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Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo — Page 85

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Perhaps the reasoning behind Trump’s authoritarian actions is not so much that he is authoritarian as much as he is merely incapable of being a politician. Politicians such as George W Bush, Barack Obama, or Hillary Clinton moved to more moderate, centrist positions during their campaigns (there wasn’t far to go with Hillary), and the reason for this was to appeal to a broad swath of the electorate. That is the purely expedient reason for moderate positions, but from the standpoint of a professional politician, it is their job to represent all of their constituents. Certainly this gives rise to the caricature of the two-faced lying politician, but the profession of politics requires politicians to be all things for all people, at least in appearance. Donald Trump apparently doesn’t recognize this imperative, and appears to represent nobody except for his fanciful imaginary self. He is the product of a hyper-partisan political environment where being a standard politician is not just passe, it’s a death sentence. Now not only the Republicans, but also some Democrats are beginning to see that they will quickly find themselves out of a job if they make deals with ‘the other side’, regardless of how reasonable these deals may be.

In the broader sense, it’s frightening to someone like myself who leans liberal (along with about half of the country) to see the liberal voices in our government so completely out of power. It wasn’t always this way. Even back in the ancient past of the Obama administration, there was still an attempt by the majority party to achieve bipartisan support for legislation, even if the opposition stonewalled them at every turn.

On a state level, I would often research all of the candidates for North Carolina office, regardless of whether they had a D or an R next to their names. I even voted for a few Republicans based on their individual merits. However, since the power grab by the Republicans after the election of a democratic governor, I cannot in good conscience vote for anyone with an ‘R’ next to their name in a state election, if this is the Game of Thrones style politics that they employ. It saddens me to do this, and this has been happening throughout the country of late.

There is cause for optimism, perhaps. I hope that this hyperpartisanship, driven by extremely biased voters being fed by information echo chambers of their own creation, is merely the effect of the breakdown of the monolithic US media that began in the 50’s. People now know that they can choose their news outlets, their view of the world. There will always be bastions of ignorance and false narratives in this nation, there always have been. Conspiracy theories are sometimes right, such as the massive surveillance by the NSA which vindicated the tin-foil hat folks some years ago. The prevailing narrative is sometimes wrong, such as predictions of Hillary’s victory last year. But perhaps more people will become united in their understanding that ALL news is worthy of skepticism, and work together for a nuanced and mature understanding of issues.

Or we could just squabble over every slight and be filled with righteous indignation at everything ‘the other’ is doing to this great nation, thus justifying our own position. That’s cool too.

You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)

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This is going to end in Paul Hogan and Olivia Newton John being deported, and every copy of Kangaroo Jack being confiscated and burned, I just know it!

Where were you in '77?

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Jeebus said:

DominicCobb said:

Jeebus said:

DominicCobb said:

Jeebus said:

Interesting article indeed.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/02/01/how-much-coverage-did-cnn-actually-devote-to-clintons-emails-heres-the-data/?utm_term=.002e715ef333

Yes because the one thing the election was missing was more talk about Clinton’s emails.

Yes, that’s what the data seems to indicate.

And yet the results seem to indicate people found out just fine.

Sure, but I don’t think that’s the problem.


http://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1039140

The “mainstream media” showed clear bias throughout the entire election, for both sides. This is why people don’t trust the media. It’s not like everyone got a wild hair up their collective asses and decided that the news was untrustworthy, that suspicion exists for a reason.

This started long before this election too. There were interviews done in 2011 where people were openly speaking about their distrust of the media.

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TV’s Frink said:

https://www.thenation.com/article/leaked-draft-of-trumps-religious-freedom-order-reveals-sweeping-plans-to-legalize-discrimination/

Lovely.

http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/01/21/heres-how-pro-lifers-responded-to-being-excluded-from-the-womens-march-on-washington/

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jan/17/pro-life-women-banned-anti-trump-womens-march-wash/

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/01/25/anti-abortion-group-of-banned-womens-march-protesters-showed-up/21662068/

Don’t be so qiuck to judge, the Women’s March was in fact a Feminist March and if you were Pro-Life you were banned from attendance by the group. Most Feminists are women but not all women are feminists so I’m sure there was a reason why it wasn’t named the “Feminist Only March” on Washington.

