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44rh1n

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Join date
5-Dec-2014
Last activity
4-May-2021
Posts
188

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Post
#1423991
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

krausfadr said:

44rh1n, I’ve successfully finished a 4K edit in Resolve using Dolby Vision and adding additional color correction. When I export the project, for example to an HEVC mp4, the final result looks beautiful. Note: the project settings are just as you specify (also the output is of course REC 709).

Here’s my question: when playing on a TV the HDR notification icon comes up signaling that this is HDR content. This this is just a flagging issue and this is fully an SDR export, correct?

Good question. How did you export it? Did you use instructions in step 8?

“8). Lastly, go to the delivery page and set whatever export settings you desire (again, I always recommend ProRes, but the settings you would pick depend on your needs). ***Then go to Advanced Settings, and change the Tone Mapping to Dolby Vision. Ensure the selected option under Dolby Vision is “100-nit, BT.709, BT.1886, Full.” Once you’ve got all your export settings enabled and you’ve selected the Dolby Vision tonemapping, you can add the export to your Render Queue and export it out.”

If you followed those instructions and still have an issue, then you may additionally need to go to “Advanced Settings” on the delivery page, and set the “Color Space Tag” to Rec.709 and the “Gamma Tag” to Gamma 2.4.

If you just export out on HEVC without using the 100-nit trim, then it will export the HDR version. However, it likely won’t be a great HDR grade if you didn’t do it with a proper HDR monitor.

Post
#1423038
Topic
Harmy's STAR WARS Despecialized Edition HD - V2.7 - MKV (Released)
Time

Hey Harmy! For Despecialized 3.0, are you doing your restoration work in way that’s limited to Rec.709, or are you doing it in a wide color gamut / logrithmic color space? ​If you happen to be working in WCG/Log, then maybe we could work together to do an HDR/Dolby Vision release sometime in the future, if you’re interested. 🙂

Post
#1420452
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

winoni71 said:

Thank you all for the valuable tips.

44rh1n said:
**Important: Ensure “Mastering Display” is set to “1000-nit, BT.2020, D65, ST.2084, Full.” That is the correct option for most 4K Blu-rays. However, for some 4K Blu-rays that are mastered at 4000-nits, you’ll want to select the “4000-nit, BT.2020” option. ALSO: make sure the resolution and framerate are correct in the the Master Settings.

As for the 4000 vs 1000 nits, do I find the information in media info?
If not, how do I know which is which?

Could it be “Mastering display luminance” or “Maximum Content Light Level” (although in the second file this is higher than 4000)?

Thank you.

Video
ID : 1
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@High
HDR format : SMPTE ST 2086, HDR10 compatible
Codec ID : hvc1
Codec ID/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Duration : 2 h 15 min
Bit rate : 62.8 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 110 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (23976/1000) FPS
Original frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.316
Stream size : 59.5 GiB (100%)
Encoded date : UTC 2021-03-28 11:31:48
Tagged date : UTC 2021-03-28 11:33:00
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : PQ
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color pri : Display P3
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0050 cd/m2, max: 4000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 636 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light : 103 cd/m2
Codec configuration box : hvcC

Video
ID : 1
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@High
HDR format : SMPTE ST 2086, HDR10 compatible
Codec ID : hvc1
Codec ID/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Duration : 2 h 7 min
Bit rate : 50.4 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 100 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (23976/1000) FPS
Original frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.253
Stream size : 44.8 GiB (100%)
Encoded date : UTC 2021-03-25 17:12:31
Tagged date : UTC 2021-03-25 17:13:24
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : PQ
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color pri : Display P3
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0050 cd/m2, max: 4000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 4809 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light : 537 cd/m2
Codec configuration box : hvcC

Is that info for two different movies?

It’s the Maximum Content Light Level. So for the first one, it looks like it’s 636-nits, and for the second one it looks like it’s 4809. So I’d use the 1,000-nits setting for the first one and the 4000-nits setting for the second one.

