DrDre

adywan said:

A lot of the CG done for the 1997 SE wasn’t even rendered in HD. Many of the elements were rendered in 480p due to budget and time. Nothing was rendered higher than 1080p. The negative was restored along with many of the original separate elements. The problem is that every re-composited shot in all 3 films were only done in 1080p. The elements were scanned @1080p, digitally re-composited into the computer, sharpening filters applied and then laser printed back onto film. The resolution of those shots is stuck @1080p.

DrDre said:

Sure, but the resolution wasn’t there in the first place, because the optical compositing severely degrades the image quality. In any case for the 4K release the effects shots were rendered at 4K resolution.

Only the added stuff done for the 2004/11 versions were redone (most but not all) for the 2019/20 Disney+/UHD releases . All of the original 1997 additions remain the same. There is a reason why ROTJ looks much better than the other two films. That’s the one that was the least tampered with digitally. 4K Star Wars looks like crap in many addition or digitally re-composited shots when compared to shots that haven’t been tampered with.

With the effects shot using the vistavision camera, even after optical compositing, the resolution doesn’t suffer too badly. It was the constrant handling and dupe grain that caused most of the degredation. And, if these same restored elements were digitally scanned and re-composited today, they would look amazing. better than any shot redone for the SE

Sure, and if the tons of films that were mastered at 2K resolution over the past decades were redone at 4K, they would look amazing too. Many movies are stuck at 2K resolution or below, or in the case of effects driven films contain elements at different resolutions. Star Wars is not exceptional in that sense.

Z6PO said:

But weren’t the compositing of SFX shots redone digitally? That is every original SFX shots made of multiple layers would have each of these layers scanned (at which resolution?) before being assembled in a computer. To the effect of a better image quality (no generational degradation) and no matte lines.

So even when there’s no CGI, the digitally recomposited shots would be stuck at whichever resolution they were scanned.

Sure, but the resolution wasn’t there in the first place, because the optical compositing severely degrades the image quality. In any case for the 4K release the effects shots were rendered at 4K resolution.

Cthulhunicron said:

Was it possible to do 4K scans in 97?

For the 1997 SE the negative was physically restored, so no scan was made. Here’s an extensive description of the restoration process:

http://fd.noneinc.com/secrethistoryofstarwarscom/secrethistoryofstarwars.com/savingstarwars.html

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

Here’s an update of the color grading including a new scene:

Looking very good. Just a little note:

Frame 2 seems oversaturated and pushed too far-red and the highlights on the last shot are drifting a little purple IMO. Other than that it looks great Dre!

In a scene by scene color grading you cannot tweak individual shots. That would be a shot by shot color grading. I also don’t agree it is oversaturated, or that it is too red. For a shot by shot I might add a bit more yellow, but not much. This is how it appears on the 1997 SE print as well. It is supposed to look sun burned. It’s more yellow on the tech prints, but those suffer from a green cast, hence the yellow. The last shot is actually supposed to be more magenta, since the scene takes place near sun set.

CatBus said:

Woohoo! A whole reel! Oh, and the colors look good too 😉

Almost a whole reel. 😉 There are two or three scenes left.

Here’s an update of the color grading including a new scene:

Since it is a different LUT for each scene, that’s not really possible, and I think it is up to Harmy to decide, if and when he wants to release some kind of preview. So, I pass on the LUTs to him, and it’s his choice what to do with them. A new update with new scenes will be coming soon…

I’m doing another pass on the color grading. Here’s a work in progress for the above sequence:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

I’ve updated the Leia vs Vader sequence to get a better separation between Leia’s creme colored dress and the bluish green walls:

That looks pretty good but a tinge too warm for my taste. I set the gray point corrector in Photoshop using the gray trim on the pipes in the first shot and got something I think is a little closer to how it looked.

Edit: For some reason, that tool also lowered the blacks a bit so keep that in mind. This is just a idea

The lights are supposed to be yellowish, so the slight warmth is to be expected, but I get what you mean. Those pipes are actually creme colored, so they are not a good gray reference. Here’s how the scene roughly looks on the Derann prints:

I’ve updated the Leia vs Vader sequence to get a better separation between Leia’s creme colored dress and the bluish green walls:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

J0E said:

Darth Lucas said:

While I think it’s looking pretty darn great so far, I think I ought to throw my two cents into the teal walls debate. I’m sure some of it would have been visible in '77, but it would have been projected with very warm bulbs, which would have counteracted the teal in the walls a bit, not a ton, but a bit. I don’t have much of a preference, as I think either way is going to be “accurate” in one sense or another. However, I do think you’ve gone a bit overboard on that teal look in certain shots. For instance, I’m seeing quite a bit of teal in Leia’s dress in some of those shots, which I don’t think would have been the case. It may have picked up a bit from the walls around the edges of her dress, but it’s not reflective enough of a material, I think, to have the wall color drastically affect our perception of the dress color itself.

Just a little nitpick, but I think it’s worth addressing.

The teal walls may have been painted like that so they’d show up as a cool white on film. Like how the Superman suit was teal so it would look blue on film. IMHO set photos as a color reference isn’t always accurate when it comes to movies shot on film. A lot of things are colored a certain way on set so they appear the way the director wants them to look projected.

That’s why I only use set photos to support what is seen on film, and what is seen on film both on the frames, and projected is a bluish green color for the walls with creme colored panels.

Projected Derann print:

Despecialized 3.0:

That 3.0 Color grading looks absolutely dead on to me! Great job Dre!

Also speaking of projection bulbs, do slide bulbs yellow too? Or just 35mm bulbs?

