ImperialFighter

Anchorhead said:

To me, after having read a myriad of interviews with Lucas and the people involved with the original film, it seems as though he never really understood why the first film was such a phenomenon.    Looking at the crawls, it seems he still didn't understand it twenty-two years later. 

We started with a princess trying to save the galaxy in her starship to a dispute over republic taxation?  Yeah, that's an adventure.

I still remember that a mother who was sitting nearby me in the cinema, was reading the 'scroll' aloud to her youngster.  But I knew by the time she read out the 'taxation of trade routes' nonsense, that the kid would *really* be confused as to what the hell was meant to be going on...and I recall thinking it wasn't a great start to the show compared to the chapter wording in the 'ANH', 'ESB', and 'ROTJ' scrolls.

Thing is, during the few years leading up to the 'Phantom Menace' release, the dictator Sadaam Hussein had constantly been the subject of troublesome stories in the news...and I imagined that Lucas was possibly cooking up a prequel trilogy that was going to be somewhat timely and pertinent to the real-life events at the time...which perhaps involved the 'Emperor' as an already-established dictator that was causing all kinds of problems for the galaxy...and that this would possibly explain how the 'clone wars' came about originally...

I still wish I'd been right about that notion, but I guess Lucas thought that 'business matters' was more interesting as a mcguffin for his saga set-up than anything else at the time.

It's previously been suggested by some that 'slavery' could have been used as a main issue in the movie's storyline instead...and that's one possibility that would have made for a more satisfying 'boo, hiss' factor, if the 'Emperor' had been written to be behind that kind of thing.

However, considering the iconic establishing scene that kicked off the original trilogy, I was then looking forward to seeing what kind of imagery Lucas had conjured up to kickstart the very beginning of his overall 'saga'...only to get a straightforward panning shot of the red Ambassador ship, and a fairly bland introduction to things overall.

I guess I expected too much right from the off...but yeah, the alarm bells began to ring for me by what was being described in that initial 'scroll' wording.

Unlike the LOTR trilogy, the HOBBIT movies have sadly ended up on my 'edits-I'd-like-to-do-one-day' list, and it's been interesting to see some of the views here and elsewhere about the various ways to edit them.

I'm actually only getting round to catching the final instalment on the big screen tomorrow, as I wasn't able to fit it in over the Christmas/New Year period as I originally intended...so will be interested to see how Jackson wraps things up.

Since I happened to be a 'philistine' that had never actually read any of the Tolkien books (!), I was able to watch Jackson's 'cinematic' LOTR trilogy as something fresh at the time, without any knowledge of how things would pan out...and without any pre-conceptions about how they *should* have turned out compared to the original source material.  I had a great time with each of them at the time, and liked the 'extended' versions even more - although I *still* think that ROTK should have ended where everyone kneeled for Frodo and the hobbits, as the camera looked up at them... :) 

However...as much as I was pleased that Jackson was going to direct the HOBBIT movies too, in the end...I'd also read the concerns that many Tolkien fans had about the fact that he was turning this smaller scale 'prequel' to LOTR into a full-blown trilogy of movies once again.  And since I've ended up having to drastically alter many, many moments of Jackson's self-indulgent 'King Kong' for myself into a much shorter version I prefer (a mix of the 'Theatrical' and 'Extended' versions), I too wondered just how much of the same excessive 'bloat' he'd introduce over these 3 movies when he got around to them...

Quite a bit it turns out, judging by the first 2 instalments alone...and it'll no doubt take a *lot* of my time to work out the various bits and pieces that I'd rather see altered throughout the 3 movies eventually.  However, at some point I'll look forward to watching the 4-hour-plus 'The Hobbit:The Tolkien Edit' by TolkienEditor that's linked to above...as I already caught some of the things he wrote across at Fanedit.org recently, and some of his ideas seem to chime with some of my own.  Yes, it's long...but there's always the 'pause' button if anyone wants a 'break'/'intermission'. 

