Just looking at your re-cut ending, I'm really excited about this cut. I loved the official release of TMNT, but it really did feel a bit sloppy in a lot of ways, and there was WAY too much exposition. Return to New York looks very promising though!
*snicker*
BTW, I love the new lightning on Palpy.
Octorox said:
Bingowings said:
Not bad, he looks enough like him to get the idea across and he is a fun actor who could have given the role the necessary coldness.
Nobody seems to care that Ewan doesn't look or even sound exactly like a younger Sir Alec.
If they were serious about putting Tarkin in the prequels they should of written a role for him and hired someone like Nighy who could have played him without OTT make-up.
you have to admit Ewan wasn't a bad match though
Dang, the resemblance truly is uncanny!
Personally, I prefer how "young Skywalker" sounds from a dialogue standpoint anyway.
tehwallaby said:
Timstuff, great job. Are you going to do AOTC Jar Jar as well?
I'd love to do fan edits / dubs of both TPM and AOTC, although I need to find time to do it and I'm planning on taking things one step at a time. I've got a big animation project that I'm working on for school so I don't have a whole lot of time to work on side projects with ATM, however it is definitely something I want to do as soon as I have some free time to do it with.
vaderios said:
here is my try to match the neckpiece of vader's in ROTJ. also as bonus and only i made him with pale skin( like murphy from robocop lol)
No more sith eyes :)
-Angel
I love what you've done with the repositioning and I think it would work perfectly. But as has been said, I think that the recoloring of the skin is a bit counterproductive. In addition to my thinking that it doesn't really match the scene, I don't really think it makes sense for him to be pale looking at this point. The guy just had his ass dragged out of a volcano, so I think it makes sense that he look red and pulpy as the movie showed. He hasn't had a chance to heal yet, so his skin would look red and raw since he's been terribly burned just recently. In ROTJ, we were seeing what Vader looks like after spending 25 years in what's essentially a walking hyberbaric chamber, so by then the redness would have gone away and he'd look pale, as he did. I think it's important that during the masking scene, Anakin's face looks like he's just been dragged through the pits of hell, not like he's been in recovery for 25 years.
brash_stryker said:Not desecrating *my* childhood as such, but making so that the next generation who watches the films (in chronological order) will miss out on the impact we had.
It's kind of impossible to avoid having the twist ruined now, anyway. Here's a fun little factoid: I had the twist ruined for me when I was a kid, when a kids' magazine made a joke about it (this was sometime in the early 90's). It didn't stop Empire Strikes Back from becoming one of my top 5 favorite movies of all time (if not the top), not did it keep me from appreciating what a shock it was for Luke's character. It's true that I was robbed of experiencing the shock value first hand, but seeing as that shock value would be lost on repeat viewings anyway I don't really care.
If someone wants their kids to have the same Star Wars experience they did, then they should be watching the series in the 4,5,6,1,2,3 order anyway. And that's assuming that it's even possible for either the parent or child to have not had the twist spoiled already before having seen the movie.
How is it desecrating your childhood if you already know Vader is Luke's father though (as 90% of the human population probably does)?
Darth Venal said:Okay, let's agree to disagree. I also have three very distinct memories from being just under two years old, and I can remember where they were and who was in them, but I still don't have a problem with the Leia dialogue because I'm not taking it too literally.
Leia never recalls a single actual memory of her mother, so to me that is perfectly fine. Anyway, moving on...
I know that this explanation isn't acceptable for some people, but I think that Leia's is able to remember Padme because of her force sensitivity. And as you mentioned, she says no actual memories of Padme, only images and feelings. This is one of those "problems" that only really occurs if you've become so used to intrepreting something a certain way for 2 years, and then when it turns out your first assumption was wrong the new explanation doesn't make sense.
If someone was watching Star Wars chronologically from beginning to end and heard that line, they'd hear "she died when I was very young" and "just images, feelings," and they wouldn't have any trouble grasping that it probably something to do with the force. When most of us heard "she died when I was very young" so many years back though, our first inclination was that Leia would have been about 2-4 years old (at least, that's what it was for me), so when we're presented with something completely different, it seems like a contradiction. It's actually a contradiction of how we originally interpreted the line, though, and that's an important distinction to make.
