Info & Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist — Page 317

     IIRC, The original concept for the ESB was that ships would moor close to the surface like dirigibles and discharge passengers and cargo over ramps.

     I like the Vader stays on the SSD and communicates with Jer by holo idea. It saves the reveal for later.

     Luke could escape on the Emp's throne. Deck covers could lift and two halves of a heavily armored escape pod could close over Luke. Vader would know how to activate it from observation of construction. Only room for one?

crickey, that would be insane!

so vader doesn't die in luke's arms, but enstead operates a console which whisks him off in an escape module. vader perhaps would be unmasked, standing watching him leave as all around him descends into flames?

talk about redemption!

Bingowings said:

This is why he shouldn't have had a Jedi weapon in ROTS, his ego tells him it can defend itself without the need of a machine.

 

Putting a weapon in Yoda and Sidious hand is another stupidity from Lucas.

A man who can easily open sealed handcuffs in 1 second can also destroy easily any weapons...or bones...

I would have loved to see him break a neck or a spine.

It's crazy and useless to strike a master of the force with a weapon...Lucas has forgotten that....and he has forgotten the meaning of the word : master. In the PT, every one is a master, it means nothing.

Anakin crying because he is not ranked master at twenty years old...wtf

It is obvious in the OT that masters don't have lightsabers...because masters don't NEED lightsabers.

You become a master when your knowledge and control of the force allows you to protect yourself without any weapon.

if size doesn't matter, then, weapon doesn't matter.

Hello, in quite new here, but I'm reading the forum from a while, so I think I'm not saying something already said.

I've recently done a rough ROTJ fan edit, just not to be annoyed from the worst parts of it, and I'm quite happy about some solutions:

Jabba's palace:

Jedi Rocks is horrible, right. But was Lapti Nek so much better? Or we just usuallt preferred it because it was in the GOUT? I've tried to entirely cut it and IMHO it's working much better. After the short musical piece that is currently before Jedi Rock I've directly cut to Boushh arrival. No Jedi Rock/Lapti nek nor Oola death (do we really need all of that stuff?)

And again, I've adopted the same brilliant solution of the Spence Edit, cutting entirely the Rancor vs Luke sequence. I mean… he is a Jedi! Does he really need to use a bone (!!!) to avoid been eaten? Does he really need to throw a stone to push the button? Can't he use the Force?

Ewoks:

I hate them. :D But I've managed to get them acceptable. Ok the Leia-Wicket encounter. But I've deeply edited the scene when the other meet the ewoks: Chewie run but no dead animals hanging from the tree (is he suddenly out of his mind? :O ) Instead i cut to the ewoks emerging from the grass, pointing the weapons towards han and luke (when they're already standing, with the arms raised)

Then cut to the ewok going back to the village, the trumpets, the reunion with Leia, kiss and hugs (no Luke and Han tied for transport, no 3PO god of the ewoks. It works and it's not silly like in the George's version!!)

Then cut to 3PO telling their stories (the only ewok related scene I actually like), Luke-Leia dialogue, etc.

Obviosly I've then totally cut the silly ewok biker. And for the battle I've just showed them emerging from grass, throwing arrows to the imperials and then it's only rebel commando vs Empire. Except for some ewoks running and the one who die.

And finally, when Han set the trap to let the Imps exit the bunker, I've used the deleted footages from "rebel raid on the bunker" instead of showing the ewoks surround the imps. It's rough, but I've done it in less then 2 hours and it works! Some skilled editor could be able to reduce the ewoks that way cogently.

And finally, this is something i've not done because I've not the skills to do so, but speaking about Coruscant I think it's not impossible: get rid of the DS2, make Endor a moon of Coruscant. Ok, already said that. But… what if the bunker is generating a deflector shield that protect Coruscant itself? In this way the Endor scene could remain the same, with forest, ewoks, etc. Luke could go to surrender to vader on the moon. So, just a scene showing the shuttle go from Endor to Coruscant and have the Luke-Vader-Palpie scenes like already are but with the Coruscant skyline outside the windows.

And for "why the rebels should attack coruscant?" what if on the planet there was something in costruction? some deadly weapon? they just want to destroy it before it's complete and working. But it's obviuosly a trap setted by Palpie. Maybe using the Boba subplot, something more about the nature of the facilities and / or the weapons could be explained.

And finally, moving the action to coruscanto could be the starting point for the riots in the capital planet.

fishmanlee said:

Wall of text much?



