I started a parallel universe where ESB has no story/plot structure flaws* (like it does now), and thus doesn’t require the follow-up movie to pull it’s (ESB’s) chestnuts out of the fire…
*i.e. it actually resolves plot/story arcs instead of leaving them hanging
I start too many parallel universes and never end up knowing what to do with them.
To answer the decade old question, yes, I can disregard Leia as Luke’s sister, for the simple reason that there’s no real proof that they’re related. Ben merely says ‘Your insight serves you well’ in response to Luke’s intuition. He’s already known to lie when it serves his purposes, so he could merely have been allowing Luke to believe that Leia was his sister to make sure that the real twin stayed ‘safely anonymous’.
The hint of Leia’s Force sensitivity only appeared after Luke basically said that she should be terrifyingly powerful with the Force, and this tracks in my mind to how the Force should really work - if you believe in it, you can become strong in it. Even The Force Awakens doesn’t ruin this idea, since she would have had 30 years to develop some real Force ability and Ben junior would have grown up believing that he was destined for greatness.
You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)
Anyone else able to enjoy less than perfect movies for what they are without rewriting them in their head?
I am, although some exceptions have to be made.
To answer the decade old question, yes, I can disregard Leia as Luke’s sister, for the simple reason that there’s no real proof that they’re related. Ben merely says ‘Your insight serves you well’ in response to Luke’s intuition. He’s already known to lie when it serves his purposes, so he could merely have been allowing Luke to believe that Leia was his sister to make sure that the real twin stayed ‘safely anonymous’.
The hint of Leia’s Force sensitivity only appeared after Luke basically said that she should be terrifyingly powerful with the Force, and this tracks in my mind to how the Force should really work - if you believe in it, you can become strong in it. Even The Force Awakens doesn’t ruin this idea, since she would have had 30 years to develop some real Force ability and Ben junior would have grown up believing that he was destined for greatness.
There you go. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This.
Each day Return of the Jedi becomes worse and worse of a movie in my mind. Even just a few months ago, my opinion of the movie was much more generous. And it makes me quite sad since I used to love it as a kid.
The sister reveal is definitely one of those things that stands out as a glaring issue but now even what used to be the good things about Return of the Jedi for me have turned into weaknesses. I used to think the stuff with Luke, the Emperor, and Vader was the saving grace of this movie but now all of it just feels cheap, contrived, and lazy. With the emperor saying things like “You, like your father, are now mine.”, or Vader saying “It is useless to resist”. They turned the dark side into some sort of dark force that tempts you and takes control of you. I kind of miss the days when the dark side was simply another philosophy by which force users would follow. When Luke made his decision in Empire Strikes Back to not join Vader, it actually seemed like a hard decision when I was a kid. Vader was his father, they could technically beat the Emperor together, and then rule the galaxy together. It actually seemed like a viable option and Luke was still able to make the right choice. In Return of the Jedi, the Emperor couldn’t have done a worse job of trying to convince Luke to join him. Why is it that because Luke loses his cool for a few moments, would maybe turn him to the dark side. For gods sake, even when he refuses to kill Vader and throws his light saber away it is starting to feel cheap and contrived.
It’s all just probably my mind becoming more and more cynical in thinking but oh well. RIP Return of the Jedi.
Are you sure you’re not a sock of mine?
You actually were the one who made me think of these issues in Return of the Jedi. It just makes me sad cause I now feel that what I considered the best is now along with the other bad things about Return of the Jedi.
I am in the same boat. I find Jedi almost unwatchable, not because of the siblings thing but because all of it aside from Luke’s confrontation with the Emperor and Vader is just so unbelievably boring.
The Person in Question
RotJ has major problems, but, Han’s rescue aside, being boring isn’t one of them. AotC, on the other hand…
Really? I think Han’s rescue, as poorly written as it was, is the best of the non-Emperor stuff. It’s everything on Endor that is unwatchable to me. Last time I watched Jedi I actually skipped all of the Ewok stuff and the forest battle.
JEDIT: In fact, and keep in mind that I’m not saying that Jedi is anywhere near as poorly handled as the prequels, the action stuff and Ewok camp on Endor is as boring to me as I remember the action and love story in AOTC being. Also keep in mind that it’s been something like a decade since I saw AOTC.
The Person in Question
Really? I think Han’s rescue, as poorly written as it was, is the best of the non-Emperor stuff. It’s everything on Endor that is unwatchable to me. Last time I watched Jedi I actually skipped all of the Ewok stuff and the forest battle.
JEDIT: In fact, and keep in mind that I’m not saying that Jedi is anywhere near as poorly handled as the prequels, the action stuff and Ewok camp on Endor is as boring to me as I remember the action and love story in AOTC being. Also keep in mind that it’s been something like a decade since I saw AOTC.
I skip the Endor stuff too when revisiting this chapter - unfortunately it’s a large chunk of film.
The only redeeming Endor footage (IMO) is the spectacular destruction of the Scout Walkers - really nice model work.
