Fullmetaled

Fan_edit_fan said:

It’s pretty much being discussed in this thread…

https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/why-i-love-prequel-yoda-and-what-i-think-people-get-wrong/id/80751

No it wasn’t what I was asking i was asking how would prequel yoda look like with modern cgi if Disney or anybody put in actual effort and had the software etc?

If someone had access to the most advanced modern cgi what would prequel trilogy yoda look like when using it without the 2002 and 2005 limitations? Am I asking in the wrong section?

SpacemanDoug said:

It’s a lot better than a lot of Paramount’s 4k releases

From what I saw it was sadly source damage the print just couldn’t look better in some parts of the movie so at least it’s still the best it’s ever looked.

How bad and often do you see grain reduction in the movie because some comparison shots look the same as the original blu ray and some are a huge improvement?

SpacemanDoug said:

No, it’s been confirmed Nick lost the original uncut masters

Then how was overseas dvds mostly uncut?

Is there any release of rocko’s modern life that’s fully uncut including the hotel scene that rocko and heifer stay at?

There was a scene that seems to be lost after Peter is found out to be the person that cut of the cable and that joke has never been restored it was kind of a gay joke. It makes me wonder how much of early family guy is censored on dvd.

Anyone know what’s going on with paramount plus they announced they’re give us every beavis and butthead episode and we only get a handful more this service really seems like a dumpster fire.

doubleofive said:

Yeah, if you want the movies to look like this, just turn on “Motion smoothing” on your tv.

I wouldn’t mind it being used if the dreaded soap opera effect wasn’t noticeable. because if it was possible to improve the stop motion without introducing that then it really would be an improvement but all I’m see is soap opera effect sadly. 😦

I hope the type of updates you are doing like that inside the millennium falcon shot that adywan’s edit is going to look as good because his changes are great. the only thing I wish he’d do besides that is update the positive cgi shots like cloud city to name a few with modern cgi because modern cgi looks so great that it really doesn’t look fake anymore at least to me.

SpacemanDoug said:

Fullmetaled said:

SpacemanDoug said:

crissrudd4554 said:

Dream Weaver was always a different recording. Gary Wright re-recorded it specifically for the film.

Apparently to restore Stairway, Paramount used a pre-theatrical mix with the OG Dream Weaver, so this replacement isn’t anything new necessarily

Why did this happen in the first place this just seems very odd.

Paramount likely used an element that happened to be the pre-release audio which not only had the original Stairway notes but also had the OG version of Dream Weaver so it was simply an oversight

I thought I ask this here rather than making another thread is Wayne’s world 2 really so unpopular that a uhd blu ray or uhd release isn’t likely? especially with it having it restore the original audio which I think is only 60s Batman theme being put back in.

Does anyone know What version of Black Sabbath’s Time Machine is on the Wayne’s world uhd?

After seeing what lucasfilms hdr grade is compared to adywan’s sdr grade adywan’s crush’s lucasfilm yet again sorry but man how can lucasfilm be this incompetent. 😦

SpacemanDoug said:

crissrudd4554 said:

Dream Weaver was always a different recording. Gary Wright re-recorded it specifically for the film.

Apparently to restore Stairway, Paramount used a pre-theatrical mix with the OG Dream Weaver, so this replacement isn’t anything new necessarily

Why did this happen in the first place this just seems very odd.

It’s ironic the audio is a workprint audio where stairway to heaven is the same as final mix mix b but dream weaver is the original version not the one made for the film sadly.

yotsuya said:

Fullmetaled said:

yotsuya said:

Fullmetaled said:

yotsuya said:

Omni said:

Fullmetaled, I receive updates on this thread as I’m very interested in updates from Ady and the edit. However, I’m not interested in your quest for HDR. Ady’s stated multiple times now that there won’t be an HDR grade. We have no idea what you’re talking about, or who you’re talking about, or what they said, or anything of the sorts. It doesn’t matter whether or not it can be done, all that matters is that it won’t be, and you’ve been told that several times by more than one person, again, including Adywan himself. Please stop derailing the thread.