Since I never read the books, I can pick and choose my favourite footage/dialogue out of Jackson's versions without feeling the urge to follow the way Tolkien laid things out originally, seeing as I was never invested in the books as my first introduction to the characters etc, only the movies themselves.  And of course, I'll be waiting to see what additional scenes the 'extended' version of 'The Battle Of The Five Armies' brings.  But I have a feeling my own eventual version for myself will be split over 2 edited movies, no matter what. :)

doubleofive said:

In other news, a call for help has been placed:

http://swrevisited.wordpress.com/2015/01/14/the-plan-for-the-future/

As there's been a new update from adywan on his Revisited facebook page concerning all this now, I thought I'd take a moment to relay it here too -

"Well we have a few new members of the Revisited Crew.  Some very talented people have come onboard.  I will introduce them all at a later date though.  I'm always looking for people with Cg skills, Digital matte skills etc, so there is still plenty of time to come on board.

I can tick a couple of the 1/48 kits off my list.  Thanks to Chris, i will soon have a fine molds 1/48 x-wing.  And i have a chance on getting a 1/48 scratch build Y-Wing resin kit which is gorgeous and really detailed.  I just need to scrape together £200 by the end of the month, so keep your fingers crossed..  I'm still no closer, however, on a b-wing 1/48 kit and an a-wing 1/48 kit. so if anyone knows anyone who is still selling any resin kits at this scale then please do let me know.

EDIT: I HAVE DECIDED TO GO DOWN THE SCRATCH BUILD ROUTE FOR THE A & B-WINGS SO I NO LONGER NEED TO FIND THOSE KITS.

I'm back to work finishing off the Han in Carbonite sculpt tomorrow and will hopefully get it cast in a week or so, so i can get those scenes filmed and out of the way.

I'll be sticking some stuff on ebay beginning of next month so i can clear a lot of this out to make way for the next batch of stuff and help raise funds for materials to carry on the saga.  I'm really running out of room.  There will be individual dagobah Trees, Han's ESB Blaster, Possibly the large AT-AT model amongst other things if I can get that filmed and out of the way in time." 

https://www.facebook.com/swrevisited?fref=nf   

While George Lucas could be considered as having been the first to have created 'fan edits' of his saga, the guy that came up with 'The Phantom Edit' surely sealed the deal...

Here's a really informative article on 'The Phantom Edit' fan edit, and fan editing in general -

http://journal.transformativeworks.org/index.php/twc/article/view/575/466 

Sadly, Rod Taylor of 'The Birds' and 'The Time Machine' fame has passed away at age 84...  - http://io9.com/rip-rod-taylor-star-of-the-birds-and-the-time-machine-1678456386

No probs.  Good luck, whatever you decide.

kane1138 said:

I think your voice fits pretty well, HAL.

Me too, although I can certainly understand that he'd prefer to hear *someone else's* voice on his version.

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Anyway Hal, I thought I better chime in with my thoughts on this, seeing as you ended up using the We cannot say how long she will survive wording I proposed.

Your re-recording sounds pretty good I reckon, but seeing as I know how much effort you've put into your prequel edits, I thought I'd better bring up a very *little* thing that struck me after I listened to your clip a couple of times.  As I previously mentioned, I haven't checked out any of your versions yet...so I didn't know you were *also* including the medical droid then saying the words We are preparing to deliver the babies immediately afterwards...and you hadn't mentioned that line in your comments at the time.

So here's the thing I wanted to point out.  You might be 100% happy with how all three lines now sound, but I kinda think that the droid saying We at the start of *both* those sentences sounds a bit 'off' somehow, and doesn't flow as well as it could.  So seeing as you are using that third line too, my slight alteration to what I suggested would be this instead -

She has sustained severe injuries.  I cannot say how long she will survive.  We are preparing to deliver the babies.

As I say, it's a very little thing indeed, and you'll just have to decide for yourself if you prefer this more 'flowing'-sounding alteration using the I instead of the first We, or if you prefer the still correct, but slightly more 'stilted'-sounding current wording from the droid.

