The Windu-Palpatine fight is so bad in so many ways but primarily is bad due to the over reliance on close ups of Ian McDarmid to cover the fact that he wasn't agile enough to pull off the fighting.
I threw in Ady's as a quick comparison. In the shot I chose there's a blue shift in the SE and Ady colored it to look more like the GOUT which is grey.
Too bad that there isn't a better broadcast ESB and ROTJ. If you really scrutinize it the smearing on the Reivax isn't too horrible in motion. Still frustrating though.
+1
IMO the 04s no matter how much work is done to them never look right if you're trying to match to the 97s exactly.
TRIFORCE89 said:
Wow, that's great. The grain is apparent on the text in the begin, but the rest of it looked pretty good in motion.
That's video noise. It's present in mine as well. On D_J's the "A Long Time Ago" title card has some scrolling noise as well. Mine has a lot of haze.
Wow, this sample looks very nice, and actually holds up to the broadcast version quite well and doesn't have that awful smearing. The IVTC (this does have it right?) and quality looks very nice without losing any of the color saturation. I compared it against my own cap of the LDs on which I didn't do any color work and left things as-is. It stays true to the source.
D_J, out of curiosity what was your workflow in doing this cap? It looks very nice and destroys the 16:9 one I did in FCP and Compressor.
I did a quick screencap of all the 97s I have on my HD and one of Ady's color corrected for comparison:
DJ's LD cap:
My LD cap IVTCd and scaled to 16:9:
A avi I found of a PAL 97 LD cap:
The Reivax 97 ANH from the digital broadcast tape:
and Ady's color corrected 2004 AVCHD for reference:
none said:
The individual who worked on the 2004 DVDs, his impression is it's a chunk of missing data. Either in the digital file or a HDCam-SR submaster tape. Not knowing what that format is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDCAM The format had an initial introduction in 1997 (Special Edition timeframe) and a SR version in 2003 (just before the DVDs) this is a possibility for the loss of data. Maybe the tape they used got a crinkle and the Humdinger came into being. But if LFL did work 100% with harddrives then this theory is incorrect.
That would make perfect sense. Lowry doesn't work with tape now, but they may have used tape at some point in the workflow process back then as they weren't as high up as they are now. Or maybe there was some tape transfer at LFL since they must have bought all of the HDtapes in existence for shooting EP. II and III.
If the glitch was introduced in tape form then it would go onto the master stored digitally and that would be why it is still there.
I freaking hate those HD tapes. All of the pains of digital video tapes magnified x1000.
Just watched the OHMSS LD.
Oh gosh, does this film get better every time!
The last time I watched this was in a screening room with the old SE DVD last year. This beats that despite the lesser resolution. The colors are properly balanced unlike the SE which was boosted and edge enhanced. But the big draw is the fact that to my knowledge this is the only fully uncut version of the film. As FF has previously said, the dialogue is in the right places (even Tracy's line "How do we get out?") and all the scenes are in the right order. The sound is really great on this digital track and boy was it a treat to hear OHMSS in PCM!! The score shines even brighter and the subtle nuances of the dialogue are well heard as compared to the lossy Dolby 2.0. I compared this to the DVD and I think for the most part the two used the same source. The SE disc in the SE boxsets supposedly had the errors corrected so I guess that means another one to track down.
This one is stunning though. As one of the later pressed titles (1991) it comes off better than the 89 discs I have and closer to the superior quality Connery collection pressings (1993). And the side breaks are very well done.
I'll have to dig out my 1995 letterbox vhs to compare any differences.
They probably sent over the video master and that was re-cropped to 2.35:1 for the PAL release. From my knowledge this is typically what would happen. It's usually minor differences like this and is most likely the case since the two are so similar. Since the mark/hair is in the same places I'd definitely bet that it's the same video master. The thing still is why it's so blocky. Because of this I first thought it was damage.
Yes. It's darn near perfect in a "real" (or should I say "reel") sort of way. Give me a battered print reduction any day. It's something tangible and has life and breath on a screen-even if it's a bedsheet.
Then again this is coming from a guy who gets excited over reel change markers. ;)
I now also like mouse droppings!
However these get out, it will be worth it. The V3s alone are the end-all versions in SD. To know that these Blu editions are in the pipeline along with Puggo's ESB and ROTJ is awesome.
Wow. I am very impressed with what Ady was able to do with the color correction. What is now possible is a darn near perfect looking film sourced ESB.
I hope you do release the work version Puggo. I still highly enjoy the non-corrected editions. Some of the tinkering ideas already presented here are imo worth checking into.
AND THERE WILL BE A RETURN OF THE PUGGO!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!
Take that freaking Blu-ray!
