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Imhotep

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Post
#1434515
Topic
Fall of the Republic - The Clone Wars/Revenge of the Sith NCC (V2.1 Released)
Time

This is a great edit, really enjoyed this. The difference in style was a little jarring at first, but well worth it for the quality Clone Wars content. Using NFBisms edit for ROTS is an excellent choice, better matching the tone of the Clone Wars. Your interweaving of the two plots is well considered, not simply smashing the two films together but taking care to bring the narrative arcs into one.

I was interested to see whether this approach could help spice up the dull sequence of dialogue scenes on Coruscant, in what I take to be Act II of the film. As much as I enjoy the deleted scenes typically added in edits, their addition makes this part of the film even more dreary; for me your edit succeeded in this way, as the addition of the Siege of Mandalore as a B plot really helped balance out this part of ROTS.

It feels like your edit is feature complete at this point, still I made some more specific notes, so take or leave them as you like:

  • I wonder if some trims could be made to the Clone Wars content, for example in the tunnels under Sundari and with Maul’s carnage on the ship.
  • Would you consider a restructuring of Padme’s ‘Seeds of Rebellion’ deleted scenes, moving the first scene to the last position in the sequence, so that the formation of the rebellion becomes the conclusion of this subplot?
  • It’s more a problem with the CW/ROTS canon, but this edit made the contradiction obvious to me; should the plot point about Anakin being on the council but not granted the rank of master be cut, since in the CW he is master to Ahsoka? Though I’m unsure whether such a cut would disrupt or clarify the overall plot here.
  • I miss the classic style of the planetary landing to open the film, and wonder if the holo-call between Grievous and Sidious could be moved and used for this purpose?
  • The intended significance of the ‘ruminations’ scene at 1:59:40 was lost on me in this edit, though bookending it with Ahsoka’s scene works well. Maybe consider adding some voiceover here as an internal monologue for Anakin, to make explicit that his fear of losing Padme stems from having lost both Shmi and Ahsoka?
  • Are you still looking to add footage from Tartakovsky’s Clone Wars? I would be keen to see your approach to integrating this content as well.
  • Would you consider any footage from the first episode of Bad Batch? Not sure where we’re at with spoliers for this, but there’s only one scene I can think of that could be useful.
  • 3:30 makes for a long movie, a simple intermission title card may help with this. Maybe after Maul is captured at 1:38:40, one intermission should be enough in my view.

I wish the dialogue about Ahsoka from the unfinished Utapau arc could somehow be used in an edit like this. Having Obi-Wan and Anakin discuss Ahsoka’s absence from the A plot would really cinch things for me. Cinematic Captures did an admirable job remastering the scene, but for a ROTS+CW edit maybe the animation style of Forces of Destiny, with the Temple Dojo setting from S1E11 ‘Teach You, I Will’ would fit well. Probably not a feasible addition, and certainly well beyond my abilities, but people wonder about the best use for that unfinished scene, and for me a ROTS+CW edit is the ideal place for it.

All up, this is an excellent edit; a fine and unique addition to the ever expanding canon of ROTS edits.

Post
#1433450
Topic
The Prequel Radical Redux Ideas Thread
Time

I wonder how hard it would be to alter the shot in TPM where Maul falls down the shaft, so that he doesn’t split in half? As good as Maul gets in Clone Wars, it still bothers me a little that Lucas so obviously killed him and then went back on this. Could also add the ‘Kenobi!’ scream from Rebels here, just to make clear that he’s not instantly killed by the strike.

Post
#1433444
Topic
The Clone Wars: Refocused - A complete series edit. [OUT NOW: 2/5 seasons + 7 episodes + 4 bonus] [CURRENT FOCUS: S3 then polish]
Time

Got around to writing up some notes for the most recent episodes. I’m still making my way through your Season 1, but I’ll get to that a bit later.

Bail’s scenes in S1E1 are a little quick, I agree, but I appreciate their inclusion as (afaik) this is the only time Bail actually fights in the Clone Wars on the battlefield, and not only in the Senate, so substantiating ANH where Leia says her father fought with Kenobi in the Clone Wars.

S3E1, Politics of War

  • In the crawl, in the second sentence, consider ‘fearing further escalation’ instead of ‘fearing the existence of others’. For the second slide, ‘Impressed with Padawan Tano’s teachings on Mandalore, Padme aims to further her political education. / With the Senate in debate over new Banking Clan loans for additional troops, Padme’s Loyalists plan their response. / Coruscant is as perilous as any battlefield…’
  • The omission of Dooku and Grievous from the bomb droids plot is good.
  • The transition at 11:30 is good, but the added audio seems a bit loud.
  • Consider cutting Dooku’s line, ‘and then some’ at 15:10.
  • Interpolated frames at 17:28, 21:46.
  • The transition to the bomb droids plot feels a little jarring without the original set up; perhaps some of the prior shots of the bomb droids infiltrating Coruscant (excluding Grievous) could be added here, if the transitions work, or restored to their original position?
  • Where Padme is attacked walking home, I think scene works well in the context of the edit; due to being positioned between scenes of her at work and home, and that her clothing is the same as the prior scene. The transition at 23:45 is a little quick, but I understand the limits of the scene, and the edit does work. The voiceover is great, giving Padme a necessary moment of introspection, though perhaps the voiceovers should start a little quieter, like whispers in the mind? I wonder if the shot of the rodents fighting could be restored, and the wide establishing shot moved to the beginning of the scene? Though I imagine you removed that shot of the rodents because it didn’t work with the voiceover. Removing the original lengthy chase sequence is well done here.
  • The scene at 25:00 reads to me as the first time Padme has asked these kind of questions to a common citizen of the Republic, implying that she doesn’t usually talk to the people, though Tekla says she does, and that this is the sole conversation Padme bases her following speech on. I wonder if some dialogue trims here would help to make this seem a more usual conversation for Padme?
  • I miss some of the drier politicking scenes from the beginning of Pursuit of Peace, but I understand why you cut them. The other cuts are good, removing the subplot of Bail ‘maybe’ speaking and then not speaking works well.
  • Great use of content from Senate Murders, your approach here is good. I don’t see how any more of that episode could be of use without harming the plot of Pursuit of Peace.

S3E2, Revival

  • In the crawl, in the fourth sentence consider, ‘The monstrous brothers MAUL and SAVAGE pillage defenceless worlds, burning a path through the Outer Rim territories.’ Capitalise ‘Masters’ in the fifth sentence? For the sixth and final sentence, ‘For Kenobi’s suffering, Maul’s is a patient hatred…’
  • I don’t have a problem altering the episode name even when you’ve made minimal cuts. Like the crawls the title is just another way for an editor to recontextualise the original content, and ‘Revival’ is a little confusing, since it seems to have no relevance to the episode, or it’s placement in your third season. That said, I don’t have any ideas as to what could replace the original title.

S3E3, Umbara

  • In the crawl, from the third sentence, consider ‘The people of Umbara resist Republic invasion on two fronts; against the orbiting armada and in the alien jungle below. / General Kenobi assaults the Capital, yet the besieged Umbarans hold out, their defense endlessly resupplied./ To sever their supply lines, Anakin’s 501st Clone Legion, led by Captain Rex, searches desperately for the remote Umbaran airbase. / But in war, no plan survives contact with the enemy…’
  • The abridgement of the opening battle feels a little quick, perhaps I am just used to the original pacing. I miss some of the other content from Darkness of Umbara, though I understand wanting to speed things up here, since the real content of the arc is in the latter episodes.
  • I am unsure of the scene outside of the airbase at 23:30, between Fives and Rex. I’m not sure this scene works with timing and location of the adjacent scenes, it may be best to cut it if possible.
  • Cutting the training scene from Plan of Dissent is good, but I miss the dialogue where Fives tells the other clones about Anakin giving him the idea for the plan to attack the Separatist supply ship.
    -Should 5s speech at 34:40 be cut? It seems unnecessary to make these obvious themes so explicit, and the scene may move better without it.
  • I wonder if the clones killing each other could be an accident, purely from bad intel, with General Krell being more a hard-line proto-Inquisitor than Separatist traitor. Then Rex’s arrest of Krell is a kind of rehearsal for Order 66, and more a question of the division between Jedi and clones. It would require some dialogue cuts, and might not work too well, but it could be a more interesting approach than having Krell as another moustache twirling Separatist conspirator?

