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AviSynth and Virtualdub filters

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Laserman or Zion,i was reffered to you by a fellow member here on learning the use of filters,i have been doing captures now for a few months,and i really would like to step up and learn the use of filtering to get a better result,i am capturing with a Canopus ADVC 110 via FireWire using Scenalyzer Live,now i know i cannot capture using the famous huffyuv,because of the canopus, but my captures arent that bad,but could be better some people here including Rikter has seen them,as well as davidian,he is the one that said they look real good but could look better with some filtering.
so my question is do you guys use Avisynth?or VirtualDUB filters?now i know Avisynth you have to write scripts,where VDUB they are kind of easier once you put the filter in the folder,what settings do you use? and where is a good place to learn this?
If either of you were to lets say "train"someone on the use of filters what would you tell your student to do first?
now i know both of you are very very busy with the X0 project,but if i could just get a few pointers and get started in the right direction,i know i can figure this out,especially with a little guidance from a couple of experts.
thanks for your time and cant wait to see your finished project
darkjedi
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I would tell my student to open up her browser and go to...
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org
doom9.org


Honestly it is the best place for this stuff. If you want to use the free programs like AVISYTHN and VIRTUALDUB, head over to their forums and search first, then ask away.
I'd almost bet my left nut that any question you have is already answered in the forums, so make sure you spend some time searching first.
Learn avisynth, it is worth the effort, but you need to know virtauldub too, so maybe play with some of the virtualdub filters first to get your head round it, and then try applying the equivalent thing using avisynth as an experment an see how you go.

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thanks laserman i noticed you said "freeware" what are some good "pay for" filtering programs?
thanks again
darkjedi

ps what are some good filters you guys like and are some favorites example,limitedsharpen(),pixiedust,etc?
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I'm not Laserman, nor zion, but I know a thing or two about AviSynth and VirtualDub -- especially the 'how to get started' part.

For AviSynth, you need to know about only two places: AviSynth.org (http://www.avisynth.org), and Doom9's forum (http://forum.doom9.org).

AviSynth.org is an online Wiki manual/user's guide, and is pretty comprehensive. Doom9's forum is where those hardcore videophiles who actually write filters and scripts and functions go. You will not need any other places to start.

VirtualDub has a new release today (1.6.8 or something?); you can also get info about how to use VDub at Doom9. I think a lot of us more experienced video tweakers use VirtualDubMod in conjunction with AviSynth. That's a very powerful, flexible, and totally free setup.

One thing to keep in mind: always use the smallest number of filters you can get away with. Using too many makes things slow, harder to troubleshoot, and (often) crappier.

Have fun!
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thank you karyudo i will look for VirtualDUBMod right now and then head over to Doom9.
darkjedi
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That damn Laserman beats me out yet again...!

One thing Laserman's post reminded me of, though: if you start with VDub and get used to some of those filters, you can probably also use them in AviSynth. There are scripts written to allow the use of many (most?) VDub filters in AviSynth. Beats the hell out of trying to save different configurations of VDub filters for a given project...
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^ What he said.

I'd start with VirtualDub or VirtualDubMod first and get a good feel for it and how the filters work. After that try out some simple scripts with AVISynth. You will find that the two programs (VirtualDubMod and AVISynth) work together nicely as well. I have found both to be invaluable recources in all my video projects so far.

But the first step, of course, is to head to doom9's forums. A wealth of information awaits you.

My Projects:
[Holiday Special Hybrid DVD v2]
[X0 Project]
[Backstroke of the West DVD]
[ROTS Theatrical DVD]

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over at doom9 should i just start downloading everything?i just dl'd blinddehalo3,masktools but i have read some of DiDee post before he is the one that made Limitedsharpen()so i figure he definitely knows what he is talking about,i will head back over and continue reading,but first i will look for VDUBMod.
thanks EVERYONE for the FAST replies
darkjedi
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I told ya these guys would know. I'm more limited in the filters department because i usually deal with sources that have already been cleaned up and really don't need much, if any work at all.

dark_jedi's captures look very good, but they suffer from the softness inherint in the natural laserdisc source. He's considering creating a dual layer version of the Criterion Bladerunner LD which I don't consider entirely essential, however I do think the video would benefit from a sharpening filter and still be released as a very respectable single layer disc.