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 (Edited)

NeverarGreat said:

Perhaps the reasoning behind Trump’s authoritarian actions is not so much that he is authoritarian as much as he is merely incapable of being a politician. Politicians such as George W Bush, Barack Obama, or Hillary Clinton moved to more moderate, centrist positions during their campaigns (there wasn’t far to go with Hillary), and the reason for this was to appeal to a broad swath of the electorate. That is the purely expedient reason for moderate positions, but from the standpoint of a professional politician, it is their job to represent all of their constituents. Certainly this gives rise to the caricature of the two-faced lying politician, but the profession of politics requires politicians to be all things for all people, at least in appearance. Donald Trump apparently doesn’t recognize this imperative, and appears to represent nobody except for his fanciful imaginary self. He is the product of a hyper-partisan political environment where being a standard politician is not just passe, it’s a death sentence. Now not only the Republicans, but also some Democrats are beginning to see that they will quickly find themselves out of a job if they make deals with ‘the other side’, regardless of how reasonable these deals may be.

In the broader sense, it’s frightening to someone like myself who leans liberal (along with about half of the country) to see the liberal voices in our government so completely out of power. It wasn’t always this way. Even back in the ancient past of the Obama administration, there was still an attempt by the majority party to achieve bipartisan support for legislation, even if the opposition stonewalled them at every turn.

On a state level, I would often research all of the candidates for North Carolina office, regardless of whether they had a D or an R next to their names. I even voted for a few Republicans based on their individual merits. However, since the power grab by the Republicans after the election of a democratic governor, I cannot in good conscience vote for anyone with an ‘R’ next to their name in a state election, if this is the Game of Thrones style politics that they employ. It saddens me to do this, and this has been happening throughout the country of late.

There is cause for optimism, perhaps. I hope that this hyperpartisanship, driven by extremely biased voters being fed by information echo chambers of their own creation, is merely the effect of the breakdown of the monolithic US media that began in the 50’s. People now know that they can choose their news outlets, their view of the world. There will always be bastions of ignorance and false narratives in this nation, there always have been. Conspiracy theories are sometimes right, such as the massive surveillance by the NSA which vindicated the tin-foil hat folks some years ago. The prevailing narrative is sometimes wrong, such as predictions of Hillary’s victory last year. But perhaps more people will become united in their understanding that ALL news is worthy of skepticism, and work together for a nuanced and mature understanding of issues.

Or we could just squabble over every slight and be filled with righteous indignation at everything ‘the other’ is doing to this great nation, thus justifying our own position. That’s cool too.

I don’t agree with everything you’ve said here, but as a whole, I agree with your ideals on nuanced and mature understanding of all that is going on. For what we seem to consider an “educated” society, these ideals seem to be the most elusive, and it saddens me greatly to see it.

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NeverarGreat said:

Perhaps the reasoning behind Trump’s authoritarian actions is not so much that he is authoritarian as much as he is merely incapable of being a politician. Politicians such as George W Bush, Barack Obama, or Hillary Clinton moved to more moderate, centrist positions during their campaigns (there wasn’t far to go with Hillary), and the reason for this was to appeal to a broad swath of the electorate. That is the purely expedient reason for moderate positions, but from the standpoint of a professional politician, it is their job to represent all of their constituents. Certainly this gives rise to the caricature of the two-faced lying politician, but the profession of politics requires politicians to be all things for all people, at least in appearance. Donald Trump apparently doesn’t recognize this imperative, and appears to represent nobody except for his fanciful imaginary self. He is the product of a hyper-partisan political environment where being a standard politician is not just passe, it’s a death sentence. Now not only the Republicans, but also some Democrats are beginning to see that they will quickly find themselves out of a job if they make deals with ‘the other side’, regardless of how reasonable these deals may be.

In the broader sense, it’s frightening to someone like myself who leans liberal (along with about half of the country) to see the liberal voices in our government so completely out of power. It wasn’t always this way. Even back in the ancient past of the Obama administration, there was still an attempt by the majority party to achieve bipartisan support for legislation, even if the opposition stonewalled them at every turn.

On a state level, I would often research all of the candidates for North Carolina office, regardless of whether they had a D or an R next to their names. I even voted for a few Republicans based on their individual merits. However, since the power grab by the Republicans after the election of a democratic governor, I cannot in good conscience vote for anyone with an ‘R’ next to their name in a state election, if this is the Game of Thrones style politics that they employ. It saddens me to do this, and this has been happening throughout the country of late.