All up, those are three excellent episodes to begin your Season 3. I look forward to what’s next!

Post
#1428516
Topic
<em>The Rise of Skywalker</em> - Rewrite Discussion Thread
Time

Thanks for creating the thread, RogueLeader. It’s been great to read everyone’s take on TROS, you all have some excellent ideas on how to approach this. I’ve been running an alternate Episode IX RPG campaign for my brothers, so thought I’d post my notes for the first session here as a sort of script rewrite, though it’s more of a scene outline as I improvise most of the dialogue. I’ve attempted to combine the best elements of Abram’s TROS and Treverrow’s DOTF, with some of my own additions.

Evacuation of Cloud City

The function of this first sequence on Bespin is twofold: to reassert that the rebels fight a defensive war against First Order aggression, and to set up Leia’s death in an appropriate and dramatic way.

Objectives:

  • The First Order (FO) seek control of the Tibanna gas exports from Bespin.
  • The Rebels are impossibly outnumbered, and must evacuate as many people as possible before they are forced to concede control of Cloud City to the FO.

Factions:

  • Bespin administration; squadron of Cloud Cars, local security guards.
  • First Order; their fleet is composed of two Resurgent class Star Destroyers, AAL troop transports, FO AT-haulers and AT-MT walkers, and squadrons of FO TIE fighters and FO TIE bombers; will be reinforced by a FO Siege Dreadnaught (from EP8) during the battle.
  • Leia’s vanguard resistance cell; her fleet is composed of two Virgillia class Corellian corvettes (from EP8), resistance transports (from EP7), I-TS transports, and squadrons of T-Wing Resistance bombers (call the B/SF-17 heavy bomber from EP8 the T-Wing), T-70 X-Wing and RZ-2 A-Wing fighters.
  • Lando’s veteran rebel cell; his fleet is composed of OT ships; rebel transports (with windows like the U-55 loadlifters from EP8, but an older model closer in design to the GR-75 transports from EP5), and squadrons of T-65 X-Wings, B-Wings, and RZ-1 A-Wings.

Characters:

  • Baron of Bespin, an Imperial Remnant Warlord, independent of the First Order.
  • Two Knights of Ren lead the FO ground forces, wielding red crossguard lightsabers.
  • Kylo Ren, with his appearance at the end of EP8.
  • Admiral Thrawn, commanding the FO Dreadnaught, arrives at Bespin toward the end of the battle.
  • Chewbacca, T-Wing Gold Squadron Leader, with Rose as his copilot.
  • Leia, Captain of the first corvette, leads the air battle.
  • Poe, Captain of second corvette, leads the civilian evacuation on the ground at the landing pads, with Connix.
  • Rey has a single green saber, having replaced the broken blue crystal of the Skywalker saber and repaired the split hilt (Rey will later construct a second red saber, that can be joined to her green saber to create a dual yellow saber); she flies the Falcon to Bespin, with R2 and 3PO aboard, and new aliens as the two resistance gunners.
  • Finn leads the ground troops, with Maz (equipped with a jetpack).
  • BB-8 flies an orange and white T-70 X-Wing, modified with the cockpit removed and the astromech socket lowered in its place, to be flown solo by a BB droid.
  • Lando flies a YT-2400 freighter (with external panels, as the Solo Falcon design) painted in old Rebel colours (faded white, with a red starbird symbol on the body).
  • Wedge (Rogue Leader), flies as part of Lando’s cell in an old but modified T-65 X-Wing.
  • Black Squadron is in atmosphere with Lando’s cell. Jess Pava is now Black Leader, Snap Wexley is Black Two; say Black Squadron has made contact with Lando’s cell to explain their absence from EP8.

Sequence on Bespin:

  1. Arrival; Leia’s rebel cell fleet exits from hyperspace over Bespin. Two FO Star Destroyers orbit Bespin, FO troops have been deployed to Cloud City and are being reinforced from the Destroyers. Lando’s Rebel cell, with Black Squadron, has already engaged the enemy in and around Cloud City. If they maintain distance, then Leia’s cell may bypass the orbiting Destroyers without incident; the battle is at Cloud City itself.
  2. Leia’s rebels descend to Cloud City, where Lando has been pushed back to the landing pads (more like a large commercial spaceport than the single landing pads in EP5). In the air battle: the rebel bombers target the FO walkers and the FO bombers target the rebel transports, fighters attempt to intercept enemy bombers while protecting allied bombers. The rebels proceed to rescue fleeing civilians, opposed by two Knights of Ren and a legion of stormtroopers; many civilians remain trapped behind FO troop lines, so the rebels must break through the FO troops in order to rescue the civilians, and escort them to the transports.
  3. Finn and Maz, leading the Rebel ground forces, push against FO troop lines to reach the trapped civilians and Bespin security forces. The Baron of Bespin is here, fighting alongside their security forces.
  4. Rey pilots the Falcon; then, seeing that the remaining Bespin security forces are isolated and being overwhelmed by the two Knights of Ren, gives control to R2 and 3PO and leaves the ship, jumping from the open boarding ramp mid-flight to confront the Knights on the ground.
  5. Kylo arrives, lands behind FO troop lines in his Upsilon Shuttle, and approaches Rey as she duels the two Knights of Ren. Kylo at first observes the duel from a distance, but may intervene if one or both of the Knights are defeated.
  6. A single FO Dreadnought, with Admiral Thrawn commanding from the bridge, exits hyperspace above Bespin; moves into firing range and then begins its firing sequence, targeting the landing pads at Cloud City where the rebel transports and Poe’s corvette are evacuating civilians; in the air battle, from the bridge of her corvette Leia sees the Dreadnought prepare to fire and sounds the alarm to abandon ship, her crew head to the escape pods, while Leia pilots, moving directly between the Dreadnought’s line of fire and the landing pads; from the landing pads Leia’s corvette eclipses the red glow of the Dreadnought siege cannon, as escape pods eject from the corvette; Leia reaches out through the force to Rey, though all characters hear, to say ‘Rey, the Force will always be with you’ but is cut short (on the second word?) as her corvette is destroyed by the single laser blast from the Dreadnought, protecting the rebel transports and our heroes on the ground; for a brief moment the ground battle pauses, having heard Leia call out telepathically through the Force all look up at the falling wreckage and escape pods from the corvette; Kylo and Rey respond first, Kylo in sorrow, falling to his knees on feeling his mother’s death through the Force, then Rey in anger, unleashing Force lightning in a wide arc, injuring and incapacitating Kylo, and killing any other characters within range (including the two Knights, if they have survived their duel with Rey); the ground battle then resumes.
  7. Rey falls unconscious from the strain of drawing on the dark side of the Force, dropping her saber. Finn retrieves her saber (possibly catching it with the Force), and carries Rey back to the transports, protected by covering fire from Maz and his rebel troops.
  8. The rebel transports flee Cloud City, and rebel ships escape into hyperspace, with their destination set as the resistance base on Ossus (replacing Ajan Kloss).

Outcome:

  • Cloud City and the Tibanna mines of Bespin are lost to the FO.
  • Have some rebel troops and civilians be captured, for the following scene on Coruscant.
  • Lando’s rebel cell joins with the resistance vanguard cell, abandoning his base on Sullst as the Eriadu sector is lost.
  • Count troop losses from the battle.
  • Number of refugees per token saved; some will join and fight, others may stay as support staff or be relocated to other worlds.

Coruscant; Restoration of the Empire by the Supreme Triumvirate

Characters: the Triumvirate is Supreme Leader Ren, Supreme Chancellor Hux, and Supreme Admiral Thrawn - they are the highest authority in this restored Empire; Execution Stormtroopers (from EP8), Knights of Ren; captured rebels - players may perform these roles, if only for this scene; the crowd, Dade (from DOTF).

