captainsolo

To clarify a bit on the above talk for GF and TB:

All pre 1995 releases had the original 1965 mono mix which had the manta ray line with the other differences and the ending cue was Thunderball. The 1995 remix somehow unearthed the alternative mix and stereoized it by simply laying in the score in stereo which can be overpowering. All later 5.1 releases use this 2.0 matrix mix from the LD boxset, and finally the UE and BD added the original mono back as a lossy alternative.
The 1989 LD has the mono and is a bit color boosted but is my favorite. The Connery Collection v2 is the same master. The CAV LD box is the same element used and is of course improved in PQ, and was recycled for the late release THx CLV movie only disc that adds an ac3 bump. This was ported for the SE DVD.

While I grew up with the remix differences and it took me a while to get used to the mono-I now only watch with the mono. It’s far more accurate and a better mix. I have no idea (and neither does anyone I know of-even in the Bond community) as to the origin of the alternate audio but my guess would be a test 70mm mix or perhaps differences between UK and US audio mixes on the original release.

GF has an interesting video history. The Criterion release is a different look and feel and seems like it was done right from an old Technicolor print. It has the snipped frames intact from Oddjob turning off the highway. It has the original mono. The first MGM widescreen attempt was more open than the Criterion and used a different source that was more stable so I’d assume it was some sort of interpositive. The MGM was 1.6 or so whereas the Criterions were all 1.75. However the first go round looks a bit contrasty and not vivid like the Criterion. This is found in the Connery box 1 and the standalone reissue with original art. Then for the CAV LD boxset they made a new master with much improved color grading and PQ-but it is the same source element. I think in many ways these were done like the 2001 boxset as a way to fix the flaws of the prior CLV movie only disc and make a nice big collectors CAV boxset. The CAV set is my personal favorite edition of the film even though I acknowledge the Criterion is likely closest to the original release look. The boxset is 1.66 and has mono but on the MGM discs the title song is replaced with the stereo version from the soundtrack master. Also on the MGM versions those few damaged frames are snipped out when Oddjob turns off the highway.
As evidenced by another OT thread the rumored 003 bomb countdown was actually in original December 1964 British release prints both 35mm and some 16mm prints. Apparently the 007 clock was spliced in to some prints and put in all remaining UK prints before being in all the Us prints for the film’s 1965 US premiere dates.

Like all the non-scope Bonds for the SE DVD, GF was cropped to 1.78:1. While this is still around the safe limits for framing flat matted widescreen the SE DVDs did crop a bit too much on all five done this way and the 1.66 is the best ratio for the initial three in terms of composition.

At this point I just want to be the EON archivist because apparently they have all kinds of stuff floating around like mag stereo for OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TMWTGG-the 70mm YOLT that only played in Japan along with the other 70mm blowups rumored to exist, the mono for TSWLM and the list goes on…

You’re right Silver, but they could have used him well and built up his strength with audiences over the course of the film in the way Jabba was in the OT.
At this point a halfhearted animated Shadows of the Empire adaptation would wipe the floor with anything they’ve yet done.

nl0428 said:

Fang Zei said:

I want to say there was a Star Wars novel with that title as well, but that could be my memory playing tricks on me.

There was one. I also have a novel that was released as promotion for Revenge of the Sith’s release about Obi-Wan beginning his exile on Tatooine called, “The Last of the Jedi”.

Last of the Jedi was actually another 10 book YA series written by Jude Watson and as usual despite the ending kinda being obvious was a better written and told tale than anything Disney has yet done. It directly picks up from the Jedi Quest series which went between TPM and AOTC and this series is between ROTS and pre-ANH.

VHS and LD copies particularly when viewed on a CRT screen do hide some deficiencies in the master but not all. Those formats are also very player dependent as all are not equal in their output quality.

However as someone who owns the major releases on VHS and LD I can say:

The older master done for the JSC and released on VHS in the widescreen collector’s box and on LD as the Fox Special Widescreen Editions are far better than the later versions based on the Definitive Collection master as they have none of the issues with drained color, DVNR and motion smearing. I have done many comparisons between formats over the years as I picked up new variants. The VHS copies are quite good for that format but the letterboxed ones while properly formatted lose a lot of detail since the resolution is eaten up by letterboxing bars.

