I think it’s intended: Tatooine’s scenes were originally shot using a peculiar filter to make them look blurred, more “romantic”; in the blu-ray (Harmy’s DE’s main source) these shots were digitally altered to look sharper, so they probably removed light smearing as well.
I just noticed something: in TFA C3PO’s left arm is red, while the same one is rusty in AOTC. Was it a PT reference for the fans?
Great find! Can’t believe some of these sets were actually miniatures and not CGI.
Poor grading decisions may had affected their on-screen look too (too much contrast, picture too dim, cyan and magenta over-saturated…)
Thanks again, TN1, for all your efforts!
I was studying this fantastic preservation and I just noticed that the stormtroopers’ shot at 1:04:05 looks almost as washed out as in Reliance’s preview (except for its blue tint and different contrast). So that’s how it was intended to look? What do you guys think?
P.S.: For comparison, here's mverta’s video on that shot with his own preview included.
Copy protection? I’d put some scotch on the bottom-left hole like in here:
btw, what are you going to use for the conversion? I’d like to convert VHSs myself, but so far I could only afford an analogue-to-digital converter (which sometimes makes the audio randomly disappear 😄 )
This preview looks fantastic, thanks! It really shows how ridiculous was Lucasfilm’s decision to use an awful quality master in 2006.
As I said before, I don’t like that TFA has so much OT’s references and recycled events. Now, I’m not questioning whether this is good or not, but do you think they’ll keep going in this direction for the next episodes too? Should they keep going, to you?
I suspect they will, anyway: if you think about it, this is a trend lots of franchises follow nowdays and, in the worst case, it’s just “more of the same”. If true, why? Is it easier then doing something new? Or does people actually like it? In general, I’d rather watch the same movie again and again, than a sequel that feels the same.
I think jedi1's scans could be another good color reference for TESB. A few frames do look green shifted (in the same scene!), but otherwise look pretty consistent to what (little) we know about its theatrical grading.
John Doom said:
-regrading (for which I suspect he has implemented the same processes he knows were used for the original movie in 1977).Well, maybe a digital version, since this is an all-digital restoration.
😄 Of course, that’s what I meant. I think he himself said that technology has improved enough that it’s possible to digitally get good approximations of the old retiming processes.
I think he said in his videos that he’s not trying to match his scans to the Technicolor prints, but to actually restore the movie as close as possible to its original look. From what I understand, here’s what he did/is doing:
-scanning and cleaning using various prints as sources to get as much detail as possible;
-color correcting to match the actual on-set look;
-regrading (for which I suspect he has implemented the same processes he knows were used for the original movie in 1977).
btw do you guys think that there should’ve been more scenes involving the Republic? I know there was one with Leia, but it was cut. Do you think more scenes would’ve improved TFA, adding to the background and making the Republic’s planet’s destruction more moving?
[…] Whilst your statements are selectively evasive, circular and repetitive like in the ‘Merry Sue’ thread (nice edits in there on taking out the ‘…I’ve never said Rey was perfect…’ in your later posts - to the first line of your first post in there which was ‘She’s too perfect…’), so I’ll stop posting in here.
Arrivederci 😃
Arriverderci un corno :\ I can stand that we have different opinions, but I can’t stand such an accusation without a reply. I swear I only edit my posts to fix the grammar and make the content clearer and clearer, improving and completing it (I admit sometimes I rush things 😄) , but I’ve NEVER edited a post after someone had already replied me, I’m not a lier nor a cheater. I don’t specifically remember doing what you say I did, why I did, nor in which specific post, but rest assured that whatever it was, what you may read now is the same thing, just more thoughtful.
Back in the first film narrative was propelled largely visually. […] There are a few of these that work really well in TFA.
Rey cleaning her finds looks up and sees a departing ship and then notices an old lady cleaning her salvage. […] It’s moments like this a superior scriptwriter and director has the confidence to put into a film with lasers and robots. It gives us a human connection, such moments transcend cultural and linguistic differences.
So true. The first part of the movie is very well told, especially the characters’ feelings, and almost entirely visually. The opening shot, Rey’s desire for a better life and Finn’s decision to leave the battlefield forever.
