The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released) — Page 705

May I have the download link?

Ditto, a download link would be awesome. Thanks!

Would Love a link!

Were the color and audio issues fixed?

That’s understandable. Take your time, Hal.

For what it’s worth, I tried the Ahch-To flashback scene with headphones on and it’s certainly a lot more audible. So I definitely get where you’re coming from. That being said, I do think all the lines after “She was quick to learn in our training…” and before “A thousand generations…” could use a at least a little more volume. Specifically because the way the AI produced those lines has his voice going really quiet in certain places, like “our father”. In a larger room, with just TV speakers, it’s definitely hard to make out what he’s saying.

Please don’t take this as any indicator that I want you to rush an amended v5 along, I’m purely trying to save you the hassle of ever having to touch this project again. However, I did notice on my most recent watch-through that there is a Threepio line using the old AI voice model (based on Lego video game lines) and it sticks out pretty poorly. I have provided the more updated lines below which use his TROS dialogue as the input:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1yqdpXVvX-lVH1Ki8_SLrB6_TJ5O3DD5D?usp=sharing

I swear to God that this is the last thing on my list lol. I just figured I wouldn’t mention it in my last post because I didn’t want to force a new version. Again, even if some new technology development comes along, I’m not going to expect you to add more stuff in. v5 should remain final for this project. The main reason I’m suggesting this change is because we’ve already updated all the other AI Threepio lines for v5 and this one just slipped through the cracks without me noticing.

Omg I just about did the same thing again. I’m not even sure why I have that voice model still saved, because I gave you lines from the old model. I was wondering why it wasn’t working well!

Just gimme a few.

EDIT: I have added in a series of lines I enjoy, anyone feel free to let me know if you want alternatives:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1yqdpXVvX-lVH1Ki8_SLrB6_TJ5O3DD5D?usp=drive_link

I know it’s way way past discussion, but I just skimmed through V5 and I gotta say, I still really don’t like the final AI lines about Leia on Ahch-To, they feel completely out of place on the scene and really took me out of it. Luke’s pep talk to Rey is supposed to be about how she shouldn’t give up on being a Jedi out of fear of turning evil, yet he goes on to tell her about how Leia gave up on being a Jedi out of fear of turning evil, and that’s supposed to inspire her? Even if the original lines are also about how Leia didn’t become a Jedi, at least there the implication was that Rey was destined to pick up and finish her Jedi path, which would give Rey motivation. Here Leia just gave up out of fear, lost everything and died. It’s just such a downer no matter how you spin it, and feels at odds with what’s supposed to be the scene where Rey regains her hope and resolve.

I also feel like putting so much focus on Leia takes it away from the legacy of the Jedi, which is more important to Rey’s journey and the overarching thread of the saga. “A thousand generations live in you now, let Leia’s legacy guide you on Exegol”. That doesn’t even make sense, Leia wasn’t a Jedi, those two lines have no relation to one another, and it’s the Jedi that guide her on Exegol, it’s the Jedi that stand behind her and help vanquish the Emperor. It was nice to add Leia’s voice to the moment before Rey stands up, but she shouldn’t overshadow a thousand generations of actual Jedi.

I get the desire to give Leia a bit more on this movie, but the scene on Ahch-To is not and should not be all about Leia, the focus should be on the Jedi legacy and Rey’s role as it’s heir, the bit about Leia and the flashback should serve that purpose, and not the other way around.

I disagree. Allow me to explain it like this: the (new) purpose of Luke’s pep talk is to demonstrate that fear/hatred has impacted the decisions of him and Leia in negative ways, but when they were finally able to rise above it, that’s when wonderful things begin to happen.

Luke feared failure and the role of the Jedi in the galaxy in causing it. By the end of TLJ, he announces himself as a Jedi once more and inspires the entire galaxy. In this new chain of events, Leia feared the darkness that came from her father, and chose to forsake her Jedi path. However, when she sees Rey, a young girl with the darkness of Palpatine in her, she rectifies her past mistake. Instead of fearing Rey or hating her for what she can’t control, she takes up her Jedi journey once more and takes on Rey as an apprentice. Leia has learned from her own personal experience in life that she has the capacity to choose love over hatred; this isn’t something ingrained in her because of her father’s DNA.