Post
#1419786
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

krausfadr said:

44rh1n said:

7). Click Analyze All. (And leave Enable Tone Mapping Preview selected). Once it’s done, you’ll notice that the image no longer looks flat and ugly because you’re now seeing the SDR version created by the Dolby Vision analysis.

One extra step should be performed: if the video image itself includes the cropping black bars then these will need to be excluded from the output, otherwise the black in every scene will skew the analysis. This can be done by selecting Timeline > output blanking. Or otherwise manually cropping the top and bottom.

Yes! Thank you for mentioning this. I forgot to say this, but this is true. I’ll add it to my post above. I also forgot to mention the Mastering Display setting, so I’ve added that to step 2 as well. It’s important to set it to BT.2020 rather than P3, otherwise the colors won’t be quite right.

Post
#1416965
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

krausfadr said:

And based on your comment: “Once it’s done, you’ll notice that the image no longer looks flat and ugly because you’re now seeing the SDR version created by the Dolby Vision analysis.” it looks like I can further color grade after the analysis and before the rendering. Sweet!

Yes, you can do color adjustments after the Dolby Vision trim analysis, and your GUI screen will show those adjustments with the new SDR tonemapping applied on top.

krausfadr said:

EDIT: or perhaps a best practice for users of Resolve would be be to import the file container with HEVC HDR into Premiere, apply the Dolby vision, and export that to a DNxHD or DNxHR to be used as the new source to edit?

I personally recommend using the HDR version of the film as the source. This way, any fan restoration or fan edit you’ve made will be preserved in HDR, so your work is future-proofed and you can make an HDR version in the future after HDR grading monitors come down in price. Regardless of what method you choose to convert HDR to SDR (whether you use a Color Space Transform or the Dolby Vision analysis), you’ll still be able to export in SDR. You just also have the flexibility to make an HDR version in the future without having to redo the edit from scratch.

But if you bake out the SDR conversion and then use that as a new source, you’re actually limiting your ability to make color adjustments because the “new” SDR source has less dynamic range and a smaller color gamut than the original HDR source. And you also won’t have a future-proofed edit that can be used to create an HDR master in the future, if desired.

Post
#1416839
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

winoni71 said:
My head hurts, this is very confusing.
If there’s no metadata, then how can each scene be graded differently and why is it so difficult to make a conversion to SDR?

Metadata, or the lack thereof, has nothing to do with one’s ability to grade each shot of a film differently from the next.

The reason you’ll likely need to make adjustments on a shot-by-shot basis is because HDR (Rec.2020/ST.2084) has a completely different color space and gamma than SDR (Rec.709/Gamma 2.4). There’s no one-size-fits-all approach to a downconversion. They’re entirely different formats, with entirely different ranges of color and luminance. So you’re likely never going to find a one-click solution that’s perfect.

winoni71 said:
I’m not looking to make a restoration, but to have an “all-purpose” method to convert HDR to SDR while preserving (as much as possible, without grading scene by scene) the visual characteristics, I’m not looking for perfection.

If you’re looking for an easy solution that doesn’t involve performing shot-by-shot corrections, then you can use a Color Space Transform effect (as illustrated in this tutorial above), a LUT, or you can do the method that another user above suggested in Premiere. Just know that it’s a technical conversion, not a creative one. So while it’s an accurate HDR-To-SDR conversion, it might not always look how you want it to look.

If you’re not doing fan restorations / preservations, then might I ask why you’re interested in doing this in the first place? Wouldn’t it just make more sense to buy the 1080p SDR versions of the movies you want to watch? Or better, get a 4K Blu-ray player? (If you have the funds, that is.)

winoni71 said:
Knowing this, having at my disposal both Abode Premier PRO and Resolve Studio, what would you recommend to achieve what I’m looking for?

Thank you.

If you have Resolve Studio (the PAID version of Resolve), then I would recommend trying out the automatic Dolby Vision trim analysis. This will do an automatic per-shot conversion from HDR to SDR. So rather than a single one-size-fits-all approach, it will treat each shot individually.

