The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS ** — Page 167

The Dark Empire said:

oojason said:

Collipso said:

It really seemed like Finn was more than able to destroy the cannon to me. He was still going relatively fast in the cannon’s direction, while all the others turned back, which it in itself is a plot hole (how did Rose even get to him?) and something I noticed upon first viewing.

Uh this cannon! Reminds me of this:

Not a very good idea for Star Wars.

GROND! GROND! GROND!

That’s very much what they were going for, in fact I am pretty sure the cannon was referred to as a “Ram cannon” at one point. Star Wars has always had that fairy tale, Knights of the Round Table, ingredient - so it seems quite fitting that they should ‘suggest’ a medieval castle siege.

The Resistance Base is the castle, AT-ATs are the ballistas, the Ram cannon is the battering ram, and the speeders are the brave but foolhardy cavalry charge.

liamnotneeson said:

TV’s Frink said:

Third watch today. Wife insisted. I had a ridiculous lunch of Chicken strips, fries, and a grasshopper milkshake. Felt like a kid again for a few hours.

Still really, really good. 3rd best or 4th best SW movie. Yeah there’s little issues here and there but it’s a movie, to paraphrase Joel, and we all should really just relax.

8.72ish/10

Wtf I agree with Frink

It’s okay, it happens to the best of us from time to time.

Ok, so I was thinking about the movie again and some different thoughts came to mind, such as Poe’s arc. I mean, sure he’s a hothead, but his entire arc isn’t his fault. Leia basically goes along with his plan to take down the huge monster ship I don’t remember the name (I’m sure she could’ve called off all the bombers and fighters if she wanted to, and she outranks Poe, so…), then when a lot of people die he basically takes all of the responsibility. And in the end, destroying the ship was the right decision anyway. Of course, these are nitpicks, so not valid criticism.

Another thing is that it seems the dark side and the light side of the force are inverted in the Sequel Trilogy. In The Empire Strikes Back, Yoda tells Luke that the dark side is easier and more seductive. In Return of the Jedi Luke is tempted. That’s what it’s about - an easy tempting way, in exchange for your humanity and the good in you. The light side, on the other hand, is just as powerful, but you have to be fully committed to it, hardworking, focused, you have to let go of things that will not be good for you. Resist the temptations. It’s the hard path, the one that takes time.

But when you come to think about it, Rey is more in tune with the ways of the dark side, while Kylo’s journey resembles that of a Jedi, or a light side user.

I’m sure all of this has been mentioned already, but these are just some quick few thoughts that came to mind, that I felt are worth sharing.

So tell me something, just who was Luke’s equal in the dark side in the OT? As one rises in one side of the force, another rises on the opposite side, right? It couldn’t have been Vader, he rose to power a lot early in the PT and he didn’t get more powerful as Luke got more powerful. Also if that idea is true, there should have been a lot more dark jedis around during the PT, one for every jedi.

In ESB, Obiwan says that if Luke goes to face Vader he will face him alone, “I can not help you”. But look what Yoda did in TLJ. Sure seems like Obiwan could have lent a hand now.

Warbler said:
Sure seems like Obiwan could have lent a hand now.

That’s a bit insensitive, poor old one-handed Luke…

Warbler said:

So tell me something, just who was Luke’s equal in the dark side in the OT? As one rises in one side of the force, another rises on the opposite side, right? It couldn’t have been Vader, he rose to power a lot early in the PT and he didn’t get more powerful as Luke got more powerful. Also if that idea is true, there should have been a lot more dark jedis around during the PT, one for every jedi.

not really. I understood that line to have more to do with their being no existing light side users for the force to balance against, so it all manifested in one place. If Luke wasn’t cut off from the force, i think things would have been different. And for that reason, i don’t see how this has any impact on the OT. Also, its all made up stuff anyway.

In ESB, Obiwan says that if Luke goes to face Vader he will face him alone, “I can not help you”. But look what Yoda did in TLJ. Sure seems like Obiwan could have lent a hand now.

different people. different circumstances. different. Also, all made up.

Matt.F said:

Warbler said:
Sure seems like Obiwan could have lent a hand now.

That’s a bit insensitive, poor old one-handed Luke…

LOL!

Mrebo said:

Collipso, as you saw above I have some of the same questions. If there are supposed to be deeper themes and meaningful character arcs, they should become richer upon inspection, or at least not fall apart. Unless this was the intention, to show that stuff happens and nobody can see the future, nobody is necessarily right or wrong. This plays into the idea that TJL is a nihilist work - something I haven’t been convinced on.

However, RJ may be focused on the ethics of decisions, whatever the morality or practical result. This would at least accord with his treatment of the light vs dark side, I think.