Ah, but it is a useful discussion to understand what HDR really is. And yes, Andywan himself from his source files would be the only way to really get any useful HDR so if he has no interest (and I really don’t see the benefits since Star Wars was shot on film and is better suited to SDR due to the nature of most of the shots) then it is an academic conversation (at least on my part).

I believe that to an project like this and utilize the original HDR metadata, that your editing suite would have to import it that data, you edit the project and then it would have to generate new metadata (which I believe is encoded into the video) for the output. Similarly, if you are using something capable of it, you can have a project that was originally intended for SDR but output an HDR. It depends on the software what you need to do to achieve that, but I’ve seen several tutorial videos that show just how easy it can be (or hard in some cases, but still doable). But converting to HDR is far more than just copying the metadata.

So it doesn’t give you what was shown in theaters but better it’s more that it’s altering the picture with some films. I didn’t know that the way it was described it was get the colors that were in the actual film to be show on disc for the first time. now I’m hearing the opposite wow now I’m even more confused about what the purpose of hdr is.

Don’t confuse the level of colors and color space with color correction or color grading. Those are totally separate. I could get into a long winded explanation, but HDR does not magically make something look like it did in theaters. HDR is intended to take advantage of the higher dynamic range of modern TV’s and projectors that can deliver deeper blacks than SDR screen or film projection ever could. If you want to see what was shown in theaters, get the 4K77, 4K80, or 4K83 versions. Those are the most true to the original run and they are SDR. The Lucasfilm color grades have issues (the 2019 version less so than the 2011 version).

Prior to HDR, blacks were always grays. You cannot get true black when you use film pigments or LCD pixels to block out the light (and even less so on an old CRT). It will always be gray. HDR is for the OLED and laser projectors where the black is a complete absence of light. OLED screens have actual lighted pixel LED’s so when they are set to 0,0,0 black, they generate zero light. The same with the laser projectors. For pixels set to 0,0,0 black, they project no light for that pixel. So HDR’s real power is in showing those darker details. That can make a night scene pop in a dark theater by adding levels of darkness never before experienced. It also has more color depth so the color gradients are smoother with less possibility of noticeable color halos. When you add in compression, HDR will not show the same compression artifacts so the image will be closer to the original uncompressed image. HDR does not magically make a movie closer to the original. You have to know where its strengths are and edit accordingly. From what I’ve seen of how Star War has been delivered in HDR, the SDR masters have been faithfully converted, but there is not much difference between the 4k HDR and the HD SDR versions. If anything, OTEEDEE’s D+ version looks better and it is SDR. HDR is just a tool to take advantage of new tech and where applicable make older movies look their best, though few can truly take advantage unless the negatives are scanned in HDR and any flaws edited out.

So your saying in the case of the original trilogy hdr even a proper new hdr or Dolby vision scan wouldn’t add anything to it and would be pointless brightness black levels Etc.

That all depends on the effort put into it and how much you can pull out of the negatives. From all the scans of those films, there isn’t likely to be any improvements. The current release appears to be using HDR to improve the colors and clarity, but doesn’t have more detail in the shadows.

But with adywan’s release your getting better than that making hdr pointless is what your saying when it comes to his version of the original Star Wars trilogy.

Meaning stairway to heaven and dream weaver

yotsuya said:

Fullmetaled said:

yotsuya said:

Omni said:

Fullmetaled, I receive updates on this thread as I’m very interested in updates from Ady and the edit. However, I’m not interested in your quest for HDR. Ady’s stated multiple times now that there won’t be an HDR grade. We have no idea what you’re talking about, or who you’re talking about, or what they said, or anything of the sorts. It doesn’t matter whether or not it can be done, all that matters is that it won’t be, and you’ve been told that several times by more than one person, again, including Adywan himself. Please stop derailing the thread.

