Info & Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist — Page 96

return of the padawan...

it would be interesting, in a sith vs jedi sense, that luke decides to not pass on his knowledge, and to bury his sabre at the end of ROTJ. the reasoning behind this, is that perhaps withouth the jedi, there is no force use, and no dark side, so no sith, so the same events need happen again. the force could be brought to balance by its annulment.

in a gary kurtz interview, he mentioned how the original plan for episode I was to have the creation of the jedi order. perhaps if in a very radical edit this were to happen, the act of buring the sabre would have more poignancy.

Maybe you'd find more grey Force cults emerging (Sidi and Jeth) who get married take care of their parents, don't indoctrinate children, don't seek high office and stay out of politics, acknowledge their passions but don't let them dominate their lives and conscientiously refrain from fighting in wars (basically Force chaplains and mystic medics).

My final word on Jedi and revenge, if the Jedi are beyond such things explain Obi-wan's wrath fueled attack on Darth Maul or Anakin's clearly vengeful charge at Count Dooku?

As I said before a good arguement could be made for the Jedi being above revenge before ROTJ and the PT, afterwards it becomes a position less easy to defend.

Bingowings said:

My final word on Jedi and revenge, if the Jedi are beyond such things explain Obi-wan's wrath fueled attack on Darth Maul or Anakin's clearly vengeful charge at Count Dooku?

1. As the evidence shows, Anakin was not good at avoiding the Dark Side in general.

2. I'm not sure Obi seemed 'wrath fueled.' He was upset, he was a bit hyper, probably unfocused, but in the end he defeated Maul by being calm and out manueverng him, not beating him down with superior rage.

EyeShotFirst said:

DarthBo said:

EyeShotFirst said:

It is a return of jedi as a whole. Luke is the first jedi since obi wan died. SO the jedi are back.

By that logic ESB should have been called Return of the Jedi.

Luke was not a jedi yet. Sooo it wouldnt really be a return of the jedi in that sense.

 in ROTJ, yoda tells luke, "Not yet, one thing remains. Vader, you must confront vader!" refering to that, that's lukes final test before he can become a full fledged jedi knight.

ROTJ just stands for the fact that the sith are destroyed, "supposedly", and the jedi power is returned to the galaxy.

Yeah ... sorry, but that was pretty terrible.  And that lightsaber duel is, in my opinion, the absolute best out of the entire saga, with the ESB duel running a very, very close second.  TPM's end duel is third, and ANH's is fourth.  Anything from AOTC or ROTS isn't even on the chart, and if any of them were, they'd be waaay at the bottom.  (Yes, I'm most definitely including the Anakin/Obi-Wan duel ... ugh.)

Palpatine : One day all this will be yours, my young apprentice

Luke : What the curtains?

Vader: He just killed my Aunty.

Luke : I just want to sing...to sing...to sing....

We're Knights of the Jedi Temple,
We smell a bit like menthol,
We jump in the air and braid our hair
And sometimes don a wimple
We dress well here on Coruscant,
We wear brown gowns, cowls and yoga pants.
 
We're Knights of the Jedi Temple,
Our backflips are for-mid-able,
We play ball games and are given names
Quite unpronounc-e-able.
We're swingball mad on Coruscant,
We never cheat we’re impeccant

In speach cryptic and artful,
Quite incomprehensi-a-ble,
Between our quests in Gundark nests,
We dance like Shirley Temple.
It's a chaste life here on Coruscant,

I have to find a swamp to haunt.
 

doubleofive said:

fishmanlee said:

in ROTJ can the FB be upped in epicness like this?

I don't know how to tell you this, but repeating and flipping shots from random points in the battle and cutting it down to less than 2 minutes does not make it epic.  It makes it whatever the opposite of epic is.

Agreed -  that cut was just plain terrible. Sorry if that's harsh, but that's how I see it.

And I really DON'T want to hear PT music in the OT - it's one of the few things I didn't about Adywan's "SW: Revisted" (ie, the music of the Obiwan/Vader duel of the non-Purist edit)

fishmanlee said:

in ROTJ can the FB be upped in epicness like this?

 man, i'm dizzy :s

btw, we're keeping the original score for that fight. this isn't obi-wan vs. vader. that was exceptional, and a damn good improvement. the music that's used in vader vs. luke now, really brought out the emotion in people. IMOP.

adywan said:

fishmanlee said:

i agree the only reason it had music was for entertainment purposes
about the BOTH in ANH:R: i thought if it had music it should be TCOL (see here)

 

but why use that music? that is used for Luke vs vader so is totally unfitting to be used for the duel between vader & Obi-Wan. I used BOTH because it signifies the final duel between the two former friends. it wasn't added just to have music in the duel. using a piece of music that was written for the duel between Luke & vader would be like using yodas theme when jabba appears in ANH:SE. Its one of the things i hated about the hack up job that was given to the score in ROTS. No though went into it at all. why use that piece of music when Yoda confronts the Emperor. Themes are there for a reason and thats how JW originally wrote them. when i first saw ROTS and that music cue appeared i instantly thought of Luke vs vader at bespin. JW writes the music to enhance what you are seeing on the screen. certain cues are there to fit the action. when you add a piece of music that was written for a different scene over another one, without re-cuing/ remixing the score it almost never fits. Anyone that knows anything about musical scoring for films knows this. This is why the soundtrack for AOTC & ROTS was such an abomination. the editing destroyed what JW had originally written. If you notice in ANH:R the BOTH was re-edited so that it folllowed what you were seeing on the screen. A quieter section came in when it needed to and vice versa.

 

the addition of the ROTS score in ANH was great, and i especially liked the mix of emperor themes in the conference room. the only thing that didnt work for me so much about the obiwan vs vader music, was that it just sounded so different to the rest of the music in the film. it would be great if we could get hold of a re-recording of that track, by perhaps a smaller orchestra, without the vocals with older recording equipment. maybe an editted version could work? despite this though, the piece of music fits the other action in the scene remarkably well.