Yes, of course saying:-
“On a side note, is it me, or things are getting a bit “intense” in this forum? Maybe I’m being misinterpreted, but I do have to say that lately, when I step on a thread about TFA, I’m by some immediately wrongly “accused” of considering this movie “garbage”, and of “bashing” it because it’s trendy or something 😄 )”
is in answer to cyclista’s request advising people to stay on thread instead of immediately accuse(ing) people like it happened to you…
I’m not forcing you to agree, I’m ok with it. But you should quote and consider the entire context, before making a point I anyone can take into consideration. Here, these 2 posts with their relative quotes are enough: 1st and 2nd.
P.S.: So much better using old-school links instead of quotes, to avoid building a wall of text 😄
I’d say my opinion and than move on. If you feel it’s trolling, just ignore it, what else? O.o
From Wing-man.
That’s why I put it into quotes. I should’ve been less “abstract”, I guess 😄
I was referring to those who keep saying that loving this or hating that is wrong, incomprehensible, absurd, and so on. This way they make discussing about actually something very hard, at the point that some, tired of this, would rather leave the thread.
Well, I hope what you said doesn’t derail thie thread - like cyclista has just stated ‘in this thread - love only’. Perhaps if you’d like to talk about your side note you could start a new thread?, or attempt genuine dialogue on the subject in the very thread in which there are a few opposing viewpoints?
It wasn’t and it’s not my intention to derail this thread, so I’ll leave again after this post, but truth be told: cyclista wasn’t “reproving” me, but someone who started arguing on what I like in TFA, on my viewpoint. So my “side note” is actually pretty relevant in this thread (along with other ones), as I wrote it to answer to cyclista’s request, advising people to stay on the thread instead of immediately “accusing” people and arguing, like it happened to me.
Done, bye 😄
I can’t say if her acting was good because I saw it in Italian and… I hate to say this, but after 6 dubbings directed by great professionals, this is the first Star Wars movie with a pretty flat dubbing in both acting and translation.
I am getting a bit tired of this thread being more about bashing the people commenting on it than about the films and the comments themselves.
Some people hold opinions about the film that some people don’t share.
Get over it.
I couldn’t agree with you more. We should all be discussing each other’s point of view, possibly trying to make a point, but nobody should force anybody to either agree or “leave”.
Hey now, this isn’t the debate whether it was good or not thread. I’m grateful Doom showed up to this party at all! Thanks Doom.
😄 No fanfare, please, it’s not like I completely dislike TFA. I’ve tried to be objective with it so far, both considering its pros and cons, like with any other movie.
(😄 On a side note, is it me, or things are getting a bit “intense” in this forum? Maybe I’m being misinterpreted, but I do have to say that lately, when I step on a thread about TFA, I’m by some immediately wrongly “accused” of considering this movie “garbage”, and of “bashing” it because it’s trendy or something 😄 )
I liked:
[…]
-the First Order’s (if brief) theme;There were a lot of great themes in the film. This was the only one you liked??
Yep. Half of the themes were remakes of the older ones, while I didn’t find very moving the new ones.
Did you even listen to the soundtrack? I’m honestly having a hard time comprehending this.
Here are the new themes:
Rey’s theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65As1V0vQDM
Kylo Ren’s theme (at 4:20): https://youtu.be/y8ac1Qg-r-8?t=4m18s
Kylo Ren’s secondary theme (at 0:13): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUs88IY1A00
Finn’s theme (at 1:11): https://youtu.be/VLipUMfiiC8?t=1m
Poe Dameron’s theme (at 1:18): https://youtu.be/cHJrfB7VquM?t=1m14s
The Resistance’s theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueqKtype7Kk
The Jedi steps theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUBUlKgsNK8Of those (brilliant) new themes, the only one that I think even vaguely sounds like a remake is Kylo Ren’s, but that makes sense narratively.
Seriously, the fact that you think not one of those is worth liking and you instead prefer a small bit at the start of the film that isn’t even a theme makes me think you are just being purposefully contrarian on this point.
Calm down, I didn’t say they’re not good, just that I didn’t find them very moving in the movie. Besides, when I said half of the themes are remakes of the older ones, I wasn’t referring to these tracks, but the other half used in the movie which actually were remakes of older tracks like the Force’s theme, Luke’s theme, Leia’s theme, and so on.
That bit I said I like wasn’t randomly chosen, it is used every time the First Order appears in the movie, so it’s kind of like a theme on its own, right?
