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.: Moth3r's PAL DVD project :. — Page 6

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xyzzy, on the scaling side of things, whatever source I end up using (PAL or NTSC) I'll be creating a PAL set of DVDs because my tv system is natively PAL and I hate 3:2 pulldown.

Testing cleanup filters with VirtualDub to upscale the image from letterbox to anamorphic I remembered I'd downloaded a filter a long time ago that does a 2x resize but with edge detected interpolation, from what I can tell it doubles the image size without increasing grain, this is an example of scaling a crappy mpeg1 frame compared to Lanczos3:

http://www.haku.co.uk/edgeresample.jpg

How I use it is to crop the 4:3 source so I just end up with the letterbox image, 2x resize with the edgeresample filter, rescale it again but with Lanczos3 to 1280x545 to get 1:1 aspect ratio image, apply a sharpen filter and then finally Lanczos3 resize & add black borders to get an anamorphic PAL image.
Slow, yes, worth it, definitely. If anyone wants the VirtualDub filter it it's available here: edgeresample.zip (it's not optimised so expect long filter times)
http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/LukeCruise.gif http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/dontcare.gif
***Citizen's NTSC DVD/PAL DVD/XviD Info and Feedback Thread***
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I could torrent it. Fact is though, that my bandwidth isn't nearly enough to cover the demand. So, if there are people willing to help seeding, and with moth3r's permission of course, I could upload the torrent.


I am sure that a few people would be able to help out seeding if you torrent Moth3rs ANH PAL version. I seem to recall that when you did Deleted Magic, you were not on your own for long!!

4 - 5 - 3 - 1 - 6 - 2

Discuss…

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Originally posted by: Metallaxis
I could torrent it. Fact is though, that my bandwidth isn't nearly enough to cover the demand. So, if there are people willing to help seeding, and with moth3r's permission of course, I could upload the torrent.


I'll help seeding it, after I've got it.

A new release of Star Wars is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get.

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I'm no expert, but xyzzy's no-resize PAL LD to NTSC DVD system sounds convincing. Would anyone who is an expert care to comment?
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If you've made a PAL cap at 720 x 576, and you just want to keep the middle 480 lines for NTSC, the aspect ratio will be wrong. Call me stupid, but I don't understand how you can "not use the full width" of 16:9 without scaling the picture. I'm willing to be proven wrong, but the three seconds of thought I've given this suggest I'm not.

Non-ana 2.35:1 PAL is about 330 lines; ana NTSC 2.35:1 is about 360. So if you scale up just 10% vertically, you'll be right on the money in terms of aspect ratio, with a very small amount of scaling.

I'd also take issue with the claim that "it makes a big difference" to the image quality by not scaling. I think Moth3r's captures (which you've all seen) and my own (which you haven't) refute that pretty solidly.

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Originally posted by: Karyudo
If you've made a PAL cap at 720 x 576, and you just want to keep the middle 480 lines for NTSC, the aspect ratio will be wrong. Call me stupid, but I don't understand how you can "not use the full width" of 16:9 without scaling the picture. I'm willing to be proven wrong, but the three seconds of thought I've given this suggest I'm not.

I don't understand it either but xyzzy mentioned PAL SVCD which I think is 480x576 and maybe that's why it was possible to convert it to 720x480 NTSC DVD by just cropping and adding borders.

So I guess if you captured a PAL source at less than 720 horizontally you could do the same thing but then the scaling would be done by the capture device instead.

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How I use it is to crop the 4:3 source so I just end up with the letterbox image, 2x resize with the edgeresample filter, rescale it again but with Lanczos3 to 1280x545 to get 1:1 aspect ratio image, apply a sharpen filter and then finally Lanczos3 resize & add black borders to get an anamorphic PAL image.

When your source is interlaced do you select "Interlaced (not recommended for enlarging)" in the resize settings?

Why is 1280x545 a 1:1 aspect ratio? Why do you want a 1:1 aspect ratio? It seems logical to me sharpening after the 2x resize with edgeresampler keeps quality better then resizing an extra time. So can you explain that?
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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1280x545 is a 1:1 pixel aspect ratio for a 2.35:1 image, because ideally when doing 2d sharpening or smoothing you want a 1:1 pixel aspect ratio image, and also the MSU Denoiser crashes on images wider than 1280 pixels.

As for dealing with cleaning up & scaling truly interlaced source (not merely the interlacing of 3:2 pulldown) I have another method I'm working on using AviSynth, but that's another story.

BTW, I messaged you about Leia's 7 seconds welding clip, did you get it? the default users setting might be not to receive messages.
http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/LukeCruise.gif http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/dontcare.gif
***Citizen's NTSC DVD/PAL DVD/XviD Info and Feedback Thread***
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the MSU Denoiser crashes on images wider than 1280 pixels.

BTW, I messaged you about Leia's 7 seconds welding clip, did you get it? the default users setting might be not to receive messages.


So that's why it crashed haha, I wondered about that.

I got a PM about the rar files. Then I send you 2 PMs, one about my ftp, the other about www.youshareit.com
My email is arnie.d@tiscali.nl maybe that works better.
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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Hi Moth3r, can you give us a list of the specifications of the final version of ANH? Somewhere in this thread I read you used audio from a VHS tape? Is this in the final version? Did you manage to insert the wipes?
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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For the specs (bitrates, etc.) see the NFO file.
Yes, I used the audio from VHS.
No, I didn't insert the missing frames at the end of side 1.

