Kexikus

Hal 9000 said:

That’s… a very not bad idea. Good call with the cut shot of Leia. I’ll hunt around for dialogue for Leia, if people would like to send clips of themselves yelling out, “Will the Republic send the fleet to help?” Or something like that.

The biggest problem would most likely be the footage to use during the “Will the Republic help?” line. In V1 there are three shots that were cut, one of Poe, one of Leia saying that they are the target and one of 3PO. The Leia one could possibly be used for her new dialog and I’d keep the 3PO line if that idea is implemented. That leaves a (very short) shot of Poe that could be used. The problem is that having this question asked from someone off screen would probably look pretty terribe 😕 So we pretty much have to reuse a shot of one of the minor characters and give them new dialog unless someone has a better idea of course.

I agree with Hal. The fact that no target is mentioned in the briefing scene implies that the Resistance simply doesn’t know what the target is going to be. But since they or the Republic are the only logical choice, they would rush to prevent it anyway.

However, I think that it would help the narrative if it is shown that the Resistance is actually trying to warn the Republic and hopes to get their help. That would be possible by inserting the deleted scene in a similar fashion to what NeverarGreat proposed and possibly by using a suggestion I made before that has someone asking if the Republic will send help during the briefing scene. If the proper audio could be found, we could use the cut shot of Leia right before 3PO’s line about the Republic fleet to have her answer that question with “No.” or “No, they won’t.” Then we’d only need to get a shot where we could have someone ask “Will the Republic send help?”. I’d place the added lines right before Poe says: “We’ll go in there…”

That latest video looks very good to me. It’d be better if Poe said “their weapon system” but it’s already a great improvement over not knowing why Finn is so important to the Resistance.

This looks quite promising actually. Poe’s voice needs to be modulated a little more since his added sentence still sounds unnatural and the cutaway to Leia is definetly too short.

The thing is, I wouldn’t want this canon change in TFA. So even though it looks promising as I said, I’m against this change unless some other random location can be added instead of Hosnian.

Your latest version seems to be overdoing it so unless something more accurate but as short as the “return to power” can be found I’d go with that.

And I’d cut the “her brother’s” in the third paragraph. I can’t tell why, but it feels out of place to me and since the crawl ends on the fact that she’s looking for Luke, I don’t think it is necessary to mention him twice in the paragraph.

@ NeverarGreat: That’s actually pretty good! I’d definetly remove the wipes as they just don’t belong there (we have neither a transition in time nor in space), but the way you put together those two deleted scenes makes them work really well. Maybe it’d work better after Finn and Poe’s reunion but I’m not sure without seeing it placed there.

They return to power since they form from the remnants of the Empire and the Empire had power.

NeverarGreat said:

The SKB sequence is complete, as far as I’m concerned, so it’s ready for final render 😃

On another note, the final shot of the film has bothered me since my first viewing, since it weaves and bobs drunkenly. I scaled it 107% and stabilized it: https://vimeo.com/201330286
Password: stable
Full quality:
https://mega.nz/#!bUVzlQ7Y!Sw0THl1J_Wtgtrq_bbTvydGVmAgNLBph959eCgMddVs

What do you think? I know it’s not strictly related to the edit. 😃

Well done! Now the shot finally looks as epic as it’s supposed to be 😃

That’s great work with the sound!

My only issues were that the Falcon seems too loud the first time it appears, overpowering the music while I feel it shouldn’t. And the collapse of the planet should become louder and not stay at a constant level for at least the big sequence of the Falcon leaving the planet but maybe it could even be subtly heard earlier.

If I didn’t know the vanilla sounds, I’d probably say that this is pretty much perfect. But as you said yourself, the implosion sounds for SKBs destruction would be better. Everything else is great though.

Damn, I liked the first version of your new crawl and then Sir Ridley came along and pointed out that it was implying that Leia knows about SKB… This is a good point though since your second paragraph bascially makes it impossible to mention SKB in the first one. Not sure what to do about this since I don’t want to loose your second paragraph^^

I’ve probably said so before, but I think that TFA would be a much better movie without SKB, focusing instead on the search for Luke to drive the story.
When I first saw the movie I felt the same as Hal, where I really liked it up until SKB came into play. And while this edit fixes some of SKBs problems it also introduces new ones as the base basically appears out of nowhere in the third act.
Having it mentioned in the crawl and then seeing it every once in a while in the earlier parts of the movie would probably make it feel more coherent for the hypothetical first time viewer.

One thing that came to my mind while I typed the above is the following: How does the Resistance learn of the existence of SKB in this cut? The Hosnian system being destroyed was a pretty obvious “Hey look, we have a superweapon.” in the theatralic cut but in the new version they seem to just know of SKB but for some reason didn’t attack earlier.

The new crawl is definetly a big step in the right direction. I have some suggestions though:

Write “has secretly risen from…” instead of “has risen in secret from…” as I think the latter sounds weird. To me it feels like the “in secret” is connected to the Empire that the FO has risen from, but that might also be because I’m no native speaker. I’m also not sure about the “fractured Empire”, but your explanation does make sense, so I’d say it works.

