Collaborative Fanediting: An ROTJ Proposition (BACK ON TRACK WITH EMANSWFAN AT THE HELM--SEE POST 1488 OR OP FOR A LINK!) — Page 17

Ronster said:

MrInsaneA said:

I think that all the users need to debate the issue....figure out what's right....and do it.

Somebody should make them do it. Someone wise. *gives creepy Anakin stare*

Did you vote?

2nd round of votes are coming later... Darth_Ender will tell you that straight... You should keep up with what we are doing and put a valid opinion in....

Or is he just winding us up.... Were debating stuff you can too?

....what?

It's a Ringlefinch....

sorry thought you were trolling, can see that you voted and  you want everyone to vote, now I see what you mean... Only half the votes are in...

Well I do not see a problem granting a few days extension but then that is a bit weak, if they did not vote then really it's their problem but I hope they vote too!

I also thought it was too early to vote but then whatever just go with the flow

Sorry to ruin everyone's fun, but Ronster MrInsaneA was quoting AOTC jokingly. And it sounded an awful lot like a dictatorship.

Side note: Crazy suggestion here. I know the DSII is suppose to be bigger than the DSI, but we never really see that so... what if instead of a shuttle docking inthe DSII we have a Star Destroyer dock inside the DSII.

^That could be interesting.  I don't know if it'd be worthwhile to the story, but I think it would be interesting to see.  I certainly hope to see more ships constructing the Death Star which should include big vessels.

Was I sounding like a dictator?  I thought I was just being overly sensitive.

darth_ender said:

^That could be interesting.  I don't know if it'd be worthwhile to the story, but I think it would be interesting to see.  I certainly hope to see more ships constructing the Death Star which should include big vessels.

 

Was I sounding like a dictator?  I thought I was just being overly sensitive.

No, I was just joking around.

POWER!  UNLIMITED POWEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

Okay, all the votes are now in, including the special effects team's!  Thanks everyone!  The votes came from the most active participants, so that's what really matters at the present.  We will have another round of voting at some later point, but hopefully we have a good direction to move in.  As I said, Angel's and Aalenfae's are especially weighty because they have to be willing to do what we request, but hopefully anything the majority disagrees with them on might still encourage them to help us meet certain goals.  Also, as Ronster has suggested, we can also seek help from others to complete things.  For instance, filming a new scene would be quite difficult, but if someone can get some friends to help, it may be possible.

I'm tallying up the votes, but I'm also at work, so it might take a bit.  I'll try to get it up in the next hour, or else it may have to wait till tonight.

Well, I think I'm probably going to have to remain the coordinator for the time being.  I won't be nearly as available starting this weekend, so I hope everyone else's energy holds up.  I'll try to help keep things moving.  Votes should be up real soon.

Counting the "maybes" is actually a bit of a challenge.  If I count it 1/2 a yes vote and 1/2 a no vote, it's meaningless and has no effect on the outcome.  If I simply count it as 1/2 a yes vote, it might skew things in a direction that doesn't really represent what we want.  So here's what I'm thinking.  I will only count the yes and no votes in the final tally.  The maybe votes will then count as 1/2, and if they change an overall no vote to a yes, that topic will be automatically be reconsidered in the next round of votes, and we should continue to actively debate it.  I hope that is fair to everyone.

Also note that I had to interpret many of your submissions.  For instance, if someone said, "I think I like that, but I'm not sure," I counted it as a maybe.  If someone said, "That's a nice idea," I counted it as a yes.  If you feel I misplaced your vote, either because I misinterpreted your statements or because I just made a human error, simply let me know and we can correct it.

So without further ado, the raw results.  I will count them up momentarily.