1). Bring the film into the Media Pool (you’ll get much faster performance if you convert to ProRes first, as illustrated in the tutorial at the beginning of this thread. But if you have a fast computer then the original HEVC should work).

2). Go to your Project Settings and change the Color Management timeline color space to Rec.2100 ST.2084. Then check the “Enable Dolby Vision” checkbox.

**Important: Ensure “Mastering Display” is set to “1000-nit, BT.2020, D65, ST.2084, Full.” That is the correct option for most 4K Blu-rays. However, for some 4K Blu-rays that are mastered at 4000-nits, you’ll want to select the “4000-nit, BT.2020” option. ALSO: make sure the resolution and framerate are correct in the the Master Settings.

3). Add the film to a new timeline (make sure the timeline has the same framerate and resolution as your movie). The image should look flat and ugly on an SDR GUI display.

4). On the Edit page, select the movie in the timeline and then go to menu item “Timeline > Detect Scene Cuts.” This will take a while, but it will analyze the movie and make physical cuts to every cut in the film. Once it’s done, scrub through to make sure it didn’t add cuts where it shouldn’t have.

5). Navigate to the Color page and click on the Dolby Vision button on the bottom left region of the screen (the button won’t be there unless you enable Dolby Vision, as mentioned in step 2).

6). Ensure the Target Display Output is set to “100-nit, BT.709, BT.1886, Full.”

7). Click Analyze All. (And leave Enable Tone Mapping Preview selected). Once it’s done, you’ll notice that the image no longer looks flat and ugly because you’re now seeing the SDR version created by the Dolby Vision analysis.

**Important: If the movie is wider than 16x9 (includes black bars), then the black will need to be excluded from the output, otherwise the black in every scene will skew the analysis. This can be done by selecting Timeline > Output Blanking. There are some great presets for different aspect ratios. If none of those presets are correct for your film, you can create custom Output Blanking by navigating to the “Sizing” button in the middle-right of the GUI, changing the dropdown menu to “Output Sizing,” and then you can adjust the “Blanking” sliders. Or you can physically crop the top and bottom of the video by changing the timeline resolution and image scaling settings in the Project Settings.

8). Lastly, go to the delivery page and set whatever export settings you desire (again, I always recommend ProRes, but the settings you would pick depend on your needs). ***Then go to Advanced Settings, and change the Tone Mapping to Dolby Vision. Ensure the selected option under Dolby Vision is “100-nit, BT.709, BT.1886, Full.” Once you’ve got all your export settings enabled and you’ve selected the Dolby Vision tonemapping, you can add the export to your Render Queue and export it out.

Now you’ll have a beautiful SDR version of the film derived from brand new Dolby Vision metadata that you created yourself. 😃

Hope that helps.

Post
#1416173
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

winoni71 said:
P.S.: I don’t’ understand something though, isn’t the HDR metadata supposed to be there precisely to determine, frame by frame or scene by scene, what the picture is supposed to look like?

HDR10 does not have metadata. It’s just plain old HDR (Rec.2020 ST.2084), and nothing else.

Dolby Vision has metadata which contains information that trims down the the Rec.2020 ST.2084 (HDR) source to a Rec.709 Gamma 2.4 (SDR) output. But to my knowledge, that metadata from the disc is only readable on a TV.

You could import the Rec.2020 ST.2084 source into DaVinci Resolve and run it through Resolve’s Dolby Vision scan, and that will give you brand new SDR metadata which you could use to export an SDR video. However, it won’t have the nuances and custom adjustments that the colorist would have made for the original Dolby Vision pass.

I should also note, as a reminder, that HDR footage is similar to log camera footage – meaning, it has much more latitude to work with than SDR footage. So if you’re doing fan restorations, it’s better to NOT bake in an SDR conversion. It’s best to do color work within HDR, and then have your SDR conversion at the very end of the chain. That’s the workflow that this tutorial of mine hopefully illustrates.

