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Info & Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist — Page 185

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I pray he was joking.  Well, I guess this isn't strictly for Adywan, so theoretically someone who makes another version of ESB with green lasers would want to have them match in RotJ.  But that would make it an ESB suggestion, not a RotJ one.

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Bingowings said:

DF Shadow said:

I just feel like the amount of work that would have to go into putting the scene in Ben's old home and have it actually look good/convincing just isn't worth it.

It's something I've been spending some time preparing to attempt myself (not that I'm really holding out much in the way of promises, I'm no Ady but I will attempt at least a proof of concept).

It's no more hard work than a lot of the proposed changes here, It's certainly a doable thing though as you say hard work.

As for if it's worth doing, that depends on your point of view as I have observed there are plenty of people who just want a basic lick and polish job done on the SE as it currently exists.

Personally I think it is worth it for the added story cohesion.

 

 

 

No doubt.......if it ended up looking good and worked better for the story then I'd be all for it. I might try at least some mock ups on Endor.

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vaderios said:

 

We are all drunk here

 

-Angel

I missed my cue there....

My sig has always said clowns, not drunk. But both work equally as another for me.

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As i think Darth venal said about the hut scene. How would Luke of hidden his lightsaber within r2? I do like the idea of the hut scene, i would still rather see Luke appear at Jabba's palace first. Just makes his entrance epic, then he catches the lightsaber and then its like hell yea!

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Bingowings said:

I know that Ben's ghost scene isn't much of a retort from Luke but it's all that we can get and just having Luke stumble on the truth at some point isn't something that can be done with the existing material.

If Lucas had done it properly we we would have shots of Luke noticing Skywalker style behaviour and then we he tells Leia (or even when he second guesses Ben's ghost in the existing versions) it could have been a semi-plausible revelation but then if Lucas had been in a mind to do it properly Leia would never have been the Other in the first place.

Leia does show Skywalker style behaviour but he's hardly ever around when she does it, (choking Lando via Chewie, choking Jabba, rushing in to save Han, sensing Lando isn't quite right etc). If anything Luke is more likely to conclude Han is his sister going on the evidence he's around to see.

If Luke had been around to notice these things at least Ben could then argue he was trying to protect her from herself and that Luke showed less potential for going the same way Anakin did.

So if we have to have the Ben scene (and I fear we do) putting him on Tatooine where he has a strong connection to Luke makes more sense, to me at least, for all the reasons I've listed.

Vader figured out Luke was his son without being around him (of course, if we go by Skywalker being the actual last name, then it wouldn't be too hard to figure out that connection. Then again, why didn't Vader know that Luke was his son in ANH, being that someone would have told him that the droids were owned by an Owen Skywalker, father of Luke Skywalker... ah, the paradox of Lucas' mind).

Even so, it is a correlation to how Vader confronts and enlightens Luke at Bespin with Luke's revelation to Leia on Endor - the scenes mirror each other.  My point is that Luke figures it out through his connection to the Force, much as Vader no doubt figured out Luke's identity through the Force as well.  Being a Jedi master is about being a master of yourself and your own path, not being told every little thing like a child at school.  In fact, it surprises me that Lucas did not keep the reveal to Luke's conversation as it happens near the end (like the one in EMPIRE) and it would have had more impact than a casual conversation in the beginning of the film.

It also shows Lucas' inability to allow the film's story to flow into revelations, and shows us his lack of faith in the audience by having Oli Wan Ricobi literally spell things out in the most banal way possible.

But, to quote a more well known philosophical a-hole, "that's just me, I could be wrong."

         

 “You people must realize that the public owns you for life, and when you’re dead, you’ll all be in commercials dancing with vacuum cleaners.”

– Homer Simpson

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One of the fun things I do in light of the prequels and RotJ is watch ANH and ESB and yell out "LIE" every time Obi-Wan tells a lie or half-truth (depending on your point of view; I'm sure he was telling the truth in the script, but later revelations show him to be lying).

Well, its fun for me...

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Darth Venal said:

 

Well anyone willing to give that a go deserves points for trying. Personally, feelings of the change being unnecessary aside, I think the technical side of it is also going to be very difficult. Apart from the tricky job of rotoscoping Alec Guinness out of Dagobah, you've then got the added issues of Dagobah still being visible through him instead of Ben's house. And while you can animate the outline of Ben with Force energy and use the glow to hide the rotoscoping, it can't be done with Luke. It's a hell of a lot of work.

Good luck with it.

One can always take Alec Guinness scenes from ANH and transparentize him, if that's possible.  Whenever he speaks, never show his face (be it we see Luke's face and the side of Kenobi's, and then the camera angle changes so when Luke speaks we see Kenobi sitting/standing while listening to Luke).

         

 “You people must realize that the public owns you for life, and when you’re dead, you’ll all be in commercials dancing with vacuum cleaners.”

– Homer Simpson

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Monroville:

Then again, why didn't Vader know that Luke was his son in ANH, being that someone would have told him that the droids were owned by an Owen Skywalker, father of Luke Skywalker.

Am I misunderstanding your context, or are you saying Owen's name was Skywalker? And even if it were, why would Vader assume Owen had a son, and that that son was the son Vader didn't even know he had?

Hm.

One can always take Alec Guinness scenes from ANH and transparentize him, if that's possible.  Whenever he speaks, never show his face.

That's ridiculous. Any editor who would do that needs his hard drive erasing.

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Unless Skywalker was a common name, you think for as smart as Vader supposedly is, it would ring some bells.  20 some-odd years is not long enough to forget your entire first 20 years of existence, especially when it was defined by being pronounced the "chosen one" and finding the love of your life.  You would think Vader would at least check it out... it's not like he had anything better to do, other than stand around making Tarkin look good.

