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Anyone else totally disregard Leia being Luke's sister? — Page 12

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screams in the void said:
If you watch the documentary From Star Wars To Jedi , Lucas talks about how he needed a reason for Luke to snap on Vader when hiding under the stairs and until that moment , he did not realize it was staring him in the face in form of Leia being his sister . So that was when that plot point came along .

If the plot point could come to him at that moment (out-of-the-blue), how is it less probable for the notion to have occurred to him years earlier?

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screams in the void said:

…until that moment , he did not realize it was staring him in the face in form of Leia being his sister . So that was when that plot point came along.

Wait, I thought it was back in 1974 when he was writing the original Darth Vader 6 - 12 - 1 - 9 film Saga (genuflect).

I think it’s weird that Lucas doesn’t seem to think there are people who remember him saying he wrote “no, there is another” before he had any idea of how he was going to address his lack of story regarding that fill-in line.

The truth is out there for people who care enough to take time to look for it.

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ToscheStation said:

screams in the void said:
If you watch the documentary From Star Wars To Jedi , Lucas talks about how he needed a reason for Luke to snap on Vader when hiding under the stairs and until that moment , he did not realize it was staring him in the face in form of Leia being his sister . So that was when that plot point came along .

If the plot point could come to him at that moment (out-of-the-blue), how is it less probable for the notion to have occurred to him years earlier?

uhhh…because then it would not have been out of the blue 😃

https://screamsinthevoid.deviantart.com/

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Anchorhead said:

screams in the void said:

…until that moment , he did not realize it was staring him in the face in form of Leia being his sister . So that was when that plot point came along.

Wait, I thought it was back in 1974 when he was writing the original Darth Vader 6 - 12 - 1 - 9 film Saga (genuflect).

I think it’s weird that Lucas doesn’t seem to think there are people who remember him saying he wrote “no, there is another” before he had any idea of how he was going to address his lack of story regarding that fill-in line.

The truth is out there for people who care enough to take time to look for it.

yup. hmmm…maybe this is why the documentary From Star Wars To Jedi The Making Of A Saga has not been re released on a modern format and has been out of print for decades …it raises too many questions .

https://screamsinthevoid.deviantart.com/

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The official SW youtube channel did upload an old copy though.

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Where were you in '77?

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The Leia thing was stupid for two reasons - one, she was never meant to be Luke’s sister and Luke was obviously attracted to her in the preceding two films (with deleted scenes clearly showing an attraction from Leia’s side as well - not ‘canon’ but certainly indicative of the writers’ intent).

Secondly she was a prisoner on Bespin while Yoda made the “there is another” declaration in the first place, so she could not possibly have been the other hope - sister or no. At best you’d have to argue that Yoda, who previously couldn’t ‘see her fate’, suddenly sensed through the Force (as Luke was taking off) that Leia would survive the Bespin fiasco but somehow he couldn’t see that Luke would make it as well. Or something…

Personally I think Boba Fett should’ve been the ‘other hope’…

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I’ve honestly disliked that line from the get-go.

Why say it within the context of this story? Luke is about to face down Vader. Don’t tell the audience Luke isn’t important anymore. Even if Lucas was thinking Luke should have a sister at the time, I don’t see why he would reveal that to the audience now.

It is clear to me Lucas originally wanted to have a new character be Luke’s sister, but when he decided to stop making Star Wars movies, he wanted to tie everything up into a neat bow. Happily ever after. So if Han and Luke are having a love triangle, just make Luke her brother! Tadaa!

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OutboundFlight said:

I’ve honestly disliked that line from the get-go.

Why say it within the context of this story? Luke is about to face down Vader. Don’t tell the audience Luke isn’t important anymore. Even if Lucas was thinking Luke should have a sister at the time, I don’t see why he would reveal that to the audience now.

It is clear to me Lucas originally wanted to have a new character be Luke’s sister, but when he decided to stop making Star Wars movies, he wanted to tie everything up into a neat bow. Happily ever after. So if Han and Luke are having a love triangle, just make Luke her brother! Tadaa!

The idea of having this line was to give the audience pause and consider that Luke might actually be going to his death. I think it works in the context of the film. Obviously it works less well in the context of the next.

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OutboundFlight said:

I’ve honestly disliked that line from the get-go.

Why say it within the context of this story? Luke is about to face down Vader. Don’t tell the audience Luke isn’t important anymore. Even if Lucas was thinking Luke should have a sister at the time, I don’t see why he would reveal that to the audience now.

It is clear to me Lucas originally wanted to have a new character be Luke’s sister, but when he decided to stop making Star Wars movies, he wanted to tie everything up into a neat bow. Happily ever after.

Yes. Yep. Yeah.

So if Han and Luke are having a love triangle, just make Luke her brother! Tadaa!

There was no “love triangle”. Leia wanted Han. She wasn’t torn between them at all.

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 (Edited)

It’s most obvious in ANH with Luke and Leia’s reactions. In fact I think within the context of that film, Luke and Leia are meant to get together. Han acts more like a mature big brother who plays “cool” with Leia.