  1. Captured rebels are led to public execution by light guillotine (as in DOTF), at the plaza in front of the old Republic Senate building; the rebels have black cloth bags over their heads, removed before execution. The Capitol itself (from DOTF) is fixed over the Senate building, a tripod frame supporting its immense structure.
  2. Speeches are made: Hux announces the restoration of the Empire, disparaging the meagre efforts of scattered rebels, and outlining the substantive policies of this Empire - abolition of monarchy and hereditary rule in member states, restoration of regional governors and the Imperial Senate, and continued support for New Alderaan (colonised Mandalore, settled by Alderaanian refugees under the New Republc); Thrawn celebrates the death of Princess Organa, the last rebel leader from the New Republic; Kylo Ren declares a crusade against the Hutt cartels, in order to enforce the abolition of organic slavery throughout the galaxy.
  3. Kylo offers the group of captured rebels mercy, if they renounce the light and swear loyalty to the Empire. Some are only citizens of Bespin, captured in the battle; they accept his mercy and are led from the plaza, their fate is indentured service at shipbreaking yards in the industrial district (from EP2) on Coruscant. The veteran rebels stand in silent refusal; they are then led, one at a time, to their execution by stormtroopers. Here, possible player decisions are will rolls, determining whether the player is able to spit before their execution, also if they are able to declare something to the crowd before their execution.

There’s more, but the rest is barely readable at the moment; mostly just a bare outline, but also way too verbose in parts. Thanks for reading if you got this far, hope it is of interest!

Post
#1428380
Topic
The Prequel Radical Redux Ideas Thread
Time

Peter Pan said:

Here’s a different take on the Bail’s apartment scene with dialogue from The Force Unleashed:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1sPI80MXqw8pO1wm34C0mLx2jCck-EUk8/view?usp=sharing

It’s far from perfect, but there is potential I think.

This is great, there’s definitely potential here. If this scene is placed somewhere after the ‘petition of 2000’ scene in Palpatine’s office, along with your take, it could help make this subplot the strong connection to the OT it should be. I think this restructure of the deleted scenes has been discussed earlier in this thread, but I can’t remember if anyone has attempted it.

Post
#1428372
Topic
The Clone Wars: Refocused - A complete series edit. [OUT NOW: 2/5 seasons + 7 episodes + 4 bonus] [CURRENT FOCUS: S3 then polish]
Time

Thanks for considering my feedback, I’ll try and get to previous episodes and then follow along as you go.

For Shadow, that the Jedi are becoming corrupt by resorting to these tactics is good, and serves the overarching plot well. Still, if you were to reduce the weirdness here a little, perhaps the following lines could be cut at around 7:10: from Anakin, ‘what does that mean, Senator?’ up to Windu’s line ‘do you think you’ll be able to rekindle your relationship with him?’, if those cuts don’t butcher the scene too much. This would reduce the honey trap element, and reduce Anakin being terrible at keeping his concern for Padme apparently platonic. The previous scene at 4:30 is fine, it’s the later scene at 7:10 that I feel goes a little too far in this.

For the crawl in Assault, it’s fine to note Lumiara’s absence in some way, but her fleet being delayed didn’t stick well with me, it didn’t seem to fit well with what follows. Instead, consider noting that Luminara and Barris are making some kind of preparations to attack the factory. Perhaps for the last slide of the crawl: ‘Master Luminara scouts the planet, confirming Padme’s report of a massive droid factory, built by the Archduke POGGLE THE LESSER / Fearing overwhelming droid production in the sector, the Jedi have swiftly diverted three fleets to neutralise this resurgent threat. / The second battle of Geonosis is about to begin…’

Hades is a great game also, I still haven’t quite made it to the end!

I’m looking forward to your take on the Heroes on Both Sides arc, this and the Scipio arc are some of my favourites. It sounds like you have a comprehensive approach here. For a title, I’ll suggest STRIFE IN THE SENATE as a possible alternative, still indicating that it’s a politics episode.

It’s fair to demote Assassin, as it feels on about the same level as Lightsaber Lost; still enjoyable but not essential viewing.

I just realised how your numbering/lettering works with respect to the colour hierarchy, and it’s genius. That way I can still keep all my favourite but less good episodes in the correct order.

I wonder if the Nelvan Crisis episode should be way earlier (even x1e00-C), given the more immature characterisation of Anakin and destruction of his robot arm, unless you’re using the end to tie into the battle of Coruscant?

As for Bad Batch implications, the new PT era flashing heads intro is great, it’ll be a great addition to TCW:R. I prefer the opening text to the newsreel, though I’ve never really been a fan of the CW newsreel. The opening text is good for the flexibility it gives you as an editor, and it’s closer to the style of the film crawls.

I hope I don’t overstep with my suggestions for the opening text. It’s just such an effective way to recontextualise the episodes.

S1E0, Dark Force Rising

  • I quite enjoy Tartakovsky’s Clone Wars so have a few suggestions here, but I’m not sure how far you’d like to go with the edit of this episode? What you have so far is great, in any case.
  • Consider cutting the opening montage; this could be replaced with your normal opening sequence, but keeping the 2003 ‘Clone Wars’ title card (00:00 to 00:12) instead of the TCW style title card.
  • Open with Ventress on Rattatak, trim the arena so we begin with a classic planetary descent; then cut from this scene to Palpatine’s office on Coruscant.
  • Your placement of the second Ventress episode is great, especially the cut from a close up of Anakin to Ventress; I wonder if the duel here could be trimmed a little, to focus more on Dooku destroying Ventress’ Jedi lightsabers, maybe cut the bit with the sculpture?
  • Extend the static close up of Ventress at 8:55, to remove the white flash at the beginning of the shot.
  • Cut part of the Arc troopers on Muunilist, from 13:15 to 15:38, intercut this with part of the space battle to cover this.
  • Your removal of Dirge is good.
  • In the space battle, cut the missiles (from around 19:35) firing across the bow and tracking Anakin.
  • Cut Obi-Wan sending a squad of clones to follow Anakin, and their arrival at Yavin.
  • I’m unsure about your placement of the scene with Grievous and Dooku. I prefer Grievous at the battle of Hypori to be his first scene; I would remove the Grievous-Dooku scene and instead cut from the close up of Obi-Wan to Anakin approaching Yavin.
  • Without the vision (of Qui-Gon and Anakin on Dagobah), the shot of Yoda at 34:55 doesn’t work for me. I’d suggest adding the vision here, or restoring it’s original placement.

S1E1, The New Padawan

  • In the crawl: consider instead ‘a year ago…’ instead of ‘many months earlier…’; ‘treacherous Separatists’ rather than ‘insidious Separatists’; for the third sentence consider, ‘With Republic support, Senator BAIL ORGANA provides relief and supplies for the people of Christophsis, a planet under Separatist blockade’; for the last slide consider ‘Anakin Skywalker has earned the rank of JEDI KNIGHT, so Master Kenobi, eager to teach, has requested a new Padawan. / The duo have tracked ASAJJ VENTRESS, Dooku’s vicious disciple, to the recently evacuated Separatist command tower. / The two Jedi Knights move to investigate…’. I found the mission of the Jedi, and the tactical situation on Christophsis with Bail and Asajj, a little confusing at first, so tried to write up something that could situate things for me.
  • I had this idea for another sentence in the crawl, but there’s likely not enough space for it: ‘The duo have bypassed the blockade to support Senator Organa, but this infiltration has left their troops isolated from the Republic fleet.’
  • For the episode title, perhaps instead ‘A NEW PADAWAN’? It’s a little more ambiguous.
  • Great cuts in the opening duel with Ventress, the lip sync isn’t exact, but the scene flows well.
  • I almost don’t believe this is from the same film I saw in 2008, excellent work with this episode.
  • Interpolated frames at 10:26, 19:20, 22:24.

S1E2, The Death Watch

  • In the crawl, in the second sentence consider instead ‘War against the Separatists spreads like fire across the galaxy, yet thousands of worlds refuse to take sides in the conflict’; in the third sentence, ‘The Council of Neutral Systems is led by MANDALORE, ravaged homeworld of the now pacifist Mandalorians.’
  • For the episode title, consider instead just ‘DEATH WATCH’.
  • I see you’ve restored the opening planetary decent, I prefer it this way, even if it is quite quick.
  • I’m not sure what to make of Almec’s disavowal of Jango at 2:58, it seems like an unnecessary deception on his part, and one that overly complicates the canon. Would it be too jarring if Almec’s response was removed, and we cut from Kenobi to Satine here?
  • Cut Kenobi missing with the blaster in the battle on Concordia, at 16:05.
  • Cut Anakin straight up asking if OWK and Satine were ever involved, as it’s really not the right time, unless Anakin should be insensitive in this way.
  • I wonder if the dialogue would run smoother (at 30:45) if Kenobi’s line ‘Satine, this is hardly the time or place for’ was cut.

