I always liked this shot, since not only is it the last we see of poor Owen and Beru, but it’s the only time we see this set in the film:
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/206702
Here’s a regrade based on one of the technicolor frames of the dinner scene, which shows a similar warm color grading:
Well, when regraded to the 16mm, the sky still has a shade of cyan, and C-3PO retains a golden brass shade. All that plus the dark shadows, contrast, etc. feel more like film than the regrading attempt on the previous page, missa think.
That’s because the first regrade is not supposed to be film like, but more akin to a home video transfer with lower contrast. The last regrade is actually a direct match to a frame of film, hence it’s film like appearance. 😉
It’s also interesting to note, that the theatrical color timing in the days before digital color grading, weren’t exactly consistently balanced like we are used to these days, which in some ways adds to the unique character of the film experience.
Actually, not exactly! The Grindhouse has a notable green shift, especially in the space sequences, and as Harmy explained, the colors are not representative of the colors of a projected print.
The regrade itself is not meant to be representative of any specific color grading, other than a reduction of the excess green, and the lowering of contrast, which is pretty high for the Grindhouse at times.
The actual colors of the theatrical presentation of the film are less green. In other words, skies are not teal, and the desert (at least for the C-3PO/R2-D2 shot) is not golden. Here’s a photo of an unfaded 16mm print of ROTJ, which is generally more contrasty than the 35mm, but does feature the same color timing in terms of hues:
Here’s the Grindhouse regraded to match the 16mm:
We had a fool ask a convoluted question. It cleared nothing up. “Will Disney release the original versions of the Star Wars Trilogy?” That’s the question you ask.
People keep saying this but I think “Will there be any more changes to the Special edition versions?” is the question that he was trying to ask. And he got the answer he was looking for. Not every inquiry people make about changes to the films revolves around the unaltered versions.
That seems very illogical to me. Practically nobody is interested in a special special edition. So the idea that he was specifically asking, if Lucasfilm is going to alter the SE further without Lucas, who was the only person really pushing for the alterations in the first place, and in the face of much criticism, seems way more far fetched to me, than the suggestion that he was asking about the OOT in veiled terms.
Either way, Kennedy stated that the final cut will always remain Lucas’ decision. It is therefore logical to conclude, that they will consult Lucas before releasing, what Lucas would consider a rough cut of his films. This may or may not happen. Thusfar the evidence is pointing towards a lack of interest of all parties involved.
Just a little fun experiment regrading the ROTJ Grindhouse.
Grindhouse:
Grindhouse regraded:
Grindhouse:
Grindhouse regraded:
Ah orange, it’s King’s day tomorrow in Holland. Everything will be orange, as the our royal family is known as the house of Orange. It is true! They are originally from the town called Orange in France. It’s great!
Still, there’s not a single shred of evidence, that an OOT release is in the works, or that they’re even considering the possibility in the near or distant future. All the info sadly points in the opposite direction, even if the Kennedy interview is disregarded. Pablo Hidalgo, the Disney restoration people, and even Mike Verta’s intial interactions with Disney sadly point to a lack of interest of all parties involved.
To be fair, the color seen here does not necessarily reflect the scan raw, it uses an LUT based on litemakr’s input on how the color should look going off of projecting his unfaded(?) Super 8(?) print.
Perhaps litemakr can weigh in?
The print is an unfaded 35mm LPP. I’m not sure where Super 8 came up. But yeah, you are correct in that litemakr adjusted the raw scan’s color to approximate the projected print, as he said that in the original post.
The print is an unfaded LPP, but the scan has to be corrected to match the print. Litmakr used his Super8 print to correct the scan, but it appears a slight color imbalance remains.
The problem is, that agreeing that most fans dislike classics being tinkered with, and agreeing, that an artist has to sole right to determine what happens to his or her art, are not mutually exclusive opinions. She may very well agree, that an OOT release is desirable, but still protect Lucas’ interests as an artist who created the works. Only time will tell.
It’s possible that’s what she meant. But it’s also possible that she was simply reassuring people that they were not going beyond what Lucas did with the trilogy. It was a respectful answer, as opposed to something like, “oh god no. it has been changed enough.” Making an ST compatible OT or any other sort of changes that are beyond his control. There’s a world of difference between post-Lucas enhancements and actually releasing something that he himself made and once signed off on. If they do release the OOT, after all, they’re surely going to present even that in a pro-Lucas manner whether he likes it or not (and why shouldn’t they? He did a good job, once).
In any case, I think there’s a limit to how much we can read into an awkward ‘on the spot’ question and answer like this, in terms of using it to establish Disney’s official position on the matter.