You've done some good stuff, either way.

(Thankfully I won't have this kind of wording problem to begin with...as unlike yourself, The Cutter, Q2, and eventually adywan too...I'm keeping Padme *dead as a dodo* for what I have in mind for myself - regardless of what Leia says in ROTJ - as I'm including certain footage that I prefer where that's concerned - although it *won't* be due to her 'losing the will to live'!)  :)

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Final thought concerning your dialogue - would the words I cannot say how long she might survive be better or not, do you think?

luckydube56 said:

I just heard they hired 3 martial artists for this film.

 Just to clarify, it seems it's these guys that featured in the well-regarded 'The Raid' and it's sequel - http://www.twitchfilm.com/2015/01/the-raid-trio-to-appear-in-star-wars-episode-7---the-force-awakens.html

Overall, the non-SE Original Trilogy was a delicious 3-course feast for the imagination...

...while the Prequel Trilogy was 3 shit sandwiches overall.

Sorry, that's all I got. 

Hal 9000 said:

That seems pretty convoluted, and personally there was never a question about what color Anakin's saber would be. It's the saber that went to Luke, therefore it is blue. Introducing a red saber through fan editing adds a host of questions that need rationalizations, as you demonstrated. 

I could live with thinking 'ol Ben must have changed the 'crystal' somewhere along the line after ROTS, for the impact the change makes - there's a lot that needs rationalized about the prequels as it is, and let's face it, he didn't seem to have much else to do stuck out in that old hut on Tattooine...except maybe sun himself, or hang out in the cantina a little too often. ;)

On the other hand, if George had just let Obi-wan hang onto that GREEN saber of Qui-gon's that he used to kill Maul with...then we could have had a contrast of colours in the duel with Anakin after all! :)

Hal 9000 said:

I'd also like to open the floor for last minute ideas about dialogue for the medical droid. The idea is to communicate that Padme is injured in such a way that she will die a few years down the road. 

Currently the droid says, "She has sustained severe injuries. She will survive, but she may never fully recover."

Although your current wording leaves it open-ended enough to tie-in with what Leia infers in ROTJ, here's a possible alternative that's equally open-ended, but leans a little more to the possibility of her untimely demise -

Perhaps the medical droid could instead say "She has sustained severe injuries.  We do not know how long she can survive." 

Or something similar such as "She has sustained severe injuries.  It's uncertain how long she can survive."

Or something equally similar such as "She has sustained severe injuries.  We cannot say how long she will survive."

Just a thought you may or may not prefer, seeing as you asked.

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Either way, I look forward to checking out your trilogy versions eventually.  Although I have very fixed versions of my own in mind where a lot of scenes are concerned, I'm always interested in what others choose to do. 

I see that you're intending to alter the colour of Windu's lightsaber.  Good stuff, as I know that adywan is intending to change the colour too, and that's something I'm looking forward to seeing eventually. 

Just as an aside, the *other* colour change to a lightsaber that I really loved was in bobgarcia74's preview clip for his Episode III: Reign Of The Dark Side edit...where he changed Anakin's blade to RED instead of blue for his duel with Obi-wan.  Personally, I think it looks terrific compared to the blue on blue fighting of the original. 

Yes, I know that some will say that having the same colour of blade 'symbolises' the tragedy that they were 'Jedi brothers-in-arms' to begin with, but it sure brings a more visually-stiking look to the shots as far as I'm concerned - and I look on Anakin as already being very set on his dark path by the time that Padme gets choked by him anyway - going by George's direlogue anyway - so a 'Sith'-like colour change to his blade (for *whatever* reason) is fine by me at this point.

But doesn't that contradict the fact that Obi-wan then tells Luke years later that his father wanted him to have his lightsaber one day...and it turns out to be BLUE in STAR WARS:ANH?...