"Give us all your money and a tank of gas. We're taking this bird to Cuba" ~Stimpy
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Start downloading nothing.

Seriously maybe grab limitedsharpen and have a play, but get to know how the programs work *first*.
Try getting some footage, applying say two filters to it in vdub, and then play with the filter settings and see what happens. The try the same thing in avisynth. Try changing the order of filters and see the results.
Get a grounding on how both programs work first by just using a few filters.
Once you have your head round it - *then* download another filter or two and see what they do.

For this sort of work the things you may want to do with footage is:
adjust the black and white points
noise removal
sharpening
resizing
colour correction

at least to get started anyway. so grab some filters that relate to those and try them one at a time, get to know them, see which you like the best, then see what order they work best in and so on.

I guess what I am trying to say in my waffle is don't get caught in the trap of being a 'collector' of apps and filters, pick a small selection of software, then start using it and learning it, and don't download anything new until you understand what you already have.
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ok downloading is stopped for now,i captured the fullscreen version of star wars anh for ocpmovie and i noticed it is pretty darn bright,not just the capture either,i watched the ld to make sure, is there anything to darken up a movie?
the fullscreen versions really do not look that great at all,but what do you expect the whole movie on 1 disc,except rotj that is actually 2.
thank you laserman again, i will just take a capture i already did, and crop just a small chunk of it and start testing,but is there any way to see what you did?and if it made any difference without burning a bunch of dvd's?because i noticed windows media player looks like crap compared to what i actually watch on tv,so i cant really use that as a judge.
darkjedi

ps can give give me some titles of filters i should practice with?i am already going to use limitedsharpen()when i move on to avisynth,but i will just use vdub or vdubmod first as you said.
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Get a card that has a proper video output, or go on the cheap and get a realmagic card or something like that so that you can compile a file and watch it on your TV.
First things first though, calibrate your monitor and your TV with some test patterns at least.
The calibrate your capture system to make sure you are capturing the full dynamic range of your source. (ie. that it is no too bright with blown out whites or too dark with crushed blacks)
If the source is still to bright, then set new black and white points.
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Originally posted by: Laserman
Get a card that has a proper video output, or go on the cheap and get a realmagic card or something like that so that you can compile a file and watch it on your TV.
First things first though, calibrate your monitor and your TV with some test patterns at least.
The calibrate your capture system to make sure you are capturing the full dynamic range of your source. (ie. that it is no too bright with blown out whites or too dark with crushed blacks)
If the source is still to bright, then set new black and white points.


I agree Laserman,

I use the ADVC100 for all my captures (including PAL/NTSC) and this has a setting on it for IRE 0/7.5 (ie black level) if capturing PAL, IRE should be set to 0, and if US NTSC, then it should be 7.5 This made a vast difference to the brightness level of my SW captures a few months back and now only a small amount of filtering is required to bring the video ready for DVD

I have the AVI in avisynth, do the IVTC and resize as required then frameserve to VD and use a few of their filters. The order of filters does matter, do experiment a little and see what effects you get. I have had to change gamma and brightness so the image comes out right (to my eye anyway) and after testing a few clips on a test DVD on the TV (the monitor is a lot different!), I then did the entire encode...

Laserman, what type of calibration do you recommend? (Yes, my AVI is DV Canopus)

ntrprs
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Go get a Video Essentials laserdisc, and use the test patterns on there as a guide - make sure you are getting the full greayscale appearing in your capture window
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ebay, second hand laserdisc dealers and so forth.
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Laserman, do you remember the link you gave me for the VE LD? It was some LD dealer, IIRC.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Just a few thoughts on calibration; I use THIS plugin for VirtualDub, which gives a neat waveform monitor allowing you to quickly spot problems in your capture.

Eg:

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/594/calibrate19ud.jpg

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/4172/calibrate28uf.jpg

Black level (brightness) should be set first, followed by the white level (contrast).

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