S1E3, Malevolence

  • In the crawl, in the first slide consider instead ‘The leader of the Separatist droid army, General Grievous, strikes strategically, targeting critical Republic defenses. / With his new weapon, the dreadnaught MALEVOLENCE, he ruthlessly attacks Clone medical stations, killing thousands of wounded troops.’; also in the last sentence of the second slide ‘But in every battle with the Malevolence, there are as yet no survivors…’
  • Interpolated frame at 22:10.
  • The attack on the Malevolence felt a little odd, given the original attack angles. I think its just the shots at 24.20 and 24:36, where the squadron is shown off bow of the Malevolence, that feel out of place, as they’ve already passed the bow at this point and should now be over the middle of the ship.
  • Also, without fighters being disabled by the ion cannon, dialogue on half the squadron being lost (at 23.55) seems inaccurate at this point. Perhaps this scene where squadron losses is noted could be placed after Matchstick’s death?
  • The Malevolence crashing into the moon works well enough, but I wonder if any of the shots with the droids on the bridge of the Malevolence (such as scenes with the lines, ‘I think we have a problem’, and ‘reset the navicomputer’) could be used to extend things a bit here?

That’s all I’ve got for now, hope it helps!

Post
#1423955
Topic
The Clone Wars: Refocused - A complete series edit. [OUT NOW: 2/5 seasons + 7 episodes + 4 bonus] [CURRENT FOCUS: S3 then polish]
Time

Hey, I’ve watched through a few of the recent episodes, and have made notes on anything that stuck out to me, but take or leave them as you like. Your work so far is great, and I’m keen to see how the remaining seasons play out.

I try and keep up to speed with the thread, and do enjoy reading your analysis and explanation of your cuts, but haven’t got around to commenting anything until now.

The general crawl format is good, having the first line as an overview of the war for multiple episodes works well.

s2e5, Tales of the Lost Clones:

  • A great concept episode.
  • In the crawl consider: ‘obedience is instilled from birth’ instead of ‘obedience is in their blood’; ‘on another path’ instead of ‘on other paths’.
  • I wonder if the scene with Rex and Cody in the control room (beginning at 10:00) would play out better if Rex/Cody planned this out beforehand instead of during the scene. If so, then consider cutting Rex and Cody’s reaction shots to Slick being in the ceiling vents at 10:25 and a few other shots of them puzzling this out, so that the audience doesn’t know that Rex/Cody know Slick is there until they have him at gunpoint.
  • Perhaps the amnesia plot point could be removed from the Gregor episode, to give the character more agency, and make it a more effective foil to the other two episodes.
  • The intertitles are a little too short for my liking. As for the crawl, the last slide has too much information that isn’t relevant until later on. Perhaps you could split the final 3 sentences, having just one sentence added to the intertitle before the relevant episode? This would also help lengthen the intertitles. If you can find appropriate music for a longer intertitle, of course.

s2e7, Shadow of Geonosis:

  • The new title serves well to recontextualise the episode within the Geonosis arc.
  • In the crawl (on the second slide) consider: capitalising ‘Council’ and ‘Senator’; ‘aim’ instead of ‘intend’; ‘enjoys a brief reprieve from battle’ instead of ‘has a brief reprieve from battle’; for the last line consider ‘But the Separatists conspire to restore their lost power…’
  • Consider trimming dialogue around 8:10 that implies the Jedi know Padme and Clovis were romantically involved, as it’s a weird take for apparently celibate monks.
  • At 13:15, I’d suggest cutting Lott Dod revealing his plans to the audience, to retain some actual surprise later in the plot.
  • At 19:25, cut Clovis’ line ‘she must be saved because I love her’, it seems too much?

s2e8, Assault on Geonosis:

  • The changed episode title is good.
  • In the crawl: perhaps ‘Clone Army’ should be capitalised; consider ‘a guerrilla campaign waged by the insurgent Geonosians’ instead of ‘a costly guerrilla campaign fought by the fierce natives’; ‘massive new factory’ instead of ‘huge new factory’; I am unsure about the last line of the crawl, as it seems unnecessary to note Luminara’s absence in this way, perhaps this last sentence could be replaced with something that better leads into the meeting before the assault?
  • Your cuts are good in this episode, they help keep things moving and focused on character.
  • The cuts to remove dialogue at 16:00 felt unnatural, like too many reaction shots cut together. I’d suggest either restoring some of the dialogue or cutting some of the reaction shots.
  • I wonder if the fade to black at 32:55 could be extended, to add a little suspense before the lightsabers ignite?

The overall pacing of the episodes is excellent. From what I recall the key moments are preserved, and the Mandalorian style bookending of the show serves your edit well. I’m looking forward to season 3, but it’s a well earned break with all your work so far.

I’ll try and write up something for the other episodes when I get to watching the most recent versions, hopefully soon!

Post
#1416687
Topic
Star Wars Episode IX (was) to be directed by Colin Trevorrow - DUEL OF THE FATES RIP
Time

I’m delighted with what Winegarner has done with this also. As much as I enjoyed the leaked script and concept art, they were only parts of what Episode IX could have been. I’m looking forward to seeing the final issues of this comic completed, it’ll help put my headcanon to rest.

Post
#1391406
Topic
The Mandalorian: A Vergence in the Force (RT 2h 27mins) (Released)
Time

I’ve just watched the edit recently, really excellent work on this one. It captures the feeling of a classic star wars film (with the crawl and opening planetary descent, added wipe transitions) despite the episodic nature of the source material. The core plot is preserved well, with many of the story beats landing better here without the extra material (like IG-11 speeding in to save the day on Nevarro).

I did occasionally miss having a few shots from the show, however; like the gag with Grogu eating the frog, Djarin entering the Mudhorn cave (though I see its exclusion has already been discussed), the rest of the training montage from Chapter 4, and the IG reprogramming montage. At times the action felt a little too constant, and I wonder if cutting too many quiet moments like these is the cause.

Other thoughts:
- Great use of the Chapter 5 opening dogfight
- I wonder if the Armourer fight (from Chapter 8) could have been cut?
- Great cut on Chapter 4, so it appears Djarin would have let her remove his helmet
- Great cut on having the client shot immediately
- I feel the shot of Kuiil’s death is too short
- Having the Karga transmission moved to Sorgen would be a great addition, as others have said, but I don’t envy the VFX work of that task

An excellent edit, and I look forward to what you come up with for season 2. From the chapters out so far it seems like it would benefit from your approach as well.

Post
#1202640
Topic
A Collaborative Star Wars Saga Edit
Time

RogueLeader said:

First of all, thanks for sharing your thoughts and these cuts. I’ll be adding a lot of these to the resources folder just in case we decide to use them, if you’re cool with that.

Yeah, that’s fine with me. If any of the cuts are useful I’d be happy to have them included.

EddieDean said:

I’ve taken a crack at a spreadsheet to record issues and their resultant scene fixes, for those who think there’s value there. Here’s a screenshot with the first example. Feedback welcome.

https://imgur.com/Ex3AfHZ
https://imgur.com/F4TbsPj

Having a spreadsheet for the project is an excellent idea, it’ll make keeping track of everything much easier.

Sir Ridley said:

Your mother once thought this should do:
https://mega.nz/#!bR0CUAgZ!8tXiiKI9PUpvmjG1VO3qkCUnFyiF5YaVewQ-oSBXAdw

That version of the line sounds great, it’d be interesting to hear it placed with the shot and see how well it fits.

RogueLeader said:

My view on the Sifo-Dyas thing is that he never gets mentioned again within the films, so within the movies we never really get an answer for it. I understand that it is meant to be a red herring, but is a red herring that is never even revealed as a red herring. So people left the theater wondering who Sifo-Dyas is and if more will be revealed about him in the next film, which we know never is. To me, this shows how murky the whole plot was in the first place, and it would just be simpler to make it where an anonymous person ordered this clone army for the Jedi Council and the Republic. It could technically still be Sifo-Dyas, we just don’t get that information (because we don’t need it). All we’ll know is that a man called Tyrannus hired Jango for this job. Obi-Wan never discovers the identity of Tyrannus, but the audience will by the end of the film when Dooku is revealed to be Tyrannus. Then the audience will know that the clone army is merely a part of Darth Sidious’ plot. I think Sifo-Dyas just makes it more complicated than it needs to be.

