Jacobss

Guys, dont kill me if it’s alread been discussed. Has Adywan confirmed that he will fix the mistake with Luke’s “ghostly” appearence at Lars homestead, even though he already left with C3PO looking for R2? This mistake is only in SW versions from 97 onwards, because when they were doing restoration in the 90s, they reused wrong frames from the original negative. It wasnt fixed in original SW:R.

Burdokva said:

Thanks, fishmanlee !

I admit I have not heard some of these but they seem to have been released with various accompanying media, mostly games, rather than in the movie soundtrack itself.

Still, as it was presented in the movie, the soundtrack was mostly forgettable and did not have any strong themes. Be they bombastic and loud as the Imperial March, or something more restrained and emotional, as Leia's or Yoda's themes.

Williams is by far the best thing to happen to the prequels and he still did a fantastic job, especially considering (if this is true) that he was forced to cut and re-arrange his music due to Lucas re-shooting and re-editing scenes. But I still feel that AOTC and ROTS were not his best efforts.

Just my humble opinion, of course. Wouldn't mind him at all scoring any future movie, to the contrary.

The music in those videos is exactly the same, as it was presented in the movie. Maybe it's time to refresh the memory and watch ROTS again :).

Personally, I consider ROTS and ROTJ the best soundtracks from all SW movies. Never was a fan of ESB music (neither did I like the Imperial March) and I also didnt like TPM music (except for Dual of the Fates).

SW movies NEED JW as a music writer. I heard KOTOR and The Clone Wars music and although the KOTOR had few good themes, TCW was pretty forgetable.

I can describe this news with only two sentences:

I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced. I fear something terrible has happened.

Cobra Kai said:

canofhumdingers said:

Hmm... Just looks like Drake's Fortune in space. Not really as innovative as the people in the video make it out to be. I'm also pretty concerned that it will still have way too much prequel influence for my taste.

Still, I'm cautiously optimistic that just maybe it'll be worthwhile. The last SW game I played was the Battlefront series, and even those were only avg. IMO. I'd love a really great SW game set in or near the OT again!

 

Yeah I try to pretend the prequels don't exist so having a bunch of battle droids or clone troopers running around would definitely spoil this one for me, haha.

My favorite games are ones that allow freedom to explore or choose my own missions (Red Dead, Skyrim, Mass Effect) so I've always wanted a Star Wars game where you can free roam different environments, fly to other galaxies whenever you want, etc.

A pre-Star Wars Han Solo game like that, for example, would be pretty sweet, imo.   

Obviously 1313 doesn't look like this but I'm still interested in checking it out.

 

Did you never heard/play KOTOR (Knights of the old Republic)?

Yes, please :). Do it.

If only you, Cutter and Bobgarcia and maybe Adywan would join together, you would create ultimate ROTS, much better than the official version.

Sadly, it will never happen...

Why not? Palpatine is not a nice uncle. He is a Sith Lord for God's sake! With his final revelation, there is nothing more to hide. 

In the original cut, he is a nice uncle at this point. But, a few hours later, he kills Jedi without any problems, gives order 66 and convert republic into galactic empire. This totally contradicts his character. Of course, you would say he was doing that to manipulate Anakin, so there is no contradiction in his character. The problem is, it makes Anakin dumb as wood. There is a Sith Lord standing before him, who has killed millions of people and he believe's that he is ok? How naive you have to be? This is exactly unbelievable like when Palpatine kills Windu and tells Anakin, that he does not have the power to save Padme. Of course Anakin does nothing and accept that, being a five year old naive child.

Another idea from me:

Palpatine reveals himself

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUFptjizGXE

As always, it's a rough idea. My goal was to make Anakin more mature, show his shock about revelation and cut as many unnecessery dialogue as possible. Also I though it was necessery to cut everything about Padme, because generally this considered to be lame. Anakin is turning to the dark side, because he wants more power. Not because he wants to save his wife. In this video, I only wanted Palpatine to reveal himself step by step. Without begging Anakin to join him. He just wants that Anakin will think about him. Anakin doesn't kill him, because he knows him for too long. He is just shocked and does his Jedi responsibility - letting counsel to decide. He realizes later that the anger he felt, when he looked at Palpatine with his lightsaber is what he wants and what gives him power. I think less is sometimes more.

