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The Force Awakens: Official Review Thread - ** SPOILERS ** — Page 131

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adywan said:

imperialscum said:

If EP8 reveals that Rey is related to someone we already know, this will be downright ridiculous.

Then you must really hate Leia turning out to be Luke’s brother in ROTJ.

There is a huge difference between what ROTJ did and what new trilogy is doing. As being part of the same trilogy, it was ROTJ’s job to develop the concept of Skywalker family that was merely briefly introduced at the end of ESB (admittedly it overdid it with Leia but okay). On the other hand, new trilogy is shamelessly directly copying concepts from OT.

真実

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imperialscum said:

On the other hand, new trilogy is shamelessly directly copying concepts from OT.

Like using a crawl. Disney sucks ass.

…

What was worse was when they didn’t use a crawl. Disney sucks ass x2.

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darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?
The Death Star 3.0 ?
The Emperor 2.0 ?
The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?
R2.0-D2.0 ?
etc.

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TV’s Frink said:

SwissArmyTin said:

imperialscum said:

To continue the rehash tradition and expand it on trilogy level? If EP8 reveals that Rey is related to someone we already know, this will be downright ridiculous.

So if she’s related to a pre-established character, that immediately makes it a total rehash?
whut

I hate how there are lightsabers in TFA. Total rehash.

I think characters are part of a story that unfolds in a specific way.

Lightsabers are furniture of the Star Wars universe to be used by the characters as required by the story. Such as hyperspace, droids, the force etc.

TFA mercifully restricts their use to plot devices portraying them as quasi-mythical. Luke’s is kept hidden until discovered by Rey. Ren’s is custom made and a symbol of his character’s struggle to emulate his grandad.

If Rey is related to any previous character that really would be a major rehash, specific to the plot.

Better if she is random. She could be from a family that believed in and taught about the force. Such teaching may have become forbidden after Luke’s failure to train more Jedi without awakening the dark side in others. Snoke and Ren’s training would have the opposite effect in stirring the force to “awaken” in Rey - as well as guiding BB8 into her hands. Perhaps she can be the one that balances the light and the dark side within herself and so achieving what Luke couldn’t.

She definitely shows a few tinges of the dark side in the movie.

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NeverarGreat said:

Handman said:

Essentially snip out all the “Leia is my sister” bits in ROTJ and add the “There is another” line into that dream sequence in TFA and that’s pretty much all you can do to make that happen. A lot of effort for something small.

If Leia has real Jedi skills in Ep 8, this idea might not work as well.

Indeed, but Leia was established as being Force-sensitive in ESB, we can fiddle with what we get. The only bad thing is I really enjoy the Luke v. Vader duel in ROTJ, and Leia’s relationship plays a pivotal role in that.

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MalàStrana said:

darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?
The Death Star 3.0 ?
The Emperor 2.0 ?
The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?
R2.0-D2.0 ?
etc.

I don’t like this movie because in a universe where it’s been established that there are robots everywhere, they made new robots. It’s too much like the old one. They should have just reused the same robots. I also don’t like that the villain wasn’t born evil, and that the evil organization has a leader. What’s up with that?

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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MalàStrana said:

darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?
The Death Star 3.0 ?
The Emperor 2.0 ?
The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?
R2.0-D2.0 ?
etc.

At the risk of becoming a TFApologist I don’t feel these are as obviously lazy rehashes as you make out. The whole Star Wars galaxy revolves around the republic/empire/new republic and the central characters within those structures are the Jedi, rebellion, the Emperor and his accomplices/protagonists - namely the Skywalker family.

As these are episodes within one long story arc, it stands to reason you’d have recurring or related characters. There’s nothing to stop them making more standalone movies to explore other stories and characters.

I can imagine TFA’s era coming after a long period of retreat for the force itself. People still sense it but few can use it as fully as the Jedi could. The republic has outlawed it’s teaching and settled into a bureaucratic neutrality. The Empire 2.0 springs up as a reaction to this malaise. As in the real world, history shows old battles are re-fought throughout the generations, following periods of complacency.

The First Order shouldn’t be in the Galaxy dominating business if it ignored existing technology to blow up whole planets. Of course they’re gonna build another super weapon. It is a bit dumb that they still haven’t figured out how to protect it fully, but then it is just a plot device which the main story revolves around.

So Death Star 3.0 gets a pass from me due to how they implemented it in the film. Only just.

I do have problems with a couple of big things. Snoke is basically a bit rubbish. Mainly because of the performance/appearance. They really could have done without the CGI. It would have been way more effective and creepy as an animatronic or enhanced live actor. Same goes for Maz (Cantina?).

It did seem a little lazy to have another evil lord with a twisted face appearing by hologram. Snoke had zero motivation beyond just being wicked. Obviously this might be rectified in the next episode. Ren on the other hand is a rare thing - a villain that’s easy to hate, a great antagonist and a character with a lot of potential development. I literally have no idea where Ren’s story arc will end up.

Anyway TFA, with it’s flaws, is definitely a pretty good episode of Star Wars. Fun, likable characters told with humour. A well put together old-school space adventure told within a few epic landscapes. After years of comic-book crap, Transformers (and the prequels) this was a relief… Hope it lasts

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Handman said:

NeverarGreat said:

Handman said:

Essentially snip out all the “Leia is my sister” bits in ROTJ and add the “There is another” line into that dream sequence in TFA and that’s pretty much all you can do to make that happen. A lot of effort for something small.

If Leia has real Jedi skills in Ep 8, this idea might not work as well.

Indeed, but Leia was established as being Force-sensitive in ESB, we can fiddle with what we get. The only bad thing is I really enjoy the Luke v. Vader duel in ROTJ, and Leia’s relationship plays a pivotal role in that.