But the Laserdiscs are the only way to go if wanting to watch older copies pre-GOUT. The audio is full PCM and while VHS hifi Dolby surround can be great it still won’t compare to full 16 bit 44.1 khz PCM. If you’re sticking to this era then I would advise the Fox original widescreen discs as you save a lot over not getting the original Japanese discs. The Definitive set is nice and full CAV but has all the DC master problems and most boxes have rot issues. The Faces sets are better due to not having rot but are CLV and some are Super NTSC encoded.
That said even though the older master is a tad soft, the DC and Faces are noticeably softer even on a CRT screen and I personally hate the motion smearing and washed out look.
I grew up with seeing these over and over and always wondered why different rental copies appeared so different to one another.

Lastly Laserdiscs usually originated masters in the pre-DVD era and then that master would be ported to the VHS release.

Unfortunately the plot twist of ESB casts Ben’s motives and statements in ANH into an entirely different light than what was originally said, shot and intended.

But if you look at the original film without any connection to the sequels it is merely that there is some sort of story there that Ben harbors some guilt or emotional weight over and this must have either been a direction given, or something Guinness picked up on and either did on his own or very likely asked George. I’d say that originally it would be like any child asking how a parent died who had done so unjustly-and your response would have to be carefully crafted and spoken whilst bringing up painful memories.

It is unfortunate that the sequels have undone parts of Obi-wan’s characterization and thus became the standard lore.

I do think that Alec’s performance is so full of delicate intricacies and is agonizingly underappreciated. He later regretted the sheer amount of attention he got over this one role but it’s really a masterful performance-even in a career peppered with ones that define the craft itself. As a huge Guinness fan, I always find myself remarking at just how developed his role is past what is on the script page. It really is one of his truly great roles and is the one thing that really carries the film in terms of being the central strength for everything to work from. The inspired part in casting was not simply finding a name star but to approaching a master well known for finding character intricacies and then making each part feel as if it were lived in.
My only regret is that Tarkin is not given more screentime and that we didn’t get a confrontation with Alec and Peter Cushing getting to work together.

That said, I do think Alec would have likely done a few things a bit differently had Obi-Wan’s fate been decided earlier on.

Wow that’s really nice. I’m really excited for this one as Jedi Apprentice is some of my favorite SW storytelling period.

Dang, most arthouses post the screening formats. I’d assume it would only be 35mm prints of the 1997 SEs and then DCP for the rest. That said 35mm for TPM would be essential due to the bad HD master.
I would love to see a TPM print on the big screen with the Dolby EX track and the SEs again.

The question should be what happened to the Anthony Daniels Wonder Column? 😉

This can either be really good or really not so good. But with it being made for TV during this explosion of the medium I think it could do very well if not overridden by the company and allowed room to breathe.

Fingers crossed. I wish there had been gameplay but we really need a decent SW game these days. EA should be ready to make up for the fallout over BF2 so we shall see. I get some Last of the Jedi vibes because of the story setup and sort of a bit of Force Unleashed since your character is apparently a lone wolf.
I will say this is a better trailer than the Ep9 one.

But the Darth Maul inclusion is just so stupid. It really is. Now this is all coming back to me. Why in the world did they do that other than someone in the development said hey that’s a cool idea. (Which is what happened, but IIRC it was Kasdan’s son with the idea.)
You know there is Prince Xizor and Black Sun and so much material to mine there…aaand you just picked Darth Maul 'cause everyone always thinks he looked cool.

The making of looks more interesting than the film itself. I will admit I found Solo the least offensive Disney release to a hardcore SW fan, but it was a bland waste of time overall that never found a consistent tone or knew what exactly it wanted to achieve other than being an origin movie.

Disney seemingly thought that they could rush out SW properties in the Marvel method and people would flock to them regardless. And it’s not working. So Episode 9 is really going to be the turning point for the future of SW and how they will go ahead.

It’s an okay title. For years my own title for my dream Obi-Wan film has been “THE TRIALS OF KENOBI”. The Rise of Skywalker is at least a big improvement over The Last Jedi as a title. TLJ should have at least had “of the” included.

But to quote Eliot Carver: “lacks punch don’t you think?”

I agree that many SW games are really not up to their own potential and that there has been a real dearth of any games recently after the demise of Lucas Arts. The best games are the ones that really capture the spirit of the films and try to break new ground in gaming.

My personal picks for the best home games are:
Dark Forces series, specifically Jedi Knight, Jedi Outcast Jedi Academy
Rogue Squadron 1-3
Battlefront I and II 2004-2005

And though I’m not a fan of the style of game, KOTOR is really great. I never did play the sequel.

I never got to play past the demo of Republic Commando but it seems like another great game. I missed out Bounty Hunter and only played the Clone wars PS2 game at a friend’s house once. I also never played Super Bombad Racing, Racer Revenge and the Xbox exclusives but otherwise I’ve at least tried or beaten every SW console released game. I grew up with the Rebel Assaults on PC and have only recently gotten to play around with the X-wing series if I could get it going on my modern PC without hassles.