Length:

1.      At least 120 minutes to avoid too short a film – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; N - ; M -

Music:

1.      Across the Stars – Y – MrInsaneA, Ronster, emanswfan, darth_ender; N – DominicCobb, timdiggerm, Vladius, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, Angel; M - aalenfae

2.      Death Star Theme (Vader’s approach to DSII) – Y – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; N - ; M - timdiggerm, fishmanlee

3.      Swing Swing Swing in place of Lapti Nek/Jedi Rocks – Y – MrInsaneA, Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee; N – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, TheoOdo, Angel; M - darth_ender

4.      Duel of the Fates (space battle) – Y – MrInsaneA, Ronster, emanswfan; N – timdiggerm, Vladius, aalenfae, Angel; M - fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender

5.      Stick with ’97 celebration music as opposed to Yub Nub [suggestions for alternate songs brought up] – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae; N – DominicCobb [suggested new composition] , Angel [suggested new song]; M -

6.      Lapti Nek instead of Jedi Rocks (but with SE footage) – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo, darth_ender; N – MrInsaneA, fishmanlee, aalenfae (cut whole scene); M - Angel

Coruscant:

1.      Opening scene stealing DSII info on surface – Y – timdiggerm, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, aalenfae; M - fishmanlee, darth_ender, Angel

2.      Endor is a moon of Coruscant – Y – Vladius, TheoOdo; N - MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, aalenfae, Angel, emanswfan; M - fishmanlee, darth_ender

3.      Blow up or threaten to blow up Coruscant – Y – timdiggerm, Vladius, fishmanlee; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; M -

4.      Move final Luke/Vader confrontation to Coruscant surface – Y – Vladius, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, fishmanlee, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; M -

Opening/Early scenes:

1.      Opening scene stealing DSII and trying to flee in ship, pursued by star destroyer, escape pod landing on planet surface – Y – timdiggerm, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; M - fishmanlee

2.      Opening on Dagobah with minimal alterations to that scene, then on to Vader’s arrival at DSII, then on to Tatooine – Y – fishmanlee, darth_ender, Angel; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo, aalenfae; M -

3.      Opening with Vader arriving at DSII, then on to Dagobah, then on to Tatooine. – Y timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, aalenfae, Angel; N – Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo; M - fishmanlee, darth_ender

4.      Open with Executor near DSII, Vader mentally contacts Luke, Luke is in cave on Dagobah, back to DSII and Vader arrives, back to Dagobah – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender; N – MrInsaneA, Ronster, emanswfan, aalenfae, Angel; M -

5.      Include Boushh (later we discover it’s Leia) as bounty hunter helping steal DSII info – Y – timdiggerm, Vladius, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, fishmanlee, aalenfae, Angel; M - darth_ender

6.      DSII should be no where near Coruscant – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, Angel; N – TheoOdo; M - darth_ender

7.      Include a scene somewhere between Dagobah and Tatooine that shows the DSII info being delivered to the Alliance, either to Mon Mothma or just to a ship – Y – DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N - MrInsaneA, aalenfae, Angel; M - timdiggerm, fishmanlee, darth_ender

8.      Include a scene as padding after Luke parts ways after rescuing Han where he goes back to Dagobah and goes to the Dark Side Cave – Y – Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel;

9.      Luke flies through Beggar’s Canyon as he arrives at Tatooine – Y – MrInsaneA, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo, Angel; N – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, fishmanlee; M - darth_ender

10.  Luke’s conversation with Obi-Wan takes place in Obi-Wan’s hut – Y - TheoOdo, aalenfae, aalenfae, Angel; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, darth_ender; M – fishmanlee (only if necessary)

Tatooine/Rescuing Han:

1.      Luke uses the Force to close the Rancor gate, or at least to hurl the skull – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; N - ; M -

2.      Remove the Sarlaac beak but keep the SE tentacles – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae (plus additional ideas), Angel; N – MrInsaneA, emanswfan; M - fishmanlee

3.      Cut Max Rebo’s band (still include music, but don’t show them) – Y – DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo, darth_ender, Angel; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, Vladius, fishmanlee; M – aalenfae (depends on if they can digitally be made to look alive)

Vader:

1.      Show a stronger Vader, not such a pushover to the Emperor (unspecified how) – Y – timdiggerm, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius; M -

2.      Obi-Wan communicates with Vader – Y - TheoOdo, aalenfae; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, darth_ender, Angel; M -

3.      A quicker-to-violence with underlings, still subservient to Emperor Vader – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo, aalenfae, Angel; N – Vladius, fishmanlee; M - darth_ender

Boba Fett:

1.      Cut out Fett completely – Y – Vladius, fishmanlee, aalenfae (unless new footage filmed) , Angel; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, TheoOdo; M - darth_ender

2.      Luke kills Fett, decapitates him – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, fishmanlee; N - MrInsaneA, emanswfan, TheoOdo, aalenfae, Angel; M - darth_ender

3.      Han deliberately hits Boba Fett’s jetpack – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N – Ronster, fishmanlee, aalenfae; M - darth_ender

4.      More Boba Fett action, i.e. flamethrower, jetting out of Sarlaac’s mouth, etc. – Y – MrInsaneA, Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee, Angel; N – DominicCobb, Ronster, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae; M - timdiggerm

5.      Fett delivers DS info to Rebellion (as treachery, or as an independent contractor) – Y - Vladius, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; M - timdiggerm

6.      Boba Fett survives the destruction of Jabba’s barge – Y – timdiggerm, Vladius, emanswfan, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, aalenfae; M - fishmanlee, darth_ender, Angel

7.      Boba Fett allows Jabba’s death to take over his criminal empire – Y – Vladius, emanswfan, Angel; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae; M -

Ewoks:

1.      Make them tougher by cutting cute actions, redubbing with more aggressive sounds – Y – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; N - ; – M - timdiggerm

2.      Give them vampire-like fangs – Y – Vladius, emanswfan; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae; M - Angel

3.      Ewoks actually use more language – Y – Vladius, Ronster, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, emanswfan; M - fishmanlee, Angel

4.      Remove Wicket’s first encounter with Leia to add mystery – Y – DominicCobb, Vladius, TheoOdo, aalenfae (or shorten it), Angel; N – MrInsaneA, Ronster, emanswfan; M - timdiggerm, fishmanlee, darth_ender

5.      Show Ewoks with stormtrooper helmets in village – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; N - ; M -

Relationships:

1.      Cut indications of Han’s jealousy, as this was taken care of in ESB – Y – DominicCobb, Ronster, aalenfae; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo; M - darth_ender, Angel

2.      Cut Luke telling Leia they are siblings (but not Obi-Wan telling Luke) – Y - Ronster; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee, TheoOdo, darth_ender, aalenfae; M - Angel

Battle of Endor:

1.      Concentrate the various cuts, focusing first on action on DSII, then cover the surface battle, then cover the space battle, instead of jumping between the three – Y - Ronster, TheoOdo; N – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, emanswfan, darth_ender, Angel (wants more interesting scenes to alter between, but not to concentrate them); M - timdiggerm, fishmanlee

2.      Include many more ships, including more Mon Cal cruisers and Victory-class star destroyers – Y Mon Cal – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, emanswfan, darth_ender, Angel; Y – B-wings – timdiggerm, darth_ender; Y – Victories – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, emanswfan, darth_ender; N Victories – timdiggerm, Ronster, Angel; M – fishmanlee Y – other - aalenfae, Angel (wants more variety to Rebels, more uniformity among Empire)

3.      Include General Madine scenes, and have his Mon Cal cruiser be the first destroyed by the DSII – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Ronster (second cruiser), emanswfan, darth_ender (second cruiser) , aalenfae, Angel; N - ; M - fishmanlee

Executor:

1.      A-wing fires missile at bridge – Y – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, emanswfan; N – MrInsaneA, Vladius, Ronster, fishmanlee, aalenfae, Angel; M - darth_ender

2.      Y-wing uses bombs on Executor – Y timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel (also suggests bombing the Death Star); N - ; M - fishmanlee

Lando:

1.      Let him die in DSII explosion – Y – DominicCobb, Ronster, Angel; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, emanswfan, TV’s Frink, fishmanlee, darth_ender, aalenfae; M -

2.      Let him live as in original film – Y – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, emanswfan, TV’s Frink, darth_ender, Angel; N – DominicCobb, aalenfae; M - Ronster, fishmanlee

3.      Make it appear as if he dies at first, then show later that he survives – Y – Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee, darth_ender, aalenfae, MrInsaneA; N – timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Ronster, Angel; M -

Ending:

1.      Anakin’s Force ghost appears at pyre scene instead of with Yoda and Obi-Wan - Y – fishmanlee (show him in both shots) , darth_ender, aalenfae; N – MrInsaneA, timdiggerm, DominicCobb, Vladius, Ronster, emanswfan; M - , Angel

2.      Put pyre scene at very end, after celebrations – Y – MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, Ronster, fishmanlee, darth_ender, aalenfae; N – Vladius, emanswfan, Angel; M – timdiggerm;

3.      Remove Anakin’s ghost completely – Y – DominicCobb, Ronster; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, emanswfan, fishmanlee, aalenfae, Angel; M - darth_ender

4.      Pyre scene takes place on Tatooine instead of Endor – Y – DominicCobb, emanswfan; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, Vladius, Ronster, fishmanlee, aalenfae, Angel; M - darth_ender

5.      Remove celebrations throughout galaxy, only showing them on Endor – Y – Ronster; N – timdiggerm, MrInsaneA, DominicCobb, emanswfan, fishmanlee, darth_ender, aalenfae, Angel; M -

Y'know, I just found the original version of Duel of the Fates from TPM, and I have to say IMO it's a little more OT-ish then the final version. My idea wasn't to have Duel of the Fates over any pre-existing space battle footage, but over some new footage we may create. Perhaps when we have some of that new footage available (God knows when) I'll make a concept video to see if this different version of Duel of the Fates would fit in well.

Because I really, really, really like Duel of the Fates. :P

The results:

Length:

1.      At least 120 minutes to avoid too short a film – Y – 10; N - 0; M - 0

Music:

1.      Across the Stars – Y – 4; N – 6; M - 1

2.      Death Star Theme (Vader’s approach to DSII) – Y – 7; N - 0; M - 2

3.      Swing Swing Swing in place of Lapti Nek/Jedi Rocks – Y – 4; N – 5; M - 1

4.      Duel of the Fates (space battle) – Y – 3; N – 4; M - 3

5.      Stick with ’97 celebration music as opposed to Yub Nub [suggestions for alternate songs brought up] – Y – 9; N – 2 [neither preferred Yub Nub but suggested a new song; M - 0

6.      Lapti Nek instead of Jedi Rocks (but with SE footage) – Y – 6; N – 3; M - 1

Coruscant:

1.      Opening scene stealing DSII info on surface – Y – timdiggerm3; N – 4; M - 3

 2.      Endor is a moon of Coruscant – Y – 2; N - 7; M - 2

 3.      Blow up or threaten to blow up Coruscant – Y – 3; N – 8; M - 0

4.      Move final Luke/Vader confrontation to Coruscant surface – Y – 3; N – 8; M - 0

Opening/Early scenes:

1.      Opening scene stealing DSII and trying to flee in ship, pursued by star destroyer, escape pod landing on planet surface – Y – 4; N – 5; M - 1

2.      Opening on Dagobah with minimal alterations to that scene, then on to Vader’s arrival at DSII, then on to Tatooine – Y – 3; N – 7; M -0

3.      Opening with Vader arriving at DSII, then on to Dagobah, then on to Tatooine. – Y - 5; N – 3; M - 2

 4.      Open with Executor near DSII, Vader mentally contacts Luke, Luke is in cave on Dagobah, back to DSII and Vader arrives, back to Dagobah – Y – 6; N – 5; M - 0

5.      Include Boushh (later we discover it’s Leia) as bounty hunter helping steal DSII info – Y – 4; N – 6; M - 1

 6.      DSII should be no where near Coruscant – Y – 6; N – 1; M - 1

 7.      Include a scene somewhere between Dagobah and Tatooine that shows the DSII info being delivered to the Alliance, either to Mon Mothma or just to a ship – Y – 5; N - 3; M - 3

 8.      Include a scene as padding after Luke parts ways after rescuing Han where he goes back to Dagobah and goes to the Dark Side Cave – Y – 3; N – 8; M - 0

9.      Luke flies through Beggar’s Canyon as he arrives at Tatooine – Y – 6; N – 3; M - 1

 10.  Luke’s conversation with Obi-Wan takes place in Obi-Wan’s hut – Y - 4; N – 7; M – 1

Tatooine/Rescuing Han:

1.      Luke uses the Force to close the Rancor gate, or at least to hurl the skull – Y – 11; N - 0; M - 0

2.      Remove the Sarlaac beak but keep the SE tentacles – Y – 8; N – 2; M - 1

3.      Cut Max Rebo’s band (still include music, but don’t show them) – Y – 6; N – 4; M – 1

Vader:

1.      Show a stronger Vader, not such a pushover to the Emperor (unspecified how) – Y – 8; N – 3; M - 0

2.      Obi-Wan communicates with Vader – Y - 2; N – 9; M - 0

3.      A quicker-to-violence with underlings, still subservient to Emperor Vader – Y – 8; N – 2; M - 1

Boba Fett:

1.      Cut out Fett completely – Y – 4; N – 6; M - 1

 2.      Luke kills Fett, decapitates him – Y – 5; N - 5; M - 1

 3.      Han deliberately hits Boba Fett’s jetpack – Y – 6; N – Ronster3; M - 1

 4.      More Boba Fett action, i.e. flamethrower, jetting out of Sarlaac’s mouth, etc. – Y – 5; N – 5; M - 1

 5.      Fett delivers DS info to Rebellion (as treachery, or as an independent contractor) – Y - 2; N – 8; M - 1

 6.      Boba Fett survives the destruction of Jabba’s barge – Y – 4; N – 4; M - 3

 7.      Boba Fett allows Jabba’s death to take over his criminal empire – Y – 3; N – 8; M - 0

Ewoks:

1.      Make them tougher by cutting cute actions, redubbing with more aggressive sounds – Y – 10; N - 0; – M - 1

2.      Give them vampire-like fangs – Y – 2; N – 8; M - 1

3.      Ewoks actually use more language – Y – 5; N – 4; M - 2

 4.      Remove Wicket’s first encounter with Leia to add mystery – Y – 5; N – 3; M - 3

 5.      Show Ewoks with stormtrooper helmets in village – Y – 11; N - 0; M - 0

Relationships:

1.      Cut indications of Han’s jealousy, as this was taken care of in ESB – Y – 3; N – 6; M - 2

 2.      Cut Luke telling Leia they are siblings (but not Obi-Wan telling Luke) – Y - 1; N – 9; M - 1

Battle of Endor:

1.      Concentrate the various cuts, focusing first on action on DSII, then cover the surface battle, then cover the space battle, instead of jumping between the three – Y - 2; N – 5; M - 2

 2.      Include many more ships, including more Mon Cal cruisers and Victory-class star destroyers – Y Mon Cal – 7; Y B-wings – 2; Y Victories – 4; N Mon Cal - 0; N Victories – 3; M to all – 1; Y – other - 2

 3.      Include General Madine scenes, and have his Mon Cal cruiser be the first destroyed by the DSII – Y – 7; N - 0; M - 1

Executor:

1.      A-wing fires missile at bridge – Y – 3; N – 6; M - 1

 2.      Y-wing uses bombs on Executor – Y 9; N - 0; M - 1

Lando:

1.      Let him die in DSII explosion – Y – 3; N – 8; M - 0

2.      Let him live as in original film – Y – 7; N – 2; M - 2

 3.      Make it appear as if he dies at first, then show later that he survives – Y – 6; N – 4; M - 0

Ending:

1.      Anakin’s Force ghost appears at pyre scene instead of with Yoda and Obi-Wan - Y – 3; N – 6; M - 1

 2.      Put pyre scene at very end, after celebrations – Y – 6; N – 3; M – 1

 3.      Remove Anakin’s ghost completely – Y – 2; N – 7; M - 1

 4.      Pyre scene takes place on Tatooine instead of Endor – Y – 2; N – 7; M - 1

 5.      Remove celebrations throughout galaxy, only showing them on Endor – Y – 1; N – 8; M - 0

MrInsaneA said:

Y'know, I just found the original version of Duel of the Fates from TPM, and I have to say IMO it's a little more OT-ish then the final version. My idea wasn't to have Duel of the Fates over any pre-existing space battle footage, but over some new footage we may create. Perhaps when we have some of that new footage available (God knows when) I'll make a concept video to see if this different version of Duel of the Fates would fit in well.