EDIT: oops, been ninja'd

Yeah, sorry! copy/paste messed up my post at first!

Don't listen to Fishface, post as much as you want, people can make their own minds up what they want to read or not.

Another idea just come to my mind: if the emperor is on coruscant, and at the beginning of the movie we see vader arrive on the capital, welcomed by jerjerrod. Jerj could be the moff controlling the coruscant sector or something like that (the regional governor?)

well, we could have riots on coruscant from the beginning of the movie, this could be the starting point of the film. The rebel going there to help the insurgents and finally end the war. Stormtroopers are dealing with the people revolting and then jerjerrod receive the command to fire on both the civilian and *his* troopers, causing him the conflict we see on the deleted footage.

Monroville said:

Here's something that came to me the other day: considering in ANH Tarkin doesn't go after an actual threat (pirates, thugs, an actual military threat) but a peaceful world with no weapons JUST for the sake of demoralizing Princess Leia (well... it was her homeworld), would it be conceivable that it was Alderaan's destruction that really got the Rebellion going and (with Adobe and other FX programs) write "Remember Alderaan" on the side of some of the larger ships in the JEDI battle?

That would be a GREAT idea..........except for one problem.  Aurebesh.

ben_danger said:

crickey, that would be insane!

so vader doesn't die in luke's arms, but enstead operates a console which whisks him off in an escape module. vader perhaps would be unmasked, standing watching him leave as all around him descends into flames?

talk about redemption!

Lovely idea even if it would probably mean poor Sebastian Shaw gets shafted again.

It would make his goodbye more like Han's in ESB or ET's I guess only he is going to his death/joining with the Force.

It would be kind of sweet if Padme was his spirit guide so to speak (or am I just being too sentimental).

Monroville said:

Sepharih said:

Monroville said:

Here's something that came to me the other day: considering in ANH Tarkin doesn't go after an actual threat (pirates, thugs, an actual military threat) but a peaceful world with no weapons JUST for the sake of demoralizing Princess Leia (well... it was her homeworld), would it be conceivable that it was Alderaan's destruction that really got the Rebellion going and (with Adobe and other FX programs) write "Remember Alderaan" on the side of some of the larger ships in the JEDI battle?

 

That would be a GREAT idea..........except for one problem.  Aurebesh.

True, but is Aurebesh the universal language in STAR WARS?  And wasn't there english text in ANH (the tractor beam console, etc)?  Anyways, just an idea.. maybe if the "Remember Alderaan" were done in an Aurebesh font (as opposed to Arial or Times New Roman)?

Well....it's universal in the same way Basic is universal.  It's the most widely used language in the GFFA.

There were roman letters in the original release of ANH and ESB...but the DVD and subsequent releases have removed them and replaced them with Aurebesh.  It's one of the best and most appropriate changes that was made to the movies IMHO....makes the world more fleshed out and fully realized.

Again, I like the idea of "Remember Alderaan" and it fits really well with the WWII inspired dogfights....but it would break continuity to have english text, and while putting it in Aurebesh would be a nice little touch for newer assets...it's a lot of work to put on existing ships when most people won't even be able to see what it means.

Monroville said:

Here's something that came to me the other day: considering in ANH Tarkin doesn't go after an actual threat (pirates, thugs, an actual military threat) but a peaceful world with no weapons JUST for the sake of demoralizing Princess Leia (well... it was her homeworld), would it be conceivable that it was Alderaan's destruction that really got the Rebellion going and (with Adobe and other FX programs) write "Remember Alderaan" on the side of some of the larger ships in the JEDI battle?

I like the image, but it immediatly brings to my mind the original opening of "Red Dwarf" and I giggle. 

In regards to your thread point Boost a reference to Alderaan could be dubbed over the turret gun deleted scenes or indeed be spoken in purpose filmed pilot inserts too.

Sepharih said:

There were roman letters in the original release of ANH and ESB...

Bingowings said:

ben_danger said:

crickey, that would be insane!

so vader doesn't die in luke's arms, but enstead operates a console which whisks him off in an escape module. vader perhaps would be unmasked, standing watching him leave as all around him descends into flames?

talk about redemption!

Lovely idea even if it would probably mean poor Sebastian Shaw gets shafted again.

It would make his goodbye more like Han's in ESB or ET's I guess only he is going to his death/joining with the Force.

It would be kind of sweet if Padme was his spirit guide so to speak (or am I just being too sentimental).

The image that came to my mind when I read this idea was the one of the custody of the grail saluting Indy with his chainmail-glove

Nice idea to have padmé be some sort of guide to join the force.