He says the Force is strong with this one after he has had trouble hitting anything besides a droid and while the image on screen is of Luke’s fight jerking around in such a way that he can’t lock on to him and Luke lasts much longer then any of the other pilots who were trained for combat do against Vader and he hits a target not even the computer can lock on to. The only reason he is there for Han to save is because he out flies a pilot who has been flying since before he was born and has been using the force much longer then he has. In the context of the movie it makes no more sense then Rey defeating Ren in the latest movie, and yet the people who attack Rey for being a Marry Sue are fine with Luke.
I don’t agree with your interpretation of this scene, but it’s fine. I don’t want to waste your time repeating myself about why I disagree on your points here.
What is more Rey is now attacked for not needing be saved by a man and not acting like a Disney princess and that is bold faced sexism.
Rest assured I’ve nothing sexist against her character, I have absolutely no problem with her gender and the fact she’s not a “damsel in distress”.
Maybe you should just consider the possibility that with some many people liking this character, it isn’t the character who is badly written, it’s just that these new films don’t appeal to you so you have zeroed in on the character as the reason. There is nothing wrong with just having personal tastes that something well written doesn’t appeal to. For instance I have never been able to get into Breaking Bad, Mad Men, or Game of Thrones. Those three shows are pretty much universally praised as some of the best written and acted shows of all time, but they just don’t appeal to me so I don’t watch them but I don’t try to tell people who do watch them that they are badly written, because it is clear a lot of people have found that to not be the case and it is more likely they just don’t appeal to my personal taste, so why would I spend time arguing over something I am never going to enjoy.
I would advise you to cut your losses with the new series and just go back to watching what you like and stop trying to convince people to hate something they enjoy. The new movies aren’t for you, that is fine, you don’t have to keep going out of your way to defend that simple fact just like I don’t have to go out of my way to defend my taste in movies. After all it’s just a film, we should really just relax.
Well, I do like Star Wars’ space opera’s genre, so I don’t think TFA just doesn’t appeal to me. When I went to the theater, I watched the movie both prising and opposing each of its features objectively, the same I do for all movies I watch, including the previous 6 Star Wars movies, and that’s not true that I completely disliked this movie (I don’t understand what made you think so).
In any case, I’m not trying to force anyone to agree with me at all on Rey. I just shared my opinions on this thread’s subject and we discussed together about what could be considered fact, what subjective, sharing each other’s point of view. I think that’s what threads are made for, after all, right? 😄
And I think we had a good time together, so thank you for making this thread.
Oh and I never said Ren just lost power for no reason, go reread what I said as I am sick of typing out the same thing one billion times in a row, so I will say it just once more.
And I never said he lost his power for no reason, I know you meant he was getting tired. I was just pointing out that Ren’s defeat can be seen from different point of views.
Also again if you have problem with this, Vader comes out and credits Luke’s use of the force with making it hard for him to lock onto and destroy Luke’s fighter in the first movie and Vader is a much more experienced combat pilot(Someone being a good pilot with civilian air craft does not make them a great combat pilot. That is why we can’t just take 747 pilots and put then in fighter aircraft without any training.)and has used the force a lot longer and he used it to kill Jedi back in the day, so why don’t you have a problem with the first movie?
If you just go by the movie with out any of the sequels, prequels, or behind the scenes info Luke being to out fly Vader and not get instantly killed like everyone else makes no sense by the same logic that you apply to the Ren/Rey fight.
Actually, Vader just says that the Force is strong with Luke, not that his power is making it hard for him to lock onto Luke’s fighter. The only reason he can’t kill him in the end, is because Han saves him at the last time and they weren’t able to actually defeat Vader either, so what’s the deal with it?
Nevermind Rey’s ridiculous ability to use the Force like a fully trained Jedi, her sudden abilty to defeat Ren makes less if no sense, unless it was just Ren being too tired to fight, as you said. I don’t think that’s the case, as it’s pretty obvious they were going for the “letting the Force in” (which, as I said, wasn’t explained nor questioned), but anyway, I agree to disagree.
I liked:
[…]
-the First Order’s (if brief) theme;There were a lot of great themes in the film. This was the only one you liked??
Yep. Half of the themes were remakes of the older ones, while I didn’t find very moving the new ones.
I liked:
-the opening shot, very artistic;
-the fact that for the first (or second?) time we see actual food in SW;
-the First Order’s (if brief) theme;
-Maz’s hippy attitude on the Force 😄
-that spy’s dressing in Maz’s castle (it feels so 70’s sci-fi 😄 )
-Han’s death. Not perfect, but still moving;
With respect JD, I think you’re pausing to talk and shift what you say you mean around, not pausing to take in and listen, and your arguments are circular. For example…
your new reply 1 - ‘only referring to the fact she was able to fly the Falcon good enough to not get destroyed by the Tie-Fighters’… and then ‘not a real issue’. Which is it? Why didn’t you say that in the first place instead?
