The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released) — Page 662

Maybe a simple “It was a night in our training…”?

Burbin said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Burbin said:

Before this movie we aren’t given any indication Leia was ever anything close to a Jedi, she seemed to be in the same place we left her in RotJ, naturally in tune with the Force without any formal training, her space walk in TLJ is closer to Luke pulling the lightsaber on the Wampa cave, which he did before any real Jedi training. It would’ve been fine if they stuck to that but in TROS she suddenly had all this Jedi training that she chose to never use, so there needs to be a reason for that. The film decided the reason was that if she picked up a lightsaber her son would die, which is ridiculous, so I think there needs to be something equivalent to replace that.

I guess I’m having a hard time understanding why you aren’t okay with reverting back to the idea that she didn’t get much formal training, then? We already shot down your point that then she couldn’t have trained Rey - she didn’t really train her, just mentored her and wanted her to reach the past Jedi instead of her.

We can argue semantics all you want, but the movie is very explicit that Leia is supposed to be training Rey, full stop, I don’t think anyone could watch those opening scenes and come to any other conclusion, she literally calls her Master. And the whole point of that flashback scene is to explain how she could be training Rey, it’s convoluted and messy, but it’s stylistically designed to be that way, and you can’t undo that. Even if you remove being the “last night of her training”, she still needs to have trained enough to be able to teach Rey, otherwise none of it makes sense.

Lmao I love your callback to Lucas on TPM

I still believe you’re thinking very black and white, though. It’s either that she learned everything or that she learned nothing at all for you. She could learn the basics, and still be a valuable resource for Rey. But it’s clear Rey is largely doing her own teaching (like a college student LMAO). She is reading Luke’s notes on the Jedi texts, running this training course that Luke made for Leia back in the day, and trying to get in contact with somebody who knows more about being a Jedi at the behest of Leia herself.

Even our new crawl has been modified in such a way to reflect this: “As Rey, sole heir to the Jedi, continues her training, General Leia Organa sends her brave agents across the stars to unite the disparate worlds in the name of Resistance.” Nowhere does it say that Leia is training her. Instead, Leia is still referred to as a General here, which is who she has largely chosen to be. Rey refers to her as a “Master” the same way that everyone referred to Anakin as “Master Skywalker”. Even though he never earned the rank of master, it’s a sign of respect for someone who has trained in the Jedi arts.

Jar Jar Bricks said:

BrotherOfSasquatch said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

It’s hard to extract “Rey” from this scene because a lot of music is in the center channel. This is beyond my abilities, unfortunately.

That’s why I think the “Rey” should be cut out, full stop.

What I meant is that by doing that to the center channel, the music quite obviously dips out and then back in. I’m not sure if this is something somebody else has done before on here.

Hmm… Excuse my naivety but I wonder if it would work if you cut out that “Rey”, incorporate the score from the official soundtrack (which I assume would have the cue that would be missing), and edit it in such a way that it matches the music before and after it in the actual film so that it all is seamless?

I also want to excuse myself if I’m being combative/annoying about this and being more of a guy telling others what to do rather than just doing it myself or contributing something feasible.

“In training, her potential rivaled my own. Leia told me her fate was bound to the core of galactic affairs, not the rigid path of a Jedi. She surrendered her saber to me…”

I’m willing to re-word this one, but I think it accomplishes three different things.

1. Leia is possibly even stronger with the Force naturally than Luke (thus why she beats him).
2. She senses that she needs to play a more active role in the galaxy than what the Jedi would allow.
3. Luke trained Leia for an indeterminate amount of time so that everybody is happy around here.

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Burbin said:

We can argue semantics all you want, but the movie is very explicit that Leia is supposed to be training Rey, full stop, I don’t think anyone could watch those opening scenes and come to any other conclusion, she literally calls her Master. And the whole point of that flashback scene is to explain how she could be training Rey, it’s convoluted and messy, but it’s stylistically designed to be that way, and you can’t undo that. Even if you remove being the “last night of her training”, she still needs to have trained enough to be able to teach Rey, otherwise none of it makes sense.

I still believe you’re thinking very black and white, though. It’s either that she learned everything or that she learned nothing at all for you. She could learn the basics, and still be a valuable resource for Rey. But it’s clear Rey is largely doing her own teaching.

It’s true that Leia is not doing much more than overseeing her, but I still think that means she’s under her training, and that’s what their scenes together try to imply, though you’re right that she could’ve learned some basics that would be valuable to Rey without her being a graduation ceremony away from becoming a Jedi Master.

