In response to Sky's OP:
Yup.
Lucas makes that little comment at the beginning of "The Beginning" (heh, "the beginning of the the beginning") documentary on the TPM dvd when he's doing the Leslie Stahl interview back in '99.
The Prequels are all him, the OT isn't.
re: what sky said,
That's why it would be nice for each of the three films to get a 3-disc blu-ray. If Lucas releases his most recent version of the trilogy in theaters (and c'mon you know he eventually will, the 3D craze would certainly give him an excuse), that could be what ends up on the first disc. The second disc could be the '97 version (mastered from the '97 IP's) and the third disc would be the original version. This would be a nice historical preservation of the three theatrically released versions of the movies.
There are 3-disc blu-ray cases that some of the studios use that don't even take up any more space than the ones that hold 2-discs or even 1-discs, so Lucas doesn't have much of an excuse there.
And guys, lemme just say it:
At this point, there's no question in my mind that when the OT hits blu-ray he'll AT LEAST throw in the remastered original versions. Each set will be at least two discs, mark my words. He KNOWS the money he'd be losing by not including it. Think of how many people will go out and buy blu-ray players just for this!
Yeah, maybe we won't get '97 Jabba, Luke's Cloud City scream and a "Galactic Celebration" sans Naboo and JarJar, but the originals will be there.
Oh, and 2012 would make the most sense at this point. It's the 35th, and blu-ray will have been on the market for just about as long as dvd was back in '04.
What's annoying is seeing so many movies, both new releases and catalog titles, being given such nice treatment on blu-ray while Lucas - a guy on Scorsese's film preservation board - keeps burying the original versions of his own material. I'm sure we'll see the original version of the OT nicely remastered for the blu-ray (if he can stamp out two-dvd9 sets for the '06 release, he can stamp out two-bd50 sets for the blu-ray), I've stopped worrying about that as it's an inevitably in my mind at this point, but it would really be nice to see the originals of Graffiti and THX nicely preserved on blu-ray. I wouldn't even care if the best existing prints aren't in great condition, just being able to watch them in hi-def would be a treat.
Oh, and I really hope that cgi shot from the Raiders HD broadcast doesn't end up on the blu-ray, but I'm not getting my hopes up because why would they have put it there if that's not what they were intending to eventually do? I guess if they know how much backlash there is against it they'll change their mind. Seriously, wtf was up with that? Whose idea was it, Lucas or Spielberg? Guess we'll never know.
Vaderisnothayden said:
Indiana Jones got more than just wires erased. There's that cgi shot added to Raiders. I wish he'd just leave it the fuck alone.
Which made its debut in an HD broadcast of all places!
Actually, in all these years I still haven't seen a breakdown of the erasures for the dvd release. All I've ever read was that they got rid of the reflection in the snake pit and erased something that was visible in the "bowling ball" shot. I've google searched it once or twice and come up with nothing. Maybe I'm just not using the right words. Does anyone know where I can find screenshot comparisons?
I honestly doubt that the movies won't be available individually when they hit blu-ray. Despite what George and Rick have been saying since '99, they and the rest of LFL know all too well how people feel about the movies and they're not gonna be stupid about how to make money off this release. Sure, there will probably be a saga boxset you can get, but they won't limit the options to that or even just two trilogy boxsets. My prediction is that the movies will be available individually and in a six-film set.
pjvader said:
2 words
3D blu-ray (or is that 3 words) i bet there is no star wars release until the 3D versions are completed then shown theatrically for the 35th anniversary then there will be the blu release by then 3D will either be passe or the norm (in terms of unavoidable when buying a new tv or blu-ray player) star wars only comes out on new formats when saturation has been proved unfortunately
What I really wouldn't be surprised to see happen (and, at the same time, have no idea how they would financially pull off) is what you're saying right here.
Someone wrote an article not too long ago about how Star Wars is the second highest grossing movie of all time in terms of domestic box office if you adjust for inflation (Gone with the Wind being the highest). All GL needs is to re-release it one last time and he's got his world title.
Avatar's massive box office success has probably made a 3D conversion of Star Wars an inevitability, honestly. The blu-ray spec was updated to allow 3D content to be stored on the discs, and the players are rolling out this year. The new spec requires that the discs be backward-compatible for the players that can't do 3D.
LFL, if you're reading this (and you're most likely not), I would be willing to spend between 30-40 dollars per movie for a blu-ray that has the following:
-Disc 1: Final / Most recent version
-Disc 2: '97 version
-Disc 3: original
In all honesty, and this is just my opinion, but I think that's a big part of the disappointment with the prequels. The people in their late 20's/early 30's in '99 had sooooo much more invested in it than people like me who were almost 14 at the time.