Ah you’re right, cutting Sifo-Dyas entirely is the far simpler option, and the reveal of Darth Tyranus fits well with that. I know Seciors cut ep2 in this way, the relevant scenes are: between Obi-Wan and the Kaminoan president, the dialogue between Obi-Wan and Jango (though Seciors also cuts the mention of Tyranus in this scene), and Obi-Wan’s holocall to Yoda and Mace. I think that’s all of them. Looks like Seciors had to splice some lines together, and the odd shot feels a bit truncated, but overall it works well. No point totally reinventing the edit.

RogueLeader said:

That’s an interesting view on Anakin using green in AOTC. I hadn’t really thought of it that way but I totally see where you’re coming from. What if the colors were swapped with him and Obi? He would still wield a green one when he dual wields.

I’d consider cutting the dual wielding part of the fight as well, as it’s quite brief and seems a bit pointless to me. That way we wouldn’t have to worry about fixing the colour of Obi-Wan’s lightsaber. It’s quite a minor point though.

Post
#1196780
Topic
A Collaborative Star Wars Saga Edit
Time

Ah you’re right about R2 RogueLeader, I hadn’t considered that. Yeah, as far as R2 knows Obi-Wan killed Anakin. It would be simpler if Bail mind wiped both droids, maybe the line in ep3 could be cut to “have the | droid’s mind wiped”. That scene always seemed off to me, and I think it’s because of the all the problems you mention. It’s a bit sad for R2 but makes sense, and there’s no reason why R2 couldn’t recover some of the data, or store it in an internal backup or something. Adding this also makes the later Rebels treatment of droids more interesting, presumably Leia or Luke never memory wiped R2 or 3PO, and Poe will never memory wipe BB8, so this shows a stronger difference between the heroes of the PT (specifically Padme, Bail, and Mon Mothma) to the OT and ST. Here’s a demo of the cut: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1BI31_EiMWySxUqzQ3BscwFxwLo8NmuWv would probably need to change the beeps so that it doesn’t sound like R2 is laughing.

On Sifo-Dyas in Obi-Wan’s detective subplot, my view is that Dooku and the Separatists are a red herring for this subplot, as Jango and Sifo-Dyas are the leads that the Jedi needed to track down (but Windu kills Jango so there’s that). In some ways I think removing the line where the President of Kamino says that the army was (specifically intended by Sifo-Dyas) for the Republic improves things here, as it makes Sifo-Dyas’ intentions unknown, and so makes his prior death simply a lead that wasn’t followed up on. About the scene itself, although it’s IMO one of the worst uses of CGI in the PT, I find that Obi-Wan’s dialogue is mostly fine, as he’s in a sort of undercover detective mode here, which could explain why he didn’t ask more prying questions about Sifo-Dyas. The dialogue scene between Jango and Obi-Wan could also be trimmed, depending on our views on Darth Tyranus.

With Chewbacca in ep3, it could be an idea to wait until the Solo film is out, as it will be interesting to see if they add any details about Chewbacca’s backstory there. One of the main things indicating that it’s Chewbacca is the bandoleer, so maybe it would be enough to remove that? Though I’m all for making him a silver Wookiee if it can be done well. For me the problem isn’t that Chewbacca is in ep3, what bothers me is that it seems like he’s best friends with Yoda, which is a ridiculous coincidence.

Also, on PT lightsaber colours, it’s not really an obvious contradiction (it could maybe be considered a thematic contradiction) but I’m opposed to Anakin using a green lightsaber in ep2 (even if it’s not his personal saber). My view is that, between Anakin and Luke, only Luke should use a green saber, because to me it represents the fulfillment of Luke’s character as a new hope and as the return of the Jedi in the OT. So I’d have it as Anakin transitioning from blue to red, and Luke transitioning from blue to green (will be interesting to see what colour Rey’s saber is in ep9). What are people’s thoughts on changing Anakin’s temporary lightsaber in this way? I’m obviously for it, but it might not be worth the work required.

About the Ewok’s in the ep6 final battle, the overly cute or silly battle scenes can be cut easily enough, it’s just a question of which shots we want to remove. Also, as Adywan is likely cooking up some interesting shots for the final battle, it may be best to wait and see what he comes up with before cutting into this part of ep6.

Here are links to some relevant cuts. I’d made these for myself anyway, so thought I’d organise them and post the relevant bits here. Some of the cuts need work (particularly on the audio side), but they should give an idea of what they’re about. Not all of the cuts may end up being relevant for this project, but it’ll be interesting to hear what you all think of them regardless. Here’s a link to the folder with all the demo scenes: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1gHgVquApxRDBhGCbtOA3qKPriJHvc7ME

OT, incest subplot:

OT, Obi-Wan deception plot:

  • ep4, “I never seem to remember owning a droid” has been cut, I couldn’t figure out a seamless way to trim the “I haven’t gone by the name of Obi-Wan since oh, before you were born” line so have left it as is: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1wdB5l8eKfChkhVyWESpDI2ymUUCYTJgB
  • ep4, “He [Owen] feared you might follow old Obi-Wan on some damn fool idealistic crusade, like your father did", cut “like your father did”: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1zPBkXtLBnnJNk5VYTGbwiqXtgx3c07t6
  • ep4, “Now, let’s see if we can figure out what you are, my little friend, and where you come from”, the words “what you are / and” have been cut: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1IT09tdxP_8fzsPoeIw1_iy0g9dVUSi1S
  • ep6, Dagobah sequence, I’ve uploaded the almost all of the sequence on Dagobah, as some of Yoda’s lines were also cut: https://drive.google.com/open?id=15uDS2HzWB47VaESu83RlvU6v5yuGcmwl Yoda doesn’t mention another Skywalker, so Obi-Wan tells Luke about Leia without being prompted. Here, the following lines have been cut, “Obi-Wan: ‘Then the Emperor has already won, you were are only hope.’ Luke: Yoda spoke of another?’ Obi-Wan: ‘The other he spoke of is your twin sister.’ Luke: ‘But I have no sister.’” Obi-Wan’s infamous “point of view” bit has been trimmed, and now reads as “…he ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader, when that happened the good man who was your father was destroyed. (Here the lines “Obi-Wan: ‘So what I told you was true, from a certain point of view.’ Luke: ‘A certain point of view?’” have been cut) You’re going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view. So what I told you was true (this line has been moved here from the cut section). When I first knew him…” Here I have attempted to portray Obi-Wan as saying all truths exist from a particular point of view, not what I said was true from a particular point of view. Hopefully Obi-Wan seems more dejected about how things turned out with Vader, and isn’t trying to avoid responsibility for having deceived Luke.

Ep6 scenes:

ST, clone stormtrooper retcon:

Ep8 scene:

Post
#1195757
Topic
A Collaborative Star Wars Saga Edit
Time

Nice work with the edit, RogueLeader.

Anakin Starkiller said:

Imhotep said:

As Jar Jar has been brought up a bit, one way to add some nuance to the Gungans (without removing Jar Jar as I agree that this can’t be done, it would break the plot of both ep1 and ep2) could be to dub them with a fake alien language with subtitles when two Gunguns are talking to each other, like in the swamp scene or the final battle of ep1. This would imply that their poor use of English/Basic is because it’s a second language for them.

I’ve had that on my change list for a while.

Ah excellent, do you have any thoughts on how to execute this idea to dub and subtitle the Gungans? My view on this is that the easiest way would be to use audio from something else in the Star Wars universe. I’d go for the Knights of the Old Republic games, as they have several different alien languages. The Rakata language might be appropriate as they don’t appear in the films, and given their appearance the Gungans could possibly have evolved from Rakatans, or be a subspecies. Lip sync could be a problem, but it’d be worth a try. Would have to change the pitch for Jar Jar though, as his voice is far too high. The Rakata language can be heard in this video: https://youtu.be/kGp5NJK-FyI?list=PLMpTBRgc57RSNbXpIs9PIQDi2Wmjl46l9&t=848

My take on Dooku is that the public don’t really know the difference between the Jedi and the Sith. I guess some would, but the Sith are not obviously evil to most people in the star wars universe. That said, I don’t have a problem with changing Dooku’s lightsaber colour if people are keen to work on that addition.