Best evidence here is that scene after escaping the Death Star where Luke asked Han about Leia, and Han says no chance, this is clearly aimed at a bit of love triangle. A naive, caring guy vs your typical detached, cool guy. Clearly setting up.

But something must of happened between ANH and ESB, because Empire doesn’t really seem interested in playing up a love triangle. Leia kisses Luke in that instance to make Han jealous. The entire B plot of that movie is dedicated to their relationship, so it’d be weird for Luke to just show up again. But in the same token they’ve already set up a love triangle.

Had ROTJ stuck to its guns with the original script, either Han’s death or Luke walking away to focus on the Jedi would have made a far stronger conclusion to the triangle.

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OutboundFlight said:

It’s most obvious in ANH with Luke and Leia’s reactions. In fact I think within the context of that film, Luke and Leia are meant to get together. Han acts more like a mature big brother who plays “cool” with Leia.

Best evidence here is that scene after escaping the Death Star where Luke asked Han about Leia, and Han says no chance, this is clearly aimed at a bit of love triangle. A naive, caring guy vs your typical detached, cool guy. Clearly setting up.

But something must of happened between ANH and ESB, because Empire doesn’t really seem interested in playing up a love triangle. Leia kisses Luke in that instance to make Han jealous. The entire B plot of that movie is dedicated to their relationship, so it’d be weird for Luke to just show up again. But in the same token they’ve already set up a love triangle.

Had ROTJ stuck to its guns with the original script, either Han’s death or Luke walking away to focus on the Jedi would have made a far stronger conclusion to the triangle.

I don’t think Han asking about his chances with Leia was necessarily setting up a triangle. He noticed Luke was interested and decided to mess with him. Otherwise, I’ll defer to my last post in this thread.

DominicCobb said:

When SW was written, the intention was that Luke and Leia would ultimately end up together (simply because that’s how these kinds of stories usually work). She’s immediately dismissive of both of Luke and Han, but quickly comes to respect Luke while the same cannot be said for Han. Except, Leia happened to have more chemistry with Han.

When they wrote ESB, they clearly noticed this, so they decided to add the Han/Leia romance with a strong love triangle in mind. This was prominent in early drafts and deleted scenes. When it finally came down to it, and the film was trimmed to what it is with extraneous bits removed, we ultimately have a movie where Luke expresses no romantic interest in Leia and vice versa, only one scene where Leia kisses Luke to make Han jealous (with any other romantic context for their kiss completely left out on the cutting room floor).

So in the end, yes, the love triangle never manifested. SW very lightly suggests that Luke and Leia might be a thing, but in the context of the next two films, it is much easier to ignore this and focus on Leia and Han’s bickering, which while not romantic in the original became such in ESB (which retroactively make them seem so in the first film).

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Hit the nail on the head, Dom!

Do you think ROTJ would’ve still worked if the sister subplot was still in the movie, but her identity was just never revealed?

So basically Luke finds out he has a sister, but they don’t reveal to Luke her identity in case Luke fails to defeat Vader and the Emperor. Vader still discovers he has a twin sister, and that triggers Luke, but Luke finding his sister is left open for a potential sequel.

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Yeah part of me wonders why they couldn’t have left the “other” sister as a hanging thread even if ROTJ was supposed to wrap things up. Much like the “pass on what you have learned” line, it’s setting up Luke’s future adventures without necessarily requiring those adventures to be on screen.

I will say Luke getting angry about the sister certainly holds more weight when it’s someone he’s close with. As cheap and silly as making Leia Luke’s sister was, ultimately I don’t think it was a decision that lacked potential for compelling drama. It’s only a shame that that potential was mostly unfulfilled in ROTJ itself.

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True. I think that could be a route one could take for a “Revenge of the Jedi” alternate history-style edit of the film.

Yeah, it was unfulfilled. They never really address this idea directly in the new films, but since Leia never came to terms with Vader being her father like Luke did, I think her son now basically being the new Vader is a continuation of that idea. It seems Leia never really forgave her father for what he did, like Luke did. Now, in a twisted stroke of irony, her own child has become her father, and she has to deal with those feelings of anger and forgiveness.

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Leaving the sister plotline in there without her being revealed is an idea I had long ago and honestly really liked because it would provide an unsolved mystery to wonder about. Unfortunately, putting in a fanedit wouldn’t much since half the fun of unsolved mysteries is the community trying to solve them, and the SW fandom at large already have their answer; it’s Leia. Also it’d be really weird not to address it in the ST, so I can’t see her not being Rey’s mother.

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Well I just was thinking you could do that for an alternate version of Return of the Jedi that doesn’t take the other movies into account. Sort of like an alternate history where Jedi might’ve been the last Star Wars movie.

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RogueLeader said:

Well I just was thinking you could do that for an alternate version of Return of the Jedi that doesn’t take the other movies into account. Sort of like an alternate history where Jedi might’ve been the last Star Wars movie.

I still see it as the last movie, much like Godfather Part II is the last Godfather movie. The ST and Godfather III are really nice epilogues though 😃