Post
#1408042
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

Nick66 said:

44rh1n said:
WOW, you’re right! I just checked my iTunes copy, and it looks REALLY good! It’s still only HD for me (hopefully it upgrades to 4K for me eventually – iTunes usually does!), but it’s definitely the new master. It looks WAY better than the old green extended Blu-ray master!

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

The simple answer is that the 1080p version is an SDR master that’s been derived from the HDR master. It’s not HDR, but it comes from the same source.

The more complex answer is that this was mastered in Dolby Vision. A lot of people don’t quite understand what Dolby Vision actually is, so let me explain: Dolby Vision is when you take an HDR (Rec.2020/ST.2084) graded master, and use Dolby’s trim analysis tools to perform a shot-for-shot tonemapping of the entire film. Every single shot is analyzed and remapped to fit inside of a Rec.709/Gamma 2.4/100-nit SDR container. After the analysis, Dolby has additional custom trim tools that allow the colorist to fine-tune the SDR version of the film. They can tweak the exposure, the saturation, and the balance/tint. This way, they can make SDR version look as good as possible. Then the same analysis/trim pass is repeated a number of times to accommodate the capabilities of different screens. For example, a brand new analysis and trim pass will be performed for 600-nit TVs, 400-nit TVs, etc. This is why Dolby Vision HDR looks so much better on consumer screens than generic HDR, because its tonemapping is done by the colorist himself rather than just using a TV’s automatic tonemapping. Every version of the film, tailored to your specific screen, was done by the colorist.

So when you’re watching the SDR version, you’re not just watching something that’s been automatically tonemapped. You’re watching the Dolby Vision SDR version that the colorist has actually created, using Dolby’s toolkit, and derived from that original HDR master. That’s what Dolby Vision is – a toolset that allows filmmakers to create an HDR master and then interpolate the color grade all the way down to SDR while preserving the original intent of the grade.

And yes, I would imagine that the new 1080p Blu-rays are going to be from that same Dolby Vision SDR trim. So they will likely look the same as the iTunes 1080p versions, but with a much higher bitrate.

Hope that makes sense.

Post
#1393322
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

Deloreanhunter12 said:

Ah gotcha. Thank so much for all your help with this. I want my Hobbit fanedit to be at its best shape so this really helps. Sorry for all the questions, but I do have one last one. Would an HDR passthrough capture card suffice for viewing HDR or would I have to go for one of the Blackmagic devices? I don’t really use resolve that often and primarily use Premiere Pro CC for my basic color needs.

DeckLink and UltraStudio devices are for monitoring, not for capturing. So that’s an entirely different type of device. Also, generally people use the same Blackmagic devices for their reference displays when using Premiere anyway. Or AJA also makes some that work too.

Also, Premiere actually doesn’t even support HDR PQ at this time (the HDR format used on 4K Blu-ray). They have plans to incorporate it into future versions of Premiere, but it’s currently not supported. (You can still cut an HDR ProRes video inside of Premiere, but you won’t be able to monitor it in HDR or export it in HDR). Right now, Premiere only “kind of” supports HDR HLG, which is an entirely different format. And to be frank, their support is quite limited.

Post
#1393223
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

In order to color grade in HDR, you need to connect your HDR monitor as an external reference display inside of Resolve, not as a GUI display. This means you will need an HDR-supported DeckLink or UltraStudio device, plugged in through PCIe or Thunderbolt.

Also, if all you have access to is a consumer display, then the only ones that can “approximate” the appropriate range necessary for accurate HDR grading are OLEDs. Particularly the last two generations of LG OLEDs (C9 and CX). But even OLEDs require calibration and lots of setup. Dado Valentic has a really great guide for getting an OLED set up for HDR grading. https://youtu.be/T-oYDNbnVXQ

Also, grading in HDR is quite difficult, actually. If you’re not already familiar with grading in Resolve, then you’ll probably want to practice grading in SDR first.