This is what Luke is trying to tell Rey: follow Leia’s legacy of not fearing that you’ll give into hatred like your ancestors. You have the power to not fall into that trap, as some things are stronger than blood. In your post, you’re making the mistake of assuming that Leia isn’t a Jedi, but this just isn’t true. By training Rey, she has taken on the role of a Jedi master. So not only is she confronting the fear of becoming like Darth Vader again, but she is also confronting the hatred that she surely harbors for Palpatine. The fact that she is able to look past that Rey is a Palpatine and look at her as her own daughter is Leia’s legacy.

EDIT: Perhaps there is indeed a better way to convey all of this, but it would have to replace the line of “Despite losing everything, and everyone, Leia always chose compassion over hatred.” It would have to be something along the lines of “Leia confronted her fear by training you as a Jedi, and chose love over hatred”.

I understand what the lines are trying to convey, I just don’t think they succeed. There’s too much focus on Leia’s failures for it to feel like a positive/reassuring pep talk. The main takeaways most would get from those lines are that Leia gave up on being a Jedi due to fear and that she lost everything and everyone that she cared about, which is just very bleak. I mean, compare it to what Han tells Ben: “your mother’s gone, but what she stood for, what she fought for, that’s not gone”. I think this scene needs a similar, positive spin, which again is what the original lines did by making it Rey’s destiny to finish Leia’s Jedi path.

Then there’s the issue of the idea that Leia would renounce the Jedi out of fear of “the hatred that consumed her father”, that just feels out of character for me. There’s no reason to believe Leia would go down a dark path after dedicating her whole life to the fight against opression. Furthermore, in TFA she says she wanted Ben to train with Luke specifically because “there was too much Vader in him”. Now, why would she send her son to train with Luke because there was darkness in him, when she stopped training with Luke out of fear of the darkness in her? This is completely contradictory, she would’ve forbid Ben from training in the Force if she believed that could fuel one’s darkness.

But she didn’t, because that’s exactly what Jedi training is supposed to be about, learning to control your emotions, rejecting the easy & seductive path. Obviously in the case of Ben it backfired, but he was too far gone (and even then Leia didn’t lose hope in him). Leia never shows any such signs of darkness, and if anything it’d make MORE sense for her to seek Jedi training to quell any potential darkness, just like she did with her son.

Rejecting the Jedi seems like a major sin for the story this movie (and this whole trilogy) is trying to tell, I mean there was an entire movie about how bad it was for Luke to reject the Jedi, and he only did so after everything went down in flames. For Leia to give up over some vague fear of inner darkness makes her look weak and foolish. She would need some major motivation (like a premonition of her son’s death) for her to throw the towel immediately.

And no, Leia was never a Jedi, she gave up on it along with her saber on the last night of her training, so she never became a Jedi (here you’re even replacing that line so we don’t know how far along she was in training with Luke). She was not a Jedi in TFA or TLJ, Luke was the last Jedi, then Rey took over after him. In this film we see Leia taking on a mentor role for Rey, and it’s explained she can do this because she trained with Luke when she was young, but that does not make her a “Jedi Master”. She doesn’t “teach” Rey anything, she just takes her to the place where she trained with Luke 30 years ago, and tries to give her encouragement along the way, while Rey runs training courses and studies the ancient Jedi texts. Rey is the sole heir/last hope of the Jedi, Palpatine tells Kylo killing Rey will “end the Jedi.” Leia is never part of that conversation, because she’s not and never was a Jedi.

Burbin said:

There’s too much focus on Leia’s failures for it to feel like a positive/reassuring pep talk.

This is intentional. The focus is on Leia’s failures and fears because this is also what Rey has been going through throughout this entire movie. She keeps on just about killing her friends, and she fears that her fate is to take the Sith throne. For Luke to reveal to her that the woman she looks up to with such admiration has gone through the same exact struggles that she has (and, in fact, also tried to give up at one point like both Rey and Luke) but finally chose to continue her Jedi path anyway is what is supposed to inspire Rey back to action. Previously, Rey was treating Leia with such reverence and respect because she figured that she was infallible. This is demonstrated by giving her the lightsaber back initially and her not retorting to Kylo’s claim that she can’t go back to Leia now because of her mistakes.

Then there’s the issue of the idea that Leia would renounce the Jedi out of fear of “the hatred that consumed her father”, that just feels out of character for me. There’s no reason to believe Leia would go down a dark path after dedicating her whole life to the fight against opression.

Bruh. Leia’s whole planet was literally blown up by the Empire. That left her with literally nothing except the fight and a desire for justice. There HAS to be some level of hatred and anger at the enemy burrowed in there. Especially when her own father allowed it all to happen.