My personal opinion is that trying to conceal Anakin becoming Vader is pointless, because you can't get around the fact that Obi-Wan lies to Luke about Darth Vader killing Anakin. If you try to cut out Anakin's final transformation from ROTS, then it makes it look like Obi-Wan killed Anakin, lied to Luke about him turning evil, and then blames it all on Darth Vader who to the viewer's knowledge wasn't even around back then. Basically, instead of us getting the sense that Obi-Wan lied to Luke for his protection, it makes it look more like he was being an ass.
On a more personal notes, seeing Anakin turn into Vader is one of the reasons I went to see Episode 3, and the same can be said of a lot of people who went to see it. I mean, it was one of those things I wanted to see since I saw Return of the Jedi when I was a little kid, right along side Anakin's duel with Obi-Wan. I can understand that some people want to preserve the shock of learning that Vader is Luke's father, but I just don't see how that can be done without undermining the purpose of the prequels.
I mean, if people are that intent on making Star Wars viewable in chronological order while keeping all of the surprises and twists of the classic trilogy fresh, then you may as well cut out the downfall of Anakin altogether, which really kind of begs the question: why even have prequels in that case? To paraphrase Yoda, "dangerous this path of thought is." I honestly don't think ROTS can be the best movie it can be if it's going to lose one of its most iconic moments, which really the entire trilogy had been building up to.
If not the Kaiburr Crystal, then perhaps it's some other precious Gungan artifact that ended up in the hands of humans? Perhaps the pearl of some gigantic, deadly Naboo sea creature?
brash_stryker said:Another vid. This time showing Dooku exhibiting a bit of remorse so that he seems more like a Jedi fighting for the greater good.
Gunray and Poggle will need to be either composited into the shot with Dooku, or the shot of them laughing removed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onooMQABtcg
I love it!
The thing about Luke and Leia being born on Dagobah is, it's a perfectly plausible edit-- things like making Anakin's transformation to Vader a secret or keeping Padme giving birth a secret are both rather tricky business, and might not turn out convincing even under the most skilled of hands. However, Dagobah is quite doable from both a practical and technical POV. All that needs to be done is create a new establishing shot of the Tanative on the planet's surface, and have us hear some quite voices from inside to transition us to Obi-Wan talking to the medical droid, who says that they are losing her (not that she's lost the will to live).
Personally, in my ideal cut I would still have the transformation of Anakin and the birth of the twins in the movie. Yeah, it's a huge spoiler for the original trilogy, but I'm OK with that. The prequels are meant to be the story of Anakin's transformation into Darth Vader, and if you don't want the backstory spoiled than your best bet is to watch the saga in its release order rather than the chronological one.
Are you a PAL user? I heard PAL speeds up NTSC since it runs at a faster rate.
The idea of the twins being born on Dagobah actually makes a lot of sense-- Lucas should feel stupid for not thinking of it, because it offered a perfect explanation for "there's something familiar about this place." If Leia can remember her mom, then Luke can remember Dagobah. ;)
It sure beats the cheese out of being born on some no-name asteroid cluster that just so happens to have medical facilities.
I've been toying around with ideas for what reason Jar Jar might be banished for with my version. I really liked Magnoliafan's explanation that he was supposed to guard the "Kaiburr Crystal," but he fell asleep and it got stolen by human thieves. It tied in nicely with the ending, and set up where the resentment between the humans and gungans came from.
A more scoundrel-ish explanation that I heard someone suggest a long time ago in a galaxy far far away, was that Jar-Jar got caught in some illicit activities with Boss Nass's daughter, and was promptly kicked out of Theed. I had some ideas for some dialogue that I thought were amusing, although I'm not sure how appropriate it'd be for a Star Wars film so I may end up just borrowing Magnoliafan's Kaiburr Crystal explanation. Also, while the concept of Jar-Jar and Boss Nass's daughter amused me, the fact that we'd never see her would be problematic.
"I know you're just humans, but you shoulda seen 'er! Built like a mermaid, that girl is!"
Well lookie here... I was able to find the preview images that Magnoliafan made. These are a pretty good demonstration of the concept I think.
I heard that Magnoliafan was planning on having a "cameo" by Neeson at the end of his ROTS edit, but unfortunately I'm not sure if it's actually coming out. It seemed like a pretty solid concept though-- place a voice-over from one of Neeson's other films in there somewhere, and place a ghostly shot of him at the end, when Yoda says "someone from your past has returned from the beyond" and remove the stuff about giving Obi-Wan meditation exercises to practice to communicate with him (since Obi-Wan can already see Qui-Gon with his own eyes, and that line didn't make sense anyway since Luke could see Obi-Wan with almost no training).
