Can Someone Explain the Map to Luke Skywalker? — Page 2

Cthulhunicron said:

Look, I’m fine with certain minor things in the Star Wars universe not making complete logical sense. I mean, it seems like it’d be a lot easier if astromech droids just spoke English (Arabesh? whatever…) rather than bleeps and whistles, but who cares?

The movie straight up tells us that the resistance does not have a map of that region of space, so the fragment from Lor San Tekka is meaningless without context. Then R2 spontaneously reactivates and reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment. It seems to me like something that needs an explanation.

I could have sworn BB-8 put the last piece in…

Either someone (possibly Luke, possibly someone else) knew where Luke was going and put the map in R2 (why?). Or someone tracked Luke’s journey, created the map, and put it in R2 without telling anyone else in the Resistance (again, why?).

That entire thing does need to be explained but mostly because of Lor San Tekka being on Jakku and how that might relate to Rey. That doesn’t really coincide with your main point though.

Lord Haseo said:

Cthulhunicron said:

Look, I’m fine with certain minor things in the Star Wars universe not making complete logical sense. I mean, it seems like it’d be a lot easier if astromech droids just spoke English (Arabesh? whatever…) rather than bleeps and whistles, but who cares?

The movie straight up tells us that the resistance does not have a map of that region of space, so the fragment from Lor San Tekka is meaningless without context. Then R2 spontaneously reactivates and reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment. It seems to me like something that needs an explanation.

I could have sworn BB-8 put the last piece in…

He did, because there was a piece missing. Like I said, R2 “reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment.”

Cthulhunicron said:

Lord Haseo said:

Cthulhunicron said:

Look, I’m fine with certain minor things in the Star Wars universe not making complete logical sense. I mean, it seems like it’d be a lot easier if astromech droids just spoke English (Arabesh? whatever…) rather than bleeps and whistles, but who cares?

The movie straight up tells us that the resistance does not have a map of that region of space, so the fragment from Lor San Tekka is meaningless without context. Then R2 spontaneously reactivates and reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment. It seems to me like something that needs an explanation.

I could have sworn BB-8 put the last piece in…

He did, because there was a piece missing. Like I said, R2 “reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment.”

I thought you said “plus” that one fragment. My mistake.

But in regards to:

Cthulhunicron said:
The movie straight up tells us that the resistance does not have a map of that region of space, so the fragment from Lor San Tekka is meaningless without context.

I’m not exactly sure how it can be meaningless if that was the final piece that completed the map. That seems pretty damn meaningful to me or am is there something I’m missing?

Lord Haseo said:

Cthulhunicron said:

Lord Haseo said:

Cthulhunicron said:

Look, I’m fine with certain minor things in the Star Wars universe not making complete logical sense. I mean, it seems like it’d be a lot easier if astromech droids just spoke English (Arabesh? whatever…) rather than bleeps and whistles, but who cares?

The movie straight up tells us that the resistance does not have a map of that region of space, so the fragment from Lor San Tekka is meaningless without context. Then R2 spontaneously reactivates and reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment. It seems to me like something that needs an explanation.

I could have sworn BB-8 put the last piece in…

He did, because there was a piece missing. Like I said, R2 “reveals he has the full map minus that one fragment.”

I thought you said “plus” that one fragment. My mistake.

But in regards to:

Cthulhunicron said:
The movie straight up tells us that the resistance does not have a map of that region of space, so the fragment from Lor San Tekka is meaningless without context.

I’m not exactly sure how it can be meaningless if that was the final piece that completed the map. That seems pretty damn meaningful to me or am is there something I’m missing?

I said it was meaningless until they had the context. Threepio initially looks at the map and says it doesn’t match any of their records. It’s only when R2 reveals the full map that they are able to figure out where Luke’s final destination is in relation to charted space.

Why does R2 have the map? Why does Lor San Tekka have a fragment? Legitimate questions. Will they be answered? Who knows.

Why doesn’t the Resistance have the same map? Don’t give a shit.

DominicCobb said:

Why does R2 have the map? Why does Lor San Tekka have a fragment? Legitimate questions. Will they be answered? Who knows.

Why doesn’t the Resistance have the same map? Don’t give a shit.

I agree, if we’re supposed to understand that the map is previously uncharted space. It’s just that I’m not sure what the movie is trying to convey. It was my understanding at first that the map was created by people working for the resistance, searching for Luke. But then I remembered that R2’s had the map since before he went offline, so that can’t be it.

My main point, is that if, by episode 9, it is never explained where R2’s portion of the map came from, I think that’s an issue. I think it’s equally as important as learning where Lor San Tekka’s portion came from, or learning where Rey came from. In other words, I’m fine with it, as long as it’s presently meant to be mysterious.