Because I really, really, really like Duel of the Fates. :P

 So do I.  I think it'd be a nice motif as well, though I also see the concern of too much PT influence.  You should upload the version you found for all of us to sample.  I don't think any idea is completely thrown out, and perhaps we can bring it up again later.

EDIT: Actually, according to my scheme, it barely won (with help from the maybes), so it's automatically up for more discussion.

darth_ender said:

MrInsaneA said:

Y'know, I just found the original version of Duel of the Fates from TPM, and I have to say IMO it's a little more OT-ish then the final version. My idea wasn't to have Duel of the Fates over any pre-existing space battle footage, but over some new footage we may create. Perhaps when we have some of that new footage available (God knows when) I'll make a concept video to see if this different version of Duel of the Fates would fit in well.

Because I really, really, really like Duel of the Fates. :P

 So do I.  I think it'd be a nice motif as well, though I also see the concern of too much PT influence.  You should upload the version you found for all of us to sample.  I don't think any idea is completely thrown out, and perhaps we can bring it up again later.

EDIT: Actually, according to my scheme, it barely won (with help from the maybes), so it's automatically up for more discussion.

Well see, here's the thing: if you don't consider the PT to be part of your Star Wars universe, then Duel of the Fates is just a cool new song in Return of the Jedi. If you do, it's a nice "callback" to the prequels. So it's really a win-win.

I can understand that maybe a few people might feel it's not "OT" enough, or something, but you can't deny it's a very powerful song, and would fit the final battle of the saga/trilogy very well. 

Anyways, that's my argument for it. I'll upload a video soon to show the original Duel of the Fates.

Length:

1.      At least 120 minutes to avoid too short a film – 10 to 0, a clear winner!

Music:

1.      Across the Stars – 4 ½ to 6.  Not quite.

2.      Death Star Theme (Vader’s approach to DSII) – 8 to 0, a clear winner

3.      Swing Swing Swing in place of Lapti Nek/Jedi Rocks – 4 ½ to 5, a near tie, and probably worth more discussion

4.      Duel of the Fates (space battle) – 4 ½ to 4, a near tie, automatically up for more discussion is needed.

5.      Stick with ’97 celebration music as opposed to Yub Nub [suggestions for alternate songs brought up] – 9 to 2, though there is discussion for original or alternate pieces as well.

6.      Lapti Nek instead of Jedi Rocks (but with SE footage) – 6 ½ to 1, pretty clear.

Coruscant:

1.      Opening scene stealing DSII info on surface – 4 ½ to 4, near tie, automatically up for more discussion

 2.      Endor is a moon of Coruscant – 3 to 6, not enough to win.

 3.      Blow up or threaten to blow up Coruscant – 3 to 8, not enough.

4.      Move final Luke/Vader confrontation to Coruscant surface – 3 to 8, not enough.

Opening/Early scenes:

1.      Opening scene stealing DSII and trying to flee in ship, pursued by star destroyer, escape pod landing on planet surface – 4 ½ to 5, near tie, probably should be up for more discussion.

2.      Opening on Dagobah with minimal alterations to that scene, then on to Vader’s arrival at DSII, then on to Tatooine – 3 to 7, not enough

3.      Opening with Vader arriving at DSII, then on to Dagobah, then on to Tatooine. – 6 to 3, seems to be the preferred format.

 4.      Open with Executor near DSII, Vader mentally contacts Luke, Luke is in cave on Dagobah, back to DSII and Vader arrives, back to Dagobah – 6 to 5, also pretty popular though strongly opposed as well, should be discussed further.

5.      Include Boushh (later we discover it’s Leia) as bounty hunter helping steal DSII info – 4 ½ to 6, not quite enough, but could be discussed further.

 6.      DSII should be no where near Coruscant – 6 ½ to 1, clearly not a popular choice.

 7.      Include a scene somewhere between Dagobah and Tatooine that shows the DSII info being delivered to the Alliance, either to Mon Mothma or just to a ship – Y – 6 ½ to 3, rather popular choice.

