Collipso said:
Matt.F said:
Collipso said:
Matt.F said:
ray_afraid said:
SilverWook said:
I wasn’t writing them off, I was trying to say the traditional movie critic who had a journalistic background or came out of the movie industry seems a rare breed these days.
There were plenty of critics I couldn’t stand back in the day. There was at least one who seemed to enjoy trashing Star Wars regularly. Probably pulling their hair out now if they’re still around. 😉
OOH! Have ya seen the video of Siskel & Ebert defending ROTJ against some fool? It’s great! 😄
Here it is
Thanks, I loved seeing that and Siskel says exactly the same thing I just said!
“This is very good of its kind.” He repeats it again and again. “This is very good OF ITS KIND.”
Judge The Last Jedi against its peers. Objectively it is a high quality family film. You can look at the professional critics opinions, aggregated on metacritic and rotten tomatoes. This is very good of its kind. Pirates Of The Caribbean, Transformers, Planet Of The Apes, Justice League. This is not opinion, this is the truth.
Shouldn’t you judge Star Wars vs Star Wars? They’re all Star Wars movies.
No, because if I say to you Collipso ‘what is your fave film of all time?’ and you reply “Empire Strikes Back” - then you are judging this new flick against the highest cinematic benchmark you’ve ever experienced. Nothing should have to attain such an unrealistic stretch target.
But if I say to you, “Collipso, out of the films you saw in 2017, which did you enjoy the most?”… and that film is The Last Jedi then I would say that’s a great success!
I see your point. However, I think we should judge a Star Wars movie against other Star Wars movies. If Star Wars movies have hit a certain mark in the past, I expect the other that follow it to do the same, to hit the same marks and if possible even more. If not, I won’t be impressed. In fact I’ll be a bit disappointed, that’s all.
I still really enjoyed both of my TLJ experiences. I do think that, as a movie, the first act is fairly weak and messy, and that the pace during that session is not very good at all. I also think some of the dialogue and writing decisions didn’t resonate well with me. But it’d still be a 7/10 or 7.5/10 for me, and that’s ok. What I don’t like are some of the directions taken with the characters. And I have my problems with the ST as a whole too.
PS: Star Wars is my favorite Star Wars movie, and my favorite movie of all time is probably The Godfather Part II.
In terms of quality, tone, and visuals, I compare Star Wars movies to each other. While the ST has hit some sour notes in tone (and in all three areas at Canto Bight), the ST has been good overall in those areas. Stopping there, I would declare the movies to be a success.
I’m with you when it comes to storytelling and characterization. It’s less a matter of comparison than judging how well those elements work in the movie as well as the bigger Star Wars story.
I put the OT in their own separate category, with ROTJ being my general favorite. ESB is great but I think the praise often goes overboard. If asked: the OT is my favorite; Groundhog Day is my favorite non-SW movie.