Simple, Obi-wan *lied* for a start as far as I'm concerned.  I don't recall Anakin mentioning any such thing to Obi-wan in the first place...and seriously doubt that it would be something he would have even given a moment's thought about 'offscreen' at the time either...considering his wife was still *secretly* pregnant, and the fact that he had bigger issues on his mind at that point, such as galaxy-wide domination... 

Therefore, due to Obi-wan's 'twisting of the truth' in ANH which suited his mission intentions at the time...I'm happy to imagine that he could also easily have given Luke *any* old lightsaber that he happened to have in his belongings at that time, which happened to have a *similar-looking* hilt to the one he picked up in ROTS...but which happened to be blue...

OR...if it was indeed the *actual* RED one that he picked up in ROTS, that he'd merely fiddled about with it at some point during the years so that it wasn't a 'Sith'-colouration anymore! This is my preferred option, by the way. ;)

I thought I'd add another update to this thread before this year ends -

Just so everyone knows, TMBTM (TheManBehindTheMask) was the talented fan-editor who contacted me ages ago to kindly offer to cut those proposed ALIEN 3/ALIEN RESURRECTION re-edits on my behalf, at some point.  Considering the work involved in these things, that was very generous of him, and I'd like to thank him very much for that again.  And once again, I'd also like to thank the others who responded quickly to my PM's at the time too.

But...a couple of things arose around that time just shortly after TMBTM's offer of help -

Firstly, I soon realised that e-mailing all the necessary detailed descriptions of the many precise cuts and timings I required for those would just take up too much of my spare time in the end...and that some would prove especially problematic for me to get across to someone else.  There were just too many moments that needed a LOT of written descriptions to get across properly, it turned out... 

Secondly, however...at around the same time, I had actually started to make my first faltering steps at messing about with some ripping and editing software for the first time ever...and soon discovered that I was able to re-edit shots together in far less time than it would have taken me to write out all the detailed descriptions to TMBTM.  On top of this, I also realised that I had several more 'cut-lists' ready-and-waiting for certain other movies I equally wanted to re-cut too...but I couldn't expect TMBTM (or anyone else) to undertake those for me too, at the end of the day.  So I eventually came to the conclusion that there was nothing else for it...I would just have to try and make time to brush up on this whole editing malarkey *myself* if I was ever going to have a chance of seeing all my own versions realised one day.

So that's what I ended up deciding to do, and I let TMBTM know this at the time.  I'm getting there bit by bit, and seeing my first short practise clips in motion was great fun.  I've now managed to reach the stage where I've been able to cut the entire, much shortened version of Peter Jackson's KING KONG that I wanted to see (a mix of the 'Theatrical' and 'Extended' versions, with numerous re-edits throughout), which took a lot of time to achieve, but has proved immensely satisfying for me. :)

Finally, I hope to show a 'visual' step-by-step of what I've come up with for that at some point during 2015.  There'll also be plenty of clips showing various possibilities for other movies included too, including a heap of my own proposals for those three bothersome 'Star Wars prequels'.

(Oh, and just so you know...unlike RIPLEY and CAPTAIN KIRK, I'm sorry to say that KONG still cops it in my version...) :p

Wishing everyone a very HAPPY NEW YEAR.  Very much looking forward to Empire Strikes Back Revisited being released this coming year.  Slange!

So that clarifies Padme's fate come the end of ROTS:R then. :)

The wording in the PT:R Facts section of the wordpress link kinda made it look like it could have gone either way, so nice to get that confirmed. 

No idea which way he's going with that, but I'm hopeful as I say.

Edit: apologies Hal 9000, I wasn't concentrating properly, and just realised that the link I referred you to wasn't actually to do with Leia's 'memories' of her mother, after all.  So adywan *may well be* intending to 'save' Padme after all using the same technique.

