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Puggo GRANDE - 16mm restoration — Page 35

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

With respect to higher-quality releases of the 16mm films, my plans are to first finish with ROTP (it’s almost done - really!). Then, I will probably make an announcement that will be of some interest.

YES!

PG and PSB really upscaled well on the 960 screen and far better than what I anticipated. Can’t wait for ROTP.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.

“George didn’t think there was any future in dead Han toys.”-Harrison Ford

My review blog: thehificelluloidmonster.wordpress.com

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

With respect to higher-quality releases of the 16mm films, my plans are to first finish with ROTP (it’s almost done - really!). Then, I will probably make an announcement that will be of some interest.

Eagerly awaiting ROTP! any updates?

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Hello all, I’m currently on the hunt for every original version of the original trilogy.
I’m looking for the highest quality version of the 16mm restoration.
but i have an important question:

is the Puggo Grande 16mm restore only available in 480p?
because that seems to be the only one i can find floating around.

P.S. im sorry if this has been already discussed within this topic, Its just 35 pages takes a lot longer to read than it took to type this out.

May the force be with you!

“Do, or do not, there is no try”

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chrisholz64 said:

Hello all, I’m currently on the hunt for every original version of the original trilogy.
I’m looking for the highest quality version of the 16mm restoration.
but i have an important question:

is the Puggo Grande 16mm restore only available in 480p?
because that seems to be the only one i can find floating around.

P.S. im sorry if this has been already discussed within this topic, Its just 35 pages takes a lot longer to read than it took to type this out.

May the force be with you!

The projects as they stand now are just DVD releases, so 480p it is. The post directly above this quotes a comment about a possible future higher quality release, but i wouldn’t sit around waiting for that. These types of projects take time to complete.

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In the meantime, if you haven’t done so already, you can check out the 35mm HD restorations floating around, like “Star Wars: Silver Screen Edition”, “The Empire Strikes Back: Renegade Grindhouse Edition” and “Return of the Jedi: 35mm Grindhouse”. 😃

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FekLeyrTarg said:

In the meantime, if you haven’t done so already, you can check out the 35mm HD restorations floating around, like “Star Wars: Silver Screen Edition”, “The Empire Strikes Back: Renegade Grindhouse Edition” and “Return of the Jedi: 35mm Grindhouse”. 😃

already downloaded those, and the despecialized versions, enjoying them quite a lot. its just hard to find downloads/torrents that work for the P.G. 16mm restoration.

“Do, or do not, there is no try”

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dahmage said:

chrisholz64 said:

Hello all, I’m currently on the hunt for every original version of the original trilogy.
I’m looking for the highest quality version of the 16mm restoration.
but i have an important question:

is the Puggo Grande 16mm restore only available in 480p?
because that seems to be the only one i can find floating around.

P.S. im sorry if this has been already discussed within this topic, Its just 35 pages takes a lot longer to read than it took to type this out.

May the force be with you!

The projects as they stand now are just DVD releases, so 480p it is. The post directly above this quotes a comment about a possible future higher quality release, but i wouldn’t sit around waiting for that. These types of projects take time to complete.

okay, wasnt aware that it was on dvd. soooo, even as a download, there arent higher quality versions. Like, was it scanned in 480p?

“Do, or do not, there is no try”

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 (Edited)

Do the 16mm prints have enough detail to resolve with higher resolutions? I would say a bigger improvement could be had by utilizing DrDre’s color correction tools to help with the faded section, and more cleanup.

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also aren’t the Puggos interlaced, i.e. 480i? if so, a move to progressive scan would more closely imitate the nature of the 16mm film. I could be mistaken.

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Having been a projectionist during my late teens and most of my twenties, I respect so many of the projects that have been undertaken on this forum. However the difficulties presented with diminished 70mm & 35mm film prints, 16mm & 8mm compromised film is a beast. My hat goes off in all directions to you Puggo! Thank you for restoring this wonderful unaltered piece of my childhood that I can now share with my children. Cheers!!