The deception plot with Obi-Wan is fine with me, I think if we trim the odd bit or inconsistency, like not knowing R2 and the “point of view” bit then it should be okay. Manipulating Luke to kill his father is a bit extreme, but the stakes are high, and I think Yoda and Obi-Wan would’ve told Luke eventually, if he hadn’t run off in ep5 before his training was complete. Also, R2 is deceiving Luke as well, in ep4 to get him to save Leia (by leading him to his old pal Obi-Wan), and in ep5 by not telling Luke about Vader. There’s also a moment in ep5 (when Luke goes into the cave on Dagobah) where R2 and Yoda could’ve had a long chat without Luke around, I like to think they did anyway. This fits with 3PO (and not R2) being given a memory wipe at the end of ep3, but I’m not sure if that’s what Lucas intended. Basically the PT makes things super convoluted, but I think we can make it make sense with a few additional cuts.

“Come here, my little friend.” / If the change can be made as you suggest then it would be an improvement, but the theatrical line is fine as is.

“I haven’t gone by the name Obi-Wan since, oh, before you were born.” / Changing this to “I haven’t gone by the name Obi-Wan since you were born” sounds like a good idea to me.

I’d cut “I never seem to remember owning a droid.” Should be simple enough to do.

“He [Owen] feared you might follow old Obi-Wan on some damn fool idealistic crusade, like your father did.” / Would be a good idea to cut “like your father did”, as this isn’t really what happened. Maybe if we’d had a few extra scenes between Owen and Anakin in ep2 it might have made sense, but as things are I find it to be a confusing inconsistency.

“Now, let’s see if we can figure out what you are, my little friend, and where you come from” / One option could be to remove the words “what you are” if possible, as this is the problematic part of the line (the cut should work for the image, but the audio may be a problem).

One option to make the final dialogue between Luke and Obi-Wan in ep6 more meaningful is to cut Yoda telling Luke he has a sister, and leave that for Obi-Wan. So then it’s more like he’s coming clean about the last part of the deception, rather than being prompted by Luke.

I’ve made a few cuts of these and some other ideas, I should have time to organise and upload them over the weekend.

Post
#1194889
Topic
A Collaborative Star Wars Saga Edit
Time

Not sure how much help I’ll be in keeping my suggestions limited hahah D: so it’s good that others are on point to do that. RogueLeader, your reference of the Phantom Editor makes an excellent point. It’s super important to keep in mind what’s possible in editing, and to work within the films that we have for a project like this. I do think that certain ideas, like changing PT lightsaber colours, fall under the TFA Restructured principle of “improving the function of something within the story”. Improving narrative function goes a bit beyond resolving inconsistencies, but if it’s a simple and effective change then I’m fine with that.

Here’s my view on the proposed changes (for the suggestions that I’ve left out I’m either not sure how to fix them or don’t see them as being a problem):

As Jar Jar has been brought up a bit, one way to add some nuance to the Gungans (without removing Jar Jar as I agree that this can’t be done, it would break the plot of both ep1 and ep2) could be to dub them with a fake alien language with subtitles when two Gunguns are talking to each other, like in the swamp scene or the final battle of ep1. This would imply that their poor use of English/Basic is because it’s a second language for them.

Why is Mace Windu the only Jedi with a purple lightsaber? / Apparently it’s because Samuel L. Jackson really likes purple, and Lucas caved with no aesthetic or lore reason at all. So I’d prefer to change the colour and make it something more meaningful. As well as Windu, there are definitely some possibilities with all the background Jedi in the ep2 final battle, also with some of the other Jedi with Windu when they confront Palpatine, and possibly Ki-Adi-Mundi as his Order 66 death scene could be an option. I also dislike having only blue and green lightsabers in the PT as it seems like weak worldbuilding, so I’d prefer adding extra colours. Really enjoyed how this was done in the Knights of the Old Republic video games, with colours indicating different classes of Jedi. So I’d be interested in adding either some yellow sabers if we just want to keep it simple with green, blue, and yellow. Or we could go full rainbow and add some purple, yellow, and orange sabers, as this could be great as well.

Why was it never explained why Jedi Master “Sifo-Dyas” ordered the clone army? / Although this subplot is really convoluted, the President of Kamino does tell Obi-Wan that the army is for the Republic, so we could assume that Sifo-Dyas was basically a rogue Jedi who ordered a clone army on the side. I don’t think this is exactly a continuity error, but we could think about how to make the plot a bit more clear here.

Why does Count Dooku just tell Obi-Wan the Sith’s strategy for undermining the Senate? / This is likely too radical for this project, but we could cut Dooku being Sidious’ apprentice. However, for this to work we’d likely need to cut Sidious being in control of the Separatists in both ep2 and ep3.

Why does Yoda run away from his fight with Palpatine? / My preference is to cut the fight, as in Hal’s ep3 edit. However, that’s likely not appropriate for this project, so perhaps we should leave it as it is.

Why does the Death Star take so long to build?/ One option could be to use the shot in Hal’s V3 ep3 edit, where Coruscant replaces the Death Star.

What’s up with Anakin’s yellow Sith eyes? Why does Anakin momentarily get them but we don’t see Dooku, Luke when he almost killed Vader, or Kylo Ren ever have them? / Would be great to remove Anakin’s Sith eyes if possible.

Why does 3PO mention the princess on board Tantive IV, then doesn’t know about the princess when he is with Luke? / Adywan’s solution could be the way to go on this. Though, following the PT, wouldn’t it be fair for the audience to assume that 3PO is now Leia’s butler (and this seems to be the case in ep5)?

On the problem of having two Death Stars, although it does bother me it’s probably best to leave it alone, as I’m not sure how this could be easily fixed.

Why doesn’t Obi-Wan remember R2 or 3PO? / As he’s trying to deceive Luke about Vader. Could cut Obi-Wan’s line “I don’t seem to remember ever owning a droid” to alleviate this.

“Your father wanted you to have this when you were old enough…”/ Either cut the line or change it to “I wanted you to have this…” if possible.

Are stormtroopers clones? / I’d prefer to keep them as clones throughout the saga, and assume that they use different templates (for Jango, Finn, Phasma, etc). As droids are important throughout the saga, and the droids vs. clones theme of the PT helps to set this up. This would require two cuts in ep7: scene on the star destroyer bridge, cut part of Kylo’s line “perhaps Leader Snoke should consider using a clone army” to Hux; scene in Maz’s bar, cut part of Finn’s line “taken from a family I’ll never know, and” to Rey, so his line reads as “like all of them I was | raised to do one thing”. This could also be supported by adding part of the ep8 extended megadestroyer infiltration deleted scene, as some lines could imply that Finn is a clone. It’s not an obvious continuity error, just removing a retcon I’d prefer wasn’t in the films.

What was Luke’s plan to save Han? / No idea what Luke had in mind, but making a sensible plan would likely require substantially restructuring the first act of ep6, which may be beyond the scope of this project.

How can Leia remember her mother, when Padme died in childbirth? / Cut Padme’s death in ep3, probably as in Hal’s ep3 edit.

Leia is Luke’s sister? Incest vibes? / Basically this would mean making some simple cuts throughout the OT, which should be easy enough. Not sure if this qualifies as a continuity error, though maybe if they’d known from the beginning that Luke and Leia would be siblings then it would’ve been left out.

  • ep4: when R2 shows Luke the hologram of Leia, remove Luke’s line “she’s beautiful”; in the Falcon cockpit, after the heroes have escaped the Death Star, cut the rest of the conversation after Han’s line “I’m trying not to kid”, to remove Han making fun of Luke for being attracted to Leia.
  • ep5: cut Luke and Leia’s kiss on Hoth (the cut can be covered with a reaction shot of Luke from earlier in the scene).
  • ep6: scene where Luke leaves to confront Vader, cut from Han’s line “Hey, what’s going on?” to Leia’s line “Hold me”, to remove Leia being a bit hysterical and Han being suspicious; kiss between Han and Leia after the Death Star is destroyed, cut from Han’s line “You love him, don’t you?” to Leia’s line “It’s not like that at all, he’s my brother”. Not totally necessary to remove this part of the conversation, but it’s a weird exchange.

Not all of these cuts may be necessary, but they’re all the scenes that could be considered related to the incest subplot.

“Obi-Wan once thought as you do…” / Adding “your mother” to the “Obi-Wan once thought as you do” line would be a great solution, if an appropriate source could be found.

How can two trees destroy an armored battle vehicle like an AT-ST? / Cut this shot, I’d also cut the Ewoks trying to trip up an AT-ST with a rope and shoot it with a catapult, as it makes them look ridiculous.

How did Anakin know how to become a force ghost? / My preference here is to cut the shot of the force ghosts. I don’t think Anakin should have this power as part of his redemption is accepting his own death, but this change is likely beyond the scope of this project.