Hal 9000 - in case adywan is too busy to get back to you on this, or doesn't want to cover it in this thread, let me refer you to a much more recent update to do with that issue near the bottom of this link - http://swrevisited.wordpress.com/rotjr-facts/

(for the record, I'm happy with this decision and am hoping it means he won't be going down the 'The Other Boleyn Girl' footage route.  It was a clever enough idea as a way to make sense of Leia's ROTJ dialogue, but I'm hoping this means he'll be sticking with actual ROTS footage one way or another.  But that's all for another day)

jedimasterobiwan - like the mountainous backdrops and skies throughout the Hoth battle, the snowplains are inconsistent during many shots as well - sometimes things look smooth, while other times the snow is rougher-looking in places.  While Ronster's still mock-up looked good, I'm not sure if it's possible to do the likes of that on moving shots.

No worries here however, as I'd never have imagined the amount of work that adywan would end up doing already to make the Hoth surroundings feel more consistent.  A few differing snow bumps here and there are to be expected, considering how mis-matched a lot of the original shots are.

Thanks for those answers adywan.  The new overall sound mix is going to be one of the things I'm looking forward to most in this edit.

Have a MERRY CHRISTMAS everyone!

jedimasterobiwan said:

where's the video or is it not up yet?

We just had the Christmas clip - these things aren't handed out like sweets, as adywan doesn't want to reveal all the footage/surprises before the edit comes out.

Maaaaybe Santa will organise some kind of additional trailer in the New Year *if* we're all good, but don't bank on it. 

adywan said:

It's a screengrab taken from the finished video

Wow, another great piece of the 'ESB:R' jigsaw is revealed.  And what a triumph!  I don't know how many man-hours it took to build and film your 'Dagobah' miniature adywan, but it was well worth it, as it looks fabulous in that shot.  It's hard to believe that it was originally just a 6ft x 6ft diorama -

Between the lighting and 'misting' effects, it looks like you actually built the whole set full-scale to film on!  :)

I wondered where you'd be positioning the knobby white spider, and it looks wonderful at this spot.  Thanks for this latest reveal.

Well it's that time of year again, so I'd just like to wish adywan and all the other denizens of OT.com a very HAPPY CHRISTMAS!

* blows big raspberry at Worf *

HigHurtenflurst said:

Those sound like SUGGESTIONS!!!  etc., etc.

Move along, HH - I was merely making 'observations'.  Don't shoot me.  ;)

At the risk of offending Mr. Ghostface, I'd just like to say thanks for that latest Christmas clip adywan....and that it's AWESOME-looking work once again!  :)

While there's a LOT more as-yet-unseen moments from the overall 'Hoth Battle' that I'm interested to see what you'll do with...there's certainly an incredible amount of adjustments in just this short 1 min. 12 secs. portion of it, alone. 

For the benefit of everyone else here that may miss one or two, here's a rundown -

1.  Colour-correction throughout - obviously.  And it's so nice to see white snow at this time of the year, rather than blue-tinged snow.  And faces that are now flesh-coloured, rather than pink...

2.  The rebel turret that gets blown up at the beginning doesn't have a huge black scorchmark on it anymore *before* it gets hit by a laserbolt. (this isn't noticeable in the clip unless you're able to freeze the very first frame at just the right moment, by the way)

3.  All the laserbolts have been re-done throughout. (and there were a LOT of them to do)

4.  The rebel turret gun recoils as it fires now.

5.  The snowspeeder that flies over the rebel trench as there's an explosion, is now bigger, to improve the scaling of it. (this is a nice little improvement, and an issue I don't recall ever being brought up by anyone previously)

6.  Correct detailing on the inside of the AT-AT's right leg now, in the close-up.  And the 'jagged', missing bit is fixed now too.

7.  The AT-ST walker in the distance has been redone and slightly re-positioned.  (and it's movement ties-in perfectly when taken into conjunction with the other new AT-ST shots, believe me)

8.  The new view through the AT-AT window is full of additional interest now - a rebel trench has been added with smoking turrets, including another which gets blown up...and has rebel laserbolts coming towards the AT-AT's direction...along with a newly-angled Power Generator...as well as a new, mountainous backdrop...and new sky.