This written guide of mine here on this forum is primarily intended for those who are interested in grading 4K HDR Blu-rays in an SDR environment. Grading in HDR really is quite a complicated beast at the moment for consumers. Most consumer hardware just isn’t really good enough yet.

Post
#1392255
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

Ugh, but the more and more that I look at these films and pixel-peep, the more I’m realizing that they really do have far too much DNR… Makes me sad. Colors on Fellowship EE are still far better than the regular Blu-ray though.

Jay said:

Just watched this review:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3Z58uiwcME

I don’t see how anybody can defend this release…

Wow, that shot of Gandalf’s staff is REALLY bad… UGH!

Most of those other shots aren’t as bad as people are making them out to be though. Most of that “detail” he’s referring to is just grain, whereas the actual detail is still there in the 4K.

But I agree that the grain looks really nice and it should have been left in!! Peter, WHY did you remove the grain?!

Post
#1392235
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

ChainsawAsh said:

…Every screencap I’ve seen of a shot that is 100% for sure not a VFX/composite shot definitely looks like a true 4K scan to me.

I think people are really underestimating how many composites and VFX shots are in these movies, and it’s already been stated that such shots are either 4K scans of 2K film-out negatives, or upscales of the 2K DI.

This. 100% this. There are so many VFX shots in these films, even shots that you wouldn’t ever think are VFX shots. But for shots that aren’t VFX, they definitely look like true 4K to me.

Also, I don’t know how anybody can complain about the Fellowship 4K release. It’s literally the best the film has ever looked on an official home video release. No other previous release even comes close! Sure, it’s not as close to the original color grading as my color restoration is, but the colors are a thousand times more natural than the previous extended Blu-ray release.

I haven’t had a chance to watch The Two Towers or Return of the King yet, though. And those revisionist screencaps concern me (although, I’ll wait to give my opinion on them until after I’ve seen how widespread those color changes really are). But honestly, I don’t see a reason to be complaining about these two films either, even if they did change the look. Why? Because these two films on regular HD Blu-ray already looked exactly like the original release! They look amazing on just regular HD Blu-ray. The only film that looked horrendous was Fellowship of the Ring, and now it’s (mostly) fixed.

We have all three films accessible to us, officially, in a way that looks pretty great. That’s what matters for both the consumer and for film preservation.

Post
#1392198
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

Deloreanhunter12 said:

44rh1n said:
In order to export in HDR you need to do the color grade in HDR. Which I doubt you’re able to do accurately unless you have a very very very expensive reference monitor, like the Sony BVM-X300 or the FSI XM310K. Or an Apple Pro Display XDR, if you’re on the cheap end. 🙂

Unless you’ve made a fanedit without any regrading, in which case you can leave all of the original HDR grading.

Ooooof, well that blows

I mean, it makes sense. You can’t really grade in HDR if you can’t see it in HDR. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

Post
#1392003
Topic
Info: Guide for Working with 4K HDR Blu-ray Rips in SDR
Time

Deloreanhunter12 said:

I have a question for HDR exporting. When you are using the lut in premiere and doing an edit, what settings should I use to make sure that the video is exporting as HDR properly and not exporting just a REC.709 color space from the lut?

In order to export in HDR you need to do the color grade in HDR. Which I doubt you’re able to do accurately unless you have a very very very expensive reference monitor, like the Sony BVM-X300 or the FSI XM310K. Or an Apple Pro Display XDR, if you’re on the cheap end. 🙂

Unless you’ve made a fanedit without any regrading, in which case you can leave all of the original HDR grading.

Post
#1390859
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

tlen said:

For me the only good thing of the entire remastered box is the really beautiful color regrade.

Apart colors, all the rest is plain 2k Upscale + outlaw DNR + Sharpening fraud.

There are plenty of screens (capsaholic and BR forum) so atrocius i can’t believe someone had the courage to ok it.

There is someone with the idea of regrade from the TE bluray with the UHD as reference?

Sounds like you actually need to watch it in 4K HDR before landing on this opinion. Haha.