 8.      Include a scene as padding after Luke parts ways after rescuing Han where he goes back to Dagobah and goes to the Dark Side Cave – 3 to 8, no go.

9.      Luke flies through Beggar’s Canyon as he arrives at Tatooine – 6 ½ to 3, pretty popular.

 10.  Luke’s conversation with Obi-Wan takes place in Obi-Wan’s hut – 4 ½ to 7, probably not going to be included.

Tatooine/Rescuing Han:

1.      Luke uses the Force to close the Rancor gate, or at least to hurl the skull – 11 to 0, clear winner.

2.      Remove the Sarlaac beak but keep the SE tentacles – 8 ½ to 2, clear winner.

3.      Cut Max Rebo’s band (still include music, but don’t show them) – 6 ½ to 4, pretty clear winner.

Vader:

1.      Show a stronger Vader, not such a pushover to the Emperor (unspecified how) – 8 to 3, people want a tougher guy

2.      Obi-Wan communicates with Vader – 2 to 9, no go.

3.      A quicker-to-violence with underlings, still subservient to Emperor Vader – 8 ½ to 2, sounds like the way to go.

Boba Fett:

1.      Cut out Fett completely – 4 ½ to 6, fairly close, might want some continued discussion.

 2.      Luke kills Fett, decapitates him – 5 ½ to 5, very close, automatically up for further debate.

 3.      Han deliberately hits Boba Fett’s jetpack – 6 ½ to 3, a pretty clear winner.

 4.      More Boba Fett action, i.e. flamethrower, jetting out of Sarlaac’s mouth, etc. – 5 ½ to 5, pretty close, automatically up for further debate.

 5.      Fett delivers DS info to Rebellion (as treachery, or as an independent contractor) – 2 ½ to 8, not gonna happen.

 6.      Boba Fett survives the destruction of Jabba’s barge – 5 ½ to 4, automatically up for further debate due to the maybes, but otherwise pretty close.

 7.      Boba Fett allows Jabba’s death to take over his criminal empire – 3 to 8, not the will of the people.

Ewoks:

1.      Make them tougher by cutting cute actions, redubbing with more aggressive sounds – 10 ½ to 0, very popular.

2.      Give them vampire-like fangs – 3 ½ to 8, not very popular.

3.      Ewoks actually use more language – 6 to 4 fairly close, might want to continue discussion.

 4.      Remove Wicket’s first encounter with Leia to add mystery – 6 ½ to 3, a good win.

 5.      Show Ewoks with stormtrooper helmets in village – 11 to 0, very popular choice.

Relationships:

1.      Cut indications of Han’s jealousy, as this was taken care of in ESB – 4 to 6, probably not close enough, but could be discussed further.

 2.      Cut Luke telling Leia they are siblings (but not Obi-Wan telling Luke) – 1 ½ to 9, no go.

Battle of Endor:

1.      Concentrate the various cuts, focusing first on action on DSII, then cover the surface battle, then cover the space battle, instead of jumping between the three – 3 to 5, probably going to keep current format.

 2.      Include many more ships, including more Mon Cal cruisers and Victory-class star destroyers – This one was very confusing with the various comments in people’s votes.  Basically, it’s clear people want more ships and more fighting, but what ships are included is a big bone of contention and this should probably be up for vote in the next round (whenever that is)  Again, here is the raw data: Y Mon Cal – 7; Y B-wings – 2; Y Victories – 4; N Mon Cal - 0; N Victories – 3; M to all – 1; Y – other – 2

If you said yes, I usually (not perfectly consistently) included that for everything, but then I realized that might not be a fair way to count it.  Most wanted Mon Cals.  A few objected to Victories, but not enough to actually vote it down, some suggested even more ships, pointing out the need for B-wings, some suggested more variety to the Rebels and more uniformity to the Imperials.

 3.      Include General Madine scenes, and have his Mon Cal cruiser be the first destroyed by the DSII – 7 ½ to 0, rather popular choice.

Executor:

1.      A-wing fires missile at bridge – 3 ½ to 6, probably not going to happen.

 2.      Y-wing uses bombs on Executor – 9 ½ to 0, very popular, and also a suggestion to bomb the DSII to open the point where the ships enter the superstructure.

