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.: LeeThorogood's PAL LaserDisc Preservation Project :. - '97 SE Finished '95 THX Finished - '97 SE Uploaded '95 THX Uploaded to the newsgroup — Page 4

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LeeThorogood said:

Good News everybody!

The (stereo audio) DL DVDs for ESB & ROTJ are finished! I am waiting on some DVD-Rs I ordered to arrive so I can backup the raw captures before I move onto ANH as I need to free up some room on my Hard Drive.

Lee,

Glad to hear things are moving forward smoothly....can't wait to check it out.

:)

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I once read an article in a UK home cinema magazine about the "best bits" of the Star Wars soundtracks - based on the Dolby Surround audio mixes from the PAL SE laserdiscs. I'm sure I still have it stashed away somewhere, I'll have to dig it out and share it.

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I'm glad you finished these. I know how much harder going through a mac can be on preservation projects.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.
“George didn’t think there was any future in dead Han toys.”-Harrison Ford
YT channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader

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The DVD-Rs came yesterday morning :D I captured ANH last night, backed up the raw capture of ANH this morning, and am now just playing with the filters and their settings as well as subtitles and chapter markers, I should be ready to begin rendering the timeline tonight, which if all goes well should mean I would be ready to start authoring the DVD by Wednesday night.

As Jetrell Fo was able to provide me with Darth Editous' DD 5.1 audio captures from the NTSC boxset (Huge Thanks by the way!) I had a go out of curiosity at syncing them up to my PAL captures, I am pleased to say I have successfully synced the 5.1 audio to both ROTJ and ESB :D I find it interesting that although I only have stereo output on my iMac the 5.1 audio seems to sound much better then the stereo captures from my LaserDiscs, perhaps its just me. :|

I am thinking that once ANH is done I may go back and take a second look at Empire as I am not 100% its looking as good as it could. I probably should have played around with the filters and settings, but I just assumed that what worked for Jedi would work for Empire, now I am not too sure it does.

Ultimately I would like to have this release completely finished in the next 2 weeks, 3 at the most.

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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As Jetrell Fo was able to provide me with Darth Editous' DD 5.1 audio captures from the NTSC boxset (Huge Thanks by the way!)

Lee,

Thank you for your words.  DE was kind enough to share those audio files with me a ways back and I purposely kept them in a safe place for when I'm ready to start my own transfer one of these days.  I also figured that someday they'd come in handy here for others who may need to fix stuff or add them to a transfer presentation or archival preservation project. 

I still have my "Hope for Laserman" artwork disc that I got for donating....when I find other artwork I try to save it as well for situations just like these.

Glad I could help in some capacity.  I look forward to the completion of this and the chance to enjoy it in my living room when it's ready.

Cheers,

Shawn

 

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Jetrell Fo you're very welcome!

Believe it or not I am already thinking about a possible V2 of this release. The reason being I came across several posts about Frame Averaging for noise reduction in the past few days, which has the potential to do a much better job at noise reduction then the filter I am using, not to mention I could probably dial back or do away with the colour correction filter as well. I will need to do a test run on a small segment probably a chapter or two from ROTJ which seems to be the noisiest of the three discs to see how effective it is and if its worth starting over.

Even if I do end up doing a V2 I will still release V1 for those who want it.

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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Multiple capture averaging will only help reduce the analogue noise that is introduced in your player, interconnects and capture device. I was disappointed when I tried it on a laserdsic capture, because only a small amount of noise was removed. In that case, it turned out that most of the visible noise was actually present on the LD master (so the noise pattern was the same in every capture). I'd be interested to see your results.

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Moth3r said:


Multiple capture averaging will only help reduce the analogue noise that is introduced in your player, interconnects and capture device. I was disappointed when I tried it on a laserdsic capture, because only a small amount of noise was removed. In that case, it turned out that most of the visible noise was actually present on the LD master (so the noise pattern was the same in every capture). I'd be interested to see your results.
Thanks for the info Moth3r :)

This is exactly why I plan to do a test run or two, as I want to find out how much noise is being introduced by my Player, cables, Capture card etc and how much is actually present on the LaserDiscs themselves.

Ultimately I don't want to remove any film grain that is present, only the video noise, or to be more precise the flickering it seems to generate.

