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Idea: Preserving the original trilogy 2 - Drafting a manifesto — Page 2

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If there are any substantial results, then I’ll decide whether or not to move forward.
I’ll not rotoscope the footage in complex ways either, it’s systematic,
A shot can be divided into 3 sections.
Foreground, Midground, Background

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I feel that using doing a deep analysis of the footage may provide us a better oppourtunity to recover details that could be hidden.
The rotoscoping is going to be used to make sure anything the cinemetographer envisioned isn’t compromised. I thought it would be a good safety measure.
On the other hand it may make analysis of the element more efficient as well.
SR software is good when used on security cameras it’s not for a piece of art unless the art is analyzed in a way that provides less risk for the software sharpening parts of the shot that weren’t intended to be sharpened.

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THE EDIT POST BUTTON IS A FANTASTIC RESOURCE

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Jeffgale26 said:
Mind you, dicks usually get things done, and mike verta has done some amazing and admirable work.

I wonder what Mike did to wind up in the second half of that sentence.

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Jeffgale26 said:

Mind you, dicks usually get things done.

Maybe you can borrow a couple from the stash Frink has in his mouth on any given Saturday night?

Holy shit Frink taking flak out of nowhere ladies and gentleman.

Harrison Ford Has Pretty Much Given Up on His Son. Here's Why

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Well some guys at lucasfilm told me he had to get his hands on some other rather large objects before he got his hands on that print.
The very civillised kind for a very civillised time, get my drift? XD

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Jeffgale26 said:

Well some guys at lucasfilm told me he had to get his hands on some other rather large objects before he got his hands on that print.

I don’t see why this would be the case. Our team has had several 35mm IB Technicolor prints scanned without having to do any unzipping.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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But Chris Chan said that’s exactly what goes on there, he said that he saw it when he was presenting Sonichu to George Lucas for a film deal.

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Jeffgale26 said:

But Chris Chan said that’s exactly what goes on there, he said that he saw it when he was presenting Sonichu to George Lucas for a film deal.

This my very well be, but my point stands that he need not have gone to LFL to obtain a 35mm IB Technicolor print. All surviving prints (with the possible exception of one) are in the hands of private collectors.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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May I ask any questions about the quality of those prints for home video vs the 2003 masters?
Will we see one more home video release by any chance?

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Jeffgale26 said:

May I ask any questions about the quality of those prints for home video vs the 2003 masters?
Will we see one more home video release by any chance?

They’re far superior in some places (e.g., color and detail not wiped by DNR) and inferior in others (e.g., detail from the negative eclipsed by grain in the production of the release print).

In my experience they are far more pleasing to watch than the 2003/4 master, SE changes aside.

I don’t work for LFL, so I don’t know what they plan on doing re: home video releases.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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That’s amazing news, but I doubt I’m gonna make it up the ladder far enough to get one of those in my personal archive. XD
Let alone glimpse the holy grail.

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How much detail was lost in the dnr vs the IB technicolor print scans?

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And is Star wars 4k material or does it always max out at 720p at the end of the day?

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Jeffgale26 said:

And is Star wars 4k material or does it always max out at 720p at the end of the day?

It was shot and edited on film. That means it could potentially use 6k+. Despecialized is at 720p because that’s the middle ground between SD 480p (GOUT source) and HD 1080p (BD source).

Army of Darkness: The Medieval Deadit | The Terminator - Color Regrade | The Wrong Trousers - Audio Preservation
SONIC RACES THROUGH THE GREEN FIELDS.
THE SUN RACES THROUGH A BLUE SKY FILLED WITH WHITE CLOUDS.
THE WAYS OF HIS HEART ARE MUCH LIKE THE SUN. SONIC RUNS AND RESTS; THE SUN RISES AND SETS.
DON’T GIVE UP ON THE SUN. DON’T MAKE THE SUN LAUGH AT YOU.

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As for chris chan that’s an Encyclopedia Dramatica thing, I like a good chuckle every now and then.

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I get that, I was just wondering
Based on other factors such as film degradation, lense quality and damage if you could still get 6k out of it?

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I suppose if it’s possible with the wizard of oz however, it should be possible for star wars.
And now for a question only a noob would ask, why wasn’t something this sophisticated done for Star Wars years ago, even if Lucas only would allow the special edition to be the cut distributed, surely FOX had enough power to retain an 8k master copy of the original version.
I mean due to lucas, there may be no money in it but why wasn’t that done for archival purposes?

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Never mind, Everyone else here is way ahead of me on the preservation of this, I think my efforts would be useless.
my bad.

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I feel like I’m listening to somebody talking on the phone and I can only hear one side of the conversation 😉

But seriously, I just wanted to say that I love your enthusiasm. I think I understand what your initial goal was and it seems like you’ve got a pretty decent grasp of the technical side but I think you should spend your summer doing something else. Another Star Wars related project that you can share with us.

It’s always nice to see somebody come along who wants to DO something rather than just talk about it! Don’t just give up altogether, there must be something else you can get working on?

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I’ve got loads of other projects I want to do, I just didn’t realize that this board facilitated other projects.
I might still go ahead and do my research and provide the 10 seconds of footage restoration I promised.
But I’m a bit dissilusioned with my ideas, after seeing that Legacy isn’t an endangered project by any means.
So to say this much maybe my example research could benefit anyone who is working on an actual print, I didn’t want to have to compromise and use the bluray.
Don’t worry I’ll provide diagrams a pdf
3, 10 second pieces of example footage, one comparison and one original and one post
And a list of software and plug ins but in a nutshell, the materials I’d be working with would be vastly outclassed by anyone else.
So I’ll provide results as a proof of concept for anyone who wants to use them on their awesome projects.

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The only other addition I can make at this point is I didn’t realize there was a technique to break a negative down into it’s original component stocks and recreate a negative from those component stocks, so apparently all is in the clear.
Individual RGB masters 35 mm
Original negative components
And a new negative
Legacy and other technicolor IB
prints
Reliance media
And archivists, collectors and
Print masters
And others I didn’t list so I’m only going to be offering a potential toolbox for anyone interested in delving deeper.
It seems most everyone has access tp better materials than me so I can ofder a toolbox.

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I have been down the super-resolution path, with separating elements, and the results are uninspiring from the sources available.

We have scans at higher than 4K of the original prints, they contain much more genuine resolution than any of the home versions, so if you were going to work with anything, it would make a lot of sense to work with those.

Resolution isn’t really the issue, it is dealing with noise, damage, grain, recovering colour, etc. We actually have more resolution than is easily handled.

Feel free to pursue your theories, you may work out a really great workflow or a solution to an existing problem, but also be ready for robust discussion and feedback. I do film restoration for a living, have a horrible amount of study and materials on everything from esoteric colour theory, to film emulsion composition, to brain bending (for me) algorithms and math based theories on everything from noise analysis, to colour matrix transforms, and (for example) over 2000 pages of research on the way silver halide particles interact with dye bases, their clumping behaviours, diffraction processes and limitations and more stuff that I really never wanted to know about. I know about 1/4 of what I wish I knew about this stuff!

This is to say, it is a deep field, way too deep for any one person to know everything, but there is a reasonable chance others have already trod the paths you may choose to explore, so be aware that people may ask pointed questions or suggest that things have already been tried or may be a dead end. You may re-explore those paths and find a branch others missed, so go for it!

The main thing on these forums is results - there are a lot of good, bad and ugly theories out there - so your idea of trying a few seconds first and seeing how it goes is a good plan. Post your results and I’m sure you will get a lot of interest.

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