Lando:

1.      Let him die in DSII explosion – 3 to 8, I was initially very torn on this, but decided to let him live, as it fits better and would be hard to pull off the emotion of it.  A clear winner.

2.      Let him live as in original film – 8 to 2, a clear winner.

 3.      Make it appear as if he dies at first, then show later that he survives – 6 to 4, changed to reflect MrInsaneA's changed mind once he had a clearer understanding. 

Ending:

1.      Anakin’s Force ghost appears at pyre scene instead of with Yoda and Obi-Wan – 3 ½ to 6, I really liked this idea, but it looks like it’s voted down.

 2.      Put pyre scene at very end, after celebrations – 6 ½ to 3, a pretty clear win.

 3.      Remove Anakin’s ghost completely – 2 ½ to 7, not going to happen.

 4.      Pyre scene takes place on Tatooine instead of Endor – 2 ½ to 7, not going to happen, darn it.

 5.      Remove celebrations throughout galaxy, only showing them on Endor – 1 to 8, the celebrations stay.

Please do upload it.  I sit on the fence on too many things and did the same for that song.  But I'd love to see it in action and maybe would commit to a firm yes.

I hope these votes will focus our discussion now on how to implement the firm winners, try to argue for the close votes, and focus on new ideas.  I think we should let the points that die lay to rest.  This is hard for me because I really like the idea of Anakin appearing at the pyre scene still, but we need to move on.  But remember, even if our ideas are shot down, we can still complete the effects and modify the edit we create together to better suit our personal tastes :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h04jM5NEEyw&feature=youtu.be

Okay, let me preface this by saying: there are TWO versions of Duel of the Fates in this video. The first is the fast alternate version that was originally supposed to be in The Phantom Menace.

However, it came to my attention that this may not fit as well as I thought with the rest of the OT music. So, after spending a little bit in Audacity, I created a slower version of the song that starts at around 3:38 in the video. So please PLEASE listen to both. I'm really rooting for the inclusion of this song.

It IS the alternate version. I think I unintentionally sped it up a little somehow, but trust me, it's not the final film version. 

fishmanlee said:

You should have posted the other version, The Great Duel.

I can post that one as well. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yr1DyvB2wlA&feature=youtu.be

Another version.

Great Work Darth_Ender!

Most ideas outright win which keeps things simple for direction and is nice to see how all the ideas fayred up.... Interesting way to look at it now it's all on paper.

Had a bit of a bad day yesterday as had a row with my landlord and am getting evicted from my flat soon but anyway I re-did my rough-cut to take my mind off things, and improved alot and tried some new ideas it is mostly structure, so even if anything I did in it like Lando getting blown up which got voted against you can now see how it might of looked... I actually pulled it off resonably well with what I am working with bit of a fluke but anyway here are the main changes and link.

http://www.mediafire.com/?286b58g9cda2gvb

41m 28s

1. Trimmed Luke & Leia + Father & Son Vader flashback on Endor.... The idea is to show anger and anguish, and the glass cracking behind as he stares toward the camera this him using the force and will be a cgi shot for that... To show Vader is boiling over inside, not sure if people will like this idea but I gave it a go none the less.

2. Madine dies my way

3.Restructured so that Shield generator now is destroyed before the executor crashes and this is lukes exit point. Padded the bunker with prision cell block footage ANH and vaders death

4.Change Ackbars lines to "the Shield it down! concentrate all firepower.... we need to give those fighters more time"

5. Cut lots of silly Ewok

6. Millennium falcon is destryed you need to imagine it's in flames while it flys towrds the fleet and the DSII blows up but after that it is quite a blissful yet sad momment. Princess Leia Theme added.

7. quite a few other subtle changes, bit more streamlined,. but inclusion of Darth Enders Shield generator hot-wire into base and possible fix to the smoke and lasers everywhere comment.

I hope you give it a try or even a flick through, I'm quite happy with it, I would like to add more to it like space battle ideas but not right now, the main thing was getting it correct to flow properly as Darth_Ender did point out a pretty big failing that I had things a bit the wrong way round.

Hope you Enjoy it :)