I tried the new Battlefront 1 when it was on sale on the PSN store for a few bucks but the load times were so insane I found the game unplayable. There are many saying that BF II is now much better but I don’t know if it’s something to try since I thought the fan boycott of EA over the lootbox issue was pretty justified.

The new BattlePod arcade machine is pretty interesting but doesn’t really take much skill. It’s really more of something to dazzle you with the graphics and booming chair speakers and since the design has an inverted screen it’s again more about the wow factor.

Ultimately the best Star Wars game ever made is still SW Trilogy Arcade which I still play at every opportunity and dream of one day owning. Finding a mint machine without problems or a jacked up joystick and then nailing all 15 secret options on a perfect run on one credit is still an absolute joy. Of course in 2019 all I ever find are busted up machines and thus I can’t get that perfect run and always miss one swing with Vader augh!

This post has now made me want to go and play all the SW games I haven’t yet.

I will say I did quite like the ROTS game despite the repetition because it was the first SW game in that style of gameplay that actually worked without any major problems. To me it was like Jedi Power Battles that was playable and worked.

Oh god, Jedi Power Battles…good lord now there’s a HARD game!

Sounds great. I need to finally get the season Blu-rays. I did manage to find the pilot film Blu-ray which goes for silly prices as it went out of print.

I had long ago reached the point of not wanting anything to do with Disney Wars, but bit the bullet and watched the trailer after not being able to get away from the “Palpy’s back!” internet hype.

Soo…I have no idea what they’re going for here. I really don’t. As soon as you hear Palpy’s laugh (Which I totally agree 00Jason-it’s placement is very 1980 Ming-like) my brain is going are they pulling Dark Empire out on us now?

I have no idea how a part of DS II ended up on a planet other than Endor’s moon. The theory about Endor itself is probably more likely unless it’s somehow a piece of DS 1 that got to another moon of Yavin. My own thought was that it’s perhaps an abandoned Imperial development facility much like the one run by Admiral Daala from the EU Jedi Academy trilogy where they developed the original Death Star and then eventually the Sun Crusher and that over the course of the film the characters will stumble across the old birthplace of the DS and then very likely the bit of Palpy if they haven’t fully brought him back as a character.

I do think Palpy is very likely back in a sense since the dumping of Snoke in TLJ. I guess this is how they felt they should proceed without their original main villain.

I just don’t know where they’re going with all this and it seems they don’t either. I don’t know why they wouldn’t have an overall game plan before starting a sequel trilogy but I’ve always felt these new films have had an appalling lack of context or connection with the previous films.

Lastly, was anyone else bugged by the use of a standard TIE howl for an obviously advanced prototype new Interceptor variant? 😉

Here’s my two cents.

As always we have to speculate endlessly due to a lack of reliable information, communication or any news outside of the usual snippets here and there. Ever since the 2012 sale there is apparently no legal reason why the OOT cannot be presented so it would make little sense to not begin a 4K restoration. Combined with the fact that no SE version exists in 4K and neither do the added effects, it becomes even more necessary for a product maintenance standpoint in terms of the company’s mind to make a new 4K master from the original elements in order to have a new presentable version for all 4K platforms and future events etc. The 97SE could be scanned in 4K but the VFX added were somewhere around 1K at the time as far as I can understand it so they will not hold up. Otherwise you only have 1080p for the 2004 and 2011 editions.

When the footage included in Rogue One popped up of original Battle of Yavin elements incorporated into the film that was the clincher for me as being the one bit of proof that Disney was very likely already working on some type of in house restoration project if only for archival purposes like many of their other restorations that are still unreleased even years after completion.

I do think that 4K is on the horizon for Star Wars in some form and that it will be a version of the OOT. Of course all we can do now is speculate. But knowing Disney’s usual methods of Blu-ray presentation and video mastering etc. I would assume that eventually we will be presented with a rather well done 4K OOT without alterations a’la the restoration of Mary Poppins and the new version will have a 5.1/7.1 mix probably based on the 70mm mixes. It has been stated in interviews that LFL has all the theatrical tracks digitally archived and available for usage but I’m sure we won’t get those on disc sadly and if we do it will only be as a lossy extra track perhaps in a more deluxe box set version.
I would worry about the color timing though since Disney and others still let teal and other color infusion happen even in new remasters. (AOTC went a bit green on the Blu-ray.)

