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Worst villain: The Emperor — Page 2

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Density said:

It’s because the Emperor is so arrogant and mad with power that he doesn’t feel the need for subtlety. He’s a sadist who gets off on his power and control and evilness. Luke flat out says “Your overconfidence is your weakness” and that’s 100% true. I don’t see what’s so hard to understand.

Exactly. He’s telling Luke that he’s going to fall to the Dark Side because, as far as the Emperor is concerned, “it is unavoidable”. Nothing can stop it, he has foreseen Luke defeating Vader and taking his father’s place at his side so he’s letting Luke know that it doesn’t make any difference whether he resists, because it is his destiny.

We already know the Emperor is a master manipulator and that he sees the future. He deliberately let the Rebellion know where the second Death Star was and that he’d be there. He tells Vader that Luke will surrender himself to him to Vader’s disbelief, and yet, lo’ and behold, Luke does just that. He knows that the shuttle Tyderium was a Rebel ruse. He foresees Luke falling and as far as we’re concerned, we see Luke start down that path when he loses control and attacks the Emperor, which Palpatine sees as Luke fulfilling his destiny to join the Dark Side and replace Vader. If anything, that makes him a better villain: he’s spot on about everything so far, and then even Luke seems to fall into his trap.

He’s scary for the same reason slow zombies are scary: the inevitability.

Like Density said, the only reason his plan failed was because of his overconfidence and underestimation of the Rebel resolve against the Empire, Luke’s resolve against the Dark Side, and finally (as well as fatally) Vader’s resolve. When Luke defeats Vader, realizes where he is headed if he continues, and throws down his weapon to show that he is truly a Jedi, the Emperor realizes that he needs to up the ante, and so he tortures Luke in an attempt to break him, to turn him to the Dark Side by Force (hur hur). Again, he was overconfident in his ability to do so, in Vader’s allegiance to the Sith and his master, and he underestimated the good inside of Anakin and the love a father has for his son.

That’s how I see it at least.

Hell, he might have even built the second Death Star not to actually use on the scale of the original Death Star, but as a massive trap. Nothing better to give your enemy a false sense of hope than to pit them against a familiar scenario they won before, but change the rules. He was stacking the deck against the Rebellion the whole time, but failed to account for their spirit.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)

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Tyrphanax said:

Exactly. He’s telling Luke that he’s going to fall to the Dark Side because, as far as the Emperor is concerned, “it is unavoidable”. Nothing can stop it, he has foreseen Luke defeating Vader and taking his father’s place at his side so he’s letting Luke know that it doesn’t make any difference whether he resists, because it is his destiny.

But doesn’t Vader tell Luke in ESB, “Luke, you can destroy the Emperor. He has forseen this. It is your destiny. Join me, and together we can rule the galaxy as father and son.”

In fact, prior to this the Emperor wants Luke killed, but Vader is the one who suggest he can turn Luke into an ally of the Empire.

We already know the Emperor is a master manipulator and that he sees the future. He deliberately let the Rebellion know where the second Death Star was and that he’d be there. He tells Vader that Luke will surrender himself to him to Vader’s disbelief, and yet, lo’ and behold, Luke does just that. He knows that the shuttle Tyderium was a Rebel ruse. He foresees Luke falling and as far as we’re concerned, we see Luke start down that path when he loses control and attacks the Emperor, which Palpatine sees as Luke fulfilling his destiny to join the Dark Side and replace Vader. If anything, that makes him a better villain: he’s spot on about everything so far, and then even Luke seems to fall into his trap.

The aspects you mentioned, like foreseeing that Luke will go to Vader, are good traits of a villain. You think this guy is one step ahead of your every move. But in his attempt to turn Luke, it was incredibly stupid, and that goes beyond simply being overconfident. And not only that, but other factors are at play which make me feel he’s one of the less interesting villains out there. Maybe if we didn’t see his eyes, like in The Phantom Menace when he was talking to the Asian stereotype aliens via hologram, and he had that same gravitas in his voice in that film, then he would come across more mysterious and intimidating. I prefer Frank Langella’s Skeletor from MOTU film over Palpatine. Better dialogue, better delivery, and better look.

Like Density said, the only reason his plan failed was because of his overconfidence and underestimation of the Rebel resolve against the Empire, Luke’s resolve against the Dark Side, and finally (as well as fatally) Vader’s resolve. When Luke defeats Vader, realizes where he is headed if he continues, and throws down his weapon to show that he is truly a Jedi, the Emperor realizes that he needs to up the ante, and so he tortures Luke in an attempt to break him, to turn him to the Dark Side by Force (hur hur). Again, he was overconfident in his ability to do so, in Vader’s allegiance to the Sith and his master, and he underestimated the good inside of Anakin and the love a father has for his son.