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I found this bit about early changes on this Wookieepedia page.

The earliest edits to the original film occurred between the initial release in May and the wider release later in 1977. The edits are minor, but noticeable. They consist of four changes. All of these changes were made before the foreign language prints were made later in 1977 and well before the last good interpositive was struck in 1985. These four shots run exactly the same length. All of them exist in the earliest bootleg video tapes and in the English 16 mm print. The original three effects shots exist in many home video English language versions released during the 80’s. None of these shots are found in the Definitive Edition, Faces Edition, or 2006 bonus discs, nor are they in any of the known extant 35 mm prints, or Technicolor prints.

  • When the Millennium Falcon is being chased after taking off from Mos Eisley, the effects shot where the Star Destroyer is shooting at the Falcon was changed. The early version has different explosions and different flashes and looks less finished.
  • When the heroes arrive on Yavin 4, the outdoor composited shot with the matte painting of the temple is recomposited and is not synced the same. It also has an artifact in the image.
  • When the fighters take off from Yavin 4, there is an extra cloud and the shot is not synced the same. It also has an artifact in the image.
  • The scrolling end credits are completely redone with the spacing, both vertical and horizontal, altered and a glitch in composition at the beginning has been removed.

This is the first I’m hearing of this. The article mentions that these only exist in the earliest bootleg tapes and the English 16mm print. Does Puggo Grande contain the early version shots? If not, where can I obtain this version of the film?

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?
GOOOOOOO DAWGS! SIC 'EM! WOOF WOOF WOOF WOOF WOOF!

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Where can I find the Puggo Versions of the Movies? I have searched and searched and searched and searched but never found something.

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yaboykevin01 said:

I found this bit about early changes on this Wookieepedia page.

The earliest edits to the original film occurred between the initial release in May and the wider release later in 1977. The edits are minor, but noticeable. They consist of four changes. All of these changes were made before the foreign language prints were made later in 1977 and well before the last good interpositive was struck in 1985. These four shots run exactly the same length. All of them exist in the earliest bootleg video tapes and in the English 16 mm print. The original three effects shots exist in many home video English language versions released during the 80’s. None of these shots are found in the Definitive Edition, Faces Edition, or 2006 bonus discs, nor are they in any of the known extant 35 mm prints, or Technicolor prints.

  • When the Millennium Falcon is being chased after taking off from Mos Eisley, the effects shot where the Star Destroyer is shooting at the Falcon was changed. The early version has different explosions and different flashes and looks less finished.
  • When the heroes arrive on Yavin 4, the outdoor composited shot with the matte painting of the temple is recomposited and is not synced the same. It also has an artifact in the image.
  • When the fighters take off from Yavin 4, there is an extra cloud and the shot is not synced the same. It also has an artifact in the image.
  • The scrolling end credits are completely redone with the spacing, both vertical and horizontal, altered and a glitch in composition at the beginning has been removed.

This is the first I’m hearing of this. The article mentions that these only exist in the earliest bootleg tapes and the English 16mm print. Does Puggo Grande contain the early version shots? If not, where can I obtain this version of the film?

I edited Wookiepedia to include that information. Yes, Puggo Grand has those, as does the Moth3r bookleg. Both also have alternate end credits. All three FX shots and the end credits are flawed. We know that the Definitive Edition (From which the 2006 GOUT discs were struck) was made from a relatively new interpositive of the original prints. Most previous video releases were made from prints. No non-English print has those 4 shots. From the timeline of events in 1977, from the initial release to the wide release and foreign release, we can track back. The various prints that were used for home video that have the three FX shots can easily be prints with the opening crawl and end credits replaced. So we know the shots were replaced at some point after a bunch of prints were struck. It was before the foreign prints. It was before the Technicolor prints. It was before all the prints that have been used in the 35 mm scans. It was after the 16 mm English print was made.