There’s the argument that Luke is the only one using the Force when he contacts her on Bespin.

Also, I prefer the interpretation (originally proposed on Star Wars Minute) that Luke’s mind immediately jumped to Leia as ‘your sister’, but his real sister was someone entirely different. Ben, knowing that the only way his real sister would be safe is if she stayed anonymous, played along with Luke in case his thoughts later betrayed him. Lyin’ Ben strikes again!

You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)

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MalàStrana said:

darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?

You mean a bad guy who aspires to match the greatness of his grandfather yet is dissapointed in his father and actually isn’t as bad as he wants people to think. He is so unique and different to Anakin. Just cause they are related and both have turned to the dark side is a ridiculous complaint. Anakin turned for completely different reasons than Ren and Vader is very different than Kylo.

The Death Star 3.0 ?

Completely agree here. This is one of my biggest problems with The Force Awakens.

The Emperor 2.0 ?

No problem here cause we haven’t gotten enough info. It really depends on how they flesh him out and his motivations. I think in the novel it says that he has been lurking in the galaxy since the Jedi Order was strong. He has seen their fall and the birth of the Empire. This is interesting and if it turns out he is someone like Plagueis who survived the attempt on his life by Palps then I would be very intrigued. Who knows though, he could just be a random baddie and then I would be a little dissapointed. All in all, too early to judge the character of Snoke. How much did we know about the Emperor in episode 4 or 5?

The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?

Definitely feel ya here. Though it works and sets the stage effectively for the story I would have liked to see something a little new here.

R2.0-D2.0 ?

Oh hell nah! BB-8 is wonderful! R2 is snarky and a smart-ass. BB-8 is really damn cute and charming. They are also very different in the aesthetic department. I thought BB-8 was actually one of the best new things that the Force Awakens brought us.

etc.

Overall I do agree that the Force Awakens relied on a few things too much. But it’s script, characters and execution was fantastic and that’s why I still really enjoy episode 7. But I consider almost all of the OT references in the PT to be distracting and illogical.

Return of the Jedi: Remastered

Lord of the Rings: The Darth Rush Definitives

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GigoloJoe said:

MalàStrana said:

darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?
The Death Star 3.0 ?
The Emperor 2.0 ?
The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?
R2.0-D2.0 ?
etc.

At the risk of becoming a TFApologist…

That’s actually a term? If anyone should be apologizing it should be Max Landis or something.

Also I guess I’m an OT apoligist because I refute the same type of arguments when discussing those films as well.

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Lord Haseo said:

GigoloJoe said:

MalàStrana said:

darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?
The Death Star 3.0 ?
The Emperor 2.0 ?
The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?
R2.0-D2.0 ?
etc.

At the risk of becoming a TFApologist…

That’s actually a term? If anyone should be apologizing it should be Max Landis or something.

Also I guess I’m an OT apoligist because I refute the same type of arguments when discussing those films as well.

There are no TFA “same type of arguments” when it comes to OT.

真実

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imperialscum said:

There are no TFA “same type of arguments” when it comes to OT.

…Jedi? Or are you just gonna turn a blind eye to the OT so you can hold them as perfect while shit-talking everything else?

What, a man builds a giant mound of dirt in his house and you aren’t entertained?

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SwissArmyTin said:

imperialscum said:

There are no TFA “same type of arguments” when it comes to OT.

…Jedi? Or are you just gonna turn a blind eye to the OT so you can hold them as perfect while shit-talking everything else?

Yes, he will, 'cause it’s what he always does and has always done.

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imperialscum said:

Lord Haseo said:

GigoloJoe said:

MalàStrana said:

darthrush said:
The Force Awakens just has fun lines of dialogue that throw back to things like the Kessel run.

The bad guy being a Skywalker who turned to the dark side aka Anakin 2.0 ?
The Death Star 3.0 ?
The Emperor 2.0 ?
The Empire 2.0 ?
The Rebellion 2.0 ?
R2.0-D2.0 ?
etc.

At the risk of becoming a TFApologist…

That’s actually a term? If anyone should be apologizing it should be Max Landis or something.

Also I guess I’m an OT apoligist because I refute the same type of arguments when discussing those films as well.

There are no TFA “same type of arguments” when it comes to OT.

I’ve seen people call Luke a Mary Sue…I have seen people say that Vader was a shitty villain in STAR WARS among other ridiculous claims. And beyond the claims themselves the hyperbolic nature of the arguments mixed in with sprinkling of half truths and lies are similarities shared by both groups.

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SwissArmyTin said:

imperialscum said:

There are no TFA “same type of arguments” when it comes to OT.

…Jedi? Or are you just gonna turn a blind eye to the OT so you can hold them as perfect while shit-talking everything else?

No point…He thinks ROTJ is just as good as ESB because OT. And yes, “because OT” is more or less his rationale for putting ROTJ on the same level as a genuine masterpiece.

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He also loves using his headcanon to explain away ROTJ’s stupidity, but gets supercilious and dismissive when others do likewise with TFA.

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SwissArmyTin said:

imperialscum said:

There are no TFA “same type of arguments” when it comes to OT.

…Jedi? Or are you just gonna turn a blind eye to the OT so you can hold them as perfect while shit-talking everything else?

There is no need to turn a blind eye to OT.

Lord Haseo said:

I’ve seen people call Luke a Mary Sue…I have seen people say that Vader was a shitty villain in STAR WARS among other ridiculous claims.

I see people being wrong all the time. Please do not get upset over nothing.

DuracellEnergizer said:

He also loves using his headcanon

An interesting term you have for the truth.

真実

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They should rename it Star Flaws seeing as they can’t make a decent film! Irvin will be rolling!

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IP55 said:

They should rename it Star Flaws seeing as they can’t make a decent film! Irvin will be rolling!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, you’re amazing.

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