I really like the second paragraph except for “combat” in “convince the New Republic to COMBAT this emerging threat.” I think something like “convince the New Republic of this looming threat.” would sound better.

And I quite liked the “whereabouts of the last Jedi” in the last paragraph but I just noticed that your wording is actually from the theatralic crawl, so I’m fine with it^^

NeverarGreat said:

Here’s a new version with the lightsaber shot. 😃

https://vimeo.com/200702407
Password: music

The music timing here is really great! So if someone were able to add proper sound effects to the scene, I am in favor of using this.

Sir Ridley said:

Hal 9000 said:

Could you post a clip? I’d be interested to see how it does with the music, before I get all my tools laid out again.

Will do.

https://youtu.be/NQ_r1ttBWhM

There’s a small hiccup in the audio 11 seconds in, but that’s a bug of some sort that can happen at an audio transition when exporting 5.1 surround to stereo, I’ll get rid of it later.

And also, Chewies arm can be seen briefly at the edge of the screen and he is seen in the crowd shot as well. Perhaps this could be covered up, to make it seem like he went straight inside.

Crop out Chewie from that one shot and it’s perfect.

Hal 9000 said:

I’d be in favor of this. This project is a restructuring of the SKB plot, and so there’s no need to apologize for proposing suggestions related to it.
I’ve posted before about a née crawl, very similar to the original one, that includes a few political descriptors. The First Order rising “in secret,” and Leia “failing to convince the New Republic of this looming threat…”

I quite like that.
But there’s still the question of where to put the Leia and the Resistance scene since the Takodana sequence is quite short and also seems to take little time in universe. From what I can tell, all the Takodana scenes take place back to back 😕

Sir Ridley said:

About the Maz’s castle attack scene, here are the changes needed (as I see it now):

• Lone Star Destroyer
• Alternate music and sound
• “They’ve found us”

Optional:
• Remove sunset TIE shot
• Regrade outdoor scenes to evening/sunset
• Change Maz’s line “Those beasts! They’re here.”
• Put back cool X-wing shots from trailers in the battle

I tried the Kylo shuttle idea, it looks fine but doesn’t really work after all, so I’m on board with only the Star Destroyer. I’ll revise my edits and see what we get.

I think the regrading is a pretty cool idea and it’d allow us to keep the sunset TIE shot which is pretty cool, so I vote for that.
As I said before, I’d keep both of Maz’s lines.
And I wouldn’t put the trailer shot back in as there is a similar one in the movie and putting it in would require to add music and sound which would be a lot of work and would disrupt the original score. So I think there isn’t enough benefit for the problems is causes.

Now that we only have the Stardestroyer in the scene I think that my proposed music (heard in Sir Ridley’s mock-ups) is no longer a good choice for the scene. Instead we need something more menacing but not an action theme. Any ideas?

Also, I’ve thought about improving the Republic-Resistance-relationship. Maybe that’s outside of what this edit aims to do, but I think that the restructure allows to do this much better than the theatralic cut. So here’s what I think could be done:
First of all, the crawl could be written a little better in this regard to show that the Republic is not supporting the Resistance but instead hesitates to do anything.
Then in the briefing scene have someone ask: “Will the Republic send help?” and someone else (ideally Leia) would answer: “No.” Then 3PO would have his “Without the Republic fleet we’re doomed.” line and the briefing would go on.
And a little later, probably before the Falcon arrives at Starkiller Base we’d insert the Leia and the Resistance deleted scene where Leia sends Korr Sella to try and persuade the Republic once more. The one problem here would be that Korr would have to teleport to Hosnian Prime in order to be there for its destruction^^ So maybe that scene has to be placed earlier, but I don’t know where.

I agree that “They’re here.” doesn’t make any sense if we see TIEs or Kylo’s shuttle.
But if it’s just the Stardestroyer then it fits perfectly as was only informed that the FO has arrived in orbit and now notices that they are in fact “here”.

I also think that “Those beasts.” makes perfect sense as a reaction to the FO bombarding the castle unprovoked.

I would actually keep both lines in the new context.

I’d say either it’s just the Stardestroyer and both the attack force and Kylo shortly behind it left the destroyer earlier and are arriving unseen. So the Stardestroyer is just there to oversee everything and to keep ships from leaving.
Or the Stardestroyer arrived in orbit and now the full attack force (TIEs and Kylo behind them) are coming directly at the base. The FO, just like the Empire, isn’t really one for surprise attacks I’d say.

But having Kylo and the attack group taking a different route really doesn’t make any sense to me.

And since having only the Stardestroyer works better with the reactions of the bar patrons I vote for using that version.

In the end though, it wouldn’t be difficult for anyone to build whatever version he/she wants since it requires only the replacement of two shots (that is if the VFX for all versions gets done properly and it looks like it will^^).

Then again it doesn’t really make sense for him to turn in the original cut either. The only reason why he would are the distant shouts so that should work just the same in the new cut.