I hate to say it, but Return of the Jedi plain sucks. Not as bad as the prequels but definitely a bad movie. The entire Jabba section feels like a separate movie, the Ewoks ruin endor, everyone besides Luke has almost nothing to do of any importance. The spunky, headstrong Leia and cocky, cool headed Han are nowhere to be seen in this film. Leia is weak as hell in the movie, and Harrison couldn’t be phoning it in any more.
The main reason it sucks though is that the only thing of any importance in this film is the confrontation with Luke, the Emperor and Vader. They tie up the haning plot threads left by the Empire Strikes Back in the first section of the film, then it completely departs into a whole new section where we get the Luke and Vader stuff, which is packed side by side with a ton of pointless filler.
Normally, one will painfully bear through most of the film (which is filler) and wait for throne room scenes which are the most important when looking at this movie as the final chapter of a trilogy. But even that stuff sucks. I guess it does have a cool space battle.
sigh
I hate to say it, but Return of the Jedi plain sucks. Not as bad as the prequels but definitely a bad movie. The entire Jabba section feels like a separate movie, the Ewoks ruin endor, everyone besides Luke has almost nothing to do of any importance. The spunky, headstrong Leia and cocky, cool headed Han are nowhere to be seen in this film. Leia is weak as hell in the movie, and Harrison couldn’t be phoning it in any more.
The main reason it sucks though is that the only thing of any importance in this film is the confrontation with Luke, the Emperor and Vader. They tie up the haning plot threads left by the Empire Strikes Back in the first section of the film, then it completely departs into a whole new section where we get the Luke and Vader stuff, which is packed side by side with a ton of pointless filler.
Normally, one will painfully bear through most of the film (which is filler) and wait for throne room scenes which are the most important when looking at this movie as the final chapter of a trilogy. And even that stuff sucks.
Remastered made ROTJ pretty good!
Do they not see the birds controlled in the atmosphere of the sky? none holds them up except Allah. Indeed in that are signs for a people who believe. – Quran (16:79)
Yeah it’s got issues but I wouldn’t say it’s even close to sucking, aside from some moments of jabbas palace.
Anyone else totally disregard ROTJ sucking?
It’s fine.
I’d say it’s more than fine, but it definitely does not suck.
I didn’t say it sucked, just that I don’t like it hardly at all anymore.
The Person in Question
Luke and the production values keep ROTJ from sucking, but only barely.
I didn’t say it sucked, just that I don’t like it hardly at all anymore.
Darthrush did.
I hate to say it, but Return of the Jedi plain sucks. Not as bad as the prequels but definitely a bad movie. The entire Jabba section feels like a separate movie, the Ewoks ruin endor, everyone besides Luke has almost nothing to do of any importance. The spunky, headstrong Leia and cocky, cool headed Han are nowhere to be seen in this film. Leia is weak as hell in the movie, and Harrison couldn’t be phoning it in any more.
The main reason it sucks though is that the only thing of any importance in this film is the confrontation with Luke, the Emperor and Vader. They tie up the haning plot threads left by the Empire Strikes Back in the first section of the film, then it completely departs into a whole new section where we get the Luke and Vader stuff, which is packed side by side with a ton of pointless filler.
Normally, one will painfully bear through most of the film (which is filler) and wait for throne room scenes which are the most important when looking at this movie as the final chapter of a trilogy. And even that stuff sucks.
Remastered made ROTJ pretty good!
I only feel like fanedits can fix some of the more minor issues with ROTJ but I appreciate it! 😃
I didn’t say it sucked, just that I don’t like it hardly at all anymore.
Anyone else totally disregard people not liking ROTJ hardly at all anymore?
I think it’s fine.
For me, ROTJ really sucks. The Jabba scenes, the Ewoks, the Endor “battle”, the sister thing… Not to mention the poor direction (am I the only one to think that Richard Marquand was not a good director at all ?)
Not only does all this make the movie bad… but hey, it was the LAST episode, the conclusion: it was supposed to be the best movie of the trilogy, not the worst!
I was just a kid, and I remember how I was disappointed when I left the theater: the struggle of good against evil, the initiatory quest of the Force, the search for the father … all that ends with teddy bears, a bad dance group at Jabba’s house, Boba Fett that slips and dies just as “POOF”, and a hidden sister?
I’m not trying to compare the OT with the PT. But in terms of personal disappointment, ROTJ was much more disappointing for me - because I expected so much more.
16 years after that, TPM was not as disappointing for me. It was not up to expectations, but the dream was already broken long before…
am I the only one to think that Richard Marquand was not a good director at all ?
I found Jagged Edge a boring, predictable waste of 108 minutes, but I haven’t seen anything else he made.
I found Jagged Edge a boring, predictable waste of 108 minutes, but I haven’t seen anything else he made.
Did he make anything else ?
Anyone else think this site and fanedit.org make people scrutinize movies too much and suck the fun out of escapist diversion?
P.S. I love it here, but seriously, that aspect of the culture, it just…
Anyone else this site and fanedit.org make people scrutinize movies too much and suck the fun out of escapist diversion?
P.S. I love it here, but seriously, that aspect of the culture, it just…