I agree with Pittrek. The PT should be watched first or not at all.
The Phantom Menace
Attack of the Clones
The first disc of Genndy's Clone Wars (Clone Wars Volume 1)
The First Chapter of Clone Wars Volume 2
All of the CGI Clone Wars stuff so far. The Movie would not come first chronologically, as there is at least one episode (The Hidden Enemy) set earlier.
The rest of Clone Wars Volume 2
Revenge of the Sith
Droids
A New Hope
The Holiday Special
Empire
The Two Ewok movies
Ewoks
Jedi
And no, I don't think you missed anything.
Megan Fox would probably get the medal for "doesn't do it for me." I saw Die Hard 4 and Transformers (in that order) on the same day (Transformers' opening day here in the States, actually) in theaters with a bunch of my friends. John McLane's daughter (Mary Elizabeth Winstead) definitely did it for me more than Megan Fox. Granted, it helped that I'd seen her as a cheerleader several months earlier in Grindhouse.
Actually, the time between the PT and the OT is gonna be covered by the live-action series .... if that ever happens. I'm sure it eventually will happen, LFL has to keep the franchise going somehow.
I really hope we get the original versions of THX and Graffiti on blu some day. Unless there's some sort of agreement with Lucas we don't know about, he has no control over those movies. THX is Warner's and Graffiti is Uni's. THX is such a short movie that WB could very easily include both versions on a single, dual-layered blu-ray disc (with either version on its own layer) and still have enough room leftover for all of the extras from the 2-disc dvd. Universal could just use seamless branching for a nice, all-inclusive blu-ray of Graffiti.
Why of course, good sir. I'm simply saying that from a mass-production standpoint, if they could stamp out two-disc sets (each disc dual-layered), they can do the same thing with blu-ray.
I guess my main point is that there's no excuse for them not to do that. They can come to a reasonable msrp for the sku's if it's just a two-disc set.
Lucasfilm could very easily give us a three-disc blu-ray for each film of the original trilogy. Remember, the Blade Runner set was only five discs because they were putting it out on both blu-ray and hddvd.
It went:
Disc 1: hi-def presentation of the final cut
disc 2: standard dvd containing the Dangerous Days documentary
Disc 3: hi-def presentation of the theatrical, international and director's cuts of the film, all seamlessly branched onto the same disc.
disc 4: standard dvd containing various bonus material
Disc 5: hi-def presentation of the workprint.
The VC-1 encodes on the hi-def discs were identical for both hddvd and blu-ray, and they couldn't be more than 30gb since that's the limit for hddvd. So, on the blu-ray version, 20gb is completely wasted on the hi-def discs, 20gb that could've been used to house the 9gb standard dvd files.
Aside from deleted scenes (which they can and should present in full high definition), the blu-ray can use bd-live to give the fans access to plenty of extras without the need to even use up any disc space. That means they have all the space they need (50gb) to give the films' video and audio the fullest quality available on home video.
But guess what, we're not even asking for all that.
ALL we are asking for is the original version on blu-ray.
Just one measly 50gb disc for each film.
I'm not naive enough to think that we won't at least have to buy a two-disc set that has the 20xx version on the first and the doubleoriginal on the second, but still, can Lucasfilm not even give us a two-disc set?
They gave us two-disc dvd's, I say they can do it again for blu-ray.
Make it happen, George.
It would be cool if we got another Star Wars trilogy every decade-and-a-half. Hell, go all the way up to Episode XV. The PT was George's "I can do whatever I want" project. An ST can be more in the style of the OOT.
I sold off my THX-1138 two-disc dvd some months back after hearing early word of a 2010 release date for the blu-ray. Looks like that date is somewhat more official now.
Sucks how WB can give us a Terminator Salvation blu-ray with each cut on a separate disc and not do the same thing for THX.
Lucasfilm and 20th Century Fox Home Entertainment need to do right by the fans! The excuse of not wanting the original versions out there doesn't work anymore because, guess what, they were officially put out there (just in 1993 quality).
If they seriously plan on streeting the blu-ray as early as next year, I really don't see how "Star Wars in hi-def!" alone will make it a bestseller. DVD was a much different situation. It was people finally upgrading from vhs and laserdisc (formats from the mid-70's) to "everyone's favorite format."
The smart move would be to release the films individually (like in '06) but include the original version on a second disc in the same quality as the 20xx version. Just slap a sticker on the front reading "For the first time ever, the remastered original version in hi-def!" There's no way that won't guarantee way more copies getting sold.
