Unusual Sequel Trilogy Radical Redux Ideas Thread — Page 106

I mean, if you’re trying to stick to as close to canon as possible, then I definitely think the angle you’re going for would be great. I think if you’re going with that approach, I would play around with the trying stick the dialogue as close to the original as possible, and save the “reveal” of her being sold/adopted by Palpatine until the actual hangar scene.

For a “Rey killed her parents” angle, I wouldn’t worry about canon and just make Ochi’s ship and her parents ship 2 different ships.

NeverarGreat said:

Another question that arises from this is how does this affect Ochi’s ship? Is this the same ship that carried her parents away from Jakku, and if so then how is it on Pasanna and not wrecked in the Jakku desert?

Just change Pasaana to Jakku. They look the same already so you’d just need to swap out a line or two. They barely ever refer to the planet by name so it should be trivial. It’d also bring the trilogy full circle.

I’m really hoping that Rey being the focus of that movie is a bait and switch. The main novelization of TROS actually makes the case that the reason Jannah and Finn rebelled is because they were Force sensitive. I’d love it if the central plot of the next movie was Rey training both Finn and Jannah as students. It could be about how the two of them want to help as many ex-stormtroopers as possible, but that would take away from their Jedi duties elsewhere. Maybe the two of them also develop feelings for each other and we can finally answer the question of whether or not the latest generation of Jedi are allowed to form connections like in legends.

Nev, I do like the new lines. There is a cool Moses parallel with Rey being the child that survived a purge to avoid a prophecy from coming true.

I will say that I think you summarized my thoughts pretty well at one points: What do we want to communicate? Or, what idea is the most important to us to convey?

What is the goal of the Rey Nobody edit? To stick as close to canon as possible except making Rey a Palpatine, or maintain Rey Nobody concept as it was revealed/established in TLJ?

To me, an important aspect of the TLJ reveal wasn’t just that her parents were nobodies, but that they also didn’t care about her. I think with a lot of suggested Rey Nobody options, it still retcons the reveal that her parents were shitty people and makes them martyrs for Rey’s survival. So a part of me feels going with this type of option only half-succeeds at the potential goal. An alternative that people who wanted to sees TROS as a proper follow up to TLJ won’t be 100% satisfied with (what TROS edit would be though?)

Yes, that may mean you have to alter more of TROS, but I think that brings the conversation back to what we are wanting to communicate. What is more important, details related to plot, or related to character? If it is character, then I think it is worth changing plot details, like Ochi’s ship and Rey’s parents’ ship being the same ship. I personally have trouble believing that if Rey’s parents cared enough about her to die for her, they would choose Unkar Plutt, of all people, to take care of her. Why would they sell her? It still doesn’t make a lot of sense in the theatrical version.

To me, Rey being on the same planet as the Falcon is best left as a coincidence. Maybe Rey wasn’t actually inherently gifted or powerful with the Force from birth, but when the lightsaber called to her in TFA, when she connected to Kylo’s mind, when she began believing in the Force, the Force awakened in her. Maybe the Force chose her during the events of TFA. To me, something like this gels better with the whole point of making a Rey Nobody edit in the first place.

But again, I guess it depends on what the priorities are when it comes to this type of edit. Story vs canon, ease vs difficulty, etc.

A part of me wonders if an edit that goes “Your parents were no one, BUT…” doesn’t wholly commit to the Rey Nobody concept of TROS being a film that feels like a follow-up to TLJ in a way that doesn’t contradict it. A part of me worries of any version of Kylo’s lines/monologue that is related to previously unknown information about her past will feel like a conversation that should’ve happened in the last movie. To avoid that, I think you could go the route of Kylo’s goading and reveal being related to Rey’s future and not her past. With the way TLJ ends, it makes me think it wanted Episode IX to leave Rey’s origins behind. There’s nothing important there. What’s important is who she is now and who she chooses to become.

With all that said, I do like what you’ve suggested Nev and see the benefits to this option. I mean you would just really change Kylo’s dialogue, and wouldn’t have to make a lot of cuts. Again, a lot of the ideas people throw out are good. I even flip flop on which ideas I like the best. Since we have Nev’s creative mind and others brainstorming ideas I thought it would be worth bringing this up again. I just thought it would be worth having this conversation again.

Still kind of have the issue where her good parents chose Unkar Plutt of all people to protect(?) their daughter.

Perhaps they kidnapped Rey from Palpatine to try and ransom her for even more money/influence and things went south? Maybe Ochi was wanting to do the same thing too, so Rey ended up lost due to everyone’s greed?