I remember now that the red lights on the elevator are extremely muted when Luke first comes into the throne room at about 1:25.
Also, is it just me or do the engine lights of the fleet do this odd little jumping and flashing when coming into the right side of the frame on the edge of the cruiser window at around 1:22:58? It's in the GOUT too.
American Hominid said:
Would you like to play a game?
Great, but hard game. One of the few that actually feels like Star Wars.
I just moved and am un-boxing my EU books. And will reread all of them....again...
The Illustrated universe book is very good. I found a battered former library copy and it really holds together in the text. The binding not so much anymore.
It's Luke's X-wing which the previous shot cuts to (he's walking to it-away from the Falcon in the storm). They started to fade in that flash effect to transition to the Blu-ray art for the end of the tag and in the transition the first frame or so of the next shot are visible.
Of course we would have to go through this frame by frame. ;)
I'm surprised at the quality being presented, but then again I'm surprised that we're seeing these at all.
Bingowings said:
General Anatol Alexis Gogol says :
Adywanski Blupoppoff is Russian film editor.
He has poisoned tipped Tom O'Connor novelty golf umbrella.
Did someone seriously just reference General Gogol out of the blue!?! I always knew I was on the right forum...
INXS-Devil Inside
Hasn't everyone? Everybody loves Scooby's snacks....
For the most part I didn't see any garbage mattes. It looks really good overall.
The ones I did notice:
-In the middle of the fleet jumping into hyperspace shot.
-A little barely visible here and there during the speeder bike chase.
-Around the edge of the Death Star, especially noticeable around 1.25.42
-Around the Death Star when the fleet comes out of hyperspace.
-In the tail end of the shot where Lando first approaches the Star Destroyers.
-In the TIEs through the Falcon cockpit shot
-On the Falcon at 1.36
-TIEs inside the Death Star at 1.52.50ish
-Executor plunging into the Death Star.
-Luke flying the shuttle out of the DS.
They really will be more noticeable during bright frames or flashes (laser blasts, hyperspace, explosions) and movement.
Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:
But seriously, now that Harmy's set has come out, the only thing that could get me worked up is if LFL actually restores SW from an original 70mm print. Now that would be worth getting worked up about.
Ah, but then you would have a restored version that is from a cropped source. 2.35 to 2.21. ;)
I'll admit that in my dreams of planning the ultimate OOT set, the 70mm version is Disc 2.
What is this glitch though? The Lucas Barcode?
Harmy said:
Thanks a ton :-)
I already noticed and fixed no. 4.
I'll look into the matte boxes but the thing with those is that I must increase contrast in order to get rid of them and when you increase contrast, you loose detail in both dark and bright areas, so you can only do it to a point.
Shoot me a PM and I'll give it a look. The garbage mattes are my biggest gripe on any version and really jump out to my eyes. Absolutely ruins the shot of TIEs in the Falcon cockpit. Their diminished presence on your other Despecializeds were really great.
Technically speaking, the GOUT will always win due to the image being at a better encode and from the video master used for the LDs. And the original 77 crawl was spliced in from a print.
But they just aren't that exciting. Especially when it comes to the canned standard Dolby 2.0 audio. I like the LDs much better. For the OT it's either the 93 or 95 Faces discs. The 95s are really just more convenient with less sides and some will argue that the CLV is slightly inferior to the CAV format.
Without the changes and Mos Eisley pink shift, the 97 LDs are stunning for the format.
And if you really want to get down and dirty, the Japanese Special Collections don't have the awful motion smearing on the 93, 95 and GOUT.
So it all depends on what you like the films to seem like, and how much you really like LD.
Kurt said:
Especially the binocular & Anchorhead Luke scenes shouldn´t ever, NEVER ever, be included into STAR WARS.
It messes the structure up badly,
Unless you wanted the movie to be "American Graffitti in space", or make a visual companion to the radio drama. (Anchorhead that would be right up your alley...;)
Luke acts like a douche,
Hey! You could have broken this! He just seems a bit more whiny but at least where this is coming from is understandable.
and it doesn´t work as character introduction.
It can, but it does wreck the flow established by the editing team.
Unless..you wanted to restore the award winning, heart stopping, positively electrifying: Rough Edit!
INXS-Listen Like Thieves
This is really a fun underrated record from a really underrated band.
It seems that most every restoration that gets done for DVD will get further tweaks and changes for the same master being put on Blu. Especially those involving Lowry. Now that we know the bad frame in ANH is still present, it looks like they just tried to take out some of the "darkness" inadvertently created when pushing everything up too high in 04...kinda reminds me of the things done in 1993. How things never change!
This is definitely exciting. Especially all of the audio tracks in lossless codecs!!
I just hope no one at LFL sees this and decides to make an HD GOUT themselves... ;)