That’s how I see it at least.

Like I said, he comes off like a cartoon villain, in the same way that the cheesy villains tell the hero their whole plan before killing them.

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In ROTS (Labyrinth of Evil 😉) palpatine convinces Anakin to join the dark side because the sith embrace all aspects of the force and that the Jedi are corrupt and wrong. Whereas in ROTJ he just says “you’ll turn to the dark side”. You understand how Anakin turns cause Palptine convinced him that what is presented as wrong is right. Luke is simply told that he should do what’s wrong. It really seemed like the emperor used reverse psychology on Luke.

Return of the Jedi: Remastered

Lord of the Rings: The Darth Rush Definitives

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When closely examined his plans seem a bit silly. I think this extends form the fact that Palpy was originally conceived as a politician and not Supreme Sith Lord etc.

Love the performance and the confrontation but agree that it lacks that epic feel necessary for the final battle scenario and that overall he seems more ineffective than he should be.

Tarkin remains the best villain for me. Cold, remorseless, calculating and the most dangerous in the OT.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.
“George didn’t think there was any future in dead Han toys.”-Harrison Ford
YT channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader

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IsanRido said:

When I read the title, I thought the thread was going to be about Palp’s plans in the prequels, which requiered everyone else in the galaxy to be idiots.

Well in fairness a lot of it rested on manipulating Jar Jar Binks so…

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 (Edited)

nickyd47 said:

Worst villain is Darth Maul. Has absolutely no character.

^ pretty much this

EDIT:

Even in TCW and Rebels he’s still mostly One Dimensional

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At least he looked cool though. And in the prequels, less dialogue tends to be for the better. He still beats Count Dooku and General Grievous, who had characters, just really bad ones. That’s worse than a guy with no character but a cool lightsaber and badass style.

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Density said:

At least he looked cool though. And in the prequels, less dialogue tends to be for the better. He still beats Count Dooku and General Grievous, who had characters, just really bad ones. That’s worse than a guy with no character but a cool lightsaber and badass style.

Maul is mysterious in episode 1 and a badass. Clone Wars expanded him a bit more. But in the Rebels finale I felt he received a lot more interesting characterization.

Return of the Jedi: Remastered

Lord of the Rings: The Darth Rush Definitives

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As much as I’m loath to say it, Darth Maul has become a fairly interesting character with some decent depth.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)

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 (Edited)

Dammit Disney, stop giving me reasons to watch Rebels!
I’ve already thrown away enough of my life to Star Wars.

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DuracellEnergizer said:

Yeah, Rebels did a pretty decent job making Maul interesting.

The real question here should be: why the hell is Maul even in Rebels when he was chopped in half in TPM? And TCW is not an excuse here. Just because one series made a stupid thing it doesn’t mean the other has to acknowledge it.

真実

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imperialscum said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Yeah, Rebels did a pretty decent job making Maul interesting.

The real question here should be: why the hell is Maul even in Rebels when he was chopped in half in TPM? And TCW is not an excuse here. Just because one series made a stupid thing it doesn’t mean the other has to acknowledge it.

Because Fandom. And since we have an in universe explanation as to why he survived it isn’t a problem.

DuracellEnergizer said:

Yeah, Rebels did a pretty decent job making Maul interesting.

I wouldn’t say they made him interesting but I will say they gave him a damn good motive for his actions in Rebels.

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What the heck was the in-universe explanation?

I hope it was that his vital organs are all contained in his top half. Or his bottom half…

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TV’s Frink said:

What the heck was the in-universe explanation?

I hope it was that his vital organs are all contained in his top half. Or his bottom half…

If Maul’s top half with robotic legs fights his bottom half with robotic arms, who would win?

Ceci n’est pas une signature.

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Frank your Majesty said:

TV’s Frink said:

What the heck was the in-universe explanation?

I hope it was that his vital organs are all contained in his top half. Or his bottom half…

If Maul’s top half with robotic legs fights his bottom half with robotic arms, who would win?

Lucas?

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Lord Haseo said:
And since we have an in universe explanation as to why he survived it isn’t a problem.

Are you okay my friend?

真実

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I like how you guys are friends now. His heartfelt concern for you is touching.

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Didn’t maul get chopped well up into his torso? Like, I’m pretty sure his kidneys and intestines ended up in the lower half. Not just a matter of robotic limbs.

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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CHEWBAKAspelledwrong said:

I’m pretty sure his kidneys and intestines ended up in the lower half.

In my scenario, his kidneys and intestines are in his head. Or maybe his feet.

Or maybe he doesn’t even need those, not being human and all.

I haven’t decided yet but it will eventually end up in the anime I’m producing.