There is cause for optimism, perhaps. I hope that this hyperpartisanship, driven by extremely biased voters being fed by information echo chambers of their own creation, is merely the effect of the breakdown of the monolithic US media that began in the 50’s. People now know that they can choose their news outlets, their view of the world. There will always be bastions of ignorance and false narratives in this nation, there always have been. Conspiracy theories are sometimes right, such as the massive surveillance by the NSA which vindicated the tin-foil hat folks some years ago. The prevailing narrative is sometimes wrong, such as predictions of Hillary’s victory last year. But perhaps more people will become united in their understanding that ALL news is worthy of skepticism, and work together for a nuanced and mature understanding of issues.

Or we could just squabble over every slight and be filled with righteous indignation at everything ‘the other’ is doing to this great nation, thus justifying our own position. That’s cool too.

Well said. It’s a dangerous way we’re headed.

Skepticism of the media is absolutely necessary, though I fear the increase of complete distrust. We can’t rely on the administration to tell us exactly what’s happening - this goes for every administration, but this one especially. Now more than ever we need good journalism. But it is worrisome when the president himself supports the delegitimization of relatively solid news outlets for simply reporting the facts. Skepticism is crucial, but what I’m seeing is going far past that.

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Jetrell Fo said:

TV’s Frink said:

https://www.thenation.com/article/leaked-draft-of-trumps-religious-freedom-order-reveals-sweeping-plans-to-legalize-discrimination/

Lovely.

http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/01/21/heres-how-pro-lifers-responded-to-being-excluded-from-the-womens-march-on-washington/

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jan/17/pro-life-women-banned-anti-trump-womens-march-wash/

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/01/25/anti-abortion-group-of-banned-womens-march-protesters-showed-up/21662068/

Don’t be so qiuck to judge, the Women’s March was in fact a Feminist March and if you were Pro-Life you were banned from attendance by the group. Most Feminists are women but not all women are feminists so I’m sure there was a reason why it wasn’t named the “Feminist Only March” on Washington.

I don’t think the fact that the Women’s March was a feminist march is any secret. That was kind of the point and implicit in the organization. I don’t know how you could expect anything else. Not all women consider themselves feminists, but if you showed up to the march to support women’s rights, you’re either a feminist or a dumb shit for not realizing you should be feminist.

Protecting women’s right to choose was clearly one of the goals of the protesters, though not the only one. I don’t think if you were pro-life your were barred from protesting, but it wouldn’t really make any sense to protest abortion at the march. Not the time or place. I’m not surprised others would be upset with pro-lifers promoting pro-life at the march.

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 (Edited)

Trump’s Benghazi

U.S. military probing more possible civilian deaths in Yemen raid

U.S. Navy SEAL William “Ryan” Owens was killed in the raid on a branch of al Qaeda, also known as AQAP, in al Bayda province, which the Pentagon said also killed 14 militants. However, medics at the scene said about 30 people, including 10 women and children, were killed.

U.S. military officials told Reuters that Trump approved his first covert counterterrorism operation without sufficient intelligence, ground support or adequate backup preparations.

As a result, three officials said, the attacking SEAL team found itself dropping onto a reinforced al Qaeda base defended by landmines, snipers, and a larger than expected contingent of heavily armed Islamist extremists.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-t … SKBN15G5RX

Trump Didn’t Bother to Show Up in Situation Room for Botched Yemen Raid
http://enewspf.com/2017/02/02/trump-did … emen-raid/

"Donald Trump just got people needlessly killed in military raid"
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/king-trump-people-needlessly-killed-military-raid-article-1.2962358?utm_content=buffer30077&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

“First feel fear, then get angry. Then go with your life into the fight.” - Bill Mollison

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Jesus Christ.

I can hear certain people already saying that you can’t believe these reports without having been there in person, but given that Trump has regularly refused to be bothered by intelligence briefings, and given that he both has zero experience in governing and has shown no interest in gaining experience, these reports are entirely believable.

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FanFiltration said:

Trump’s Benghazi

U.S. military probing more possible civilian deaths in Yemen raid

U.S. Navy SEAL William “Ryan” Owens was killed in the raid on a branch of al Qaeda, also known as AQAP, in al Bayda province, which the Pentagon said also killed 14 militants. However, medics at the scene said about 30 people, including 10 women and children, were killed.

U.S. military officials told Reuters that Trump approved his first covert counterterrorism operation without sufficient intelligence, ground support or adequate backup preparations.

As a result, three officials said, the attacking SEAL team found itself dropping onto a reinforced al Qaeda base defended by landmines, snipers, and a larger than expected contingent of heavily armed Islamist extremists.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-t … SKBN15G5RX

Trump Didn’t Bother to Show Up in Situation Room for Botched Yemen Raid
http://enewspf.com/2017/02/02/trump-did … emen-raid/

"Donald Trump just got people needlessly killed in military raid"
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/king-trump-people-needlessly-killed-military-raid-article-1.2962358?utm_content=buffer30077&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

This is misinformation as it was the Obama administration that had this planned set up and already in go mode by the time Trump was inaugurated.