But if we’re just supposed to understand that R2 has the map because he had access to imperial records from the Death Star or something, I don’t see why the Resistance wouldn’t have the same records after 30 years of access to abandoned Imperial bases and ships.

The way I understood it in the movie was that no one knew where Luke had gone. Lor San Tekka is a kind of space archaeologist. Indiana Jones in the Star Wars galaxy if you will. Somewhere in his travels he’d procured this ancient map to the very first Jedi temple. When rumours emerged that Luke may have gone there, Leia contacted San Tekka to get the map fragment from him.

With regards to the full map, Kylo Ren says to Rey that the first order got it from the Empire’s data base but it is missing a fragment. My guess is that somewhere in history a Jedi or someone likeminded feared that the Empire would destroy the sacred site so infiltrated the Empire’s database and removed that section of the map so they couldn’t find it.

The resistance now have the fragment but are missing the larger map from which it was taken. Artoo however, is the missing part of the puzzle. Presumably, either when he had access to the Republic archives or when he was plugging into the Death Star’s database he was able to download the larger map and has been storing it since then.

I agree, there is a lot of speculation as to exactly how the key players got a hold of these different versions though. Maybe it will be one of those things we will be debating endlessly.

Looking forward to the forthcoming Raiders of the Lost Map to Ahctu : a Star Wars story.

Tobar said:

Been some time since I last saw the film but it seemed to me that Luke put himself into a self-imposed exile.

If the others ever needed him, he trusted San Tekka and Artoo to know when and if to disclose his location. Separating the map ensured that it meant both of them agreed that he was really needed.

Yeap exactly this seems the most likely explanation, and is all but implied in the film. Will we get direct confirmation of this in the next films? If it’s important, sure. But it isn’t, necessarily.

Even though the question is left unanswered in the film, calling it a plot hole is kind of silly. A plot hole is an unanswered question that can’t be answered. This has plenty of possible explanations, from obvious to less so. Just because it isn’t spelled out doesn’t make it a “major plot hole.”

ATMachine said:

Seriously, though, Tobar explained the idea in two sentences. Surely it can’t be that hard for the writers to do likewise?

Maybe not but why if there’s no purpose or need?

Proposed EpVIII scene
Rey is doing a handstand with Luke sitting on her foot
Luke: Concentrate
Rey: But Luke, how did Artoo have the map?
Luke: Why is that important?
Rey: Because I need to EXACTLY how I was able to find you.
Luke: But… you’re here now.
Rey: Tell me I need to know or it will bother me forever and I’ll never stop complaining about it.
Luke sits down on a log and Rey joins
Luke: Well, as you know, I put himself into a self-imposed exile. If anyone ever needed me, I trusted Lor San Tekka and Artoo to know when and if to disclose my location. Separating the map ensured that it meant both of them agreed that I was really needed.
Rey: Thank you for taking the time out of my training to explain this! Plot hole resolved!

Seriously though, they could easily explain this more efficiently in the film, but I see no reason unless something else (not easily inferred from watching TFA) in addition is revealed that pertains to more directly to the plot of VIII (not VII).

And to clarify I don’t think doubleofive meant that Luke didn’t trust Leia and that’s why he gave R2 the piece of the map. If Luke didn’t trust her he wouldn’t have given it to TWO mutual allies.

Exactly. I’m of the thought that Luke had to direct Lor San Tekka there as I remember the Jakku village being close in proximity to Niima Outpost. I mean that’s a little too obvious.

DominicCobb said:

Cthulhunicron said:

How is not major? It’d be like if the original Star Wars never explained what the Death Star weakness was.

Not at all. It’d be like if the original Star Wars never explained why Leia couldn’t just beam the plans directly to Yavin.

Easy, too big of a file for that distance, and possibly it couldve been traced to the receiving point and the rebel base location revealed. Granted, they had transmissions between Yavin and the Rogue guys, but those were quick verbal transmissions, not large files of information that maybe wouldve been easier to trace. Who knows? In the real world, during my ARMY commo days, transmissions were made to be short and to the point to avoid be located in some instances. Maybe the same applies to transmitting the plans to Yavin.

Sure, there’s plenty of possible explanations, some more obvious than others. Point being, just because it’s not explained in the movie doesn’t make it a plot hole.

I’m curious also why Lor San Tekka decided to give the map to Po Dameron, if Luke was trying to stay hidden.

Cthulhunicron said:

I’m curious also why Lor San Tekka decided to give the map to Po Dameron, if Luke was trying to stay hidden.

“this will begin to make things right”