It’s not upscaled 2K, except for the VFX. Everything else is true 4K, scanned from the original negative. That’s also why it’s so clean. Sure, there’s some DNR, but nowhere near the amount of DNR in other film releases (cough cough James Cameron cough cough). And it doesn’t even come close to the amount of DNR on the original theatrical Blu-ray. Plus, LOTR always had digital sharpening. It’s part of how it has always looked. Sharpening is even talked about in the color grading BTS in the appendices from 2001.

The HDR looks really great on a true HDR display, like my LG OLED. I definitely recommend checking it out on a true HDR screen, preferably one with Dolby Vision support.

My only complaints so far are that the DNR could have been done a bit less, and the color grading could have been a bit more similar to the original DVD release (with the added HDR, of course). Some scenes are less warm from the original grading (Rivendell), while others are warmer than the original grading (flashbacks and Galdalf’s confrontation with Saruman). And skintone/midtones seem to be a bit more lifted overall in bright scenes than in the original grading. I also noticed some blues in Gandalf’s beard during his scene with Frodo at the beginning of the film, which looks like a stray qualifier of the sky. Kind of annoying. Reminds me of the stray power window that used to be in this exact same scene on the old green-tinted Blu-ray. But that’s me nitpicking! Without comparing it to the original grading, it’s quite good.

Granted, so far I’ve only looked at Fellowship. It’s a vast improvement from previous official HD releases. I still have to look at Two Towers and Return of the King, though.

Post
#1390424
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

Harmy said:

I also finally got a look at it. I still prefer the theatrical colors when looking at it side by side but on its own, it looks great. The only thing that bothers me is that to my taste, they went a little over board with dnr. It’s really good state-of-the-art dnr, so it didn’t really remove any detail but it looks a bit clinical and digital.

I agree, I still prefer the original color from the theatrical/extended DVD. But I have to admit the HDR is really nice.

Also, I actually noticed that there’s some really nice grain throughout the film, although it’s very fine, subtle grain. You’re right that they’ve definitely applied some DNR, (and more than I would have liked). But I’m grateful they didn’t try to scrub out the grain completely, because there’s still a light amount of it that’s present in the film.

The DNR does feel a bit more prominent on VFX shots, though. But that may just be a resolution thing.

Post
#1390401
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

I finally had a chance look at the 4K HDR version, and it looks amazing! My comments above remain the same — it doesn’t look exactly like the original release, but it’s very much in the spirit of the original release. I have some reservations, but overall it looks really good, and seeing this film in HDR is a really cool experience. It’s super visceral! And of course, now that there’s no awful green pollution throughout the entire film, it’s finally watchable again!

Post
#1389014
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

CatBus said:

Speaking of your avatar, for those who haven’t already seen this:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php?p=18347156&postcount=5884

Top: Theatrical Blu
Middle: Extended Blu
Bottom: UHD

The tonemapping on that UHD still doesn’t look accurate to me. (It at least shows off the lack of the green tint though!)

Post
#1388537
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
Time

dranore said:

44rh1n said:
So the CGI is technically upscaled 2K (scanned from film though), and everything else is true 4K. It’s a very thorough remaster, from what I’ve read.

I realize this is quite subjective, but how well do you think the effects hold up?

You’re just looking at the HD version and not the 4k, but I’ve read a lot of people expressing concerns about how effects heavy shots would age once the refreshed live action material was set alongside it.

From what I’ve seen so far (and I haven’t watched the full film yet – waiting on the 4K to do that), it looks very good. The CGI appears more detailed than previous Blu-ray releases. I wouldn’t be surprised if a good amount of the 2K CGI was re-composited onto the 4K scanned negative (not re-rendered in 4K or anything like that, but just re-composited in 4K). Can’t verify that though, of course. One of my go-to shots to judge CGI is the CGI helicopter shot at about 1:50:09, and in this release it looked very good. Also the troll sequence at 2:15:00 and the Balrog sequence at 2:25:00 look quite detailed. It’s still very much 2000s-era CGI, though. Nothing will change that. But it looks good!

