The MeBeJedi feedback thread — Page 5

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 1-Nov-2004 11:15 PM
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The AVIs are filter-free. Nothing was changed or added. That was the point of those MPEGs. I'm not going to do anything to the AVIs until I've corrected the glitches.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Zion
Time: 1-Nov-2004 11:17 PM
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hmm, maybe that happened during the encoding then?

I'm going to check mine when I get home from work and see if I have the same thing in my mpeg.

My Projects:
[Holiday Special Hybrid DVD v2]
[X0 Project]
[Backstroke of the West DVD]
[ROTS Theatrical DVD]

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 1-Nov-2004 11:19 PM
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Which frames are you referring to?

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Zion
Time: 1-Nov-2004 11:29 PM
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The shot where Vader and the other Tie Pilot hit each other and clear out of the trench. Look at the walls of the trench.

My Projects:
[Holiday Special Hybrid DVD v2]
[X0 Project]
[Backstroke of the West DVD]
[ROTS Theatrical DVD]

Author: WaSaJedi
Time: 2-Nov-2004 12:04 AM
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Hi, it's me (I changed my email, and now my account is goofed up

).

Anyways, I think what you are referring to is dot crawl. Maybe you could post a screencap and circle the "offending" parts.

Author: Laserman
Time: 2-Nov-2004 6:15 PM
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OK guys, some explanation is probably in order here going on the confused questions...

1) The laserdiscs are very 'bright' compared to the official dvd release and to most of the bootlegs. Laserdisc transfers in general tend to be lighter, and most laserdiscs do not put out 'superblack' or 0IRE.

2) I believe the video posted was the direct capture from laserdisc - So if they look grey and bright exactly the same as the laserdisc, this is a good thing. It means that all the available detail from the laserdisc has been captured as a master to work with, This is what you *should* be aiming for when starting off on this process.

3) This doesn't mean that the final result will look like this. With colour correction tools available in most packages, you can adjust a cetain 'black level' down to absolute black, restoring the blackness of space for example without really affecting the stars, or losing shadow detail. You can also adjust the gamma settings to change the levels of part of the spectrum of the image, so you can get a wider dynamic range, with nice inky blacks without crushing them or losing your whites. In combustion you can colour correct just parts of an image etc.

In other words, you want to capture the footage 'as is' and work with it from there - you don't want to do it *as part of the capture process* as this means you are throwing away information you may wish to restore later.

Many of the current bootlegs suffer from crushed whites and blacks, i.e. You lose detail in Vader's cloak, and on the stormtroopers armour for instance - as all darkish areas become black, and all quite white areas become uniform white.
Although this makes them look 'punchier' it really degrades the image. The idea is to get black back down to true black, white up to true white and keep all the detail in the gradients in between - that way you get the punch AND the detail.
I believe that's what mebe is trying to do. If I am talking out of my rectum mebejedi, please jump in!
(Hmmm that didn't come out right....)

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 2-Nov-2004 6:19 PM
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That's precisely it.

Vegas has a "fliter" (if you will) called Restore Black. It starts with the darkest colors, and works up from there as you increase the setting. This should provide a "darker" space, without affect the stars or surrounding brightness/contrast levels - otherwise, you get "twinkly" stars, which is very annoying.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Laserman
Time: 3-Nov-2004 5:40 PM
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So where exactly are you up to with your experiment now?

Author: ADigitalMan
Time: 3-Nov-2004 8:29 PM
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I downloaded the 16x9 Tantive .mpeg file but get an error opening it in Windows Media every time. As much as I HATE asking totally novice questions, do I need a particular codec to view this, or a different player? Thanks in advance.

I am fluent in over six million forms of procrastination.

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 3-Nov-2004 9:54 PM
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I hate to tell you, but as far as I know, it's a standard MPEG codec. I try not to mess around with odd codecs. Hell, I can't even make a decent looking XVID file.

As to Laserman's question, I'm just taking out glitches right now, but I could create an MPEG with the "Restore Black" function for a short demonstration.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Moth3r
Time: 4-Nov-2004 3:00 AM
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Originally posted by: ADigitalMan
I downloaded the 16x9 Tantive .mpeg file but get an error opening it in Windows Media every time. As much as I HATE asking totally novice questions, do I need a particular codec to view this, or a different player? Thanks in advance.

WMP includes MPEG-1 decoders by default, but to view MPEG-2 (which is what this is) you will need to have DVD playback software installed such as PowerDVD or WinDVD. Alternatively you could use Media Player Classic or VLC Media Player.

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Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 4-Nov-2004 7:53 AM
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This makes sense. Thanks, Moth3r.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Patrick R.
Time: 4-Nov-2004 10:06 PM
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Things are looking good MeBeJedi. They look much better than that crap Episode III trailer. I'm sorry that I may be the only one, but Episode III looks like shi* to me.

So, are you still using Vegas 4 or did you upgrade to 5. I just subscribed to this thread and haven't had time to read over it all yet.