And in Star Wars, once you start down the dark path, it corrupts you. So even if somebody like Leia were to use her anger for righteous things, it would turn out badly for everyone.

Furthermore, in TFA she says she wanted Ben to train with Luke specifically because “there was too much Vader in him”. Now, why would she send her son to train with Luke because there was darkness in him, when she stopped training with Luke out of fear of the darkness in her? This is completely contradictory, she would’ve forbid Ben from training in the Force if she believed that could fuel one’s darkness.

It’s important to consider that Leia simply feared confronting that dark potential within her. She doesn’t know if that is also something Ben would also fear facing. Training in the Force is a personal journey, and in Leia’s case she just didn’t trust herself enough to partake at that time. However, she isn’t prejudiced, and wants Ben to give it a try to see if it can still help him. I don’t see the problem here.

Leia never shows any such signs of darkness, and if anything it’d make MORE sense for her to seek Jedi training to quell any potential darkness, just like she did with her son.

We see signs of darkness by the way that she defeats Luke in the flashback. True, we could have used a lot more, but this feels like something that would be explored in more depth by the comics, books, etc. And, as I stated before, she personally found that Jedi training made her afraid for her own mental wellbeing. She was able to control these emotions better following her mother’s path of politics. However, that is no reason to deny it for her son. Everyone is different.

For Leia to give up over some vague fear of inner darkness makes her look weak and foolish. She would need some major motivation (like a premonition of her son’s death) for her to throw the towel immediately.

I think what you’re describing is a lose-lose scenario. A premonition causing Leia to give up is also extremely short-sighted and foolish, because we know that the future is always in motion. Luke didn’t actually give up being a Jedi because of a premonition, but rather because of what he did immediately after seeing one. That was foolish of Luke in the moment, but it’s at least it’s more believable as a spur-of-the-moment kind of thing. As something that Leia brings up with Luke personally on the final night of her training, and continuously chooses as her son falls/the First Order rises, it’s absolutely stupid.

Yes, ideally there would be more context surrounding Leia’s inner darkness, but it’s a lot more understandable than some extremely contrived prophecy dropped at the last second which was always going to happen no matter what choice Leia made in the past.

In this film we see Leia taking on a mentor role for Rey, and it’s explained she can do this because she trained with Luke when she was young, but that does not make her a “Jedi Master”. She doesn’t “teach” Rey anything, she just takes her to the place where she trained with Luke 30 years ago, and tries to give her encouragement along the way, while Rey runs training courses and studies the ancient Jedi texts. Rey is the sole heir/last hope of the Jedi, Palpatine tells Kylo killing Rey will “end the Jedi.” Leia is never part of that conversation, because she’s not and never was a Jedi.

That doesn’t stop Rey from referring to her as “master”. True, I suppose that Jedi are often referred to by that title without the actual rank, but it still implies Leia having at least some sort of Jedi rank. Most certainly a Knight. If in canon that was her final night of training, then she almost certainly has enough training to be Rey’s formal master. The only reason we don’t see her teach Rey anything personally is because of Carrie’s passing. Nothing more or less. But I’m fairly certain that she does these things off-screen.

I’d be down to take a second look at the line I mentioned in my last post. Because a viewer can definitely come away from this sequence believing that Leia made the right choice in giving up and that Luke is telling Rey not to be a Jedi, either. The goal was to emphasize that Leia put off confronting her fear, but once she did that she was able to make the right choice. And as Luke says, “confronting fear is the destiny of a Jedi.” Therefore, Leia is a true Jedi.

I think a lot of what you’re saying is just arguing semantics. There is a very clear and glaring problem with two very conflicting perspectives. Either Leia belives Jedi training would help with dark tendencies, or she believes it would make things worse. What she says in TFA contradicts what Luke says about her here, plain & simple.

I’m talking about what is actually said and shown on screen, you have this whole other movie in your head where Leia has a whole character arc, but as you said, we got very little Carrie on the film. We don’t see Leia “continue her Jedi path”, we see Leia helping out Rey on HER Jedi path. We don’t see Leia struggle with inner darkness, we see her confidently pull her son back to the light. And we have TWO whole movies where Leia is very clearly NOT a Jedi in any way. It’s stupid for Rey to suddenly be calling her “master” now (add that to the stupid pile for this movie), but at least I can see it as a simple sign of respect towards a mentor that’s trying to help her down the right path, that does not make Leia an actual “Jedi Master”. She was always in tune with the Force and she once trained with Luke years ago, but she never practiced their religion. And it’s better to keep it that way for the sake of continuity with the rest of the trilogy, which I thought was the whole point of this fan edit.