I think all bulbs have tendency to become less bright and warmer as they age, even the sun. 😉

I’ve updated the colors for the above shots to remove some traces of pink:

CatBus said:

DrDre said:

Projected Derann print:

Any idea what bulb was used for that photo? A lot of old films projected with a newer xenon bulb or some such thing will look much cooler than they would have theatrically with a vintage bulb. Not saying this one was, but it looks pretty cool to me.

I don’t know, but I recently saw one of these prints projected, and it looked very similar. This is also what I see on 1997 SE frames I have. I’m personally more interested in what is seen on the print, because while it’s great to use vintage bulbs, the underlying assumption is, that the bulb burns at the same temperature as it did a few decades ago, whereas I believe lights become warmer with age, and so projecting a film with a vintage bulb may not be the most accurate representation.

Darth Lucas said:

While I think it’s looking pretty darn great so far, I think I ought to throw my two cents into the teal walls debate. I’m sure some of it would have been visible in '77, but it would have been projected with very warm bulbs, which would have counteracted the teal in the walls a bit, not a ton, but a bit. I don’t have much of a preference, as I think either way is going to be “accurate” in one sense or another. However, I do think you’ve gone a bit overboard on that teal look in certain shots. For instance, I’m seeing quite a bit of teal in Leia’s dress in some of those shots, which I don’t think would have been the case. It may have picked up a bit from the walls around the edges of her dress, but it’s not reflective enough of a material, I think, to have the wall color drastically affect our perception of the dress color itself.

Just a little nitpick, but I think it’s worth addressing.

I’m still working on improving those shots, but with some shots being more green, others more blue, and others more pink on the 2019 SE source, it is a bit of a balancing act.

J0E said:

Darth Lucas said:

While I think it’s looking pretty darn great so far, I think I ought to throw my two cents into the teal walls debate. I’m sure some of it would have been visible in '77, but it would have been projected with very warm bulbs, which would have counteracted the teal in the walls a bit, not a ton, but a bit. I don’t have much of a preference, as I think either way is going to be “accurate” in one sense or another. However, I do think you’ve gone a bit overboard on that teal look in certain shots. For instance, I’m seeing quite a bit of teal in Leia’s dress in some of those shots, which I don’t think would have been the case. It may have picked up a bit from the walls around the edges of her dress, but it’s not reflective enough of a material, I think, to have the wall color drastically affect our perception of the dress color itself.

Just a little nitpick, but I think it’s worth addressing.

The teal walls may have been painted like that so they’d show up as a cool white on film. Like how the Superman suit was teal so it would look blue on film. IMHO set photos as a color reference isn’t always accurate when it comes to movies shot on film. A lot of things are colored a certain way on set so they appear the way the director wants them to look projected.

That’s why I only use set photos to support what is seen on film, and what is seen on film both on the frames, and projected is a bluish green color for the walls with creme colored panels.

Projected Derann print:

Despecialized 3.0:

44rh1n said:

DrDre said:
The titles could indeed use a little more red, but the blue in the opening shots is something of the later home video releases. All the prints show the planet in the background being gray:

Those titles are much improved! It’s crazy how much of a difference a subtle change can make. 🙂

Any thoughts about the “Episode IV: A New Hope” lines?

That’s up to Harmy. I’m just the color guy…😉

44rh1n said:

DrDre said:

Here’s the current status of the colors for Despecialized 3.0 (with some tweaks):

Great work! My only thought this time around is that maybe the opening shots could use a bit of color separation / color contrast. Right now, they look a tad faded, with a bit too much of a brown tint IMO. In particular, we’re lacking a bit of blue all around.

The colors in the opening titles feel off to me as well. Same problem. The “Star Wars” title and opening crawl actually look slightly lime green.

Also, the green beams and the explosion both lack the “punch” that I always recall feeling when the movie first starts.

I know you’re using prints for reference, which is awesome. So I may be wrong. But I wonder if the prints aren’t as accurate as we sometimes like to think they are. I think they’re a great reference – But I also believe we can actually improve on them while also retaining the spirit of their overall look.

I actually think Harmy’s Despecialized 2.7 is a great color reference for these opening shots. You might might argue they’re tiny bit oversaturated, but they have the color separation I’m talking about:

One last note: Is that “A New Hope” line going to stay in the crawl for Despecialized 3.0? (It’s actually the one change George made that I like; but I know a lot of people on here might want that gone.) Just curious, more than anything.

Awesome work!! Can’t wait to see more! So excited for this! 🙂

The titles could indeed use a little more red, but the blue in the opening shots is something of the later home video releases. All the prints show the planet in the background being gray:

act on instinct said:

Did you raise some of the pinks to get more of the color in the off white panels? R2 on tatooine looks great, 3P0 looks great.

Yes! 😃

Here’s the current status of the colors for Despecialized 3.0 (with some tweaks):

Here’s the first Tantive IV shot, which clearly shows the subtle color differences of the walls:

Here’s a first pass at the opening shots:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

The artifacts in the Tatooine shots can be reduced:

I think this is a bit better, what do you think?

It looks good, but these scenes did not have bright blue skies originally, so I will try to keep the colors reasonably consistent with the print references.

Fair enough, all your other grading look absolutely fantastic. Glad I was able to give my perspective. Keep up the great work!

Here’s a slight update of the C-3PO/R2-D2 desert scene:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

The artifacts in the Tatooine shots can be reduced:

I think this is a bit better, what do you think?

It looks good, but these scenes did not have bright blue skies originally, so I will try to keep the colors reasonably consistent with the print references.

Here’s an update with more shadow detail, and less red:

Here’s a first pass for the R2-D2 canyon sequence, which is generally pretty dark and reddish on the film references:

That’s just part of the source, and made worse by compression. Star Wars suffers from a lot of color noise, a lot of it magenta. Here’s the C-3PO frame from 4K77:

The artifacts in the Tatooine shots can be reduced: