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Commander Courage

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16-Aug-2004
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1-Oct-2015
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Post
#195994
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/195994/action/topic#195994
Time
Originally posted by: Erikstormtrooper

Thanks, guys!
Move the ROTJ opening scene over Endor to the beginning of ESB. (I've always felt that the opening for ESB was a little weak.) The Empire has already started repairing the station. This keeps the Death Star in the story, so it doesn't feel so rehashed in ROTJ. To spice things up, see if it's possible to replace Endor with Mustafar in this opening shot.

Vader lands and tells the new Grand Moff that he's there to get the project back on schedule. Cut the mention of the Emperor. Cut to Star Destroyer launching probes. Then use the ESB Special Edition shot of Vader's shuttle approaching the Super Star Destroyer to get to the fleet, so he has time to check out the fleet and then get the report about the rebels on Hoth. Continue with rest of movie as planned.

For ROTJ, start out with a new opening shot, or maybe heavily modify the original opening shot and have the Emperor show up at the beginning. Commander Courage's idea about moving the Dagobah scenes to the beginning work well, so maybe a new opening shot panning down on Dagobah would work.

This is the way to go with the Second Death Star. The opening crawls of all the films will be reworked to some extent, so the concept of the DSII would be introduced in the last paragraph. Pan down to RotJ's first scene. Not sure about referencing the Emperor. Wipe to Probe droid speeding towards Hoth; we've been told the Empire is deploying probe droids, we don't need to see it (like you said it's a boring scene). The film would commence as originally until the Imperial Fleet scene. The shot of Vader's shuttle approaching his Star Destroyer won't match with the shot of the fleet, but the shuttle can be matted in to the fleet shot. With some shot shuffling on the bridge of the Executor, it appears as if Vader has just arrived and is walking over for a status report from his officers. I've cut together a test of this and it works great (other than the needed special effects work with the shuttle). Also, while incorporating Mustafar is an interesting idea, I think it's best to leave DSII at Endor. It would probably be best to try and paint out some of the DSII to make it appear less completed in ESB than in ANH.
Post
#191772
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191772/action/topic#191772
Time
Originally posted by: Trooperman
I just have one problem right now, having lined all of the scenes in the movie in order for further editing: I cannot stand the bedroom scene. Portman's acting is weak, the style of shooting is weak, the conversation is weak, and I just think that this scene is a waste of time. I know that MTH was pushing for it, but I'm dying to remove this scene. Could you either OK this, or explain to me better how the benefits of this scene outweigh the losses? When viewing it in sequence, it just brings down the whole movie for me.

I've always been for cutting this scene. Your analysis explains why. Be gone with it!
Post
#191523
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191523/action/topic#191523
Time
The Death Star only being damaged, resulting in its appearance in RotJ, does seem to be the most obvious solution. However, without a complete destruction of the battle station the end of ANH would be too confusing. The Rebels wouldn't be hanging around celebrating, they'd be getting the hell out of there. And what about Tarkin and all the other officers on the Death Star? How would it be made clear they died in the attack? Constructing a Vader/Palpatine conversation about repairing the damaged Death Star would aslo be much more difficult than referencing a *destroyed* Death Star.

There might be a way to pull it all together, but as you can see there would be much to overcome.
Post
#191521
Topic
Idea: Fan Edit of ROTJ
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191521/action/topic#191521
Time
To ease all tention and put all this to rest for good:


EPISODE VI
RETURN OF THE JEDI

A final, climactic confrontation in GALACTIC CIVIL WAR looms near. The Empire, desperate to extinguish the ever-spreading flame of rebellion, has hastened its dual construction on the second DEATH STAR.

Recognizing if completed this ultimate weapon would spell certain doom for the Alliance, the Rebellion has organized a preemptive strike against the armored battle station, preparing to go into battle with or without several of their key leaders, who on Tatooine have masterminded the rescue of Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster, Jabba the Hutt.

Having returned to the Dagobah System, Luke Skywalker is facing his final trials to become a Jedi Knight. Luke is eager to complete his training and join his friends in the effort, but has unanswered questions for his dying Jedi Master that could shatter his reality and alter the course of galactic history…

-First scene of Vader arriving on Death Star II as is.
-Wipe to Dagobah. Edit Luke and Yoda's dialogue. Scene as is until:
Luke: But...the training?
Yoda: No more training do you require. Already know you that what you need.
Luke: Then I am a Jedi?
Yoda: Luke, when gone am I, the last of the Jedi you will be. The force runs strong in your family, pass on what you have learned. Do not underestimate the powers of the Emperor, or suffer your father's fate you will.
Luke: Master Yoda... is Darth Vader my father?
Yoda: Rest I need, yes, rest.
Luke: Yoda, I must know.
Yoda: Your father he is. Told you did he?
Luke: Yes.
Yoda: Unexpected this is. And unfortunate.
Luke: Unfortunate that I know the truth?
Yoda: No! Unfortunate that you rushed to face him, that incomplete was your training. That not ready for the burden were you.
Luke: I'm sorry.
Yoda: Luke...there is another...Sky...walk...er.
-Luke/Obi-Wan scene as is (for now anyway). Btw, I am aware Luke has his black glove on during these scenes, but the way I see it hardly noticable clothing continuity is a small price to pay for the greater good of the story. It could also be assumed it was for his hand, like Anakin in RotS, and he removed it on Tatooine, only to have it damaged and require a covering yet again.
-Wipe to Emperor arriving on Death Star II. (This transition works really well with Obi-Wan's last line, "...but they could be made to serve the Emperor."
-Wipe to Tatooine with droids approaching Jabba's palace. Story flow as is (there will of course be many asthetic changes to this sequence). Luke's late arrival and the confused plan can be interpreted as him having to finish his training the the Rebels not being able to wait any longer, so they spring a plan to rescue Han and get back to the fleet and plan the attack on the Death Star II.
-It would be really nice to have the deleted sandstorm scene, as it presents at least SOME kind of resolution to the Han/Lando situation that was desperately needed in the film. The radio drama addresses this in a great scene with the two on the Falcon, which of course is impossible to duplicate. And that's another point; not once in RotJ do we see Han flying the Falcon. Shame. Maybe we can do something about that, a rear cockpit view of jumping into hyperspace perhaps?
-Luke would of course just meet the crew "Back at the fleet," already having dealt with his business on Dagobah in between movies and in the opening of this one.
-Wipe to first Throne Room scene on Death Star II. (This transition works really well with Vader's mention of "...a Rebel fleet massing near Sullust?", we then get to see that fleet.)
-Wipe to Rebel Alliance meeting, film continues as is (with appropriate asthetic alterations throughout).

Shuffling the basic story structure of the beginning of RotJ would not only greatly strenghten the film, but also account for the numerous nitpicks presented by its original form. Most importantly in my mind, is Luke actually completing his training on Dagobah with Yoda, and finding out about Anakin. Yes, it is a stretch to believe Luke went for almost a year without mentioning it to Yoda, but it is much more believable than him not even going back in a year, not just to complete his training but to get some answers. I think my new opening crawl does a lot for the story as well. It has been pointed out that the other 5 episodes' crawls all open with important galactic happenings. RotJ? "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine to..." yeah, not so much. If you look at things with an open mind, this version of events deals with most of the issues that were botched or confusing in the original:
-A second Death Star? So fast?
-The rushed plan to get Han, Luke's late arrival. (sort of)
-Desperate to rescue Han before having to get back to the Rebel fleet.
-Luke completing his training and discovering the truth about his father.
-Making the film flow together much better instead of feeling like Episode 6A and Episode 6B.



Here is my altered RotJ script incorporating dialogue from the Radio Drama. The new dialogue being in bold:

Too late. The Wookiee has already pulled the animal from the
stake. SPROOING! The group finds itself hanging upside down in an
Ewok net, suspended high above the clearing. Artoo lets out a
wild series of beeps and whistles, and Chewie howls his regret.
Their bodies are a jumble in the net. Han removes a Wookiee paw
from his mouth.

THREEPIO
One would suppose a 220 year old Wookie to have learned a measure of self-restraint.

HAN
What are you telling them?

THREEPIO
Hello, I think... I could be mistaken.
These creatures seem to call themselves Ewoks. And I do believe they think I am some sort of god.

Suddenly all activity stops as LOGRAY, the tribal Medicine Man,
comes out of the big hut. He examines the captives carefully,
goes to join Threepio, whose throne has been placed on an
elevated platform. A larger, gray-haired Ewok, CHIEF CHIRPA, is
examining Luke's lightsaber with great curiosity.

THREEPIO
As I understand it Master Luke, the forest has been invaded by Stormtroopers. The Ewoks presume you to be enemies.


HAN
What did he say?

THREEPIO
I'm rather embarrassed, General Solo, but it
appears you are to be the main course at a
banquet in my honor.

Shot of ARTOO.

THREEPIO
And you Artoo are to be reclaimed for useable scrap.

Another Shot of Artoo-he is displeased.


At the end of it, the Chief, Logray, and the elders confer, then
nod in agreement. The Chief stands and makes a pronouncement.

LUKE (OS)
What are they saying Threepio?

THREEPIO
The Ewoks want to know where they fit into the story Sir. Myth and life are strongly intertwined with Ewoks. If I make them part of the tale, it will in their minds make them part of the Rebellion”

LUKE (OS)
Do it Threepio.

Threepio says more Ewokese, including them in the story.

That strengthens the Ewoks characterwise I think, giving them reasons for their actions. Also I thought it would be nice to throw that reference to Chewbacca's age in there just for the fun of it.

Post
#191496
Topic
Idea: Fan Edit of ROTJ
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191496/action/topic#191496
Time
No problem, Stoss. I just thought I better speak up before things went any further. I know you had no ill intentions, but from my perspective though I did feel "jacked." When in doubt, quote, and if you can't find the quote, reference it. Chances are someone will find it for you eventually. Hope I didn't put a damper on your enthusiasm; the more fan edits and contributions the better!
Post
#191493
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191493/action/topic#191493
Time
Originally posted by: musicman
...if you could somehow establish with some dialogue somewhere that the DS (my filter blocks out D e a th...ugh) is their big plan, and the intention from the start is to make more than one--perhaps eventually a whole armada of DS's or something--then it might help make the ROTJ DSII work better. So when the DSII comes along, they've probably already been working on it--since the first one was the initial DS, they learned from the construction of that and are now ready to kick it up a notch and then begin the whole bunch of DS's, starting with the DSII. Does that make sense? I don't know if that would be doable either, but for this saga edit, it might be a good way to go.

This has bothered me as well, MM, and rectifying it would go a long way in improving RotJ. A line in RotJ's revamped opening crawl would help. I was thinking of something along the lines of: "Eager to extinguish the ever growing flame of Rebellion, the GALACTIC EMPIRE has hastened their dual construction on the second DEATH STAR."

Also: "This turn of events is unfortunate. We must accelerate our plans," (now deleted from Episode I) will most likely be finding it's way back into the saga, and would help this plotpoint as well...
Post
#191185
Topic
Idea: Fan Edit of ROTJ
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191185/action/topic#191185
Time
Thanks, stossmo. To be honest all this talk of editing RotJ according to my roadmap without any "credit," as it were, had annoyed me a bit. Ideas are free but if we're going to share let's share, not steal. Sorry if that came off wrong, but I put a lot of effort into thinking all that stuff through, and to have all these other people discuss using my ideas in their edit without any reference to where they came from was frustrating. Again, I apologize if I sound like a jerk, that's just how I felt.

Now that I've got that off my chest, let the discussion continue!
Post
#191183
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191183/action/topic#191183
Time
Erik, I think that's a wonderful idea. For a re-write, or re-imagining of the saga. The saga's original climax was in fact to be the destruction of the Death Star, as has already been pointed out. But looking at the saga we have to work with, this is completely impossible. I do remember a poster called Obi-Wan Spicoli who had mentioned something similar to this before, but he's dissapeared and I can't find his thread. He was planning on editing the saga into 9 shorter episodes, and had some pretty radical ideas. If someone can deduce a way to make this work, it would certainly be an interesting "Infinities" saga. But really I just don't see any way to accomplish it.
Post
#191151
Topic
Idea: Fan Edit of ROTJ
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191151/action/topic#191151
Time
Originally posted by: stossmo
Originally posted by: Commander Courage
Other than a couple of scene division differences (the impact which of can't be seen unless presented with the surrounding scenes), there's no change in this script from the original scenes. Granted there are a few deleted and/or never filmed bits here and there, but those aren't available to be used in an edit. Sorry, I just don't see what you were trying to accomplish with this.


are you talking about the end or tatooine?

I was referring to Sluggo's posted script exerpts that have now been removed.
Post
#191150
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191150/action/topic#191150
Time
Originally posted by: Ell the Ewok
At the end of TPM could we have Qui Gon fade away? it just eliminates the whole shitty Jedi trick problem.

This was discussed but it was ultimately decided having Qui-Gon fade away in the fire (the only plausable time for him to do so) would cause more confusion than clarification. It's established that Jedi don't naturally dissapear when they die in II and III. Qui-Gon being the first Jedi in history to do so would certainly be cause for a reaction from the Jedi, of which there is none.
Post
#191049
Topic
Idea: Fan Edit of ROTJ
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191049/action/topic#191049
Time
Other than a couple of scene division differences (the impact which of can't be seen unless presented with the surrounding scenes), there's no change in this script from the original scenes. Granted there are a few deleted and/or never filmed bits here and there, but those aren't available to be used in an edit. Sorry, I just don't see what you were trying to accomplish with this.
Post
#191037
Topic
FAN EDIT REQUEST THREAD - Post your dream Fan Edits Here!
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191037/action/topic#191037
Time
Some I'd love to see/be involved with someday:

Batman Begins - With Danny Elfman music. Having a REAL musical score would enhance this film so much. Batman and Batman Returns would be the two greatest sources obviously, but other Elfman scores such as Edward Scissorhands and Sleepy Hollow could be utilized as well.

Superman III - Re-sequenced and re-edited to downplay the more ridiculous aspects and focus on Clark/Lana, and Evil Superman. The junkyard battle would be the climax of the film. Perhaps have the supercomputer (Brainiac by any other name) be somehow responsible for Superman's disturbing behavior change.

Superman III/IV - A combination of Superman III and IV. I have no definite ideas for this, but I think it would be interesting to try and make something out of these two ultimately dissapointing films. I do have some vague ideas though: The Smallville part on the farm in IV can tie into the Smallville stuff in III, Nuclear Man being the cause of Evil Superman, and possibly using the Voice of Jor-El instead of Lara.

The Batman Begins edit could start at anytime, but any attempt at Superman should wait until the 14 DVD set is released later this year.
Post
#188640
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/188640/action/topic#188640
Time
We're thinking of opening the narration with a blinding light followed universal/galactic/infinity shot. Think the opening credits of Star Trek: The Next Generation. If anyone has any ideas on a source for that it would be appreciated. Speaking of Star Trek, we have a policy of absolutey NO Star Trek footage. It's far too recognizeable and it just wouldn't be right. Of course there may end up being exceptions in certain cases, but let's really try to shy away from borrowing stuff from the good people of the 23 and 24 centuries.
Post
#188635
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/188635/action/topic#188635
Time
That's my favorite fan-made trailer for anything, ever. It was just so ahead of everything else of its kind back when it came out, and when you look at what they had to work with, it's incredible what they put together. A very creative use of resources and incorporation of the various Episode II rumors at the time. There is a similar, earlier version with Leonardo DiCaprio, but this one is superior.

There's an excellent breakdown on how this trailer was made at TheForce.Net: http://theforce.net/fanfilms/trailers/episodeii/shots0.asp
Post
#188247
Topic
Idea: Fan Edit of ROTJ
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/188247/action/topic#188247
Time
Hey stossmo!

Our ideas in the Starkiller Ranch Thread are indeed going toward an eventual RotJ edit. We're starting with Episode I, so it will be a while before we get there. We're all very exciting about a retooling of RotJ, and as you've already seen we've got a lot of promising ideas floating about. If you want to add to the discussion we'd be more than happy for any input you may have.
Post
#188188
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/188188/action/topic#188188
Time
Great stuff Trooperman. The lightsaber duel clips you posted earlier are particularly impressive, and your rotoscoping is looking excellent! The "Lawrence of Arabia" clips look promising as well. Both versions of "Dune," 1984 and the Sci-Fi channel miniseries, would undoubtingly be very beneficial as well. The "battle" in AotC seemed almost like an afterthought; very dissapointing. Let's hope something can be made of it after all. Your desaturation techniques seem effective to a point; my only concern is the flesh tone of characters ending up gray or blue.

You brought up the nigthmare again. Have you attempted to rip the audio from the Tone Poems yet? As far as we can tell on the Episode I edit, it's impossible to seperate the dialogue from the music. If you aren't able to either, we'll have to rethink what we want Qui-Gon to say at the beginning of the dream.

It's good to see you're making progress. Keep it up!
Post
#188187
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/188187/action/topic#188187
Time
"Prologue" Discussion Points:

-Too "Lord of the Rings"?

-Repetitive? As in, we'll have this prolouge followed by yet another introductory device, the opening crawl.

-Narrator? If so, who? ID and I are thinking Christoper Lee for various reasons. He has a vast filmography for the picking, featuring lots of appropriate dialogue, and he just has a very cool voice which is perfectly suited for such a narration.

-Which films to take various footage from? This will feature both space and land battles, as well as various lightsaber duels. Such footage will be enhanced with special effects and altered so as to not be instantly recognizable from another film. "Braveheart" and "Troy" come to mind for ground battles, "The Last Starfighter" and "Serenity" for space battles, and the "Highlander" films are the first that come to mind in regards to duels.

-And should there be a cohesive character, such as Darth Bane/Darth Plagueis, or short character moments of some kind? Ever since the casting rumors of Christopher Walken in Episode II, I have always envisioned him as the aformentioned Sith Lord. Could clips from "The Prophecy," "Sleepy Hollow," and other Walken films be of use to us?
Post
#180543
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/180543/action/topic#180543
Time
Originally posted by: Trooperman
Also, CC, I should really know this, but where can the "Antique" tool be found in Photoshop? Once I figure that out, it'll be easy to remove the "purple hand" in motion.

I actually don't have Photoshop, but a program called Photosuite. So I can't help you with specifics. Photoshop might not even have "Antique" per say, but I'm sure it has some tool and color you can use to similar success.
Post
#179821
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/179821/action/topic#179821
Time
There might not be a lot going on in the thread at the moment, but I assure much is being accomplished behind the scenes.

On a somewhat unrelated topic, it has been brought to my attention that utilizing the audio from the Tone Poems is impossible due to not being able to seperate the dialogue from the music. If in fact this is the case it is a terrible shame, and if anyone could let us know otherwise that wouldbe wonderful. The loss of the tone poems leaves us without some excellent Qui-Gon dialogue, so it seems we will have to be more creative. I suggest utilizing the Qui-Gon dialogue in Clone Wars as part of a voiceover to Anakin at the end of the space battle. The voice actor sounds almost exactly like Neeson, and with the added ghost/spirit echo effects it should be indistinguishable. This dialogue is as follows:
"Yes Anakin. It calls to you."
"Yes. You must enter it, alone."
"Control your fear. You are the Chosen One, and you must be tested."
"Only what you take with you."
"Your final test is at hand. Trust in the Force."

The dilemma would be mixing this dialogue with other Neeson dialogue. If we did, I think the non-Neeson stuff would stick out too much. So there's something discussion worthy to inject some life back into the Ranch thread.