There are two things in this scene, which always bothered me - music and too much unnecessary dialoge. Considering limited amount of footage, with my poor technical editing skills, I was doing my best.

Some may wonder why I post it in this thread. Well, first of all, I'm trying to give the Cutter some inspiration. Second, I'm hoping that a little traffic will bring him back here :).

Rough idea of getting OT feeling:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UhjZJSVSaU

Look only at content - it's only a rough idea...

TV's Frink said:

Jacobss said:

TV's Frink said:

You need to work on your sarcasm...especially if you throw out the rape thing.

Well, it's hard to express "sarcasm" on the internet. Besides that, english is not my native language and my culture is totally different from yours, so it's natural that we have different views on such things.

So are you saying "rape" means something different in your culture?

And because sarcasm is difficult to express on the internet, the burden of expression lies with the one who is attempting to use it.

You still don't get it. I have not invented "Lucas raped my childhood". Don't you see that I was just laughing about those whiny fanboys, who scream the whole time that they want OUT, because it's the part of their childhood. They don't want to preserve it. They don't care about the cultural impact and history. They want subconsciusly regain they childhood by getting it. Sadly, it's impossible. It's gone. Forever.

I care about OUT only because of preservation. It was part of my childhood, yes, but my childhood is gone. I won't care so much about movies, only because there were part of my childhood. I care about them because Lucas want to rewrite the history. That's all. And I think that's also the goal of this site. This site was not created for whiny fanboys to get movies from their childhood. It was created to convince Lucas to preserve OUT and make it available to the public. It didn't happen, so we have to do it with our own hands.

TV's Frink said:

You need to work on your sarcasm...especially if you throw out the rape thing.

Well, it's hard to express "sarcasm" on the internet. Besides that, english is not my native language and my culture is totally different from yours, so it's natural that we have different views on such things.

Cuchulainn said:

Jacobss said:

Yes, it is connected with our chilhood (therefore these can be seen more than just movies), but now, in 2011, it's time to let go. I accept that I can't have everything in my life, and that my childhood is long gone. Many of our childhood memories are connected to this movies, but we won't regain it, if SW will become, what it once was.

I will never agree with this. The point seems to be totally lost on you. I adored Star Wars as a child and I love it as an adult, but to just go 'ok it's shit but at least it's something' is ludicrous. The point isn't the fact that he has fucked around with it so much that it's making less sense than ever before, it's the fact that he's dismissed the original, awesome movie (remember, the cool one with the ace sound) to the point where he's actually physically destroying any remains of it. Anyone with a brain within their head can see there's something seriously wrong here (despite the many, and potentially illegal aspects of his actions).

This, and only this, (the EU and Prequels can fuck off, IMO)is why I'm feeling in anyway 'down' about Star Wars.

What you said here does not contradict anything I said.

I am not a member of this site since yesterday. I was a reader already in 2004 and joined here two years ago. I totally understand anything about preservation of SW and knowing some things, I will not cry if OUT is not released by Lucas ;).

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

I'd feel the same if it was "Citizen Kane"... important cultural stuff deserves to be preserved.  Just "let it go" is not the purpose of this forum.  That's why there are people here doing their own preservations/restorations, and the various efforts such as the webpage(s) and facebook page, petition, etc.  It's not about whining, it's about acting.

There are three other forums I belong to with similar aims for other topics (not Star Wars), just so you know that it's not just some weird SW fixation.

I hope you were not responding to me. Because if you did, then all my effort of posting, being active etc. on this site makes no sense. I know exactly what and why we are doing it. I was just responding to people doing nothing and whining. Strangely, but people who are doing something (like Adywan, Harmy, you etc.) are not whining, but people who does nothing, are talking bullshit like (GL raped my childhood etc.). Personally I'm involved in preservation of SW on another site (you know exactly what I'm talking about ;) ) and that's why I will not cry if OUT will not be released.

WhatsMyName said:

Jacobss said:

but... but... these are more than movies for me... it is my childhood and... Lucas raped it...

 you gonna be immature with that Lucas raped my childhood thing?