Ah, but it is a useful discussion to understand what HDR really is. And yes, Andywan himself from his source files would be the only way to really get any useful HDR so if he has no interest (and I really don’t see the benefits since Star Wars was shot on film and is better suited to SDR due to the nature of most of the shots) then it is an academic conversation (at least on my part).

I believe that to an project like this and utilize the original HDR metadata, that your editing suite would have to import it that data, you edit the project and then it would have to generate new metadata (which I believe is encoded into the video) for the output. Similarly, if you are using something capable of it, you can have a project that was originally intended for SDR but output an HDR. It depends on the software what you need to do to achieve that, but I’ve seen several tutorial videos that show just how easy it can be (or hard in some cases, but still doable). But converting to HDR is far more than just copying the metadata.

So it doesn’t give you what was shown in theaters but better it’s more that it’s altering the picture with some films. I didn’t know that the way it was described it was get the colors that were in the actual film to be show on disc for the first time. now I’m hearing the opposite wow now I’m even more confused about what the purpose of hdr is.

Don’t confuse the level of colors and color space with color correction or color grading. Those are totally separate. I could get into a long winded explanation, but HDR does not magically make something look like it did in theaters. HDR is intended to take advantage of the higher dynamic range of modern TV’s and projectors that can deliver deeper blacks than SDR screen or film projection ever could. If you want to see what was shown in theaters, get the 4K77, 4K80, or 4K83 versions. Those are the most true to the original run and they are SDR. The Lucasfilm color grades have issues (the 2019 version less so than the 2011 version).

Prior to HDR, blacks were always grays. You cannot get true black when you use film pigments or LCD pixels to block out the light (and even less so on an old CRT). It will always be gray. HDR is for the OLED and laser projectors where the black is a complete absence of light. OLED screens have actual lighted pixel LED’s so when they are set to 0,0,0 black, they generate zero light. The same with the laser projectors. For pixels set to 0,0,0 black, they project no light for that pixel. So HDR’s real power is in showing those darker details. That can make a night scene pop in a dark theater by adding levels of darkness never before experienced. It also has more color depth so the color gradients are smoother with less possibility of noticeable color halos. When you add in compression, HDR will not show the same compression artifacts so the image will be closer to the original uncompressed image. HDR does not magically make a movie closer to the original. You have to know where its strengths are and edit accordingly. From what I’ve seen of how Star War has been delivered in HDR, the SDR masters have been faithfully converted, but there is not much difference between the 4k HDR and the HD SDR versions. If anything, OTEEDEE’s D+ version looks better and it is SDR. HDR is just a tool to take advantage of new tech and where applicable make older movies look their best, though few can truly take advantage unless the negatives are scanned in HDR and any flaws edited out.

So your saying in the case of the original trilogy hdr even a proper new hdr or Dolby vision scan wouldn’t add anything to it and would be pointless brightness black levels Etc.

yotsuya said:

Omni said:

Fullmetaled, I receive updates on this thread as I’m very interested in updates from Ady and the edit. However, I’m not interested in your quest for HDR. Ady’s stated multiple times now that there won’t be an HDR grade. We have no idea what you’re talking about, or who you’re talking about, or what they said, or anything of the sorts. It doesn’t matter whether or not it can be done, all that matters is that it won’t be, and you’ve been told that several times by more than one person, again, including Adywan himself. Please stop derailing the thread.

Ah, but it is a useful discussion to understand what HDR really is. And yes, Andywan himself from his source files would be the only way to really get any useful HDR so if he has no interest (and I really don’t see the benefits since Star Wars was shot on film and is better suited to SDR due to the nature of most of the shots) then it is an academic conversation (at least on my part).

