Han Shoots First - Any valid reason to not have Han shoot first?

JadedSkywalker said:

Greedo was going to kill Han for the Bounty that Jabba placed on him, and take Han’s ship.

What was he supposed to do ask Greedo to a dance off like Star Lord.

Don’t give George any new ideas! 😛

Han didn’t shoot first , he was the only one who shot . As it was ,and as it should have remained .

I used the original version of the scene for my ANH project, mainly because Greedo shooting first is a total fuckup.

I did emulate the subtitles pretty well using Harmy’s and Catbus’ projects as reference.

I decided not to replace the flash frame of the Greedo dummy with a better looking frame from earlier, as Darth Editous had done, because I avoided non-harmonizing-OT-and-SE changes, though I wonder if that one might’ve been better to do.

One thing everyone can agree on is Greedo got SHOT. You don’t see blasters do that kind of damage very often. Greedo’s brothers (Slotho, Envio, Prideo, etc.) had to have a closed casket funeral. His childhood friend, Walz, committed suicide from grief.

^ lol ! I think he was secretly under orders from Darth Badguydious .

Hal 9000 said:

I used the original version of the scene for my ANH project, mainly because Greedo shooting first is a total fuckup.

I did emulate the subtitles pretty well using Harmy’s and Catbus’ projects as reference.

I decided not to replace the flash frame of the Greedo dummy with a better looking frame from earlier, as Darth Editous had done, because I avoided non-harmonizing-OT-and-SE changes, though I wonder if that one might’ve been better to do.

One thing everyone can agree on is Greedo got SHOT. You don’t see blasters do that kind of damage very often. Greedo’s brothers (Slotho, Envio, Prideo, etc.) had to have a closed casket funeral. His childhood friend, Walz, committed suicide from grief.

I think you mean Wald?
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wald

Hal 9000 said:

One thing everyone can agree on is Greedo got SHOT. You don’t see blasters do that kind of damage very often. Greedo’s brothers (Slotho, Envio, Prideo, etc.) had to have a closed casket funeral. His childhood friend, Walz, committed suicide from grief.

Stop making me feel sorry for Greedo… you’re backing up George’s argument that Han shouldn’t have been a ‘cold-blooded killer’!

In an seriousness, I disagree with the change but I do understand George’s motivation behind it. He didn’t want Han’s easiness around shooting because he felt threatened to be considered ‘cool’ or whatever, but then of course Han goes on to kill a load of stormtroopers and sometimes unarmed Imperial officers on the Death Star; pacifism has always been played fast and loose in Star Wars, especially when on a one-on-one basis. Not least because the original scene, where the explosion happens suddenly in front of Han before the cut, is so much better - and the altered scene throws that pacing off - if I was doing a fan edit, I wouldn’t change it.

SilverWook said:

Hal 9000 said:

I used the original version of the scene for my ANH project, mainly because Greedo shooting first is a total fuckup.

I did emulate the subtitles pretty well using Harmy’s and Catbus’ projects as reference.

I decided not to replace the flash frame of the Greedo dummy with a better looking frame from earlier, as Darth Editous had done, because I avoided non-harmonizing-OT-and-SE changes, though I wonder if that one might’ve been better to do.

One thing everyone can agree on is Greedo got SHOT. You don’t see blasters do that kind of damage very often. Greedo’s brothers (Slotho, Envio, Prideo, etc.) had to have a closed casket funeral. His childhood friend, Walz, committed suicide from grief.

I think you mean Wald?
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wald

Yep, you can thank autocorrect for that one.

There is no merit to Greedo shooting at all, but there is merit to him saying Maclunkey.

jedi_bendu said:

In an seriousness, I disagree with the change but I do understand George’s motivation behind it. He didn’t want Han’s easiness around shooting because he felt threatened to be considered ‘cool’ or whatever

I just don’t understand how having them shoot a half second apart (then a quarter second, then a twelfth second, then at the same time) changes anything about Han’s appearance or motivation. Han still puts his foot up to block Greedo’s view. Han still plays with the wall to draw Greedo’s attention away. Han still pulls his gun out of his holster and change his entire mood once he has it out. He’s not doing any of that “just in case”.

If Lucas wanted to re-edit the meaning of the scene, he should have re-edited the entire scene. The single (now two) added shot changes less than nothing.

Han shooting second makes him less like a cowboy. In a classic western shoot out, the villain generally draws first. Greedo drew first, and was holding him at gunpoint throughout the scene. In a western, if the villain shoots first, the hero gets shot. The villain draws first, so the hero has to react and draw faster to beat the villain to the trigger. Greedo made it very clear he intended to kill Han at that moment, so Han took his opportunity to shoot first.

jedi_bendu said:

Hal 9000 said:

One thing everyone can agree on is Greedo got SHOT. You don’t see blasters do that kind of damage very often. Greedo’s brothers (Slotho, Envio, Prideo, etc.) had to have a closed casket funeral. His childhood friend, Walz, committed suicide from grief.

Stop making me feel sorry for Greedo… you’re backing up George’s argument that Han shouldn’t have been a ‘cold-blooded killer’!

In an seriousness, I disagree with the change but I do understand George’s motivation behind it. He didn’t want Han’s easiness around shooting because he felt threatened to be considered ‘cool’ or whatever, but then of course Han goes on to kill a load of stormtroopers and sometimes unarmed Imperial officers on the Death Star; pacifism has always been played fast and loose in Star Wars, especially when on a one-on-one basis. Not least because the original scene, where the explosion happens suddenly in front of Han before the cut, is so much better - and the altered scene throws that pacing off - if I was doing a fan edit, I wouldn’t change it.

The only unarmed officers might have been in the control room above the hangar, but those guys would have pulled an alarm switch if Han hesitated. Pretty sure all the detention block chaps were armed.

Thank goodness George didn’t want any moral ambiguity about a guy who smuggles drugs for a giant space slug. 😉

Dek Rollins said:

Han shooting second makes him less like a cowboy. In a classic western shoot out, the villain generally draws first. Greedo drew first, and was holding him at gunpoint throughout the scene. In a western, if the villain shoots first, the hero gets shot. The villain draws first, so the hero has to react and draw faster to beat the villain to the trigger.

Right! It’s like George forgot what kind of scene he set up.

Greedo made it very clear he intended to kill Han at that moment, so Han took his opportunity to shoot first.

Another right! Han didn’t kill Greedo “In cold blood”, as George likes to say, he was clearly defending himself. Again, it’s like George forgot what was happening here.