And i'm not worried. I can live with SW as it is even if i don't agree with the changes.

It was sarcasm. I've repeated your post (in sarcastic form) to all people, who are "depressed" with the current state of SW. I also want the OUT to be released in HD, but if that will not happen, I will not cry. These are only movies. Yes, it is connected with our chilhood (therefore these can be seen more than just movies), but now, in 2011, it's time to let go. I accept that I can't have everything in my life, and that my childhood is long gone. Many of our childhood memories are connected to this movies, but we won't regain it, if SW will become, what it once was.

but... but... these are more than movies for me... it is my childhood and... Lucas raped it...

"Discussion" with some "fan" from blu-ray.com

Moviefan2k4

Unrestored laserdisc masters of the OT's theatrical versions were included as bonus material on the 2006 "Limited Edition" DVDs. Within a very short time frame, fans started bickering, even after sending so many years demanding unaltered versions, which is exactly what they got

Me

No, it is not.

Please, stop it. Laserdisc from 1993 on DVD in 2006 from a company, which once cared about quality? This is what the fans wanted? No. Would you be happy, if you would get upscaled DVD version of SE on Blu-ray Disc with compressed sound? They didn't even transfer the PCM track from Laserdisc on DVD. They used just heavily compressed DS 2.0

But we are talking here about company, which can't even get SE right...
The funny thing about quality of OUT is, that it is still possible for it to look better than SE. The 2004 and 2011 versions of OT are stuck in 1080p resolution (1997 on 2k) , when with OUT you can still get 4k scans.

Moviefan2k4

Truth be told, the majority of purists clamoring for "unaltered" versions don't realize what they're asking for, in the strictest sense. If Lucas were to release a truly unaltered version of the OT, it would be grainy, dirty, color-drained, and the sound would be seriously degraded. That's what "unaltered" means: not changed.

That's why I think a new term really needs to be invented, or maybe even have folks describe what they want in detail...but that would require contemplation, rational thinking, and overall objectivity, all three of which are sorely lacking in much of the "purist" community. If people want cleaned, restored, and updated video or audio for the theatrical OT films, that's fine; more power to ya. But don't stand around, constantly saying you want them "unaltered". Those who use that term are basically hanging themselves with it.

Me

Time to take a little break from all this sad talk about LOC, Lucas or prequels. Although we all know that music (especially in SW films) is very important, we often don't mention John Williams as a man, who was one of the key people to make OUT so great (or in my opinion, the only man, who made prequels watchable). I would even consider, if he wasn't the most important of all key people (Kurtz, Lucas, Marcia, Kasdan, Kershner). So taking all this into account, I wanted to ask you - what is the best SW score in your opinion and why?

In my opinion the best is the "Force theme" - it is sad, but it also made me happy, when I had bad days. It gave me motivation to survive all problems. Original, it was an extended and little slower version of "Binary sunset". During prequels era, various versions of this theme were made. Some parts of it were used in "Battle of the heroes", "funeral of Qui-Gon Jinn" or during the beginning of ROTS, when Obi Wan and Anakin fly above the republic cruiser.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lROtpmO3NbE&feature=related

Tell me that this video isn't beautiful.

The sad thing about Lucas is, that you are only good, when you accept his new vision. What I am trying to say is that, it's not only that OUT fans are ignored. 1997 fans are also ignored (trust me, there are many people who prefer them over 2004 edition - no Hayden, better colors and so on), just like the 2004 fans (they also do exist - all those kids who grew up with it). Now everyone has to accept the 2011 version. But the saddest thing is, when the 3D version (with new changes) comes out, this will be the version you will have to accept. Those who prefer the 2011 version, will be ignored again.

Do you prefer the 1997 edition? Well, the best possible quality (available legally) is only laserdisc.

Do you prefer 2004 edition, without Vader yelling noooo? Well, the best possible quality is DVD.

And so on....

With Lucas, you just have nothing to say. You can't have a version you prefer. You have to accept what vision Lucas actually have and that's it.

In my opinion, ROTJ is the best from OT. It has it's flaws, but none of the SW films is perfect (not that any film is perfect, but AHN and ESB are also far from being perfect). When I was reading those "10 reasons why ROTJ suck", I was thinking that the author didn't understand a few points. He said that there is nothing redeemable in Darth Vader. Well, that's exactly the major point of all this! Even Obi-Wan and Yoda didn't think he was. Not even Palpatine. Everyone thought that his was just evil guy, a machine. Just watch the movie, watch their conversation on the bridge on Endor).

This was perfectly clear to me as a young boy (the prequels didn't exist at that moment) and I can't understand, why it isn't clear for the author.

If I had more time, I would write more. Besides Ewoks and second Death Star, in my opinion there is nothing wrong with ROTJ. It still entertain me more than ESB and AHN. They are great movies, but they also have unnecessary subplots and boring moments (I almost fell asleep during battle of Yavin or on Cloud City, before Vader shows up.)

I also cancelled my preorder. I don't need this movies. I don't need anything from Lucas anymore.

I was so hyped about this release and now I feel just raped.

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

georgec said:

I'm going as far as to say that since 2004 and the botched audio issues with A New Hope, and now with confirmation of added dialogue and other changes, Matthew Wood comes across as a complete douche bag who's trying to put as much of his imprint on SW as possible.

...he sounds like an idiot who's more excited about making his own changes to SW and taking credit for them rather than doing what's best for the movies,

The more I read the interview, the more I saw that too.  I get the impression that at LFL, the movies are seen as a sort of sandbox that everyone gets to play in once every few years. What a warped view of classic cinema.

I agree. I got that impression when I was watching the making of documentaries from PT. Designers, actors and ILM guys were almost always talking crap like:

"Getting into Darth Vader suite - that's the cool part", "Yoda with the lighsabre, that's cool". "Everyone was cheering when Darth Vader showed up on the set". "I was doing things which I was imagining since I was a kid". And so on...

It's sad that besides Lucas, nobody was really interested in the story. Every character from OT showing up in the PT was cool for them and that's it. They didn't see any magic in those films. It was just a job for them. That's why I say that it wasn't only Lucas fault that the PT failed. To make a good movie, you need a good team, with passion. Look at OT, then you will see ILM guys really wanting things to work. You will see a producer interested in the plot, not only interested in making the cheapest movie possible (McCallum).

You also need actors, who are interested in the roles - Portman and Christensen, although they were main characters, didn't show any interest. I think they just used this movies for their carriers and that's it.

I took some pictures:

Exactly the same as 2004 color timing with horrible pink skin:

Cyan tint

Bright Death Star

Beautiful long and thin lightsabres

Alert pink!!!!

Now, tell me that I wasn't right, when I said that Ady's work influenced Lucasfilm. Check this clip and look on Vader's eyes:

http://moments.starwars.com/scene/162

Yes, they are black.

Sadly, this confirms that those clips are took from BD. Why is it sad? Well, I checked all pictures from OT SE and sadly, color timing is almost unchanged from 2004 DVDs and lightsabres (except for ROTJ crossed sabers) are not fixed.

So, thank you Lucasfilm again for this "countless" hours spend on BDs. I bet the green saber on the Falcon is still the same (maybe it is yellow this time?).

And now a gift from Lucasfilm:

Gift, what gift?

Hopefully.

Tell me that Lucasfilm is not reading OT.com:

Tidbits and “But I saw it at Comic-Con…”

I reported earlier that the “Humdinger Glitch” has been fixed.  There have been a lot of people inquiring as it was in the footage that was seen at Comic-Con.  I was told that someone from Lucasfilm overheard an attendee at Comic-Con comment after seeing the footage that “the glitch is still there”.  They tracked it down and had it fixed.  It was one of the last if not THE last change made prior to the discs being locked down for final release.

Yea, right... Sorry, I don't believe that. They read it here (theory with Kenkraly being Matt Wood isn't so crazy) and fixed it. Considering that this glitch was spotted not so long ago and they made it on time, well, hard to believe.

I read part I and part II, also I read another preview of Blu-Ray:

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/starwarsbds/preview.html

Some of you may recall that on the 2004 DVD, when the X-Wings begin their dive down to the Death Star, the familiar John Williams trumpet fanfare was buried in the mix so you could barely hear it. No longer! The trumpets ring true in the Blu-ray mix loud and clear. When I heard this, I couldn't help thrusting my arms up in the air in a bit of happy relief. I then turned to Matt (Wood), who as it happens was standing right next to me, and saw him give a little smile and nod - he knew exactly what I was reacting to. When I leaned over to thank him for fixing it, his simple reply made me smile as well: "Trust me, I read the blogs too..."

I think he is visiting OT.com and maybe he is hiding under some nickname.

Why Didn’t You Ask About the Original Series?

I did, and I was politely given the answer I expected, the same one that has been given before: This is the vision that George Lucas has for his films….

Q:  On the DVD, the orchestra for the surround channels was swapped, was that fixed?

A:  It’s funny, because it never really was an error --- what happened back then was that the music master we had at the time didn’t have any surround information.  One of the techniques that has been used previously from mixers is to give it a bigger soundstage---they would have flipped the back channel to give it a different kind of reverb.  And that was done on the THX 1138 remaster, which I didn’t work on.  For this go-round (6.1) we decided not to do that, so the surround information is direct to the back, no longer flipped on the music track.

Yeah, deliberate creative....

So, I came to a conclusion: BIG, BIG THANKS to ADYWAN, HARMY AND OTHER OT Artist for forcing Lucasfilm to make this changes. Really. Without you, they would say everything is all right with 2004 DVD. BUT with your edits, they saw that they cannot lie anymore and they have to do something. GREAT!!!

Ady - You were worried about cyan tint over Hoth - there is still hope they fixed that:

While I am fairly sure that they originated from the digital files, they should not be used to look for DNR, crushed blacks, resolution levels, or to find Waldo, but they should be used to see that there is no longer a puppet pole showing, that light sabers have changed, that there is more picture information on Episode I, and to represent the concept that a lot of work has gone into this release to fix issues from the previous DVD release.  Any other use is not recommended or implied.  Hopefully that will squelch any controversies, but since this is Star Wars, I may be expecting too much. 

There is still a chance they fixed the "colars".

I'm waiting for "our" members to deal with those new informations, because I'm very exited now.

We also learned that TPM was done from digital files (we were all wondering if there was a DI from TPM).

There are also some sad things:

Q:  Was there any thought given to archiving previous tracks like the 6-track master from the 70mm prints or the 78 mono remix?  Any thought given to putting them on the Blu-ray?

A:  Yes, we have those and they’ve all been digitized.  I don’t know if they considered putting those on the Blu-ray.  That might be more of a question for Marketing, it may be an issue of space.  It’s funny because I play those other audio tracks, like the scene when R2 and C3PO have been left on Tatooine and they walk through the canyon.  I just love that on the current mix, you can actually hear the quiet, when R2 is lonely, going through the canyon.  I played the original mix and it’s FULL of hiss and totally brittle, so it’s fun now to hear it like George wanted it to really be, what was intended.

So they have the restored 1977 70mm sound. Now all we need is that they scan the original elements from the negative, incorporate them into SE negative and release it on BD with lossless sound. Sadly, this will probably never happen.

Quick idea from me. Don't look at the technical aspect, because it was done very quickly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK-3UNRm-yk

It's only an idea. I know you already replaced this moment with your Obi Wan Anakin theme, but I think that at the moment, when they say "may the force be with you", there should be a force theme presented. That would be a great continuity with OT.

Another idea I had in mind was about burned Anakin on Mustafar. Originaly, there was no dialog in this scene, so I tried to do something like this.

Original music:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g98kvH83y5g

Force theme version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0voGuaYEOM

But as I said, this was very quick made.

Now, as we just learned that BD set will contain the 2004 master, we know that the colars will not be fixxxxed. As always, we got Kenkraly response about that.

Kenkraly said:

These flaws with the OT transfer from 2004 don't bother me at all why it bothers some fans I don't get. at all. It won't stop me from buying the blu-ray box set if it is indeed the case that the flaws are not fixed. If some don't like it then don't buy the set. I had hold'ed out hope for the erorrs from 2004 to be fixed but if their not I can deal with that.

Source: blu-ray.com forum

I can remember that months ago he said he IS sure that everything will be fixed. Now, what do you have to say Kenkraly? You should come here and apologize everybody.