Kurgan

I didn't remove the pic, just resized it (hit refresh). It's one of several shots you can easily find with google image search from that show. You said before you wanted to tone down the blue, but still leave them blue, before. Then you said you wanted it gray after a few people seemed up for that idea... then when I mentioned it last time, you said you were making them blue and I'd just misunderstood. Now we're back to gray again?

As for the "muted" stuff:

I thought you said that the removal of color was due to the aging of the film and the crappy restoration jobs of the past...

I have nothing against Black & White, it just isn't what Star Wars was meant to be, and when you have a scene of black & white it stands out sandwiched between scenes of color.

I think you had the right idea with making all the TIEs blue. Why are you making them all gray in one version and all blue in another? Your HD edition is also a fan edit... I just don't understand the back & forth. Blue just looks better. Heck, even if you just left the TIEs as is (how they looked in 1980) that'd be cool. There's been nothing wrong with them all this time. To suddenly make them all gray just makes it more boring, visually. Gray TIEs next to gray asteroids, gray ISDs on a black background with white stars, chasing other gray objects. Yawn.

Hey, I'm sure you can deal with a little constructive criticism. ;)

The Empire has millions of TIE Fighters... why do they have to all be the same color? The interceptors too? I don't see how it looks better (maybe it's easier?) to desaturate every one of the blue TIEs, rather than making them a uniform blue color, as you just said yourself that they're all already blue in the high def edit that a tiny percentage of people will be able to view.

If anything, you should be changing the ones in ANH to blue, for consistency's sake!

The less of the movie that looks like black & white, the better...

So the TIEs are now definitely going to be back to grey. The Bombers will have the original colouring because they are different ships. TIEs were grey in ANH, so i want to keep the consistency there

Argh, why do the space battles need to look like black & white? Anyone can just dial down their color contrast, right?

The TIEs were originally intended to be blue, and this gave ESB & ROTJ a unique look.

Glad you're keeping the Executor color, but I say, bad idea on the monochrome TIEs in ESB.... :(

Can you try http://www.archive.org/index.php (wayback machine, formerly on webarchive.org)?

Green lasers? Arggh... green lasers are only for Imperial fighters and capital ships!

Red is for ground troops and vehicles on both sides (except Imperial speeder bikes which are orange/yellow).... and for all Rebel ships. Ion canons are red (forget the games).

Apart from the speeder bikes, it was perfectly consistent before the Prequels... it was just the Empire's space force that had green lasers.

(Note that I'm not counting "missiles" those little glowing things fired by Luke's X-Wing or Lando and Wedge to destroy the death stars, or the "bombs" dropped by TIE Bombers briefly... those are not the same as "lasers").

The prequels confuse things a little:

Queen Amidala has a blaster in Episode I that fires green shots (though everyone else uses red; it's one of those needle-nosed pistols that were hidden in the palace throne room).

Blue is for Old Republic military (infantry and capital ships anyway)... (iirc Jedi fighters shoot green lasers).

a last but not least, purple is for Geonosian fighters.

Chewbacca's bowcastor has always fired red bolts (just like all rebel and imperial infantry weapons), but we see one Wookiee in Episode III firing an "ornithopter" mounted crossbow (rapid fire) that shoots green bolts.

Anyway, ignore the video games and comics, as they just confuse things further!

Green bolts may "look cool" but it's a change I'd hate to see in Andwan's version! It's pointless. I think the red bolts look more "dangerous" anyway... and the reason we have different colored bolts in the space battles is for contrast's sake, and because a black starry background gets boring without some more things going on and more color (since it's usually just a black background with gray objects flitting past) and it's harder to tell which side the shots are coming from.

Speaking of pointless changes.... consider this...

For 30 YEARS people have misquoted the famous scene in ESB as "Luke, I am your father."

Now, thanks to the magic of editing, you can make all those people CORRECT by changing the audio (from "No, I am your father")! ;)

Happy Halloween everyone (yesterday)!

I didn't like the mini-lightsaber change either (it seems more like a fanboy joke), but my handle is in the credits, and I feel like I contributed in a small way, by contributing to the Great Flipper Debate of '08 which eventually resulted in the (far superior, and accurate) "severed hand." ;)

I will confess that the bloody paw always looked cool, it just didn't make any sense (continuity wise).

