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scruffy_looking

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30-Aug-2004
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16-Mar-2017
Posts
34

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Post
#67000
Topic
Star Wars, The Beatles, and the desecration of our cultural heritage
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/67000/action/topic#67000
Time
Orusaka,
I enjoy Let It Be Naked too, to a degree, but I prefer the Get Back bootleg. I understand it's simply a matter of personal preference. Just to clarify, noise reduction, particulary NoNoise, is not needed, nor is it really intended, to make things sound clearer (as in hearing more detail in a guitar riff). It's generally used in the hopes of making things sounds cleaner, as in getting rid of tape hiss. Very similar to the use of edge enhancement on DVDs. Problem is, when you get rid of tape hiss you also lose other high frequencies that make up the ambience of the original recording. LIBN just sounds too sterile to me.
But what really bothers me is that it was marketed as the "Beatles original cut", when it's nothing of the sort.

Again along the lines of the SE and Lucas's refusal to release the OT....these new mixes and experiments would be easier to digest and would be of more interest to fans if the original mixes of the original albums were properly released first.
Post
#66904
Topic
Star Wars, The Beatles, and the desecration of our cultural heritage
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/66904/action/topic#66904
Time

Hello everyone,

I'm so glad that this site exists, and that there are others who feel the way I do about the O-OT and film preservation. I've been lurking and making a few replys here the past few months, but this is my first real post of substance.
It may seem rather off topic, and I apologize for the length, but I actually think it's a subject very relevant to Star Wars and our cause. It concerns the recorded output of the Beatles, and how their recordings have been treated in the digital age...

Whether or not you care for their music, The Beatles are undeniably one of the most influential and creative bands ever. They changed the course of popular music in much the same way that George Lucas and the OT had a profound influence on cinema. What non-fans or casual listeners don't often realize, is that the Beatles were particulary innovative and forward thinking in the use of studio technology. They were the first band to sit behind the mixing console, and after a few years of recording they gained complete creative control over the engineering of their albums, and proceeded to break practically every rule.
Just as the experience of the OT is about much more than just the story and dialouge, the music of the Beatles is about much more than the songwriting and lyrics. Instrumentation, recording techniques, effects processing, editing, and especially mixing were all creative elements to which the band paid close attention during most of their recording career, and which factor in significantly to the artistry and emotional effect of thier music.

So where am I going with all this? Well, I'm drawing a parallel between the original master tapes of the Beatles and the original theatrical cuts of the OT. They are absolutely equivalent. Sure, the O-OT has multiple "authentic" versions (70mm, 35mm, pre-ANH, etc), but likewise the Beatles made at least two different "official" mixes (mono and stereo) of each of their songs. Each set of works also exists in a tangible analog form which has probably already been backed up digitally, but which remains largely inaccesible. And both have been seriousley f**ked with in recent years.

The saga of the Beatles catalogue in recent years is remarkably similar to the special edition/2004 dvd fiasco....

--the respective hardcore fans and amateur historians know that the OT theatrical cuts/Beatles original mixes are the truest and best representation of the artists original vision, and have great cultural/historical significance.

--these original versions are available to most people in vastly inferior formats. OT fans can find VHS copies fairly easily, and Beatles fans can hear a good deal (but hardly all) of the original mixes on CDs that haven't been upgraded since 1987(seriousley, the last time they properly remastered the albums for CD was 1987!) More dedicated fans own higher quality, but less practical media: laserdiscs of the OT, and mint condition Beatles vinyl.

--the O-OT and the Beatles original albums are being replaced with revisionist products in the name of "upgrading", and most buyers haven't a clue. We all know about the 1997 SEs and the abhorrent 2004 DVDs. WEll, as far as Beatles releases, the initial CD issues in the 80s left many things to be desired, although they at least released the original stereo mixes of about half the catalogue.
But the last 5 years have been gloomy for purists: a completely remixed Yellow Submarine soundtrack (sounds punchy and "new", but takes creative liberties), The Beatles "1" collection (excessive use of noise reduction and sloppy remixing to the point of incoherency at times), Let It Be Naked (more stifling use of noise reduction, use of different takes and new edits being passed off as "the beatles original vision"), and new 5.1 surround mixes for the Anthology DVDs (interesting, but it's kind of like adapting ANH to a circle-vision theatre). Meanwhile, the original mixes, and for that matter the original catalogue, that is the 13 albums recorded by the Beatles, have recieved no attention. EMI, the record label that owns the Beatles recordings, has a horrible track record which would indicate that any future remastering of the original mixes will be botched.

and...