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https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/01/world/middleeast/donald-trump-yemen-commando-raid-questions.html

President Barack Obama’s national security aides had reviewed the plans for a risky attack on a small, heavily guarded brick home of a senior Qaeda collaborator in a mountainous village in a remote part of central Yemen. But Mr. Obama did not act because the Pentagon wanted to launch the attack on a moonless night and the next one would come after his term had ended.

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TV’s Frink said:

Jesus Christ.

I can hear certain people already saying that you can’t believe these reports without having been there in person, but given that Trump has regularly refused to be bothered by intelligence briefings, and given that he both has zero experience in governing and has shown no interest in gaining experience, these reports are entirely believable.

If you were part of the administration and there, I’d buy this entirely believable thing, but since you’re not I don’t. You have nothing to show he is refusing intelligence briefings at this time and until you do I take this as only your opinion, nothing more.

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TV’s Frink said:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/01/world/middleeast/donald-trump-yemen-commando-raid-questions.html

President Barack Obama’s national security aides had reviewed the plans for a risky attack on a small, heavily guarded brick home of a senior Qaeda collaborator in a mountainous village in a remote part of central Yemen. But Mr. Obama did not act because the Pentagon wanted to launch the attack on a moonless night and the next one would come after his term had ended.

I watched the briefing on it this morning. I am a Veteran of the United States Army. This plan was in go mode, it was going to happen, and they’re info was apparenlty flawed. This has been a public issue for some time now and Benghazi was what brought that fact to life. These soldiers probably didn’t even know the info was flawed so trying to blame Trump just because one doesn’t like him is foolish.

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NeverarGreat said:

Perhaps the reasoning behind Trump’s authoritarian actions is not so much that he is authoritarian as much as he is merely incapable of being a politician. Politicians such as George W Bush, Barack Obama, or Hillary Clinton moved to more moderate, centrist positions during their campaigns (there wasn’t far to go with Hillary), and the reason for this was to appeal to a broad swath of the electorate. That is the purely expedient reason for moderate positions, but from the standpoint of a professional politician, it is their job to represent all of their constituents. Certainly this gives rise to the caricature of the two-faced lying politician, but the profession of politics requires politicians to be all things for all people, at least in appearance. Donald Trump apparently doesn’t recognize this imperative, and appears to represent nobody except for his fanciful imaginary self. He is the product of a hyper-partisan political environment where being a standard politician is not just passe, it’s a death sentence. Now not only the Republicans, but also some Democrats are beginning to see that they will quickly find themselves out of a job if they make deals with ‘the other side’, regardless of how reasonable these deals may be.

In the broader sense, it’s frightening to someone like myself who leans liberal (along with about half of the country) to see the liberal voices in our government so completely out of power. It wasn’t always this way. Even back in the ancient past of the Obama administration, there was still an attempt by the majority party to achieve bipartisan support for legislation, even if the opposition stonewalled them at every turn.

On a state level, I would often research all of the candidates for North Carolina office, regardless of whether they had a D or an R next to their names. I even voted for a few Republicans based on their individual merits. However, since the power grab by the Republicans after the election of a democratic governor, I cannot in good conscience vote for anyone with an ‘R’ next to their name in a state election, if this is the Game of Thrones style politics that they employ. It saddens me to do this, and this has been happening throughout the country of late.

There is cause for optimism, perhaps. I hope that this hyperpartisanship, driven by extremely biased voters being fed by information echo chambers of their own creation, is merely the effect of the breakdown of the monolithic US media that began in the 50’s. People now know that they can choose their news outlets, their view of the world. There will always be bastions of ignorance and false narratives in this nation, there always have been. Conspiracy theories are sometimes right, such as the massive surveillance by the NSA which vindicated the tin-foil hat folks some years ago. The prevailing narrative is sometimes wrong, such as predictions of Hillary’s victory last year. But perhaps more people will become united in their understanding that ALL news is worthy of skepticism, and work together for a nuanced and mature understanding of issues.

Or we could just squabble over every slight and be filled with righteous indignation at everything ‘the other’ is doing to this great nation, thus justifying our own position. That’s cool too.

Great post.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)

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Jetrell Fo said:

TV’s Frink said:

Jesus Christ.