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So I had cause to down tools today to produce a sample clip for my question about LaserDisc flickering in the How-To section. I figured as I had all the equipment connected I may as well have a go at the frame averaging test I wanted to do.

So I did 5 captures of the same chapter of Jedi and I think it has helped if only a little, its kind of hard to tell. Below is an MPEG2 upload of my test on the left side of the frame is the original unaltered capture, on the right is the 5 capture average.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=NQ5P8CZY

I have zipped up the m2v file, but there is no password. Let me know what you think, if using the frame averaging has not helped then there is no point me pursuing this technique any further. :) Now back to work on ANH.

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
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I think I can certainly say that a V2 release is going to follow, if only to give me peace of mind that I have achieved the cleanest, best quality transfer possible on my set-up.

Current changes planned for V2:
- Switch to a quad-shielded 24k gold plated Belkin Pure AV 1.8m S-video cable for best transfer quality from the D925 to the ADVC-55.
- Implement 5 capture frame averaging, to eliminate any random analogue noise in my set-up. (If there is any its not allot, but every little helps right?)
- After initial capture (which is stuck as MiniDV) switch from using regular ProRes 422 to ProRes 422 HQ.
- Do away with the Colour Correction filter. (I think this is causing blocking :S)

As with the V1, V2 will use DarthEditous' DD 5.1 AC3 captures, and will be released in DVD9 format.

I was wondering if anyone has any advice as to which order filters should be applied? Currently the order I am using is:

1. Chroma Smoother
2. Colour Corrector
3. Noise Reduction

Are there any rules of thumb as to which order filters should be applied?

Many Thanks

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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Good call with the ProRes 422 HQ.  I've only started working with Final Cut this year in my experimental editing class, but for shits and giggles I ran a comparison test between ProRes 422 and ProRes 422 HQ, and I can tell you that the HQ looks quite a bit better.

Other than that, everything else is a bit over my head!  Though I did download your sample, and while you're right that there isn't that much noise, there is a difference between the 5-capture average and the single capture, subtle though it may be.

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Agreed. The 5 capture average just edges out the original. The HQ difference is subtle, but it is better. Your resulting file is larger though.

Did you IVTC your footage or deinterlace? And how will you add the ac3 out of curiosity.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.
“George didn’t think there was any future in dead Han toys.”-Harrison Ford
YT channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader

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 (Edited)


ChainsawAsh said:
Good call with the ProRes 422 HQ. I've only started working with Final Cut this year in my experimental editing class, but for shits and giggles I ran a comparison test between ProRes 422 and ProRes 422 HQ, and I can tell you that the HQ looks quite a bit better.

Other than that, everything else is a bit over my head! Though I did download your sample, and while you're right that there isn't that much noise, there is a difference between the 5-capture average and the single capture, subtle though it may be.
Ash, thanks for the info on ProRes HQ. When I started this release I wanted to use HQ as I assumed it would give better results, but as Hard Drive space was limited I consoled myself that it was probably over kill any ways and went with regular ProRes, clearly I was mistaken and will have to fix that for the next release (I have just brought a 1TB external FW800 hard drive for this very purpose.)

Thanks for the feedback, its so useful to get second opinions on this kind of thing!


captainsolo said:
Agreed. The 5 capture average just edges out the original. The HQ difference is subtle, but it is better. Your resulting file is larger though.

Did you IVTC your footage or deinterlace? And how will you add the ac3 out of curiosity.
Captainsolo first of all thanks for the feedback its always helpful and appreciated!

I didn't IVTC as that's only needed for NTSC footage with 3:2 pull-down. I didn't need to de-interlace Moth3r explains why back on page 1 or 2. For the AC3 audio I used compressor to adjust the speed from NTSC to PAL, I then imported the output from that into Final Cut, turned on the audio waveforms, and used those to sync up the start of each audio file, then I used the speed change option in Final Cut to adjust the speed of each file as necessary to get it to fully sync up with the stereo, removing excess silence where necessary.

FYI for the test clip I was still using regular ProRes. :)

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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 (Edited)

A Long Time Ago In A Galaxy Far, Far Away...