The thing is, that Kennedy’s statements do not stand alone. When the rumors started up again, Pablo Hidalgo stated on Feb 23:
“As far as I know, there’s only one person who could make this happen and he hasn’t seemed all that interested.”
So, combine that with Kennedy’s “I wouldn’t touch those, are you kidding? :laughs: Those will always remain his.”, and I believe the picture is pretty clear.
That’s a shit article anyway. That’s not the question she was asked. She was basically asked if they were going to make another special edition with more changes. She was not asked if they were going to restore the originals. Article just wanted attention.
Not exactly, the question asked by the interviewer is pretty ambiguous:
“The vision of George’s final cut of the films that he left us with, whether that might be altered over time.”
To which Kennedy says:
“I wouldn’t touch those, are you kidding? :laughs: Those will always remain his.”
To me that reads pretty clearly like another SE or further “enhancements”. Of course, it could technically be twisted a bit to mean reverting to the original films. But her ‘on the spot’ response is much more likely geared towards the more obvious meaning, in my opinion.
Either way, if the interviewer intended to get information about the OOT, it’s unfortunate that he was apparently afraid to ask directly or clearly.
Yeah, but the broader point is, that she makes it abundantly clear, that the final cut will always be decided by Lucas. Given that reality, it seems highly unlikely, that Lucasfilm under Kennedy will release the OOT without consulting Lucas first, and if he’s against such a release, that it would ever happen. So, the question is, whether Lucas has softened on the subject? I think it’s pretty obvious Lucas is not very enthusiastic about the direction Disney has taken with the franchise. So, will he look kindly on the idea of an OOT release, that may eclipse his preferred final cut? Either way it seems questionable, whether Disney and Lucasfilm will want to open that can of worms, rather than focus on the truly lucrative aspect of the cooperation, the making of new films.
That’s a shit article anyway. That’s not the question she was asked. She was basically asked if they were going to make another special edition with more changes. She was not asked if they were going to restore the originals. Article just wanted attention.
Not exactly, the question asked by the interviewer is pretty ambiguous:
“The vision of George’s final cut of the films that he left us with, whether that might be altered over time.”
To which Kennedy says:
“I wouldn’t touch those, are you kidding? :laughs: Those will always remain his.”
While working on the WOWOW regrade, it seemed to me, that there’s a slight but consistent color imbalance in the scan, turning every shot slightly magenta. Do you agree?
LPP:
LPP balanced:
LPP:
LPP balanced:
LPP:
LPP balanced:
LPP:
LPP balanced:
LPP:
LPP balanced:
The 1977 bootleg features the mono soundtrack as Beru’s dialogue is different for the Lars dinner scene:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8_LYKyZDiajNDAyT0tGTjVCd0E/view?usp=sharing
Which end credits does that copy have? Is there space between John Williams and the LSO credits or are the together. I’m guessing there is a few lines of space between them (like the GOUT). The only two copies of the alternate end credits (Puggo and the pre-ANH bootleg VHS) have the stereo mix of Beru.
It’s the same as the GOUT, like you predicted.
The 1977 bootleg features the mono soundtrack as Beru’s dialogue is different for the Lars dinner scene:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8_LYKyZDiajNDAyT0tGTjVCd0E/view?usp=sharing
The mainstream internet media have picked up on the Kathleen Kennedy statements:
http://movieweb.com/star-wars-classic-trilogy-disney-wont-alter-restore/
They all agree that Kennedy was referring to any alteration of the final cut, including restoring previous cuts of the films. I suppose this may create some buzz on the twitter feeds, so let’s hope for a more extensive statement from Lucasfilm/Disney on the subject sooner rather than later.
I don’t see why keeping George’s version as it is precludes any possibility of the original cuts being released with his version.
Yes, the guy interviewing Kennedy should’ve worded his question better, but all she really said was that they’re not going to alter George’s version. That doesn’t really tell us anything either way about the unaltereds.
The situation with Fox is the reason for their silence, I’m convinced of it. Just wait, after May of 2020 we’ll suddenly get an announcement.
I would say, because as Kennedy states they will always remain his. She won’t touch the final cuts of the OT, which she states in no uncertain terms. In other words, any decisions regarding the release of alternate versions of the OT are Lucas’ prerogative.
Kennedy is not stupid. She understood the question, the same way all the internet news media understood the question. Nobody is interpreting the question and subsequent answer in any other way, except those that refuse to accept the inevitable.
Given the statements she made, it is unconceivable, that they will release the OOT without Lucas’ approval, especially since he has stated time, and time again, he doesn’t want them released. Is it possible he will change his mind? Sure, but it’s unlikely.