It was obvious, as I was answering to this question, read it again:
I disagree with a lot of that JD - for one she hasn’t acquired more skills than Luke has (has she?)
She has, indeed:
[…]
-she’s a good enough pilot that she can outdo two (or three?) Tie-Fighters; Specifically, she knows how to pilot the Falcon AND also knows how to fix specific Falcon’s issues;
your new reply 2 - your ‘almost fully trained Jedi’… holding a lighsabre and still it’s a small knowledge of the Force (of all the force powers and abilities out there…)
Right, she doesn’t use the Force for mind reading, mind tricking or pulling lightsabers out of the snow, things Luke could only do in ROTJ (with the exception of pulling in TESB once), when Yoda says he knows everything he needs to know.
your new reply 4 - it contradicts your own claims in your new reply 2. Which is it - ‘she barely knows what it is’ or ‘almost full trained jedi’?
And that’s the contradiction I meant. If she barely knows about the Force and had no training, how can she use it like an almost fully trained Jedi? Never explained.
your new reply 5 - he’s now ‘drawing power from the Darkside’ because another user on here said so? Again, that’s quite a reach.
DrCrow just said the same thing I said in this thread, but anyway, it’s just a guess.
your new reply 6 - ‘Which, again, is something she does but never explained how or even hinted’ - erm… Maz hints at it where she says that Luke’s sabre is calling to her… and Maz tells her about the Force - “it moves through and around every living thing”, “close your eyes… feel it… the Light. It’s always been there - it will guide you.” - after the Force Visions where she touches Luke’s lightsabre. As I stated before the Force guided Rey when she let it in after she was her getting beat by Rey (you know, the bit where she closed her eyes and let the Force in?)
😄 When she was taking a nap, I remember it. Did they explain how she did it (IF she did it? DrCrown, for example, says Ren was instead defeated because he became powerless)? If it was not explained, was at least ever enstablished in any SW movie that people can learn about the Force like when “downloading” in The Matrix, with no actual training?
I’ve done you the courtesy of answering your statements and questions - but as I stated above, your posts shift in what you mean, your arguments are circular - and you don’t seem to have taken in what others have said - so I hope you understand why I won’t be replying to you again on this. Thank you.
Had you read what I said, you would’ve find out that I’ve actually taken into consideration and agreed on some points stated in this thread. No problem, anyway.
Nothing you said is ever officially stated in Star Wars if it stands on it’s own without any other movies. So if something not being officially stated as fact in bold typeface in TFA means that explanations based on lines and what we see there doesn’t count, then why do the explanations in Star Wars count.
When is it stated on screen before the stormtroopers scene that Jedi can could people’s minds like The Shadow?
You are giving Rey crap for having having powers and knowing things that have not been spelled out before they were used in the movie, when Obiwan does the exact same thing in the first movie.
I think you’re completely missing my point. It’s not about explaining how these characters can use their skills BEFORE they’re used, it’s just about explaining, either before or after. Just explain something or at least hint at it, c’mon :
Obi-wan is fine because we know he’s a Jedi, trained in the Force. We don’t know his specific “spells” yet, but we do know he’s able to “cast spells” like a “wizard”. Rey, on the other hand, is not a “wizard”, does not know about “magic” and yet she’s suddenly able to make use of powerful “spells” without any sort of explaination. It’s just not the same.
We are never shown Leia knowing what Chewie is saying, in fact she talks about him like he is a thing and throws around what could be considered a racist remark about his race. this would lead me to believe that she has never interacted with Wookies before, so why would she be able to understand him?
You’re assuming she’s never interacted with a wookie only because of her calling Chewie a “big walking carpet”? Had he been “The Nutty Professor” and had Leia said something about his body, would’ve meant she had never interacted with a human being? 😄
But anyway, I still don’t remember Leia actually talking with Chewie. I’m reading the shooting script at this very moment, and the only clue I see is “The Wookiee chatters something to Leia”, which doesn’t mean she understood what she said.