Regardless, I feel like these ideas have 2 issues. 1) They feel very exposition-heavy. Kylo just delivers A LOT of backstory that we mostly don’t see. Is it really compelling?
2) These last two versions both still contradict TLJ. I know Hal’s version of TLJ cut some of these lines but to reiterate:
“They were filthy junk traders, who sold you for drinking money. Dead, in a pauper’s grave in the Jakku desert.”

If you show the flashbacks of her “good” parents, it directly contradicts the idea that her parents sold her for drinking money, which is stated in the text of the previous film, and it is never addressed why Kylo said this despite it not being true. Did Snoke/Palpatine deceive him? If you’re gonna directly contradict what was stated in TLJ, I feel like it should be directly addressed, not left for assumption. Or edit TLJ so it isn’t stated. But if your someone who likes that reveal in TLJ, that wouldn’t be really satisfying.

Just throwing out another option, if you wanted to go with an idea that doesn’t contradict TLJ at all, I think I would cut the parent flashbacks in TROS, and make Rey’s whole dilemma be revolve her natural power vs her ability to control it. Throughout the film she hurts, or almost hurts, people she cares about because she loses control of her powers. Maybe her Jedi training isn’t enough to control her dark side. So Palpatine/Kylo can offer her mastery of her power, to protect her friends, and she struggles with the choice she has to make.

Here is a version of the Force bond duel and the hangar with this in mind.

Kylo: Wherever you are, you’re hard to find.

Rey: You’re hard to get rid of.

Kylo: I pushed you in the desert because you needed to see it. You have power, but can’t control it. Not without me. Rey.

Rey: You’re lying.

Kylo: You know it’s true. Your friends aren’t safe around you.

Rey: Don’t.

Kylo: You know what will happen to them. I’ve been in your head.

Rey: I don’t want this!

Kylo: Search your feelings!

Rey: No!

Kylo: Don’t deny it! Accept it!

Kylo: If you can’t control the dark side-

Rey: Stop talking!

Kylo: -it will control you.

Kylo: Tell me where you are, I’ll help you.

Kylo: If you face Palpatine on your own, without embracing who you are, you will not succeed. And your friends will all be destroyed.

Rey: No!

Kylo: So that’s where you are.

Kylo: You know what will happen if you face him alone.

Rey: No.

Kylo: I’ll come tell you.

Kylo: Rey, I saw what you will become. I know the rest of your story.
Rey: Tell me.
Kylo: He’ll offer you the power to save the ones you love, and you’ll sell your soul to protect them. You will join Palpatine, and take the throne. But it isn’t too late. I feel the pull to the light. And you, the darkness. We’re a dyad in the Force, Rey. Two that are one. We’ll bring true balance, together. You know it’s the only way. You know.

So really you’re playing a similar angle that Palpatine played with Anakin and with Luke in the other films, but it is built on the foundation of the insecurities that have been established for Rey. And I think this angle is the most believable as far as if the audience even partially believes it could happen. Palpatine used the same “save the ones you love” argument with Anakin, and it worked.

Another benefit to this is it actually contradicts canon the least out of any option we could go with. Rey could still be a Palpatine for all we know. That potential backstory is just simply never brought up. The identity of Palpatine’s granddaughter died with Ochi, basically. If you still want to believe that. And as far as the Ochi’s ship issue goes, you can either ignore it, change the ship in the TFA vision to a different ship or different shot, or recontextualize it as a vision of Ochi’s ship in the future (associated with her friends/future family) rather than her parent’s ship.

Maybe this reveal isn’t as big of a reveal as some other options, but it’s possible we could also edit the hangar scene to feel less like a “big reveal” moment if it felt necessary.

Whenever I mess with TROS again myself, I may just try to rebuild the SFX for the Force bond duel and the hangar scene and share them. That way, we could just have a version of those scenes so anyone can insert whatever dialogue they want into those scenes, trim it however they want, etc.
Might be the best way to test some of these ideas out.

I’m pretty certain that’s similar to what RL (or somebody else?) said a few pages back. I think it’s the best way to take things in a Rey Nobody edit. Their dyad forms because they’re both related to Anakin - Rey is “a” chosen one and Ben’s grandfather is “the” chosen one. Although I’m pretty sure that making it so Palpatine orchestrated both the creation of Anakin and Rey by “influencing the midichlorians” would make the kiss at the end even worse than Luke and Leia’s.

You’re probably referring to that canon comic which showed Palpatine behind a pregnant Shmi, but I believe the comic writer later stated that was just what Vader suspected to be the truth, and not reality. It’s best if both Anakin and Rey were gifted their powers and created asexually by the cosmic Force, rather than Sith trickery.