Burbin said:

I think a lot of what you’re saying is just arguing semantics. There is a very clear and glaring problem with two very conflicting perspectives. Either Leia belives Jedi training would help with dark tendencies, or she believes it would make things worse. What she says in TFA contradicts what Luke says about her here, plain & simple.

I would say that this is just black and white thinking. The life of a Jedi is not easy whatsoever (Qui-Gon line from TPM). There can absolutely be a certain level of fear attached to tackling such a lifestyle without thinking that the whole thing is rigged for you to fail. It’s much more complex than that. On the one hand, Jedi training gives you techniques and exercises to keep your emotions in balance, but it also presents you with WAY more opportunities for things to get out of line - such as being in a lightsaber duel with somebody. We see this all throughout the movie with Rey, where she slips up in highly intense moments. Which is why we may just have to revert to the idea that Leia preferred diplomacy and forming relationships to what the life of a Jedi demanded of her.

And we have TWO whole movies where Leia is very clearly NOT a Jedi in any way. It’s stupid for Rey to suddenly be calling her “master” now (add that to the stupid pile for this movie).

Yes, she didn’t have that role in 7 or 8, but with Luke gone, Rey did need a Jedi teacher to continue her training. Leia very clearly stepped in to fill that role for this film. This is clearly set up at the end of TLJ with Leia being by the broken lightsaber and assuring Rey that they have everything they need. To say that she didn’t become a teacher to Rey is nonsense. You’re the one just arguing semantics by calling her a “mentor”.

Ultimately, while what we’ve got for v5 isn’t perfect (as you’ve demonstrated in some ways), the idea that Leia refused to train over the course of 30 years because of a vision that her son dies on her Jedi path is so unbelievably bad. The first thing Luke would tell her after revealing such a thing is that the last time he made the decision to stop his Jedi training to save his loved ones based on a vision (ESB) it didn’t work out well for him. Nor did it for their father (ROTS). Again, I can understand Luke making a hasty mistake in the hut with Ben Solo, but that’s it.

I think there are ways to improve the dialogue in the scene. Perhaps the first line could be changed to suggest that Leia feared something else, such as temptation. And the next line could say that Rey renewed her faith in both herself and the Jedi. But the throughline on Ahch-To which makes the most sense to me is that everyone has their own fears (everyone is flawed) and that Rey is just as capable as Luke/Leia to overcome them and make the right choices.

This is a pick your poison scenario. We all know this movie (well, the sequel trilogy) is an absolute mess in terms of coherent narrative, character motivations and lore, so there’s only so much one can fix; no matter how we play with it, it’s always gonna be fundamentally broken at its core (unless we redo the entire movie, line by line, shot by shot).

I agree 100%. But as I hinted at with my last post, I think v5 has the most thematically relevant solution for the Leia flashback. Previously, Ahch-To felt kind of disjointed. Luke was talking about confronting fear, and then was suddenly talking about how Rey is prophesied to finish Leia’s Jedi path but at the cost of Ben Solo’s life. So Rey doesn’t really have a choice in the matter. Very bizarre.

We are yet to hear Hal’s opinion on this matter, but here is what I think would be a more clear set of dialogue for an amended v5:

“She was quick to learn in our training. But Leia feared the hatred that consumed our father, choosing instead to follow our mother’s path. Leia faced her fear by training you as a Jedi, and chose love over hatred. A thousand generations live in you now, but this is your fight. Let Leia’s legacy guide you on Exegol.”

I finally saw V5, and I was blown away with how much the movie has improved from the theatrical release. I didn’t see what others were talking about regarding Luke’s force ghost being red instead of blue, it looked fine to me. The ONLY thing that was distinctly noticeable was the line of dialogue from C3PO that sounded off, which I believe was the Lego star wars line that Jar Jar Bricks was referring to. I can’t remember the line since I watched it last week, but it definitely sounded like it was a different pitch and his head movements didn’t seem to match. But aside from that minor quirk, I don’t see anything egregious. As for the discussion between Luke/Leia/Rey, I understand both sides, but with what options we have, I think Hal did the best he could, and I think it’s fine as is. You can only polish a turd so much.

Overall, it’s a fantastic improvement. Thank you so much!

I very much have enjoyed all of these edits as they’ve improved with each version. The only thing I think might not age that well is they may imply in the new Rey movie that Kylo’s spirit literally lives inside of her, hence why he doesn’t have a Force ghost at the end. It’s possible.