I believe that to an project like this and utilize the original HDR metadata, that your editing suite would have to import it that data, you edit the project and then it would have to generate new metadata (which I believe is encoded into the video) for the output. Similarly, if you are using something capable of it, you can have a project that was originally intended for SDR but output an HDR. It depends on the software what you need to do to achieve that, but I’ve seen several tutorial videos that show just how easy it can be (or hard in some cases, but still doable). But converting to HDR is far more than just copying the metadata.

So it doesn’t give you what was shown in theaters but better it’s more that it’s altering the picture with some films. I didn’t know that the way it was described it was get the colors that were in the actual film to be show on disc for the first time. now I’m hearing the opposite wow now I’m even more confused about what the purpose of hdr is.

doubleofive said:

Fullmetaled said:

yotsuya said:

Fullmetaled said:

@adywan someone told me if you have the hdr or Dolby vision metadata from the original trilogy it can be added to your fanedit but the only thing I wasn’t sure on was would your new footage complicate that or not just wondering. because if it doesn’t I’m surprised you and nobody knew about this I didn’t know about until yesterday.

HDR is really just a different way of encoding the colors. Before OLED and Laser Projectors, there was a range to blacks. It basically expands that range. Someone skilled at the conversion could take any of his changes and render those shots in HDR. The only way to get true HDR is to shoot it in HDR. All old film was not designed for that and it will be an approximation. Some films can be scanned from the Original Negative and glean out some extra data when scanned as HDR. The Star Wars films are heavy on FX which really limits things. The scans we have were not scanned with HDR in mind, but with 3D in mind. So converting Adywan’s edit could be just as good as the Lucasfilm HDR version.

At least the way I understand it. You can discuss the color space and all the technical details, but at the root you have to have an original image that is suitable for HDR. Other have done HDR conversions of non-HDR sources.

So how can the lucasflim’s hdr grade be added to it then now I’m even more confused?

It can’t. Please stop.

This what someone said what are they talking about then? there are fanedits that copy/lift hdr metadata from one release and paste it on another is this true or is this person wrong?

yotsuya said:

Fullmetaled said:

@adywan someone told me if you have the hdr or Dolby vision metadata from the original trilogy it can be added to your fanedit but the only thing I wasn’t sure on was would your new footage complicate that or not just wondering. because if it doesn’t I’m surprised you and nobody knew about this I didn’t know about until yesterday.

HDR is really just a different way of encoding the colors. Before OLED and Laser Projectors, there was a range to blacks. It basically expands that range. Someone skilled at the conversion could take any of his changes and render those shots in HDR. The only way to get true HDR is to shoot it in HDR. All old film was not designed for that and it will be an approximation. Some films can be scanned from the Original Negative and glean out some extra data when scanned as HDR. The Star Wars films are heavy on FX which really limits things. The scans we have were not scanned with HDR in mind, but with 3D in mind. So converting Adywan’s edit could be just as good as the Lucasfilm HDR version.

At least the way I understand it. You can discuss the color space and all the technical details, but at the root you have to have an original image that is suitable for HDR. Other have done HDR conversions of non-HDR sources.

So how can the lucasflim’s hdr grade be added to it then now I’m even more confused?

doubleofive said:

That doesn’t sound physically possible.

on the uhd blu rays

@adywan someone told me if you have the hdr or Dolby vision metadata from the original trilogy it can be added to your fanedit but the only thing I wasn’t sure on was would your new footage complicate that or not just wondering. because if it doesn’t I’m surprised you and nobody knew about this I didn’t know about until yesterday.

@TheAlaskanSandman is it possible for you to import the hdr or Dolby vision metadata from the official uhds when updating the cgi or does the update cgi get in the way of using that?

thephantomaton said:

Fullmetaled said:

No one has even remotely tried to do a modern cgi take on the prequel trilogy yoda at all. 😦

i mean it wouldn’t work lore wise since yoda was younger in the prequels than the ot

I wasn’t meaning taking away his prequel trilogy look I meant updating him to look less dated that’s what I meant with today’s textures detail etc. I didn’t mean make him look like the original trilogy yoda or the sequel trilogy yoda.