Fox is a non issue. Disney already has a distribution deal with Fox for the first six films, as is evident from the fact, that Disney and Fox jointly released all of them in 2015.
It’s a non issue if Disney doesn’t mind giving some of the profits from a guaranteed-to-sell-in-vast-numbers OOT blu-ray release to Fox. If they wait until 2020, they only have to give Fox their percentage on ANH.
It would be awkward for Disney/Lucasfilm to explain it in such blunt terms. That’s why we haven’t heard anything on the subject.
As for the George thing, we’re just going to have to agree to disagree. Obviously they’re not going to alter the SE without his permission, but I think we’re taking the extreme interpretation of that somehow also meaning they’ll never restore the original versions.
If it happens, I will be ecstatic, but I’m not going to spend another three years hoping for a miracle. First it was the 40th anniversary, which was THE time for a release, now it is 2020, and when that date passes, it will be 2027 for the 50th anniversary. It reminds me of those people, that continually predict the end of the world, only to argue a mistake was made in interpreting some ancient text, once the prediction doesn’t pan out.
I will peak in on Mike Verta’s Legacy Edition forum every now and then, since his restoration is a reality at least, but other than that, I will just enjoy our fan preservation community, and whatever new films may be worth seeing in the future.
The mainstream internet media have picked up on the Kathleen Kennedy statements:
http://movieweb.com/star-wars-classic-trilogy-disney-wont-alter-restore/
They all agree that Kennedy was referring to any alteration of the final cut, including restoring previous cuts of the films. I suppose this may create some buzz on the twitter feeds, so let’s hope for a more extensive statement from Lucasfilm/Disney on the subject sooner rather than later.
I don’t see why keeping George’s version as it is precludes any possibility of the original cuts being released with his version.
Yes, the guy interviewing Kennedy should’ve worded his question better, but all she really said was that they’re not going to alter George’s version. That doesn’t really tell us anything either way about the unaltereds.
The situation with Fox is the reason for their silence, I’m convinced of it. Just wait, after May of 2020 we’ll suddenly get an announcement.
I would say, because as Kennedy states they will always remain his. She won’t touch the final cuts of the OT, which she states in no uncertain terms. In other words, any decisions regarding the release of alternate versions of the OT are Lucas’ prerogative.
Kennedy is not stupid. She understood the question, the same way all the internet news media understood the question. Nobody is interpreting the question and subsequent answer in any other way, except those that refuse to accept the inevitable.
Given the statements she made, it is inconceivable, that they will release the OOT without Lucas’ approval, especially since he has stated time, and time again, he doesn’t want them released. Is it possible he will change his mind? Sure, but it’s unlikely.
Fox is a non issue. Disney already has a distribution deal with Fox for the first six films, as is evident from the fact, that Disney and Fox jointly released all of them in 2015.
The mainstream internet media have picked up on the Kathleen Kennedy statements:
http://movieweb.com/star-wars-classic-trilogy-disney-wont-alter-restore/
They all agree that Kennedy was referring to any alteration of the final cut, including restoring previous cuts of the films. I suppose this may create some buzz on the twitter feeds, so let’s hope for a more extensive statement from Lucasfilm/Disney on the subject sooner rather than later.
I hope that it’s not the case of course, but apparently it’s such a sensitive question, that even the media is pussyfooting around it. Makes you wonder what it’s like for Lucasfilm employees. Remember how Lucas told one of the fans to grow up? I suspect it was a pretty touchy subject while Lucas was in charge, and it may be even now.
I think that’s a pretty silly interpretation, honestly.
Combine “I wouldn’t touch those. They’re his films” with Hidalgo’s “As far as I can tell only one person can do it, and he’s not all that interested”, and a pretty clear picture emerges. I don’t think it’s a silly suggestion, that those people that in some cases worked with Lucas for decades, would respect his wishes, even if there’s no legally binding contract.
I think it is silly to believe otherwise at this point, since nothing other than unsubstantiated rumours supports another thesis. All information coming from (semi-)official sources points to no OOT in the works at this moment in time. Kennedy’s remarks fit that interpretation of events.
All she said was that they aren’t going to do any more revisions, which is pretty much just common sense and shouldn’t be news to anyone.
You don’t think she could mean they have no plans of releasing any version except the one that George considers his truest vision?
That’s the way I understood her remarks, at least not without George’s blessing.
Fresh off the presses: Kathy Kennedy, on whether or not there are plans to alter George’s “final cut” of the films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie6Cr3m344k&feature=youtu.be
skip to around the 2:50 mark
The writing’s on the wall. “I wouldn’t touch those. They will always be his films”.