Yeah but I don’t think that simply the ethics of the decisions is a good enough reason to sacrifice basically all the lore and understanding that we previously had and was previously established of the force, how it works and the training to become a powerful force user, etc.

dahmage said:

Warbler said:

So tell me something, just who was Luke’s equal in the dark side in the OT? As one rises in one side of the force, another rises on the opposite side, right? It couldn’t have been Vader, he rose to power a lot early in the PT and he didn’t get more powerful as Luke got more powerful. Also if that idea is true, there should have been a lot more dark jedis around during the PT, one for every jedi.

not really. I understood that line to have more to do with their being no existing light side users for the force to balance against, so it all manifested in one place. If Luke wasn’t cut off from the force, i think things would have been different.

that is not how I read it all.

Also, its all made up stuff anyway.

I’m sorry, but there is no reason to say this.

1. we all know that

2. that could excuse any continuity error/plot hole in any fiction.

3. it being true, doesn’t mean the fiction universe shouldn’t make sense.

4. its lame to say it

In ESB, Obiwan says that if Luke goes to face Vader he will face him alone, “I can not help you”. But look what Yoda did in TLJ. Sure seems like Obiwan could have lent a hand now.

different people. different circumstances.

um no, same universe. same force. Either force ghosts can do what Yoda can do in TLJ or they can’t. Unless you the movie explains how the force somehow changed and now force ghosts can do things they couldn’t do before. But no explanation was giving.

Also, all made up.

read what I wrote above about that.

Warbler said:

dahmage said:

Warbler said:

So tell me something, just who was Luke’s equal in the dark side in the OT? As one rises in one side of the force, another rises on the opposite side, right? It couldn’t have been Vader, he rose to power a lot early in the PT and he didn’t get more powerful as Luke got more powerful. Also if that idea is true, there should have been a lot more dark jedis around during the PT, one for every jedi.

not really. I understood that line to have more to do with their being no existing light side users for the force to balance against, so it all manifested in one place. If Luke wasn’t cut off from the force, i think things would have been different.

that is not how I read it all.

Also, its all made up stuff anyway.

I’m sorry, but there is no reason to say this.

1. we all know that

2. that could excuse any continuity error/plot hole in any fiction.

3. it being true, doesn’t mean the fiction universe shouldn’t make sense.

4. its lame to say it

In ESB, Obiwan says that if Luke goes to face Vader he will face him alone, “I can not help you”. But look what Yoda did in TLJ. Sure seems like Obiwan could have lent a hand now.

different people. different circumstances.

um no, same universe. same force. Either force ghosts can do what Yoda can do in TLJ or they can’t. Unless you the movie explains how the force somehow changed and now force ghosts can do things they couldn’t do before. But no explanation was giving.

Also, all made up.

read what I wrote above about that.

just because one force ghost does something, doesn’t mean all can. and even if all can, doesn’t mean all will.

different people. different circumstances.

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

dahmage said:

Warbler said:

So tell me something, just who was Luke’s equal in the dark side in the OT? As one rises in one side of the force, another rises on the opposite side, right? It couldn’t have been Vader, he rose to power a lot early in the PT and he didn’t get more powerful as Luke got more powerful. Also if that idea is true, there should have been a lot more dark jedis around during the PT, one for every jedi.

not really. I understood that line to have more to do with their being no existing light side users for the force to balance against, so it all manifested in one place. If Luke wasn’t cut off from the force, i think things would have been different.

that is not how I read it all.

Also, its all made up stuff anyway.

I’m sorry, but there is no reason to say this.

1. we all know that

2. that could excuse any continuity error/plot hole in any fiction.

3. it being true, doesn’t mean the fiction universe shouldn’t make sense.

4. its lame to say it

I agree with this. If it’s “all made up stuff anyway,” then why should we discuss it? There’s no reason to discuss the details of any fiction if you accept that excuse.

you do realize that i added the ‘and its all made up anyway’ as a mostly throw-away joke after my answer? But i guess lets focus on that. sorry if Warb felt i was insulting him, i wasn’t.

yhwx said:

Does one have to learn how to become a Force ghost from somebody else, or can one naturally “know” it?

are you including the prequels or not?

chyron8472 said:

Warbler said:

dahmage said:

Also, its all made up stuff anyway.

I’m sorry, but there is no reason to say this.

1. we all know that

2. that could excuse any continuity error/plot hole in any fiction.

3. it being true, doesn’t mean the fiction universe shouldn’t make sense.

4. its lame to say it

thanks for continuing to focus on something that wasn’t even the point…

Maybe Yoda is just that strong even in death. Maybe being dead for 30 years powered him up. Maybe the temple location gives him more energy. Maybe it’s just a thing that wanted to do for fun and Obi-wan takes things too seriously. Maybe the the question isn’t why can he do this out of nowhere, but why shouldn’t he? There are so many options in a magical space fantasy and people are arguing over the supposed rules, again.

yhwx said:

dahmage said:

yhwx said:

Does one have to learn how to become a Force ghost from somebody else, or can one naturally “know” it?

are you including the prequels or not?

Sure.

Well then probably you have to learn, (according to Yoda). But my personal take is that someone had to figure it out first… so sure, you could probably learn it.

i mean, not you, but someone 😃