I like that idea. I feel like part of Rey’s character in TROS is trying to live up to the legacy that’s been passed down to her, and eventually accepting her role as a Jedi and a Skywalker in the end. Making her the literal chosen one that will decide the fate of the Galaxy definitely puts the pressure on her to not give in to the dark. I think the only thing that’s missing is an external reason for her to be drawn towards the dark that the audience would actually maybe buy. We all know she’s not gonna take the throne just because palpy asks her to. The visions kind of work for this, but I wonder if there’s some better solution.

My original idea was that a “chosen one” determines the fate of the galaxy. They have to choose whether it goes to the dark or if it becomes balanced. Nothing is set in stone.

That would be cool if it could be communicated. The whole chosen one prophecy wasn’t really explored in the prequels so expanding on that in this movie as a replacement for the Rey Palatine arc would be a great way to tie into the prequels and make this feel like a true finale. There are some questions I think most people would want answered: is this tied to a prophecy like Anakin? Who made it, and how does kylo know about it? Recontexualizing it to fit Rey’s arc would be awesome.

I don’t think I suggested that a few pages back, but I’m sure I’ve suggested a similar idea in the past. Since Palpatine mentioned in ROTS that Plagueis had the power to create life, and it was never confirmed that Anakin was created by Plagueis (it seems like the Force created Anakin on its own, or the very least as a response to what the Sith were doing), perhaps Rey could be like an anti-Chosen One. A perfect vessel created by Palpatine.

Just a question to think about though. Does any alternate version where Rey is somehow inherently special/unique sort of defeat the purpose of a Rey Nobody edit? Based on TLJ, the only thing that makes Rey significant is her natural talent and connection with Kylo. She doesn’t have some kind of special destiny. So if you make Rey a product of Palpatine’s machinations, whether she is his descendant, his creation, his pupil, etc., you’re just replacing one thing that contradicts the message of TLJ with another.

And again, if you’re talking about canon, would making something close to “Rey Palpatine” but not “granddaughter Palpatine” be more contradictory to canon than just just bringing it up at all? If you make her whole dilemma in TROS be based on her visions of the future rather than her past, her self-doubt, etc., you don’t have to contradict her canon backstory. You’re just omitting it, and then the audience can fill in the gaps however they want, Rey Palpatine or not.

I see what you’re saying about maybe coming up with some solution so if she is referred to as a Palpatine or Palpatine’s granddaughter in future content it could still make sense, but honestly don’t you think we’d edit that stuff anyway if it gets brought up again? At this point we don’t even know if/how it will be relevant in future content. There also is a risk that these alternate backstories could make addressing narrative hiccups even more complicated if you’re worried about potentially contradicting future content.

Again, I’m not saying “my way is the right way”, just genuinely trying to brainstorm a solid option. Like I said, I’m sure I suggested Rey as a new “chosen one” or “anti-chosen one” at some point in the past, a part of me still finds it appealing! But another problem with all of these ideas is that everyone is gonna have different opinions on if they like this alternate backstory, or that alternate backstory. Because we’re having to make a new origin story for Rey almost whole-cloth, using only what we’re visually given in TROS as a skeleton, you could see how people would have different opinions about these ideas.

This is, again, a benefit of just trying to nail a version of Rey Nobody that doesn’t try to replace the Rey Palpatine reveal with some other backstory alternative. Rey’s worries about her future vision and her concerns with her ability to actually control her power are already there, so maybe we should beef that up instead. It doesn’t contradict anything because that narrative stuff is already there, it’s just sharing runtime with all of the Rey Palpatine stuff.

Yeah, I think making a clean Rey nobody version as a base is a good idea first. Then we can use it to make some more radical ideas. The Rey nobody version of ascendant is honestly pretty good on its own so I’m not sure what else needs to be done to get this clean version. Is there anything not present in that version that we would like to add without adding any more complex storylines?

hinventon said:

Yeah, I think making a clean Rey nobody version as a base is a good idea first. Then we can use it to make some more radical ideas. The Rey nobody version of ascendant is honestly pretty good on its own so I’m not sure what else needs to be done to get this clean version. Is there anything not present in that version that we would like to add without adding any more complex storylines?

One thing Spence did (and did well) was heavily trim the hangar duel scene to cut out existing dialogue related to Rey Palpatine. I think now with the voice AI stuff, we could potentially redo the audio for this scene and add some new dialogue. Just generally making the scene feel less edited and more seamless by padding it out more to something a little more closer to the theatrical version.

I also think it wouldn’t hurt to revisit the current Rey Nobody version and see if everything makes sense narratively, or if we could make some changes that will help the whole thing make more sense.

EddieDean said:

Yeah, those are all good points. I don’t imagine this as a Rey Nobody edit, so much as a 'Rey Somebody but it makes a bit more sense and we don’t have to think about Palpatine having sex’ edit.

Lol this mental image has haunted me ever since 2019 and has been driving me this whole time.