Also if Leia wasn’t helping to fly the ship then why did she need to go up there in the fist place and when is it stated in any of the movies that she knows anything about flying a ship, let alone enough to help in combat with a ship that controls are so far from the standard most people use that Luke, who is quite a good pilot, is confused by them. When is it even implied that she has any training that would help on a merchant ship in combat? If she isn’t up there to help fly it then all she was doing was getting in Chewbaca’s way, in the middle of a combat situation and why would Han or Chewie let her do that?
Same thing with her piloting: like in the movie, nowhere in the script I can see her actually piloting the Falcon, just “Leia watches the computer readout as Chewbacca manipulates the ship’s controls”.
Probably Chewie can’t handle everything by himself, even if he just someone to read about the ship’s status. As I alredy said the post before, it may be a plot hole, I’m not defending it.
Vader has still been in combat and Luke has not, so again how is Luke able to out fly Vader for so long and how is he so in touch with the force after one training session? I mean Luke being to out fly Vader under the logic you are applying to Rey and Ren’s fight, would be like a crop duster pilot being to out fly a an ace when they were dueling in state of the art F22s. Why are you not calling Luke a Marry Sue.
Because has been officially enstablished in the movie that Luke is a skilled pilot. All he had to do against Vader was flying streight to the target, anyway, so there was nothing he could do to out fly him. Why do you say he out flew Vader? Have we seen the same movie? 😄
Oh and about the fight think about what I have just explained as someone who has used a sword and has studied it’s use for some time and then tell me what part of this doesn’t make sense. Ren starts out winning but in the cold people burn through energy fast, he is using up his fast then Ray is, then you add in the fact that he is wounded, then he leaves himself open to an attack because he wants to try and tempt Rey to the dark side, he has not been in a real fight since Luke vanished so he isn’t expected Rey to lash out, he is expecting her to join him because he is just that full of himself, she then surprises him after letting the force in and gets in a couple of lucky hits that send him to the ground. He tired by this point and his body was giving out, if he had seen Rey as a threat he would have finished her off before he got tired, but he did and that did him in, it’s all there in the fight. You can tell he is getting tired because he keeps hitting himself so he can use the pain to keep himself awake and angry and full of energy.
Real life fights are nothing like the ones you see in video games, there are not any stats that determine who wins and loses every time, and in a sword fight if you misplace one foot in the middle of the fight, not matter how good you are you can find yourself in a world of hurt.
Yeah, but nothing does ever happen suddenly like that. One second before he was good enough to corner her, one second later he’s powerless. It makes no sense, I’m tired of repeating myself on this :\
Oh and if all it takes is the one training session to open Luke’s mind to the force, then could it be that Rey’s vision when she touched Luke’s lightsaber and then Ren using the force to try and get into her head had opened her mind to the force and thus she was able to do things on the same scale Luke was? I know this isn’t spelled out in the movie, but since when is everything spelled out in any Star Wars movie?
All that stuff you said explaining plot holes in Star Wars, was never stated on screen, we are left to figure it out ourselves from the context of how it shows up in the movie, so why is it not okay for TFA to do the exact same thing and to a lesser degree?
Since almost everything was spelled out or at least hinted in the other movies and, if it didn’t, it should’ve been. Something major as Rey’s ability to use the Force should’ve not been ignored by the movie itself, it feels like a deus-ex-machina.
Oh right because this movie is new so bashing it is cool, but bash Star Wars or any of it’s characters is not.
I don’t find not liking some aspects of TFA cool.
I don’t think anyone would even be complaining about Rey if she had been a guy, I think the only reason this question even comes up is because she is a girl and whenever there is a female lead in a modern movie it doesn’t take long for someone to accuse her of being a Marry Sue but I have never once in my life seen this same charge applied to a male character.
The fact is we see her make mistakes, she isn’t perfect, and everyone doesn’t treat her like she is the best thing in the history of everything and that alone puts her out of the running to be a Marry Sue without anything else needing to be explained. She is only a Marry Sue if you ignore all the times she makes a mistake or isn’t perfect at something, and once you are doing that then it is on you and not the writers, since they have no control over what you make up in your own head.Honestly I think it has gotten to the point that if a female character does anything right in a movie and doesn’t spend the whole time crying while waiting for a male hero to save her she is called a Marry Sue.
I have no problem with Rey being a girl: Even if he were I guy, I would’ve still complained that his skills were coming out of nowhere, with no explaination and when needed by the plot.
Since I started posting in this thread, never once I said that I disliked Rey for not making mistakes and being “too perfect”. I dislike her character for the way she’s suddenly able to do what needs to without a proper explaination.