Again, I think we're expressing all our viewpoints to prevent giving the impression that everyone here thinks we need to shoehorn in as much experimental stuff as possible.

I think Adywan's edits WILL inspire people who want to just tinker with the movies to add more stuff. I really see this as a fan service to get GOOD QUALITY versions of the movies released... the kind of Special Editions Lucas SHOULD have given us from the beginning.

I'd have to look to someone else to give me a true restoration/preservation of the original films (and these can never take the place of those, though for me they will take the place of both SE's).

Please, DON'T kill off Veers. While I think "original ideas from the screenplays" are probably the least objectionable things to add, I don't think that just because it was an original idea means it has to go into the film.

I think it's great that we don't know the fate of every single character in the series. Not everyone has to be killed on-camera, and the Rebels do enough as it is. I always liked the "exploding head" on the AT-AT.

Don't modify the Ion Cannon... it's the first and only one we see in the series. Turning it into some sparky effect or changing it is just stupid and unnecessary.

The Imperial presence at Hoth doesn't need to be increased, because the Rebellion is small... the Empire DIDN'T send their entire force to crush the Rebels there, because they didn't need to! If anything, the rest of the Imperials were patrolling the rest of the galaxy. Besides, if we expand the presence too much in ESB, it'll diminish what we see in ROTJ (which still wasn't the entire force).  ESB was just supposed to be showing us a lean, elite group of Vader's that was going to find Skywalker.

I'm for minimal changes to ESB. Other than fixing color gaffes and Special Edition excesses, is IS "danged near perfect" already. Splicing in the ROTJ Emperor in the hologram scenes with the original lines is one change I agree with (so long as it doesn't look too obviously recycled).

But trying to throw in Prequels references, "extend" the battle, and so forth is just fanboy-service, it won't fix or improve the film. If Adywan wants to put some stuff like that into "deleted scenes" on the disc, that's cool, and the fanboys can make their own edit to splice that into the film itself. But he made the right choice with putting say, the "extended Alderaan destruction" into a deleted scene instead of the movie proper.

Recoloring all the ships and blasts just seems pointless. Why does ESB have to change to match some other source or interpretation?

Too many people I think are going off on how many unnecessary things they can get inserted into the film.

Lucas himself did this with ANH and ROTJ, but he made the fewest unnecessary changes to ESB. The ones he did do tended to stick out as stupid.

The Golden Idol said:

Kurgan said:

Well, see you all in a year!

 

 Why a year?

Because that's how long Adywan estimated it was going to take to finish this (look back a page or two)... which incidentally would make this project much shorter than ANH:R!

But who knows... with sufficient hardware failures and enough suggestions for changes, we might be able to stretch it out to two... ;) (j/k)

Well, I got through the whole thing... pretty impressive job!

Of course, the deleted scenes are still pretty rough (especially the fight with Jamis) and could do with some more work on them.

I noticed a few places where the Fremen blue eyes aren't present... like there's several closeups of Fremen firing their weirding modules during a raid in the sand. I think it's the scene where they discover Gurney amongst the smugglers in the desert (I could be confusing it with the scene where they attack the Harkonnen troops in the desert). Basically during those yellow tinted desert shots normally in mid to close shots everyone has blue eyes, but there's some guy on the left that doesn't have them (behind Paul).

The eyes could have been a little more blue during the "history will call us wives" scene too.

Anyway, I'm sure it's a pain keeping track of them all (at least Paul's eyes stay consistently blue, and more Fremen have them than did before). But this is the best fan edit of Dune thus far! I can't wait to show it to some of my friends...

Well, see you all in a year!

Okay, I got it this morning. It burns on Nero5 with no problems.

I'm only halfway through, but I like what I see and hear so far! The quality is great. The re-inserted deleted scenes don't perfectly mesh (as expected), but decent job! I like the blue within blue eyes... that always bugged me about the unfinished scenes from the Alan Smithee cut.

Sounds like a good idea! Good luck...

Never seen the ride, just watched a really crappy quality cam recording off youtube sometime last year I think.

Now it's like 50 leechers, and 1 seeder (who isn't online half the time).

I guess people don't have it yet, but when you do get it, please help seed!

What's wrong with the Cinderella DVD?

I'm slowly getting this from the usual place (where demons roam!).