DominicCobb said:

It almost just seems like you’re going in circles poking holes in everything. It’s a flawed script we’re working with here. Nothing is going to be perfect. If you don’t think her son dying is a good explanation either I’m curious then what you think should be the line, if anything.

I’m sorry if my criticism comes off as destructive, but if this was the line that was in the original film, I imagine many would be criticizing it to shreds for the same reasons I’m laying down, I’m just looking at it from that perspective. I also criticized sensing the death of her son for being dumb and advocated for changing it, but at least that gave us a reason for why she never picked up her Jedi training again. “She had sensed the end of her Jedi path” might be vague, but it avoids raising further questions on Leia’s character since it sounds like it’s something out of her control, like the Force was telling her she wasn’t meant to go down that path for whatever reason (similar to the Jedi Council’s hesitance to approve of Anakin’s training in TPM, they didn’t get visions of Order 66 or anything, they just felt something was off). That reason could very well be the role the Resistance would come to play in the ultimate victory, just as you mentioned.

Something like this is what I would suggest:

“There’s something my sister would want you to have.”

“Leia’s saber.”

“She had begun her training as a Jedi. Though she was strong in the Force, Leia told me she sensed her fate lied down a different path. She surrendered her saber to me and said that one day, it would be picked up again by someone who would finish her journey.”

We have to remember the point of this scene is 1. to explain how it turns out Leia was a sort-of Jedi but not really, 2. to help lift Rey’s spirits, and 3. to give Rey a cool new lightsaber. Going into specifics about the values of diplomacy, Leia’s mom, and the taxation of trade routes really doesn’t sound like dialogue that would’ve been in the actual film.

DZ-330 said:

Here is another stab at it:

Luke: “I started to train her. Leia was quick to learn, but she knew she could better serve the galaxy with diplomacy, as our mother once did. She surrendered her saber to me and said that one day, it would be picked up again by someone who would finish her journey. A thousand generations live in you now. We’ll always be with you, but this is your fight.”

I’d REALLY like leaving the Padme reference if we can. It would be the only time she is referenced in the ST and it would be nice to include as this is the finale to the whole Skywalker Saga.

I tend to agree re: Padme. I think your new line is a good way to get across her skill while making the amount of training even more vague. I’d probably reword the first sentence to “I had begun to train her.”

Here’s how that latest one from DZ might sound, then:

https://youtu.be/cjGnFo_EYQI?si=lJ_l78JdZQ_-0LOS

Just jumping in here to say, you’re all killing it!! Although, I am a little annoyed at myself for downloading V3 the day before V4 began “production.” Alas, I will wait for the true FINAL version!

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Here’s how that latest one from DZ might sound, then:

https://youtu.be/cjGnFo_EYQI?si=lJ_l78JdZQ_-0LOS

Pretty solid, but the “I had begun to train her” doesn’t quite work IMO, 'cause she definitely seems to have been in training for at least a decent amount of time. I still think a simple “it was a night in our training” could work better here.

Also, “through Senate diplomacy” could work better than just “diplomacy”, 'cause as someone said, the jedi were always kind of diplomats as well.

I’d understand if it was “I’d just begun to train her” or “We were training for the first time” but the phrase itself is ambiguous enough to be referring to a beginning before the flashback itself. Though I understand there could be some confusion there. We’ll have to consider some options here.

You’re right about the next part, but by referring to their mother we get that exact same interpretation without having to be overly detailed.

Yes, since the new dialogue refers to a general feeling and choice that Leia made over time (rather than a specific moment of premonition and decision), a more general statement of timeframe is more fitting that setting the scene to a specific night (but yes perhaps there is the potential for confusion).

I’m liking this new line. And that AI voice is an incredible match.

I actually really liked having “Leia was a quick learner” right after she beats Luke in combat. Putting it before would spoil who wins their spar kinda. But it’s a minor thing, really.

“Leia was quick to learn during our training”

How many times have I redone this single scene today? Lmao:

https://youtu.be/2MdQdcov7VQ?si=rpRbTrVx5sdKc4R8

"Our mother watched helplessly as the democracy she fought so hard to maintain crumbled before her eyes, so Leia decided to follow in her footsteps and watched helplessly as the democracy she fought so hard to maintain crumbled before her eyes. She surrendered her saber to me and left me to deal with Ben Solo’s darkness alone.

Lesson three. Now that she’s gone, Leia is romanticized, deified. But if you strip away the myth and look at her deeds, the legacy of Leia is failure. Hypocrisy, hubris. A thousand generations live in you now, but this is your fight, and honestly you’re better off on your own."