The prequels' discs could easily include the theatrical versions with seamless branching, no need for a second disc. Phantom Menace is the obvious example, since they are likely to replace the weird-looking puppet Yoda with the much more Empire/Jedi-looking digital model from Clones and Sith. I would still want them to include the '99 version of the movie, if only for preservationist/historical reasons.
Speaking of which - and I don't wanna get too ahead of myself here - what are your thoughts on including the '97 SE and making ANH, Empire and Jedi three discs each? They'd still have plenty of room across the three discs for whatever extras they wanted to include (Blade Runner only would've needed the three blu-ray discs if they hadn't also put it out on hddvd day-and-date, and we don't have that problem anymore now that the format race is over). I certainly think it would be interesting from a historical perspective, to let people see where all the controversy started. If the '97 interpositives are still lying around, all LFL would need is to make a fresh hi-def master.
Seriously, I find it just a tad ridiculous how Blade Runner, the movie that got swept under in the summer of E.T., can get the ultimate home video treatment, but Star Wars can't because the rights are owned by LFL and not a major Hollywood studio. It's been said before, but George Lucas' career has been rife with irony.
Lucas' role in the prequels should have been the same as Empire Strikes Back:
Write the story and pay for it, let other people do the rest.
Instead, he decided to write and direct it all by himself (Jonathan Hales co-wrote the Clones screenplay, credit where credit's due).
The Special Edition in '97 was Lucas going "I am the auteur of these movies even though I only directed one of them."
But that's the thing. Giving the OT an update in the form of the SE wouldn't have been so bad if it didn't mean going onto a PT where close to every last shot has some sort of cgi effect in it. It's pretty ridiculous when you consider how each of the original films only had a year of post-production whereas the prequels had two years.
Wow, just wrote out several paragraphs and then accidentally closed the tab, blast. Must remap the mouse pad and left/right clickers at some point.
Anyway, the gist of what I was writing is this:
Do you think Lucas' reasoning for leaving the SE at 1080 comes from the fact that the prequels' effects were mostly rendered at only 2K (if even that)?
Wow, first I heard Bradley Cooper mention that he'd seen him and James Cameron on the red carpet, but now the show has started and George is literally at the front of the closest table to the microphone!
If WB chose to release a bd with the original version of THX or if Uni chose to do the same thing with Graffiti, would LFL be able to legally stop them?
Zombie, you're mistaken about the opening of THX-1138. It's "American Zoetrope," Coppola's company, that you see at the very beginning, not LFL. LFL doesn't own any kind of rights to that movie, WB does. WB actually announced in a transcribed live chat on digitalbits that they were looking at a 2010 blu-ray release for it.
It's the same kind of situation with the first American Graffiti. That's Universal's property.
That reminds me, I should totally put a link in my avsforum sig. I post over there from time to time (same handle).
How many signatures did the old petition get?
I'm surprised how dead this thread is considering .... well, considering what it is.
Are any of you guys actually gonna buy the blu-ray if it doesn't have the remastered OOT in it?
Fooled me once with dvd, shame on you Lucas. Fool me with the next format, shame on me. That's the problem here. Lucas thinks that "Star Wars in 1080p!" will be enough for even the biggest hater to go out and buy it. The sad thing is that he might be right. Guys, the big message we need to send is all the potential money LFL will be losing if they don't include the OOT. They're gonna have to include an entire additional 50 gig disc with each movie in order to give us what we want anyway. Sure, I'd be thrilled if they gave each movie anything remotely approaching the Blade Runner / CE3K treatment, but this is Star Wars and it has become a mere product after all these years. They put out a four-disc set, charged $70 for it, and made the highest single-day sales in the history of the dvd format.
Blu-ray is a different story. For one thing, we have to wait and see what the deal is with the 3D conversion. I'm really starting to think it won't happen, if only because I just don't get how they're going to re-release SIX MOVIES in theaters and still make a profit after such an expensive conversion process. The industry just standardized 3D blu-ray though, so maybe we haven't heard the last of all this.
We also have to remember that the live-action show will be hitting around the same time and Lucas still doesn't have a distributor for it. I can't help but wonder how 20th Century Fox's distribution rights to the six-film saga is gonna play into all this.
I don't know when the old petition got started, before '04 or after, but this time around we're getting it out there well before the initial blu-ray is hitting (Bill Hunt puts it at 2011 at the earliest). This gives us time to get more signatures.
Jay, the twitter message is a few characters too long. You might want to revise it. I simply deleted the part where it says originaltrilogy.com since that's in the actual address already.
Gil Taylor, Star Wars' DP, was a "special effects photographer" on Dam Busters.