If I also recall, didn't Shmi (or whatever Anakin's mothers name was) mention that Owen was her brother, and that is why Obi Wan gave Owen Luke to begin with?  Of course, this conflicts with the ANH original story line that Owen was Kenobi's brother (King Arthur connection - Arthur was given to Kay's dad [can't remember his name] to take care of.  At his coming of age, Arthur finds out that his "dad" is a surrogate and he is the true son of Uther Pendragon, who in the STAR WARS universe is still very much alive).

And now I've gone cross-eyed... 

         

 “You people must realize that the public owns you for life, and when you’re dead, you’ll all be in commercials dancing with vacuum cleaners.”

– Homer Simpson

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Monroville said:

Unless Skywalker was a common name, you think for as smart as Vader supposedly is, it would ring some bells.  20 some-odd years is not long enough to forget your entire first 20 years of existence, especially when it was defined by being pronounced the "chosen one" and finding the love of your life.  You would think Vader would at least check it out... it's not like he had anything better to do, other than stand around making Tarkin look good.

If I also recall, didn't Shmi (or whatever Anakin's mothers name was) mention that Owen was her brother, and that is why Obi Wan gave Owen Luke to begin with?  Of course, this conflicts with the ANH original story line that Owen was Kenobi's brother (King Arthur connection - Arthur was given to Kay's dad [can't remember his name] to take care of.  At his coming of age, Arthur finds out that his "dad" is a surrogate and he is the true son of Uther Pendragon, who in the STAR WARS universe is still very much alive).

And now I've gone cross-eyed... 

It has been a long time since you watched the prequels...  Shmi married Owen's dad, making Owen and Anakin brothers.  Uncle Owen is actually Luke's uncle, not "Uncle" Owen as had been assumed.

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Monroville:

If I also recall, didn't Shmi mention that Owen was her brother, and that is why Obi Wan gave Owen Luke to begin with?  Of course, this conflicts with the ANH original story line that Owen was Kenobi's brother.

Well whatever the original ANH story is irrelevant, what ended up in the movie is, and there is no explicit indication whatsoever that Owen and Ben are related. In Attack of the Clones, Owen is clearly established as Anakin's step-brother - Owen's dad married Anakin's mother. So Anakin's son is Owen's nephew. Contrived as it is, that's how it is, Owen is indeed Luke's (step-) uncle. And it's Owen Lars, not Skywalker.

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doubleofive said:

One of the fun things I do in light of the prequels and RotJ is watch ANH and ESB and yell out "LIE" every time Obi-Wan tells a lie or half-truth...

I could do that!  Maybe I'll get in ESB:R after all...

Monroville said:

It also shows Lucas' inability to allow the film's story to flow into revelations, and shows us his lack of faith in the audience by having Oli Wan Ricobi literally spell things out in the most banal way possible.

What's so wrong with that?

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It's academic anyway.

Outside the EU we don't know how Vader found out who Luke is.

I assume that there was an investigation into who it was who destroyed the Death Star, the name came up and it made sense when Vader took into account his own perception of a pilot unusually strong in the Force, it makes sense he was told by spies.

Luke didn't just figure out Vader was his father, Vader told him and it was confirmed by Yoda and Ben later.

To have Luke just figure out Leia is his sister with very little if any forewarning or observed evidence, based solely on some half whispered dying words about "another Skywalker" is pushing it a bit.

How was he even supposed to leap to sister from that information?

Uncle, mother, grandfather, brother, cousin...and then to a name?

Even Lucas wouldn't make that much of a leap.

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Just wanted to let you guys know that I'm going to be on travel for my company next week (details in the "Going Away?" thread).  If list-worthy stuff happens, just keep track and someone (Bingo?) PM me with it when I get back.

I'll catch up later.

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If only luke had gave in his application for the academy lmao. Would have been a brilliant reason for how Vader found out his name lol

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DuTwan said:

If only luke had gave in his application for the academy lmao. Would have been a brilliant reason for how Vader found out his name lol

Vader sits at a desk, looking through applications:

"Hmm, what's this?  Good piloting skills, slight whining problem.  Sounds like he'd be alright.  What's the name here: 'Skyw---'  No...  Where's he from?  Tatooine?  Who is his guardian?  LARS?!  No, certainly Obi-Wan wouldn't be stupid enough to..."

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doubleofive said:

DuTwan said:

If only luke had gave in his application for the academy lmao. Would have been a brilliant reason for how Vader found out his name lol

Vader sits at a desk, looking through applications:

"Hmm, what's this?  Good piloting skills, slight whining problem.  Sounds like he'd be alright.  What's the name here: 'Skyw---'  No...  Where's he from?  Tatooine?  Who is his guardian?  LARS?!  No, certainly Obi-Wan wouldn't be stupid enough to..."

 Haha!! I totally saw that in my head, can imagine him sittin in his meditation chamber thing thinkin ''how could he be so stupid!''

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thats for Bingo:

Note that i havent touch the matte at all. I hate the centered shot as you do :P (Get rid of this shot ady :D)

 

-Angel

–>Artwork<–**

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Yay! you got the wings to work too!

I spent ages trying to get that right.

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005!

Add that too :)

Different locks between shots.(sorry i could yet the right frame in the first pic)

it would cool and at the same time useless to have a lock animation ala Trade federation blastdoors

 

-Angel

 

JJ?

lol :P

–>Artwork<–**

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Great, let's flood Jedi with lots of completely distracting lens flares! Even when there aren't any lights off camera to cause them.

AWESOME!

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Darth Venal said:


 

Great, let's flood Jedi with lots of completely distracting lens flares! Even when there aren't any lights off camera to cause them.

AWESOME!

He was poking fun at JJ Abrams. xP

A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em