I can hear certain people already saying that you can’t believe these reports without having been there in person, but given that Trump has regularly refused to be bothered by intelligence briefings, and given that he both has zero experience in governing and has shown no interest in gaining experience, these reports are entirely believable.

If you were part of the administration and there, I’d buy this entirely believable thing, but since you’re not I don’t. You have nothing to show he is refusing intelligence briefings at this time and until you do I take this as only your opinion, nothing more.

how long will you hold a candle for Trump?

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 (Edited)

^^^From the article …

Trump told the folks at Axios, a freshly launched news site, that he prefers his intelligence briefings short and to the point.

“I like bullets or I like as little as possible,” he said in an interview published on the site. “I don’t need, you know, 200-page reports on something that can be handled on a page. That I can tell you.”

This does not imply what you are assuming.

dahmage said:

Jetrell Fo said:

TV’s Frink said:

Jesus Christ.

I can hear certain people already saying that you can’t believe these reports without having been there in person, but given that Trump has regularly refused to be bothered by intelligence briefings, and given that he both has zero experience in governing and has shown no interest in gaining experience, these reports are entirely believable.

If you were part of the administration and there, I’d buy this entirely believable thing, but since you’re not I don’t. You have nothing to show he is refusing intelligence briefings at this time and until you do I take this as only your opinion, nothing more.

how long will you hold a candle for Trump?

It has nothing to do with Trump and everything to do with fact vs. fiction. I am at least willing to give the man a chance and would rather be a part of helping to make it better instead of making pointless comments based purely on how I feel about him as a person.

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Jetrell Fo said:

^^^From the article …

Trump told the folks at Axios, a freshly launched news site, that he prefers his intelligence briefings short and to the point.

“I like bullets or I like as little as possible,” he said in an interview published on the site. “I don’t need, you know, 200-page reports on something that can be handled on a page. That I can tell you.”

This does not imply what you are assuming.

  • wrong

JEDIT: oh wait, i did convey that in a bullet point list. i am confused. 😉

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TV’s Frink said:

Three days prior to inauguration but relevant and disconcerting.

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2017/01/19/never-seen-anything-gaping-holes-trumps-foreign-policy-team

Many aspects of President-elect Donald Trump’s transition have been described as disorganized (at best), but his administration’s approach to foreign policy “appears” particularly rudderless, raising concerns among domestic experts and international allies alike.

The defining part of the article is the quoted word above … “appears”, and that is an opinion, not fact. LOL

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Jetrell Fo said:

TV’s Frink said:

Three days prior to inauguration but relevant and disconcerting.

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2017/01/19/never-seen-anything-gaping-holes-trumps-foreign-policy-team

Many aspects of President-elect Donald Trump’s transition have been described as disorganized (at best), but his administration’s approach to foreign policy “appears” particularly rudderless, raising concerns among domestic experts and international allies alike.

The defining part of the article is the quoted word above … “appears”, and that is an opinion, not fact. LOL

ok, i can respect your point that you should work to make things better (from your previous post, not this one). but what i don’t respect is your constant brushing aside of every piece of information as being opinion, and not fact. the opinion of the matter is, that almost all information that is out there is not fact. if you can’t deal with finding the shadow of the facts by sifting through and weighing opinions, then I don’t know… ? i don’t know.

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dahmage said:

Jetrell Fo said:

TV’s Frink said:

Three days prior to inauguration but relevant and disconcerting.

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2017/01/19/never-seen-anything-gaping-holes-trumps-foreign-policy-team

Many aspects of President-elect Donald Trump’s transition have been described as disorganized (at best), but his administration’s approach to foreign policy “appears” particularly rudderless, raising concerns among domestic experts and international allies alike.

The defining part of the article is the quoted word above … “appears”, and that is an opinion, not fact. LOL

ok, i can respect your point that you should work to make things better (from your previous post, not this one). but what i don’t respect is your constant brushing aside of every piece of information as being opinion, and not fact. the opinion of the matter is, that almost all information that is out there is not fact. if you can’t deal with finding the shadow of the facts by sifting through and weighing opinions, then I don’t know… ? i don’t know.

I do wonder at what point I’m allowed to stop giving Trump another chance. 70 years hasn’t been enough. 2 years of campaigning hasn’t been enough. 2 weeks of a nonstop shitshow hasn’t been enough. Is 2 months more enough? 2 more years? Will I ever be allowed to question anything that Saint Trump has done or said?

dahmage, I’m relying on you to guide me on this matter. What ever your counsel, I will follow it.