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Info: Droids and Ewoks, anybody ? — Page 11

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Thanks, Ted.

That did the trick.

The episode looks gorgeous, aside from some ghastly edge fringing that probably is part of the source. I'm very much looking forward to seeing all the episodes in this quality.

The sound was bright and clear, but with a slightly harsh quality, and a somewhat hollow, reverb-like character to it. Did you do much work on the sound, or is this just part of the original recordings? We've probably never heard them in this quality before, and it brings out the deficiencies in the original tracks.

Anyway, excuse my niggles. This is the best we've ever seen or heard Droids, and probably ever will. The community owes you and Pittrek big-time for doing all this work.

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Yet another screenshot comparison from me. This time with Ted's NTSC MKV and my RAW PAL captures. NTSC on top, PAL on bottom.

As you can see, the NTSC MKV has brighter colours, and none of that ghosting that pervades the PAL masters.

Oh, the ghosting! The horror! The horror! PAL EPIC FAIL!

 

In these, you can see the ugly edges along R2s legs and in front of 3PO's mouth. They are there in both sources, they just show up better in Ted's brighter MKVs.

 

Ted, the edge fringing is excessive on this capture. The NTSC has three outlines along 3PO's hand, while the PAL has one (and some ghosting again). Did you add some horizontal sharpening, or was this in your source? Perhaps you can show us a before-and after of how you cleaned up the NTSC recordings?

 

Here the reds bloom a little, typical of NTSC. The PAL fares better in this respect. I would tone down the colours just a little bit on the NTSCs.

 

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Thanks for the feedback Video Collector.  Unfortunately a number of these issues have already been nagging at me for quite some time :/

Concerning the edge fringing (I feel like there is another term for it that escapes me at the moment) those are in the actual capture/source itself.  Keep in mind I am using a JVC 9600U SVHS player with TBC so the VCR itself shouldn't be adding much to the problem.  Here is a screenshot of the raw capture.  You'll notice the lines are still there.

 

Concerning the blooming reds in the NTSC capture.  It appears that this is just the way the NTSC copies are meant to look.  For example, here are some screenshots from my capture and the DVD.  

RAW CAPTURE

Filtered

DVD

So here for example, the red isn't my only concern.  I am also trying to get the scepter to not be so dark and damp. And I still didn't go as high as the DVDs. It really is a game of compromise.  In the end I pretty much went with less is more and only made slight tweaking.

Also, notice that there are blooming reds in almost every shot.  And I really don't want to tone it down as it then negates too much color from other shots.  I am sure you have noticed while going through these droids tapes that once scene can have completely overblown whites and washed out colors only to have the next scene be so dark you can't make out any details and the colors are turned up to eleven.  I am pretty sure that is just the way the cartoon was produced.  It really makes it a pain to try and tweak this colors and have it work for the entire episode.

In regards to the sound, I made my recordings in VirtualDub straight from the VHS tape to PCM.  Then I edited the sound in Sony Vegas to get it to sync properly, as well as make up for the UK PAL tapes deficiencies around commercial breaks and the end of the episodes (they usually cut out about 2-3 seconds early.  I then saved the Vegas project as AC3 and that is the track in the MKV.  I performed no cleaning or denoising.  For the VCR used on the PAL tapes I have a Philips 6-Head SVHS which produces pretty good sound.

One thing I will say about my captures that makes me really happy is the TBC used on the JVC SVHS deck.  It really straightens up the lines on the tapes and eliminates a lot of the traditional VHS wavy lines.  Here is a screenshot from the intro showing almost perfectly straight lines.

I love it!

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retartedted said:

Concerning the edge fringing (I feel like there is another term for it that escapes me at the moment)

"Ringing" ?

Anyway, your gear seems to be pretty high-end. The VHS captures are indeed wonderful.

Thanks for all your effort to bring Droids to us in the best possible quality.

Visit my *NEW* Star Wars on Video Collection site:

http://www.swonvideo.com

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 (Edited)

retartedted said:

Concerning the edge fringing (I feel like there is another term for it that escapes me at the moment) those are in the actual capture/source itself.  Keep in mind I am using a JVC 9600U SVHS player with TBC so the VCR itself shouldn't be adding much to the problem.  

Edge halos?

Do you have any adjustments on the player? Some decks have a sharpness dial, my JVC SVHS deck has an "Edit Select" option that can be set to "Enhanced" (sharper edges, more ringing), "Normal" (minimal edge enhancement for normal viewing) or "Dub" (no edge enhancement, picture looks softer but best for dubbing or editing to minimize picture quality deterioration).

At least that's what I assume the options do, I haven't carried out a detailed comparison yet. 

Edit: I've just pulled up the manual for your JVC model, and spotted this note:

Digital R3 picture system applies edge correction to the luminance signal to enhance detail.
...
If you use this VCR as the player for editing, be sure to set "DIGITAL R3" to "OFF" before starting.

I think this is the same sort of thing.

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Thanks for looking into that. It is edge halos (a quick google search confirms it).  

I remember doing tests back when I got the deck and deciding to go with the R3.  But it couldn't hurt to do more.

Here is a screencap without the R3

http://i.imgur.com/RCyAI.png

Here is a screencap with the R3

http://i.imgur.com/jYMCj.png

You can see that Digital R3 is not the cause of the halos, but it does enhance it.  But it also works wonders for the rest of the image too. I think any sharpening done in Avisynth/Virtualdub would likely lead to the same results.

There is a Virtualdub filter out there called Exorcist that is supposed to help with edge halos but it can give mixed results.  Not to mention destroy a little bit of detail in the process.  

But to be honest I think that it would start to veer away from my originally stated goal of just making a simple preservation while implementing the most bare minimum enhancements.

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 (Edited)

Video Collector said:

There isn't really a better source for the Ewoks series than the PAL tapes, is there?

There is! At least for episode 2 to 13 from series one. Here is a screenshot of my version of episode 1x11 The Three Lessons. It comes directly from a TV station that broadcasted it (PAL) so it is no VHS transfer with its disadvantages:

The Three Lessons

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sennaheu said:

Video Collector said:

There isn't really a better source for the Ewoks series than the PAL tapes, is there?

There is! At least for episode 2 to 13 from series one. Here is a screenshot of my version of episode 1x11 The Three Lessons. It comes directly from a TV station that broadcasted it (PAL) so it is no VHS transfer with its disadvantages:

The Three Lessons

 

Interesting...

There is no frame blending on that tape?  Have you run it through frame by frame?

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Wow ! Meesa wan it :-)

It looks REALLY great! I am planning to do a better version of Ewoks, and your source would be a great help!

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pittrek said:

Wow ! Meesa wan it :-)

It looks REALLY great! I am planning to do a better version of Ewoks, and your source would be a great help!

BTW, I do have a copy of Ewoks tape 4 from Mexico.  It has these season 2 episodes in NTSC with un-blended frames...

1 "The Crystal Cloak"
2 "The Wish Plant"
6 "The Totem Master"
7 "A Gift for Shodu"
16 "Horville's Hut of Horrors"
17 "The Tragic Flute"
18 "Just My Luck"
19 "Bringing Up Norky"

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any updates?will there be a volume 2?

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have anybody the german ewoks audio track from season 2  aired in the german ZDF late in 1988?copy from old vhs?