The trouble is that there's only one person seeding it, and like 30 leeching...

But apparently it's only been posted about a day or two, so it just needs more people to seed. Please! Seed!

What I've seen so far looks good, though!

A question while we wait: can we burn this with Nero?

Somebody going to seed the torrent? ;)

I was just recalling how the official “IMAX Experience” cut of Episode II was a better film than the now familiar “digital cut” (on DVD), as it trimmed a lot of the sillier scenes, bad acting, and filler.

I realize that it had a square aspect ratio (equivalent to blowing up a full frame DVD to epic size), but I’m more interested in someone re-creating the shorter cut used.

That’d be pretty cool as a fan release!

It's done, hooray!

Glad to hear it... and good to know that these DL's I've got won't go to waste. ;)

This will make an excellent companion next to the recently released official DVD set (until such time, if any, that Lynch decides to release his "definitive vision" for this under-appreciated film)!

Thank you for doing this, I can't wait to watch it!

Cool. Can someone post some comparison shots for ESB and ROTJ?

How about some shots comparing Wookieegroomer's HD-DVD edition to Adywan's blu-ray?

Thanks in advance

So what's the progress on this edit? I see you put the release date as "September 2008" and it's the second already.

Was that just an optimistic estimation, or are you almost done? 50%? 75%?

I look forward to this eagerly.

Good luck!

Not that it's any of my business of course, but I couldn't help noticing... Adywan, your kids are either adopted, or you're remarried... am I right? I did a double-take at first before I realized that had to be the case!

Edit: I see Darth Solo beat me to the punch!

Yeah, removing the "oops, close talker Vader" thing isn't something I'd suggest either. Removing it will just take out one more fun thing about the Trilogy we all enjoyed (like "fixing" the stormtrooper head bump, which is far less subtle than this).

***

Vader's attitude in his search for Luke, the opening crawl, and his dialog with the Emperor were fine in 1980. You can sense that Vader's underlings are all thinking their boss is a bit crazy, but most of them are too scared of him to object (note Ozzel's near condescending attitude "My Lord, there are so many uncharted settlements,... it may be smugglers...). That's kind of a cool thing, and it extends into ROTJ ("It's an older code sir, but it checks out, I was about to clear them..." and the awkward pause as Vader reaches out with the Force to sense Luke). Perfect. That's the sort of thing Lucas would screw up if he thought of it, so please leave it be!

Adywan's decision to use the ROTJ Emperor (instead of the pickup shots from Episode III that Lucas clumsily inserted in 2004) with the McDiarmond dialog is fine, and actually looks decent. The only way to make it perfect would be to get the actor saying "Luke."

I am totally against anything that would connect ESB's badass Vader with the weak willed, whiny brat that Hayden plays in Episode II and III. No references to Padme, no extra dialog please!

As for all the stuff about recoloring ships.. it's getting way out of hand. I urge you to not modify the color of the Executor. It looked great in 1980 as this big dark badass ship. It isn't just a regular Star Destroyer that's been inflated, no matter what some stupid EU source says (which gets the size wrong anyway). Aligning all the ships so they all look the same and fly the same and are lined up just makes it look more fake. The only ships that ever "flew in formation" were the TIE Fighters. The battles in Star Wars are not like the "ship of the line, age of sail" type battles in Star Trek (the "broadsides" in Episode III's battle of Coruscant nonwithstanding), but would be more akin to a cross between submarine and aircraft carrier/battleship warfare of the 20th century.

Making everything a shade of gray is just as bad as making everything blue like the 2004 editions did. It just turns the movie drab. I have nothing against black and white film, but that was one thing about ANH:R that looked a bit off... having a color element or two floating on a black and white background (I realize ady tried his best with what he had since so much of the color had faded... I would have suggested using overlays from the GOUT to get the colors as good as possible).

But in the end, the colors ought to look like a restored theatrical edition, not modified to meet someone's fanboy expectations of how it should look (expectations that are largely colored by reading too many EU comics and playing too many EU video games).

Hey, at least no body is arguing that the Ion Cannon shot should be blue! (and before you say it, no, that's a TERRIBLE idea!).