--George Lucas has gone nuts and has lost his creative edge. He's surrounded by yes-men. Two of the Beatles are dead, their original producer has lost most of his hearing, and Paul and Ringo are in no condition to make artistic decisions about music they helped to record 30-40 years ago. The Beatles recordings are largely in the hands of young EMI staff now. Enter the fans...

This is where it gets interesting and even more relevant to originaltrilogy.com. I frequent a site called bootlegzone.com. Although members there discuss unreleased and rare recordings, a large part of the forum is dedicated to the aquisition and preservation of the original Beatles mixes. There are several "bootlegers" who have obtained mint condition, high-grade vinyl copies of the entire catalogue, and then made meticulous transfers to the digital medium using high-end equipment. For the cost of postage and blank CDs you can easlily obtain these transfers. The sound quality blows away anything that EMI has officialy issued on CD, and more importantly the original mixes are preserved in a medium that's easy and inexpensive to copy and distribute. Sound familiar, O-OT DVD owners?


Sorry for such a long post, but I guess if you read the whole thing, you find it interesting. I'm terribly sorry to all the OT-ers who aren't Beatles fans, but I think the paralells here are revealing. I find it very interesting, and encouraging, that when the "big guys" fail to preserve or make available an important work of art, there are average Joe fans ready to step in. Technology has made this a lot easier and more effective of course. It's just sad that such important cultural milestones get treated like sh*t. Does anyone know of any other "grass roots" preservation projects like this, or important artists/works that have gotten seriousley stiffed in a similar manner?




Post
#66861
Topic
New thoughts about getting the OT on DVD
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/66861/action/topic#66861
Time
Hi Lethe,

your idea, specifically the mention of how much money Fox could make on the o-ot, made me think of a whole new problem. Since Lucas/Fox/whatever is oh-so-cleverly, and dishonestly, marketing the 2004 DVDs as simply "the original trilogy", I think the general public would be rather confused if the "original theatrical cuts" were finally offered for sale. The average movie watcher, not realizing how altered the new DVDs are, might think "the original theatrical cuts" are some kind of rarity, something only film historians would be interested in, since after all, the "original trilogy" has already been released. In other words, the current marketing and packaging of the 2004 editions essentially denies that they are different from the original films, therefore reducing the neccesity (as perceived by the public) for theatrical cuts.
Unless there is considerable coverage of the changes made in the commentary and documentary features (is there?). Even then, these are still things the average Wal-Mart shopping DVD consumer may never watch anyway. Because of all this, I could see Fox considering a release of the o-ot to be risky and not widely marketable. Regretable, this is
Post
#66633
Topic
Using the '04 SE DVD version to restore the Original (with lots of info)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/66633/action/topic#66633
Time

Naturally, this is of course just a project we're doing in-house to practice the art of compositing and color correction, as no exhibiton or distribution of such a project would be legal.

nudge nudge, wink wink, right Mike? How can you possibly get all of us drooling and then say we can never watch the final product?
When you get this thing done, I'll send you postage and 3 DVD-Rs. Maybe a fine cigar too. Now that's not illegal, is it?
Post
#62531
Topic
The tauntaun stiffy thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/62531/action/topic#62531
Time
Ok, hands down, the most awkward line has to be in ANH, shortly after the Falcon arrives at the Death Star.
Vader orders the ship to be searched. Then he pauses and says "I feel something. Something I haven't felt in....", and then he dashes off like he's about to burst in to tears. It's just so out of character and out of place, it cracks me up everytime.
Post
#62029
Topic
The 1997 SE's - My take
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/62029/action/topic#62029
Time
Quote
Originally posted by: Klingon_Jedi
Quote
Originally posted by: Luke Skywalker
i agree with Pagz completely...
except for the new song at the end...

my take on that end song was not so much to end the trilogy... but it was actual music the ewoks were playing...
i mean you see them with drums and all this other crap...
so i always envisioned that as a celebration song that the ewoks were playing in respect to celebrating...

unless they had an orchestra tucked away in one of the huts we didnt see... i still prefer "yub yub"
i feel it suited the scene much better...


Finally! I thought I was the only one that preferred "Ewok Celebration". By the way, Buddy-X-Wing, I don't know what animes you're referring to, but the new music sounds in no way japanese to my ears. I have noticed the William's latest stuff has been lacking.


IMO, the new music was an absoulte travesty! It sounded like frickin' Kenny G! I'm glad others agree that was a bad change, because I've seen too many lists like this, where fans despise most of the changes, but then say "the new music was an improvement though". How? Not only is it out of place with the rest of Williams's score, but it completely fucks up the mood of the last scene, and therefore the end of the trilogy, at least for me. I prefer the intimate feel of the Ewok celebration over the galactic rejoicing montage nonsense. That galactic celebration belongs at the begining of episode 7, if anywhere...