In the same vein I always thought of Ben Kenobi speaking to Vader in order to bit his head off and prepare the ground to Luke.

It could be added either in the meditation chamber scene of ESB, or in the deleted one of ROTJ, the thing is to add some sense to Vader's line "ObiWan once thought as you do".

I imagine Jor-El and Lara observing their infant son leaving a doomed Krypton in Superman The Movie would be another touchstone for the concept.

Darth Editous said:

 

Sepharih said:

There were roman letters in the original release of ANH and ESB...

In ESB? Where?

ANH still has modern, umm, Terran (Arabic) characters in the stylised form of "94" on the docking bay wall.

DE

 

In the x-wing, when R2 and luke are talking, wasn't the readout originally in english?

I know that the numerical characters are the same.....but they've still all but purged the lettering from the movies, and if we're going to split hairs i'd sooner remove the more terrestrial numbers then I would restore letters.

Sorry for the wall of text, but this is a radical idea inspired by the awesome ideas of bringing the characters to coruscant in ROTJ and I thought a lot about it early this morning.  Maybe i'm crazy, but I wanted to see what you guys thought.

How about inserting a scene/sequence in ROTJ or earlier in the series at some point which explains that the fate of the clone/storm troopers is tied directly to the Emperor's life? IE, it's bred into them just like order 66?

That may seem crazy/illogical and awfully convenient for our characters.....but really think about it. Does it not fit perfectly with Palpatine's character?  Remember, he is meant to be the ultimate embodiment of avarice, and he is distrustful of EVERYONE. Tying his own fate to the clones insures that there is no plot against him in the power structure, because to do so would remove the first and last line of defense in the imperial navy.

Moreoever, it fits with everything that is established about Palpatine and the sith (Rule of two), consolidating all power to himself, without any consideration given to what would happen should he fall.

Despite what the expanded universe might have you believe, he would have absolutely zero interest in a grand admiral Thrawn or any leader of the empire beyond himself or, at the very most, one of his sith heirs. Such an idea would likely repulse him every bit as much as a new republic because it would be someone he viewed as a “lesser” taking command of all that he had built.

Like or hate Episode III, the quote was extremely appropriate: “I AM the senate.” In Palpatine's ultimate view of the world, he IS the Empire. Without him, or a proper heir, there is nothing he cares to give consideration for. The entire empire can crumble into the dust for all he cares.  This isn't even that out of line with the themes of the expanded universe which speculates that the loss of Palpatine's “battle mediation” force ability caused the imperical forces on endor to fall apart without his influence.

Adding this subplot would:

1) make it more believable that the empire could fall almost overnight as it seems too. In this version of the movie the capital would have been taken over and the backbone of their military has been obliterated, with nothing but the officers holding the bag. Not so crazy anymore.

2) make Anakin and what he does that much more important, because it cements the idea that without his final choice none of this would have been possible. The emperor would have simply killed luke and the rebels would have been crushed. Plus it also parallels his victory in episode 1.

So as for exactly what happens to the troopers once the emperor dies, I'm not 100% on how it should be handled, but my ideas include:

A) They die, instantly, falling over dead the moment the emperor is...... “shafted”.

B) They shut down, go brain dead, little more than droids with their memories wiped.

C) They lose the will to fight. A scene could be included with a stormtrooper laying down arms and an officer screaming “WHAT ARE YOU DOING!??! Fight to the death for the empire!!!!” and the stormtrooper could perhaps grab him by the collar, look him in the eye and go “What Empire? Who commands it exactly?”

D) Probably WAAAAAY too dark......but they commit quasi-seppaku. IE, they realize they've failed in their mission to protect their emperor, and so they take their own lives in penance.

Doesnt make much sense... First of all, he also said "Once more the Sith will ruuuuule the galaxy"
Secondly, doesnt make much sense to imbred the clones with such order "if i die, all the clones should die with me". Its like saying "If I die, i dont want the bad guys to keep ruling anymore, just leave the galaxy to the good guys" Im guessing even if he dies he prefers the galaxy to be ruled by a Sith than by a good guy.

It would make much more sense a rule like "If I die, i want all the clones to start killing EVERYTHING in their sight"

If you want to feel like the death of the Emperor is much more important, just tweak all the "celebration" scenes to "riot" scenes. Killing the emperor and the death star is just a symbol for all the people to rise against the Empire. You dont even need to show if those riots end up well, you just imagine they will even if there is much more fighting to do.