nice indeed - I finally found some decent priced good quality Dual layer media.

Good luck with it all.

LM
Post
#72217
Topic
Using the '04 SE DVD version to restore the Original (with lots of info)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/72217/action/topic#72217
Time
Cool idea, but I can't see it working.
Unless everyone used the same capture equipment or worked from the same captured video, and had the same gamma settings, same encoders etc. etc. you would end up with a mish mash.

But hey I am happy to edit the final piece if you ever get takers to do the rest of it. Our Avid suite sits idle most nights so I could do it in my sleep (quite literally)