I’ll bet that they’re having a VERY rough time with AOTC and ROTS due to them being early digital shoots. TPM should and CAN look great outside the soft digital elements. I will say though that my memory of the theatrical showings I saw on the original runs all were great. I wish I could remember technical details more clearly but I saw TPM opening week in Dolby EX, AOTC and ROTS on midnight releases, AOTC in 35mm several times and the IMAX version. I do remember being surprised when the video releases came out for each at how much more obvious all of the digital work and effects were. It looked much better on 35mm but I didn’t see any of the DCP showings of either one.

So in short, I think it is coming at some point-but the chances of getting what we should have in the form of a Blade Runner style set with all versions available for fans should they choose to buy the complete box set are very slim. (Not to mention that even though I adore that set and waited outside the local Best Buy day of release to get a copy-it isn’t perfect and standardizes the archival versions a bit in the way that I think the OOT would be on 4K UHD. And now WB has only done the Final Cut in 4K leaving the other versions and all the extras stuck in the old disc forms.)

This makes me really want to finally sit down and watch the entire show run. I saw the pilot film after its release and found it okay, but never saw the series while it aired. Later I became an Avatar fan so I really must get to it.

Thanks so much for compiling this. This brings back a lot of memories and all good ones. This site long ago became the heart of SW for me and still continues to be.

It didn’t sell. Finally found some more info.
http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=001566

So apparently early release prints did make it out with the 003 seconds. The last poster mentions his IB tech dated December ‘64 has 003 seconds.

I never knew this was on release prints. You learn something new every day. So apparently we just need to look for either UK orignal prints or very early 1964 prints. All 1964 prints should be UK ones anyway because the US release date wasn’t until 1965.

Ok, so that ebay listing is really odd. I have no idea what the source is.

Well, the OHMSS one is the only one that ever appeared in any release versions. It was quickly recalled and replaced with the Thunderball credit. It is unknown how many prints were released with OHMSS listed or if it was only the premiere engagements.

IMDB is not an accurate source to use as it is frequently full of user posts that merely repeat urban legends etc. No version I know of ever had 003 seconds shown as it was Harry Saltzman who insisted they need to go back during editing a replace it with the insert of the counter reading 007. It was so late in the game there was no time to adjust Bond’s line about the three more ticks.

I have never heard of the blip of Bond and Pussy escaping the plane being missing. The shot and music cue is timed to show that blip of escape at exactly the last second. The only difference I might expect is in the end credits akin to Thunderball where some versions might have Barry’s ending music instead of the title song. (TB has Barry’s Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang in a custom instrumental in the regular mono and in the remix with alternate dialogue there is the JB theme slapped on.) Of course this is merely me speculating as I think they had early on decided to drop Barry’s end cue for a reprise of the title song.

I’m really wanting to pick up the new BD reissue to finally see this. It’s supposedly the Fox BD with the dvd extras added.
Does the HD master make any changes that we know of or is it relatively fine?

This is the same rumor that went around saying early video editions of FRWL contained the cut “What a performance!” line by Grant on the train and the reference by Bond in the end sequence that was hastily cut out which causes the jump edit and degraded footage that still remains to this day. It doesn’t as Aluminum Falcon found out when he bought a VHS copy.
I have some of the early LDs and am starting to try and get early tapes as well and as far as I know they did one master and the early jackets/covers carry the white text UA logo which then became either CBS/Fox on later issues or carried a MGM/UA logo on the packaging. The transfers are all the same. They were done for Fox to release and begin with the 20th Century Fox fanfare and a voiceover: These United Artists features brought to you by Fox etc. The reissues were primarily to update the packages with the correct logos after the legal stuff made CBS/Fox a reality and gave them video distribution to the UA catalog as this was during the mad reign of Kerkorian where UA and MGM were all over the place before being run into the ground with insane abandon.

As Silverwook indicated it is only the early CEDs that seem to have differences, such as the YOLT CED has the trimmed ABC TV edit for some strange reason.

I’ve heard of some of those edits before and then others not at all. I would presume these were ones requested by the British censor which Peter Hunt would have to comply and argue for just like the others. Usually the US censor would only then ask for another trim or so but usually was only concerned about sexual innuendo etc.

Wow! I’ve long wanted to hear at least the original mono for the original film but this going the extra mile! Currently I only have the LD and BD boxsets and despite the stereoization the LD 2.0 stereo tracks obliterate the new remixes. They’re largely mono with stereo score insertion but can pan to the sides at times as you mentioned on MF.

I’m interested that the LD reissue of MF sounds different as I thought all the individual releases were ports of the boxset discs.