Why isn’t hyper speed ramming more of a thing? / One solution could be to cut the majority of the silent part of this scene, so we only see the destruction of the megadestroyer and not the annihilation of most of the First Order fleet. Then the hyperspace kamikaze move would be more like a standard fire ship tactic, but this is likely too radical.

Post
#1193682
Topic
A Collaborative Star Wars Saga Edit
Time

Sounds like good guidelines so far, Asimov’s laws of robotics are a helpful way to think of this!

Separate threads for each trilogy could help spread things out, threads for each films might be too much though. Or threads by project category (reports, discussion, etc) could work. Depends what you’d prefer to set up, RogueLeader.

I have a few suggestions that I’ll throw into the ring here:

  • Give Mace Windu a blue lightsaber (I think this has already been done for ep2 by Jackpumpkinhead).
  • Relation between Obi-Wan and R2 (PT and ep4): cut “I don’t seem to remember ever owning a droid” in ep4. Apart from this line it doesn’t bother me too much, Obi-Wan is deceiving Luke in general and it’d be too difficult to remove all scenes with R2 and Obi-Wan in the PT.
  • Two Death Stars in the OT: This seems to me like the major contradiction within the OT. If Lucas knew he was going to continue past ep4 then the Death Star wouldn’t have been destroyed in that film, but editing the final battle to avoid this would be a major (and likely problematic) change.
  • The incest subplot (Han and Luke being jealous of each other throughout the OT, and the kiss between Leia and Luke on Hoth): shouldn’t be too difficult to cut, and makes Leia’s comments in ep6 less weird. Also removes some of Han’s more annoying bits in ep6.
  • Vader’s reference to Obi-Wan in ep6: where he says to Luke “Obi-Wan once thought as you do”, as in ep3 Padme tries to turn Anakin back from the dark side. Could simply cut the line?
  • Clone Army retcon in ep7: as lines by both Hux and Finn state that the stormtroopers are no longer clones. I know this is also in parts of the EU, but if the troopers aren’t clones anymore then the whole Kamino investigation subplot of ep2 is a bit of a waste of time.

Dom, you make a good point about the feasibility of the project 😕 though even if it does end up being a collective resource that would still be useful. If this becomes the revised aim of the project, then perhaps it would be better to work towards slightly more intensive changes (like making Windu’s lightsaber blue or replotting the vague reference to Sifo-Dyas), as simple dialogue cuts are easy enough to make for individual projects.

Post
#1191995
Topic
A Collaborative Star Wars Saga Edit
Time

Sounds like an excellent idea, I’d be happy help with basic editing work.

Though I wonder how much work would actually be necessary, if this kind of project would provide much more than has already been done in other edits like Hal’s PT and TFA Restructured? It would be interesting to write up some possible changes, including new ideas and things that would be copied from existing edits and see how those two things compare.

As you say, things can’t really be finalised until ep9 is out, but that’s no reason not to get started if enough people are on board 😄

Also, Hal’s point about having RogueLeader guide the project is a good one. Collaboration is great and all, but a project this large could benefit from some solid direction.

Post
#1183859
Topic
Imhotep's Star Wars Saga (Episodes 1-7 + R1) (Released)
Time

Yo, sorry for the delay. Yeah, I’ll have another look at the titles and see if I can come up with something else for either ep1 or ep8. Will have a look at giving Rogue One an episode number as well, as I do agree on this. To me Rogue One feels like the end to the PT we never got with Lucas.

Ah not sure when I’ll get another chance to work on the edits as things are quite busy with work at the moment. Though I’d say they’re in a serviceable state as they are (except for ep4), so now is as good a time as any! PM me and we can sort it.

Post
#1171186
Topic
Imhotep's Star Wars Saga (Episodes 1-7 + R1) (Released)
Time

Collipso said:

It’s the same guy. Matthew Woods is his name, I believe. He voiced both the droids and Grievous in TCW and Grievous in Episode III. Not sure if he voiced the droids in III, but he might’ve.

Ah yeah, I did use some of TCW Grievous dialogue in ep3, but I’m not sure if I’ll keep it as it sounds a bit too different from the ep3 dialogue. Though I guess that’s more due to how they altered the voice, rather than the voice actor.

Post
#1171184
Topic
Imhotep's Star Wars Saga (Episodes 1-7 + R1) (Released)
Time

Thanks for the extensive reply! Hopefully I can bring the three trilogies together and make them more cohesive, but I’m a little worried about it as well 😄

Yeah, you’ve got it, those are the main changes.

As for the names, I can give some reasons as to why I chose them. I’ve tried to vary the titles a bit (mostly by avoiding the “X of the Y” formula). I guess the ep6 and ep8 theatrical titles are just a reference to Luke, so I don’t find them very interesting either, but I’ll try and justify my ep1 and ep8 titles being so similar:

  • Veil of Darkness continues in the vein of The Phantom Menace and Hal’s Cloak of Deception, implying that there is some dark unknown force yet to be revealed. It also refers to Anakin’s character, as his fate is unknown at this point.
  • A Separatist Threat was used because ep2 is about misdirection and setting up the tragedy of ep3. So the opening of ep2 is meant to imply that the Separatists are the most pressing danger to the Republic, but the Republic will become the Empire due to internal causes, such as the passivity of the Jedi and the ambition of Palpatine.
  • Twilight of the Republic refers to the light/darkness metaphor established in the ep1 subtitle. Also, in ep6 Yoda delivers the line “Twilight is upon me, and so night must fall”, so it’s also a reference to this.
  • Dominion of the Sith describes the political situation at the beginning of the film, however it’s also a slight misdirection, as by the end of the film the Rebellion has emerged to challenge (and ultimately overthrow) this dominion.
  • A Hidden Fortress is a reference to the Kurosawa film, and to the various hidden fortresses in ep4: the Death Star, Tatooine for Obi-Wan and Luke, and Yavin IV. Also, one of the Imperial Moffs almost finishes delivering the line “…or given you clairvoyance enough to find the Rebel’s hidden fortress” before he is force choked by Vader.
  • The Force Unknown is an inversion of The Force Awakens. It also refers to Vader for Luke, the Rebel cell on Hoth for the Empire, and both the Force and the Chosen One for Yoda and Obi-Wan (as they will, in ep6, continue to counsel Luke to kill rather than redeem Vader).
  • A New Dawn refers to the light/darkness metaphor, specifically to Twilight of the Republic, as the new Republic of ep7 is able to be established due to the events of ep6.
  • Fate of the Rebellion is to contrast with the optimism of A New Dawn in that ep7 undoes much of what was achieved in the OT, as the Jedi Academy and Republic are destroyed once again. So the new dawn promised by ep6 was false in some sense.
  • Odyssey of Darkness refers to the light/darkness metaphor again, specifically to Veil of Darkness, and indicates the position of the heroes of ep8 in relation to the heroes of ep1, as in ep8 our heroes are beyond the veil of ep1; in ep8 our heroes are now in the position of the Separatists of the PT, whereas this was not exactly true for the Rebellion of the OT (except perhaps for Saw Gerrera). Odyssey of Darkness also equally refers to Rey’s more existential odyssey and to the odyssey of the Resistance fleet from D’Qar to Crait, perhaps also to Finn and Rose’s odyssey which has fatal consequences for the Resistance fleet.
  • Triumph of the Force refers to The Force Unknown, as ep9 will presumably fulfil the contradictions of the previous episodes, and so the Force will have become fully realised at this point.

For these reasons I’d prefer to keep Odyssey of Darkness as is, but thanks for your suggestion.

I love this idea about giving Rogue One the “Episode IV” number and increasing the number of the other episodes, as I consider Rogue One to be essential for the OT, but I wonder if this would make things a bit too confusing?

Thanks for pointing out those problems with the demo clips, I think I’ve fixed up the problem with the Boss Nass scene, and I’ll review the ep5 Hoth medbay scene and deleted scene integration when I have time. Hopefully I’ll be able to make the cuts run a bit smoother there. If you find any other errors please let me know 😃

Post
#1169975
Topic
Imhotep's Star Wars Saga (Episodes 1-7 + R1) (Released)
Time

This is a series of edits, currently including all 7 available Episodes and Rogue One, with a tentative cutlist for Episode 8. Episode 9 will also be edited if necessary. The project is still a work in progress, but I wanted to get the edits out as they are and see what you all think of them. There will likely be some errors scattered throughout, but hopefully you can get a feel for the overall concept of this variation on the Saga.