Good news for everyone who has been following this thread. Version 1 of this release is now finished. :D

Specifications
Format: DVD-Video
Size: Dual Layer DVD-9
Running time:
ANH: 1:59:48
ESB: 2:01:57
ROTJ: 2:09:23
Video Format: PAL
Framerate: 25 fps
Display Aspect Ratio: 16:9
Presentation Aspect Ratio: 2.35:1
Video Codec: MPEG-2
Video Resolution: 720 x 576
Video Average Bitrate: ANH & ESB 7.7 mbps ROTJ 7.0 mbps
Audio Track 1 - Type: Main
Audio Track 1 - Channels: 5.1
Audio Track 1 - Format: AC3
Audio Track 1 - Average Bitrate: 448 kbps

Each DVD also includes the special feature explaining the changes/enhancements they made for that film. Where applicable Alien subtitles are hard coded into the lower black bar.

Anyone interested in a copy of these DVDs should PM me for now, until they find their way to the usual places.

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
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Work on version 2 of this release has begun. I have side A of ESB captured, averaged and output to a ProRes HQ .mov file ready for later. Side B of ESB is capturing as I type. :D If all goes well I should have all the capturing and averaging done by the end of Sunday.

I may post some samples next week using different DVNR filters to see what people think as I really can't make my mind up at the moment as to whether to use DVNR or not, you see on the one hand I want as clean a transfer as possible but on the other hand I want this release to look as good as it possibly can. Decisions, decisions... :)

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
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Hi everyone,

Capturing and Frame Averaging are now complete, the difference in noise between a single capture and the averaged capture is perceivable, especially for the VHS clips. :D

I have also finished editing all the sides together for all three films and will start rendering the timelines in the next few days, although it will probably take about a week for all three films to fully render. At present the only filter I am applying is a chroma smoother which fixes a problem introduced by the Apple miniDV codec. I have thought about applying DVNR but to be honest I am not sure how much of the 'noise' is actual noise that I would want to remove or just film grain that I would want to keep.

If I get time I will post a test clip so you can get an idea of what the picture quality will be like for the V2 release.

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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 (Edited)

Nice avatar LOL, could you find one a little more similar? I guess it is time for a change now anyways.

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 (Edited)

My bad......................please accept my humblest apologies...........I am suffering from a pretty bad sinus infection....it is no excuse for sure, I am truly sorry.

 

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Jetrell Fo said:

dark_jedi said:

Nice avatar LOL, could you find one a little more similar? I guess it is time for a change now anyways.

Are you serious?  You actually posted this?  WTF, really.........you have nothing better to do now that you've canceled your own project yet again? 

It's not like Lee is doing a vinyl archive of the same stuff you were doing.........like anyone here is really trying to copy your project or be a DJ clone just to rattle your ronto....................yeesh, get a grip.

:(

WTF does this mean? who canceled what? I canceled nothing, you should pull your head out of your ass and read what you just quoted LOL, I mentioned nothing of canceling.

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dark_jedi, JediTray, what's the difference?

;-)

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 (Edited)

Apology added above..........again, I'm really sorry.

I guess you can tell I was a bit disappointed in the canceling/restarting/canceling again of JediTray's vinyl project....I saw the word "jedi" and got sorely confused..............and a little wild to boot.

Again, it was MY mistake.  I have no ill will towards you at all DJ.  I'm thinking that the Corellian Tie-Stick I bought isn't so good for medicinal purposes after all..........LMAO

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dark_jedi said:


Nice avatar LOL, could you find one a little more similar? I guess it is time for a change now anyways.
Hi DarkJedi I guess they are very similar, I didn't mean to step on any toes or cause a problem I just found it at the weekend and as I like Ahsoka from The Clone Wars I thought it would make a cool avatar but if you want me to change it just say :)

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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 (Edited)

Okay I have put the sample clip together with the follow segments:

1. Fox Fanfare & LucasArts Logo from ROTJ
2. Binary Sunset from ANH
3. Scruffy Lookin Nurf Herder from ESB
4. Into the Death Star from ROTJ
5. Carbon Freeze Facility from ESB
6. Chewie in the Millennium Falcon Cockpit just after leaving the Death Star Hanger from ANH
7. Opening sequence from ROTJ

Click the link to download the sample

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=MC6Q08XH

Although its zipped up there is no password.

Let me know what you think :)

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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i downloaded it and when i tryed to unzip it it gave me an error and i couldnt extract it :(