Edit: I’ve also been thinking about where to put the deleted scene and so far the only place I found is after the brief cut to Kylo searching for Rey and right before the Falcon’s landing approach on Starkiller base. But I have to admit that I’m not convinced it’ll work there but I wouldn’t place it any later since it would disrupt the final act and I haven’t been able to find any earlier place for it.

Why not just use “It’s the First Order. They found us.”?
I think that’s pretty much perfect since it explains what that Stardestroyer means (in case the audience doesn’t get it) and also continues their earlier discussion that the FO is probably able to track the Millenium Falcon.

Now that I’ve seen the shot with only the Stardestroyer I think that this is the best solution. It explains why nobody is panicing since there is no attack incoming yet but it also gets rid of Kylos shuttle approaching from a different angle. So the attack isn’t really meant to be a complete surprise attack but the FO wants to hide their true intentions until it’s too late.

Having the Stardestroyer shoot a ship could work but I think it’s not necessary. It would provide a good reason for Finn to look up but I never had any problems with that. You could also add a little crowd noise that makes him wonder what’s going on and so he turns around and sees the destroyer in the sky. And since we have “They found us.” instead of “They’ve done it.” anyway we don’t need a reason for the latter.

About Leia’s hair: It looks like it should be possible to digitally remove the braid which would make it no more noticeable than Kylo’s backhead in the Snoke scenes. But even if it’s not, I think that this continuity error is a small price to pay to have this scene in the movie.

Sir Ridley said:

How about Kylo and TIEs but no Stardestroyer?

I’d have to see it but the combination of a shuttle flying directly at them and a surprise attack is what feels off to me. Not having the Stardestroyer wouldn’t change that and also it looks very cool.

NeverarGreat said:

Awesome! So glad to finally find some sort of solution. 😃

JEDIT: Here’s close-to-final sequence, from the launch of the shuttle to landing:
https://vimeo.com/199415784
Password: kylo
And here’s the uncompressed avi of the final sequence with a few more tweaks to the movement of the shuttle:
https://mega.nz/#!nM9ACJ7L!FREhN8pIrmzOy6y9u6Hr1PzpzIRi0J4dJjzRmk6mIqo

I just used the original movie edits, so obviously it will need dubbing at the very least. Beyond that though, cuts are really subjective. I suppose the Apocalypse Now TIEs can go, but ‘Those beasts!’ sounds about right considering the surprise attack.

What do you think? Should Kylo have a TIE escort, or is he more brazen than that?

The ship movements looks unconvincing to me. An actual 3d model with animation would definetly look better here. Also I think the shuttle should be farther away and moving slower since it would arrive way earlier than the TIEs in this version. And I’d add the TIE escort simply because the Empire and the First Order like to show their military power by giving escorts to everything^^

Ultimately I’m not sold on the idea though. It does fix several issues for sure but it also lets us know very early that Kylo arrives which we don’t know in the original cut at that point. And I also find it a little unbelievable that the First Order would launch a surprise attack and at the same time have a Stardestroyer clearly visible in orbit and a shuttle coming right at their target. I personally have more problems believing that than seeing the bar patrons not running away immediately when they see the TIEs. But I guess that comes down to personal preferences and if necessary I can always edit the TIEs back in for myself^^

Sir Ridley said:

I like how the new cut order makes the attack more fast paced, what would you say is your main issues with how things unfold now?

I agree that how Finn sees the ships (moving down) compared to how Rey sees them (moving straight ahead above the treetops) might be a continuity issue. Perhaps NeverarGreat could make a mock up of the idea with Kylo’s shuttle?

For me it’s actually too fast. The second part of the Rey scene feels too short and generally the Rey scene shouldn’t be chopped apart at this point I think.
I prefer to give Han and Finn some time to reach Maz and go to the cellar where in this new cut the TIEs are there pretty much instantly after they first spot them.

And I wouldn’t call that a continuity error since (in the original cut at least) Finn sees the TIEs at a great distance making there descent to the planet’s surface. The next time we see them is about a minute later when they are making there attack run. They can easily reach the surface some hundred meters away from the castle and then attack from there.

NeverarGreat said:

That’s the thing though: Kylo’s shuttle ISN’T the first ship to leave the Finalizer, it is implied that the other ships were launched first and approached stealthily from a different direction while the shuttle approaches under the auspices of peaceful negotiation. The TIEs would still arrive first and wreak havoc as in the final film.

With this idea, I’m just reconciling the fact that the TIE fighters and landing craft seem to approach the castle low and from over the forest with the fact that in this edit, the Finalizer is almost directly overhead or at least over the lake somewhere. In every version of this edit, there is a slight continuity error because of these facts, which this idea solves.

And as I said, the current version doesn’t have any outstanding problems (apart from Finn’s line change which I assume will be in version 2), however with this idea there is no need for the patrons to flee at all, since the shuttle flanked by two tie fighters would not be seen as a hostile action.

Okay, I get it now. That version would definetly need the original cut order we had but if someone could make the effects for it I’d definetly be interested in seeing it. Still not sure if it’d work better but trying won’t hurt 😃