There's no need to come up with more work for ady, just to make the project take a long time and remake the film. As so many have said, ESB is already a great movie and doesn't "need" much work on it at all compared to the rest. A proper restoration to undue the damage done in the 2004 edit, and a rollback on the dumber changes made by Lucas in 1997... beyond that, fixing SFX glitches is really all that needs to be done. People are cool with their ideas, but it's like they're going out of their way to see what COULD be changed (not that really needs to be). Just a nitpick there.

doubleofive said:

mumbles_ said:

doubleofive said:

I've always thought how funny it is immediately after that line.

"Set your course for the Hoth System. GENERAL VEERS! Prepare your men."

The way he spins around to find Veers standing right next to him is funny. If Vader had spun around pointing at Veers thinking he was further away, he would have knocked him right over!

But that just might be me...

no you're not the only one. I still find that part HILARIOUS... it must have been hard for Vader to see him with that helmet. just as much as the automated targeting computers and how close they come to Wedge's face in A New Hope. i always imagine it hitting him in the face. it's the little things...

 

Glad I'm not alone. Since I'm a screenshot fiend, I'll post what we're referring to:

Vader is yelling to set their course for the Hoth system. Vader turns his head to his right...

The shot changes and pans over to revel GENERAL VEERS(!) who is way too close for comfort.

You'd think he'd be visable in the first shot, or at least moving to that position, cause it looks like he was standing there the whole time...

I LOVE that part! It's like the "stormtrooper head bump" of ESB. Please don't take it out... pretty please! It doesn't need fixing! :D

Darth Solo said:

Jeyl said:

nohandluke said:

Totally agree, vbangle. Ady, you have the free pass to get ticked whenever (and whyever) you like.

 

Well, everyone can be whatever they want to, but if you're going to get very vocal and not understanding you might risk alienating some of your fans who read these forums. I'm very glad Adywan that you took your time to apologize. I like listening to people who know they should have limits and don't want to push people away.

 

Grrrrrr. Ady doesn't owe the fans anything! He is giving them something for nothing, and making a lot of sacrifices with his personal time and money to make that happen in the first place. Its not like your paying 15 pounds/dollars to buy a copy at the end of it!

How about the people who donated so he could buy fancy new hardware to complete his last project and work on this one? I'd say he definately owes them something! Selling this thing would be illegal and liable to draw the unwanted attention of LFL's lawyers, anyway.

(watch the fight begin)

Seriously, the point is that as soon as adywan creates a fan edit, and especially when he starts a thread soliciting feedback, he's open to the whole world's opinions, whether he likes it or not. I think as a big boy, he can handle it, jokes aside.

As an addendum, to make this about Star Wars movies, so Ady doesn't put me on ignore ;) I'm going to say... please don't modify the lines in ROTJ about Leia and Luke's mother at all. Mess with Revenge of the Sith. Please no more toying with the Originals to "make them fit" with the Prequels. That's Lucas' fault, and it shouldn't be taken out on the original movies, no matter how many "ESB is better than ROTJ" fanboys there are out there. People agree that Hayden replacing Shaw was a travesty (and I say BRING THE DANGED EYEBROWS BACK! Put CG eyebrows on Hayden if you have to in ROTS, I don't care... but Shaw looks far worse without them)... don't add to it!

There, rant over. In four years, I hope people remember I said that!

Who am I kidding, I have on more thing to say on here... the idea of Fett getting decapitated by Luke is pretty awesome sounding, but then we won't get to hear him scream as the Sarlacc crunches him (with beak) or swallows him (sans beak). Perhaps a deleted scene? Luke getting all slice 'n' dice would be perfect for that. ;)

PS: BD-R would be pointless for piracy now anyway, because the recordable media costs as much (sometimes more) than the commercial movies! But perhaps they're reluctant for the future, when the price eventually comes down. They can't fight it forever!

So I take it the Prequels are the same "cuts" as the DVD editions, and the OT are the "2004 editions" right?

Of course I don't have any High-Def hardware at all (and my current PC hardware couldn't handle it even if I did have the right drivers/software installed), but I thought I'd ask. ;)

Can someone post some comparison shots?

It's nice to know though that by the time I DO get one, there will be a six film saga waiting for me (if a decent official one isn't out by then). Once these are out, and with these and the wookieegroomer versions to compare with, anyone can do a color-correction, sound-fix if they wish (since, believe it or not, there are actually people out there... though not me of course... who prefer the 2004 editions, but admit that they have a few glitches).