My technical expertise is quite limited (basically to what I’ve learnt working through this project), so any feedback or advice would be much appreciated.

With respect to the PT - where so much work has already been done - I have taken a similar approach to Octorox; my edits are as much hybrids of previous edits as they are my own work, with sequences, shots, or audio often sourced from other edits. Though this is becoming increasingly true for my other edits as well.

Cuts were made according to several practical principles:
• To minimize the unnecessary repetition of dialogue and events
• To remove particular lines where they obscure the dialogue or function of the scene as a whole
• To remove unnecessary action
• Where possible, to remove dialogue from a shot entirely so that only the image and music/foley remain
• To maintain the episodic nature of the films, and their relation as parts to the saga as a whole

Cuts were also made according to (what was worked out through this project as) the concept of Star Wars. At times it was necessary to work out this concept through writing out more theoretical notes (https://docs.google.com/document/d/16HIYjQ_R59mrCh0ZpugrAoI0dCAGdtQ9TiJPk_Kz_o8/edit?usp=sharing).

Though I’ve attempted to cut the films into a more cohesive saga, if you’re interested in one or two of the edits in particular there’s no reason why they can’t be watched in isolation, only the new ep5 and ep6 title crawls won’t make sense if watched this way.

Major changes:
• All films have new episode titles and title crawls
(https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jniKThfEReg3iZvgwJKJIy12gQ_Vhmt6eLlkNpihgRQ/edit?usp=sharing)
• Various minor scene and dialogue trims have been made throughout
• Various deleted scenes have been added (despite the OT deleted scenes being in poor condition, and the timestamp on part of the TFA deleted scene)
• Various cuts have been made throughout to maintain continuity, for example Padme doesn’t die in ep3, some dialogue cuts to Obi Wan and R2’s reunion in ep4, Vader’s reference to Obi-Wan rather than Padme in ep6 with respect to ep3, and all lines in ep7 stating that the stormtroopers are no longer clones have been removed
• In the PT the Illuminati subplot has been removed: the Trade Federation, Count Dooku, and the Separatists are not depicted as being allied with Darth Sidious (except where Dooku reveals that Nute Gunray was betrayed by Sidious). Darth Sidious does not appear until he is confronted by Mace Windu. The Separatists then perform the function in the PT that the Rebellion provides for the OT, and the Resistance for the ST
• In TPM all of Sidious’ scenes have been removed
• In AotC the forbidden love subplot has been removed and the detective subplot trimmed, as in the Attack of the Phantom edit
• In RotS the opening sequence has been heavily trimmed, including the buzz droids, elevator sequence, and crash landing; the duel between Obi-Wan and Grievous has also been shortened, from when the Republic armada arrives
• Rogue One has been given a title crawl, and various wipe transitions have been added
• For the OT Harmy’s Despecialised editions have been used as the primary source. The only SE shots used are the exterior shot of the rebel hangar on Yavin IV in ANH, some shots in Jabba’s palace and to remove Anakins eyebrows in RotJ
• In the OT the incest subplot has been removed: Luke no longer refers to Leia’s hologram as beautiful, Han doesn’t taunt Luke about being interested in Leia, Luke and Leia don’t kiss, and Han isn’t jealous of Luke in RotJ
• In the OT there is only one Death Star: it is not destroyed in ANH (in ANH the final battle has been trimmed and cut into the earlier escape from the Death Star sequence so that it is not destroyed here, though the sequence needs work it should give an idea of how it will play out), the new RotJ crawl attempts to justify its change in appearance, and the rebel briefing scene in RotJ has been trimmed accordingly
• For TFA, my edit is in line with the Restructured edit curated by Hal9000, and is partially sourced from that edit.
• In TFA R2 does not have the rest of the map; Rey uses the force to locate Luke

I only have a partial cutlist at the moment, detailing the most significant changes (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gdMdFvH6bLu-dVpSz_3RNNlh01LmNxcsAyrfQq-qOpk/edit?usp=sharing), and have also uploaded some demo scenes (https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B6VlVFdyzUPneEVVQlYwVk1jM2s?usp=sharing).

Titles and running times:
• Episode I - VEIL OF DARKNESS (at 94 minutes with 42 minutes cut, theatrical at 136 minutes)
• Episode II - A SEPARATIST THREAT (at 90 minutes with 52 minutes cut, theatrical at 142 minutes)
• Episode III - TWILIGHT OF THE REPUBLIC (at 99 minutes with 41 minutes cut, theatrical at 140 minutes)
• DOMINION OF THE SITH (Rogue One) (at 131 minutes with 3 minutes cut, theatrical at 134 minutes)
• Episode IV - A HIDDEN FORTRESS (at 105 minutes with 17 minutes cut, theatrical at 122 minutes)
• Episode V - THE FORCE UNKNOWN (at 121 minutes with 5 minutes cut, theatrical at 126 minutes)
• Episode VI - A NEW DAWN (at 111 minutes with 22 minutes cut, theatrical at 133 minutes)
• Episode VII - FATE OF THE REBELLION (at 126 minutes with 12 minutes cut, theatrical at 138 minutes)
• Episode VII - ODYSSEY OF DARKNESS?
• Episode IX - TRIUMPH OF THE FORCE?

References:
• Adywan’s Episode IV - A New Hope: Revisited, and Episode V - Empire Strikes Back: Revisited
• Digmodification’s Rise of the Rebellion, and Episode VII - Heir to the Force
• Hal 9000’s Episode I - Cloak of Deception, Episode II - The Approaching Storm, Episode III - Labyrinth of Evil, and Episode VII - The Force Awakens: Restructured
• Harmy’s Despecialized Editions for the OT
• Jackpumpkinhead’s Custom Crawl Creator
• L8wrtr’s Episode I - Shadow of the Sith, Episode II - The Republic Divided, and Episode III - Dawn of the Empire
• NeverarGreat’s Episode VIII - The Starlight Project (forthcoming)
• Octorox’s Episode I - The Phantom Menace - Faster, More Intense!, and Episode II - Attack of the Clones, Sanded Down
• Phantom Editor’s Episode I - The Phantom Edit, and Episode II - Attack of the Phantom
• Schorman’s HDTV Star Wars Saga Preservation for the PT
• Seciors’ Episode I - Return of the Sith, and Episode II - Army of the Republic
• Swagbeditor’s Episodes I, II, III - A Galaxy Betrayed

More specific references have been noted in the cutlist.

There are some further possibilities I’d like to pursue, but lack either the skill or time to follow up on. I may get to some of these tasks later on, though if anyone is interested in assisting or giving advice with these it would be much appreciated:
• Possibly redo the custom crawls in After Effects, mostly to try and fix letter spacing as I couldn’t figure out how to do it by line in Blender
• Remove slugs from single shot in ep2 assassination scene
• Remove ignited lightsabers from the background of a single shot in the ep2 arena battle, as in the Attack of the Phantom edit
• Colour some PT lightsabers yellow, as a reference to Knights of the Old Republic: Mace Windu, Ki-Adi-Mundi, and a few other background Jedi in the ep2 arena battle
• Colour youngling lightsabers white in ep2
• Dub General Grievous; I’ve written out new lines, but am unsure if I’ll be able to do this competently
• Remove planet in new Rogue One title crawl
• Remove Rogue One planet titles (preferably not by cropping)
• Add intercom voiceover (as in Rogue One) where Red and Gold squadrons depart Yavin IV for the Death Star in ep4
• Remove Yavin from the background of shots where Red and Gold squadrons approach the Death Star in ep4
• Remove OT deleted scene image noise/damage
• Colour C-3PO silver in early shots of the ep6 Tatooine sequence as, according to the restructure, he shouldn’t have arrived at Jabba’s palace yet
• Remove ST deleted scene timestamps

Post
#1159453
Topic
The Starlight Project Part 2: The Last Jedi (WIP)
Time

Your alternate crawl sounds good, but I always find it hard to tell without seeing it in motion. Though I’m not sure about “awaiting the return of the legendary Luke Skywalker”, I’d go with something on reigniting the rebellion here instead. Also, I’d say farthest rather than furthest in paragraph two.

Your idea for Holdo in TFA is interesting. If you could make it work, I think a close up of Holdo (something like with Korr Sella on the planet) would be great.