(Question for adywan - the original AT-AT laserbolts in this shot are seen to fire from *below* the window in a 'one-two' movement - presumably from the 2 big guns below the window.  But in your new version the laserbolts are fired in 'unison' from either side of the window instead - Am I right in guessing that this is a deliberate change to the AT-AT firing at this point using it's smaller guns on either side of it's 'head'...and that the big guns will be used for the final big explosion?  Or have I got this all wrong?)

9.  A speeder 'flap' has been added to the close-up of Rogue 2's craft now, which matches the opening and closing movements of the miniature shots before and after.

10.  One of Rogue 2's chest buttons is blue throughout now, not green.

11.  Instead of Luke and Rogue 2's speeders approaching only 2 AT-ATs in the distance, there are *more* now...including accompanying AT-ST walkers. (and they have turned out marvellously in these shots.  A real highlight of the clip for me)

12.  One of Luke's speeder close-ups has an added 'flap' now too.

13.  A couple of Luke's chest buttons are blue throughout now, *not* changing from black to green then white as before.

14.  Control panel graphics added to speeder interiors now. (which really brings the cockpit to life now, and look great when they're knocked out)

15.  More colour added to Rogue 2's speeder exploding.

16.  AT-AT laserbolts don't show through parts of speeder windscreen frame now.

17.  Some additional blue electrical sparking inside Luke's speeder cockpit now.

18.  New mountainous backdrop added as Luke is about to crash.

19.  Additional AT-AT laserbolts firing as Luke is about to crash.

20.  Luke's speeder window cracks as he crashes now, to tie-in with shots that come afterwards.

21.  Dark grey markings and black scorchmarks added to rear of Luke's speeder now as he opens it's cockpit, to match the markings on the miniature. (excellent-looking work here)

22.  Redone speeder flying in distance now, at this point.

23.  New mountainous backdrop added as AT-AT legs approach.

24.  New mountainous backdrop added as AT-AT legs get nearer.

25.  Pink tinge on AT-AT Legs has been removed, so they remain grey.

26.  Dark grey markings and black scorchmarks added seamlessly to rear of Luke's speeder once again.

27.  Redone speeder flying in distance when Luke reaches into back of his cockpit.

28.  Larger-scaled AT-AT foot crushes Luke's speeder now.

29.  New mountainous backdrop added again at this point. (all these added backdrops are helping to give the impression that the battle is occurring in one 'whole' environment now, which is a great achievement!)

Okay then, if that's not an AWESOME amount of thoughtful enhancements for such a small portion of the overall battle, rather than 'tinkering'...then I don't know what the hell is! 

Exceptional work...and imagine what the entire sequence will look like eventually, especially once the re-built audio side of things is completed too.  :)

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Finally, I don't know if this is your absolute final version of this portion or not adywan, but since I did notice a couple of *teensy* little things along the way that caught my eye...I know you'd think it remiss of me not to bring them up also.  ;)

At the 0:34 mark just as Rogue 2 yells in close-up as he's hit - his chest button is still green at this point, not blue.  It's fleeting, but it's there.

Also, should there be a hint of a crack added to the left side window of Luke's speeder too?  It just seems that there might be some kind of damage on that one also, due to the impact.  But no biggie once again.

At the 1:08 mark just as Luke reaches into the back of the speeder before the AT-AT foot stomps down...it looks as if there was an attempt made in the original to add the dark grey markings to the rear of the speeder at this point.  I see that you've not done anything to this shot in your clip, apart from the redone speeder that flies past - but the 'white' rear section of the speeder on the left-hand of this shot looks kinda jarring after the sterling work you did on the markings in the other shots.  It wouldn't stick out so much if it was even just darkened the same as the top portions have been in this shot.  Just a thought.

Can't say Smithers, as I'm only getting the dreaded small 'x' instead of the image.  Are others actually seeing the pic.?