Patrick

"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk." - Tuco from The Good, The Bad And The Ugly

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 4-Nov-2004 10:07 PM
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Hi, Pat! "It's PAT!"

I've been using Vegas 5 for some time now.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: ADigitalMan
Time: 4-Nov-2004 11:19 PM
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Rats. I do have power DVD, and a whole host of different Mpeg-2 decoders. I can't figure for the life of me why I can't see the file. My browser must be corrupting the download or something.

MBJ, do you have the ability to zip the files on the server without wasting your time re-uploading?

I am fluent in over six million forms of procrastination.

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 4-Nov-2004 11:24 PM
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DO you mean put them in a zip file? You can't get much more compression from video files.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: ADigitalMan
Time: 4-Nov-2004 11:33 PM
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Yeah. Not so much to compress for downloading, but to change the file type. I've found that browsers rarely screw with the binary data being transmitted in a zip file. Unfortunately, IE loves to screw up multimedia files for no tangible reason. It's not a major problem, but when it is a problem, it's usually pretty chronic. I can probably count on my hands the number of times I've seen this problem on my end, but zipping the source has always worked well for fixing the problem.

If you can't do that at the source, no bother though. I think I'll fire up the trusty ol' Netscape 4.7, who treats file downloads nicely almost always, even if it makes pages look like ass.

Update:
I downloaded with Netscape but still had the same problem. It's gotta be my Windows Media player, but I am totally lost on fixing it. Quicktime refuses to open it too. Alas ... t'weren't meant to be.

I am fluent in over six million forms of procrastination.

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 4-Nov-2004 11:39 PM
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That sounds good. I don't have access to the server, so obi skywalker would have to zip it up. Good luck!

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Moth3r
Time: 5-Nov-2004 3:14 AM
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You may be interested to know that I've tested tantive_16x9.mpeg, and it won't play on Windows Media Player for me, either. WMP from verison 7 onwards is bloated crap if you ask me, I was a bit annoyed that WMP9 was forced on me with SP2.

BTW it plays fine on PowerDVD and Media Player Classic.

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Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 5-Nov-2004 7:20 AM
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So, how does it look (other than the brightness, of course.) No one has compared the 16x9 version to the 4x3 yet.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: ADigitalMan
Time: 5-Nov-2004 9:12 AM
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FINALLY! I figured how to open in PowerDVD (I had to download the latest version and run the trial). Brightness issue not withstanding, it does look very good. Far crisper than the five-star 1997 SE discs, for certain. That said, I know you're doing some work to them, and I look forward to a side-by-side comparison of the straight capture vs the retouched version.

Until the official DVD came out, I never in all my hundreds of viewings noticed all of the green flashes during the saber duel. They come in well in your capture too, but not to the obnoxious level they are on the DVD.

I am fluent in over six million forms of procrastination.

Author: Moth3r
Time: 5-Nov-2004 10:36 AM
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Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
So, how does it look (other than the brightness, of course.) No one has compared the 16x9 version to the 4x3 yet.

It's only possible to make a fair comparison of the 4:3 and 16:9 versions when playing on a TV, IMO. From what I see on the PC monitor they look pretty good.

Talking about the brightness (sorry) have you thought about changing it before capture rather than apply filters afterwards? (I have the opposite with my caps in that they're too dark.) VirtualVCR gives me the following options tab that might be able to help:

http://img123.exs.cx/img123/6929/settings.png

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Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 5-Nov-2004 11:46 AM
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"Talking about the brightness (sorry) have you thought about changing it before capture rather than apply filters afterwards?"

This was how I originally did it. Unfortunately, it ended up doing more harm than good. The BIGGEST problem being: if you realize later, like Zion did, that the settings are bad, you have to recapture the whole thing over. It's extremely difficult to remove the effects of such settings after the fact, without distorting something else in the video.

Now that I have a properly calibrate capture, I have a perfect reference with which to compare (as opposed to starting up the LD player whenever I want a comparison shot.) If I don't like the effect of any filters I've used, I still have a pristine master to work with.

When I get home, I'll show you guys my settings.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.

Author: Laserman
Time: 6-Nov-2004 12:49 AM
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I can't emphasise enough the importance of not messing with the brightness/contrast of the original capture. You NEED to capture the full gamut of the original... ALL the greyscale, only then can you correct it in a way that gets the blacks right with still keeping the detail.
Plus, the laserdisc is all over the place in some scenes as regards to black levels, capture those too dark and you can never get that detail back!

Author: MeBeJedi
Time: 6-Nov-2004 7:59 AM
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Here are my settings...

Brightness 1884
Contrast 79
Hue -704
Saturation 151
Sharpness 53
Gamma 100
White balance 0

"It's only possible to make a fair comparison of the 4:3 and 16:9 versions when playing on a TV, IMO. From what I see on the PC monitor they look pretty good."

True, but this comparison was mainly for people who wanted to see the difference on their computer monitors. People kept saying there was a noticeable difference, so now's their chance to compare two identical segments in each format.

MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.

MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.

JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.