But again, my opinions could change once I’m able to pixel-peep on a higher bitrate source. Right now I’ve only been able to look at the iTunes version on my LG OLED while sitting on my couch, and it initially looks quite good. But I’m much more interested in watching the actual 4K HDR version, or even a 1080p SDR Blu-ray (if that releases, which hopefully it will). I’m afraid these first impressions I’ve been giving are a bit premature.

Post
#1388378
Topic
44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
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dranore said:

Out of curiosity, what’s the verdict on how they handled the original digital negatives for effects?

All non-VFX shots were scanned in 4K from the original negative, and all VFX shots were scanned in 4K from the original VFX film-outs. So the CGI is technically upscaled 2K (scanned from film though), and everything else is true 4K. It’s a very thorough remaster, from what I’ve read.

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44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
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Since I’ve only been able to look at the iTunes version so far though, I’m not 100% certain about the texture. (Because the iTunes version is so compressed). However, it looks like there aren’t DNR issues, and there’s some nice grain. Which is good. But I’ll be analyzing the texture a lot more in-depth once I can my hands on the actual 4K Blu-ray.

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44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released)
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Nick66 said:

The new master of FOTR has already hit iTunes in both 4K HDR and 1080p. Not to purchase, but if you already own the HD versions and stream them it’s the new version that plays. Looks as if someone just may have put them up early.

In any event, the green tint is GONE!

WOW, you’re right! I just checked my iTunes copy, and it looks REALLY good! It’s still only HD for me (hopefully it upgrades to 4K for me eventually – iTunes usually does!), but it’s definitely the new master. It looks WAY better than the old green extended Blu-ray master!

It’s still quite different from the original DVD/theatrical release, but it looks amazing nonetheless. In fact, it’s actually an improvement in many ways (unlike the ugly green extended Blu-ray) to that original version. For example, it no longer has the fairly prominent magenta shift that the original DVD/theatrical release had in the highlights. So it now looks closer to The Two Towers and The Return of the King. And the green tint IS TOTALLY GONE!!

In other areas, I think it’s still a tiny bit worse than the original grade, though. I think it’s a tad undersaturated in some scenes. And some of the more warm, tungsteny scenes (such as Bilbo writing in his office) are a tad too warm to my taste. I liked the original version that was a bit more balanced and had some more color separation. And the scene in Bilbo’s house when he has a panic attack because he can’t find the ring, is still fairly dark as well. But at least you can actually see the colors in that scene again! His vest is actually red again! (In the old extended Blu-ray, that scene was much darker and his vest was black).

And the Rivendell scene is much less saturated than the original DVD/theatrical release. But I’m actually ok with it. It’s still warm, unlike the green version. I might even like this scene a tad more than the original version, because that scene was always very saturated in the original. But I don’t know. I’m kind of conflicted. I’m still married to the original look, I suppose.

Overall, most of the daylight exteriors look VERY close to the original release, though! It looks SO GOOD! I can’t verify this, but I would almost bet money that Peter Doyle returned to do this new color grade. It definitely looks like his handiwork!

I can’t wait to see this in HDR! I bet some of my saturation complaints won’t be quite as relevant with the HDR version, due to the wider gamut of the grade. I’m SO EXCITED!

I’m seriously SO HAPPY that it looks this good! It’s not perfect IMO, but it’s a thousand times better than the old green Blu-ray. It’s definitely at an acceptable state now, and I’m excited to watch it once I can get it in HDR. 😃

Also, for what it’s worth, I just scrubbed through The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey as well, and it also has a new grade. It’s a bit more analogue/film-print-like, and looks a tiny bit closer to the style of The Lord of the Rings trilogy! It’s less saturated than the original Blu-ray, which is great because I always thought the Hobbit films were a bit oversaturated compared to LOTR! I haven’t watched the Hobbit films since the third one was in theaters, so this might give me an excuse to rewatch those!

Thanks for letting me know, Nick66! This is FANTASTIC NEWS!