Yeah, if Dooku wasn't really evil, it would probably leave Obi-Wan asking more questions about which side Qui Gon would have chosen. There's not any way to directly convey that in the movie, but it's part of something wonderful called SUBTLETY, something which the prequels could stand to use more of anyway! Also, another reason a green lightsaber would be great for Dooku is that it'd reinforce his connection to Qui Gon.
I really like the idea that Dooku isn't really evil-- he's an idealist who sees the corruption in the Republic, and is trying to do something about it. One question though: would the connection between him and Sideous be removed completely, as in the scene where he meets up with Sideous at the end is gone? I have mixed feelings about it. On the one hand, it would show that Dooku is playing both sides, which keeps his true motives a bit more ambiguous. However, on the other hand, if he really is an idealist it's possible that he under no circumstances would lower himself to working with a Sith, even if he's going behind Sideous' back. I'm not really sure which way it should go, but also I did like that there was some foreshadowing to the Death Star in Episode 2 (though I do feel like showing its construction in ROTS was unnecessary and chronologically sloppy).
True, and it would also bring some more weight to Anakin's feelings that he shouldn't have killed Dooku. I mean, if he was a Sith there's really not much way around it-- Sith = bad, and Jedi need to fight them. If Dooku is a rogue Jedi though, then it does bring more weight to Anakin's decision to kill him-- like, was Dooku really wrong for joining the seperatists, or was he simply following his Jedi beliefs in a way the others disagreed with? Since he had a red lightsaber in the movies it pretty much removed any moral ambiguity from his character, but giving him a blue or green saber would restore it.
Hmm, I suppose your right. Some of the reaction should stay, but the faint is what pushed it over into cartoon territory. It's not like it would be difficult to put in a wipe that cuts away right before he faints, either.
Brimley said:
Also, I believe your dialogue is just what this film needs- an arrogant rogue character, but perhaps more cowardly (think Han Solo meets Ash from Army of Darkness).
Speaking of neo-Jar-Jar's cowardice: in the scene where Boss Nass tells Jar-Jar that we will be a general, rather than being a general, Boss Nass simply tells Jar Jar he'll do great in the battle, and Jar-Jar says "wait, I'm going to to be in the battle!?" and then he faints. :D
Hehehe, nice. And I love how "Lando" gives his 2¢ at the end. :D
Thanks a lot Angel! Maybe my misspent youth making movies with my Star Wars action figures wasn't so misspent after all. :)
Something to keep in mind if I decide to pursue these recordings further, is that my school has a professional recording studio that would make for much better audio on a DVD. I actually recorded this scene in my car, using the microphone that came with Rock Band with a paper hood taped over it to reduce popping and crackling. It got the job done, but if I decide to do it all, I'll probably do it at school so I'll have that all-important DVD quality sound.
Let me just start off by saying I loved how Magnoliafan was able to re-imagine Jar Jar’s character in his “Balance of the Force” and “The Clone War” edits. Jar-Jar’s role in the saga has always been and is destined to always be that of the fool, however now instead of being an baby-talking, mentally challenged nitwit, he was an arrogant smart ass, which not only made him much less annoying, but genuinely entertaining. He was able to fill the same function as the original, and yet was able to do it in a way that didn’t make you want ear plugs.
The issue I had though, was that Jar Jar was essentially speaking jibberish, and his character was defined solely on whatever we read at the bottom of the screen, and it stretched believability to think that all characters in the movie were fluent in Gunganese. His character didn’t quite feel complete, and I always felt like if the goal was to truly do him justice, you’d have to record a new voice for him using a new actor, rather than just garbling up the foreign language tracks from the official DVDs. Since today was labor day, and the concept had been nagging at me all weekend, I figured I’d stop imagining about it and see if it was actually possible to sync some a re-imagined Jar Jar’s voice to the original. My recording equipment sucked and the picture quality didn’t come out too hot, but I think it demonstrates the concept effectively:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiGyJB7-LpA
So now, the big question: is my new Jar Jar voice an improvement, or is he more annoying than ever? I’ll let you be the judge (don’t worry, I can handle some tough love).