The only way an OOT release will happen, is if George Lucas gives his approval. I doubt Lucasfilm would start restoring the OOT on their own accord, and as Pablo Hidalgo hinted, George Lucas is not all that interested.
At this point Mike Verta’s restoration is our best hope. Once his pitch has happened, I suspect a copy will be shared with Lucasfilm, who will have to decide what to do with it.
Well, I dont know - the way the interviewer phrased it she could have taken that as if he was talking about future changes to the movies. So I’m not sure if that told us anything one way or the other. A wasted opportunity by the interviewer
Certainly, but she has great respect, and affection for her former boss. “They will always be his films”. Releasing the OOT without consulting George Lucas would be incredibly disrespectful.
Pablo Hidalgo has confirmed the 4K restoration is the SE, and was started under Lucas’ watch.
The Disney restoration people have confirmed the negative is still conformed to the SE.
At this point all we know is, that Lucasfilm and Disney are preserving all Star Wars related material, which would include the surviving OOT material. So, a release is technically possible at some point in the future, but I wouldn’t bet on any time soon.
Yes, but perhaps George really doesn’t care if they release the OOT along side his preferred cuts. He seemed to soften on his stance about that before Disney bought it anyway.
That being said - yeah I agree with you. I dont have have much hope left either.
Perhaps, although his remarks at celebration about the critics and fans, and the films being for kids, tells me he’s still pretty bitter about it all. I guess we’ll have to wait and see, or more correctly just see, as I’m tired of waiting 😉.
Fresh off the presses: Kathy Kennedy, on whether or not there are plans to alter George’s “final cut” of the films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie6Cr3m344k&feature=youtu.be
skip to around the 2:50 mark
The writing’s on the wall. “I wouldn’t touch those. They will always be his films”.
The only way an OOT release will happen, is if George Lucas gives his approval. I doubt Lucasfilm would start restoring the OOT on their own accord, and as Pablo Hidalgo hinted, George Lucas is not all that interested.
At this point Mike Verta’s restoration is our best hope. Once his pitch has happened, I suspect a copy will be shared with Lucasfilm, who will have to decide what to do with it.
Well, I dont know - the way the interviewer phrased it she could have taken that as if he was talking about future changes to the movies. So I’m not sure if that told us anything one way or the other. A wasted opportunity by the interviewer
Certainly, but she has great respect, and affection for her former boss. “They will always be his films”. Releasing the OOT without consulting George Lucas would be incredibly disrespectful.
Pablo Hidalgo has confirmed the 4K restoration is the SE, and was started under Lucas’ watch.
The Disney restoration people have confirmed the negative is still conformed to the SE.
At this point all we know is, that Lucasfilm and Disney are preserving all Star Wars related material, which would include the surviving OOT material. So, a release is technically possible at some point in the future, but I wouldn’t bet on any time soon.
Fresh off the presses: Kathy Kennedy, on whether or not there are plans to alter George’s “final cut” of the films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie6Cr3m344k&feature=youtu.be
skip to around the 2:50 mark
The writing’s on the wall. “I wouldn’t touch those. They will always be his films”.
The only way an OOT release will happen, is if George Lucas gives his approval. I doubt Lucasfilm would start restoring the OOT on their own accord, and as Pablo Hidalgo hinted, George Lucas is not all that interested.
At this point Mike Verta’s restoration is our best hope. Once his pitch has happened, I suspect a copy will be shared with Lucasfilm, who will have to decide what to do with it: bury it, or get Lucas’ approval for some kind if release.
Either way, as far as I can tell an OOT release seems highly unlikely this year.
I only wish that were true. The 2015 releases of the saga box set contained nothing new, yet it still was a huge hit.
If the history of releases teaches us anything, it’s that people will buy anything with the words “special collectors edition”, or “remastered” on it, or just a cool new cover.
True, but if you go back to the initial releases of these discs in 2011 and look at how people reacted to news of the additional changes and how it took the blu-rays more than a week to make what the 2004 OT dvd made in its very first day, then it should become clear that the fans wouldn’t be so excited about repeating the experience on a new format.
Sure, but the bluray market now is quite a bit smaller than the DVD market was in it’s heyday, and the price tag for the saga set was also pretty steep, compared to previous releases. I’m not sure if things would have been very different, had an OOT set been included. Most of the OOT fans still bought the bluray set, despite no OOT, while the general audience doesn’t care either way.
If a 4K SE set is under way, I would still buy it, if only to replace the horrible 2011 release, and to get better material for fan edits. I suspect many here will do the same.