The other clue as to when is that all the prints linked to the mono soundtrack have the newer FX shots. That means, to me, that these must have been from the original release. They would represent the 70 mm version and the first run of the 35 mm. There would have been very few and by the time of the wider release and the foreign release, the FX shots and end credits had been changed. And the rough state of the first FX shot (where the Falcon is leaving Tatooine and the explosions appear to be drawn on rather than composited) seems to confirm that it was a rushed inclusion and the finished shot was dropped in later. The later two shots both have flaws that the replacements don’t.

I’m not sure why they redid the credits entirely when only the transition had a flaw, but the entire end credits are spaced differently, though they run the same length. And for the 1981 re-release with the new crawl, the extant 35 mm copies of the film show that the new crawl was spliced on. So the only known copy that was taken from a print that has the 1981 crawl is the Definitive Edition LD. Though it is possible and even likely that a lot of the prints used for the video transfers had a 1981 first reel. The three changes are on reels 3, 5, and 6.

I actually found out about these changes here on OT. I had never noticed them myself. They aren’t easy to see. But when I found out about them it became very obvious and then I set out to find out when they were changed. The why was obvious as each one had an obvious mistake in it. But the when seems like it has to be between the first small release and the wider release later in 77. It was definitely before the foreign release and the negative in 1992 (or whenever it was struck) contained the changes. Two of the shots were replaced for the SE, but the first one is the same as the DE, confirming that the DE was the current state of the negative at that time.

So again, Puggo Grand and Moth3r have the 3 fX shots and the end credits. The JSC, US SWE, and other English home video releases have the 3 FX shots, but the 1981 opening crawl and the replaced end credits. The DE has none of them. No LD from the foreign market as them (as in non-English).

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So in essence what we have here is a precursor to the revised ESB prints after the 70mm premiere.
Wow, the stuff you learn here every day…the differing shots were a revelation to me but this flow of events is not surprising at all given how rushed the last weeks of post production were.
It’d be funny to see if anyone today even remembers doing any of these shots last minute…then again very few remember there were three audio mixes.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.

“George didn’t think there was any future in dead Han toys.”-Harrison Ford

My review blog: thehificelluloidmonster.wordpress.com

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captainsolo said:

So in essence what we have here is a precursor to the revised ESB prints after the 70mm premiere.
Wow, the stuff you learn here every day…the differing shots were a revelation to me but this flow of events is not surprising at all given how rushed the last weeks of post production were.
It’d be funny to see if anyone today even remembers doing any of these shots last minute…then again very few remember there were three audio mixes.

I tend to think of it as 2 audio mixes. The mono and the 4 channel. The 4 channel had LFE channels for the 70 mm, was encoded in Dolby Stereo for 35 mm, and Puggo Grand 16 mm has a mono down mix of it.

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Okay, for you non-Spleen people that would like MKV’s of the Puggo Star Wars Trilogy I uploaded mine to MEGA. Please private message me for links and keep unnecessary posts to a minimum. If some folks would like to help me out in sharing the links that would be appreciated. Oh, and each movie is a separate download.

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Hi, where can I download the Puggo’s versions of the trilogy?
I appreciate any information, thanks!

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

Bobocop said:

So am I to understand there will be a Swedish overdubbed audio option?

Sorry, it’s English audio with Swedish subtitles.  Interestingly, Chewbacca’s name appears to be “Tugg”.  Hmm, now might be a good time to ask the question that the subtitles left me with — what’s a “misslycat”?

Tugg means chewing in Swedish. It’s the same with the original Icelandic translation as well. Chewbacca was originally named Tobaks Tugga which translates to tobacco chew. Later on he was renamed Loðinn which just means hairy.

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Hi, how can I get the Puggo’s STJARNORNAS KRIG edition of Star Wars?

Can someone share a link?

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arnautovic said:

Hi, how can I get the Puggo’s STJARNORNAS KRIG edition of Star Wars?

Can someone share a link?

I would also very much like to get my hands on a copy of this Swedish edition. Anyone who can upload it somewhere?

Tom