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I captured all three movies of the Definitive Collection with the digital PCM tracks. I would be happy to give you the audio for Empire and Jedi if you want it (also the audio from ANH if you want). I presume you're also going to tranfer them too. If you want a sample first to check if the quality is better that's ok.
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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One thing I've learnt about replacing audio tracks from different sources is that doing the replacing without the video can be extremely time consuming to get it as accurate as possible, without the video as a guide to synch them together you don't know if the source or destination have dropped frames that can put the sync way off.
Which is why when I finally do my own DVD set with audio from the Definitive LD's and video from the German THX LD's I'm going to have to undo the 3:2 pulldown on the captured Definitive LD set so I can match the frames up with the captured THX LD set to then save the Definitive LD's audio and use it with the THX LD's video.

I've got the first 3 seasons of the ReBoot CGI cartoon on dubbed Russian DVD that I'm going to synch up with the audio from my VHS's sometime. Another future project I want to do is get hold of the French DVDs of Insektors and remaster them with the British audio (they dubbed it round the world, each country having their own voices, names for the characters and in-jokes that only people in that country would understand)
http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/LukeCruise.gif http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/dontcare.gif
***Citizen's NTSC DVD/PAL DVD/XviD Info and Feedback Thread***
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Not a single frame was dropped. How about compressing the video and leaving the audio as is? Then it's more easy to compare.
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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Yes Citizen your thinking is spot on.

I did indeed capture the VHS video as a reference to aid with the audio synching process. Even with this reference, it's still fairly time consuming to cut out all the 40ms sections that need removing to maintain sync (although it was a lot easier the second time with TESB).

For some reason I got my left and right audio channels switched again - this is with another VCR this time. It must be the audio cable that's wired up incorrectly, unless it's the actual line-in on my motherboard.

I've encoded the video for TESB, but on watching I've noticed that the colour saturation is not constant and needs to be tweaked on the video capped from sides 3 and 4. Which of course means that the 28 hours encoding time has been wasted...

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Originally posted by: Moth3r
Yes, unfortunately you're right, I've just checked the end of side one and that wipe is missing. I hadn't realised that before.

Anyway what to do about it? I'll have to insert those frames captured from another source, I'll try my VHS tape to see if the quality difference sticks out - I suspect it will. Maybe I'll have to get them from one of the NTSC captures and resize it to PAL res.

The French soundtrack is also going to end up with a gap at that point, fixing that is also going to be messy.


Hi,

Going back to A New Hope and the problem it has with missing footage, do you know if the German or Spanish versions have this problem?

Cheers!
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I don't know for certain, but I'm told that the German version does not have this problem.

I've since found that the French TESB disc is OK. Well, in truth there is one field (half a frame) missing on the side 3/4 change, but I doubt that's going to be noticeable.

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I asked for advice on a good set to get, Rikter told me to wait because a good one's on the way. I got impatient and got this one, and I'm very very happy with it. It's pretty much the Star Wars I grew up with, no real 'fixes', just a nice straight transfer. Very happy with this , cheers moth3r!
VADER: Let me look on you with my own eyes...

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http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=WO_S6UgkQk0
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OK, here's an update on TESB:

Rectified the colour saturation issue. I had used the same capture settings for each side, so I don't know how side 3 came to look so de-saturated but 1, 2 and 4 were OK. Anyway, I've checked frames containing red lights with a vectorscope tool to ensure a uniform level of saturation that doesn't clip. As before, I've left the hue dead centre. If you're used to the Dr Gonzo version you may feel like turning the colour up, but I'd suggest, if your display is properly calibrated, my version is a more accurate representation of how the laserdisc is supposed to look.

Watching the new encode, the video is as good as the ANH disc, generally it's lovely to watch - the halos and a bit of dot crawl are still there but not noticeable on my 28" w/s CRT TV. And this time there are no missing sections in the side changes!

I did notice some dropped lines that hadn't been caught by the filter. There's now a new version of DeScratch which means that I can tune the detection more accurately; after a bit more tweaking, I checked 5 frames known to have line drops and they've all been fixed.

Another issue I noticed; remember the blocks occaisionaly caused as a side effect of the noise reduction filter? (Look carefully at the ANH disc, in the smoke left behind after Greedo buys the farm.) I didn't hear of anyone noticing the blocks in ANH, but in one scene in TESB the effect is quite bad. So I've now added in a block-blurring filter, just over these few affected frames.

Here we go then for the final 48-hour processing/encoding session...

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You are a hero Moth3r.
VADER: Let me look on you with my own eyes...

LUKE: Dad, where are your eyebrows?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=WO_S6UgkQk0
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I didn't do any "correction", I would describe what I did as "calibration".

Some useful guides are here:
http://trevlac.us/colorCorrection/
and section 7.1.9 here:
http://www.doom9.org/capture/postprocessing_vdub.html

Laserman has also written some useful articles on correction, you can read them at the X0project site.

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Moth3r, don't know if you've capped Jedi yet, but if you have/when you do, could you post the same frame as on the XO website, for comparison?
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I haven't got to ROTJ yet, but when I do I'll post up that frame for comparison.

By the way it's X0, not XO.

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