Info & Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist — Page 89

The problem isn't that there were dream sequences but the manner of them.

Luke's vision in the cave is a form of dream sequences but it has the symbolic twisted logic of a dream (more of a visionquest).

The dreams in ROTS lacked that essential dreamlike visionquest quality.

If someone could revisit the idea of Anakin's dream by going back to key sequences and giving them a Dagobah cave style make over I wouldn't mind.

The same goes with Vader having some sort of vision in ROTJ.

Just having a clip show happen in the middle of the action is out of place and stating the obvious without any elegance or leaving any room for ambiguity.

fishmanlee said:

oh and about the blue saber thing i meant as a bonus feature like a deleted scene or something

I'm sure there are plenty of people on here who could do that for you, making the blade slim down however is a lot of effort whatever the colour is.

fishmanlee said:

the thing is it wasnt a dream it was more like in empire when lukes on the falcon and vaders on the executor
and he says "Son, Come with me"

I got that fishmanlee, I was refering to the notion of having flashbacks while Vader is pondering what to do while Palpatine is killing Luke.

Ressurrecting that idea would be more difficult because you'd have to pull the material from elsewhere.

It could be made as an interesting bridge between Luke leaving Dagobah and Vader arriving at the Death Star if someone put the scenes that way around.

fishmanlee said:

would be kinda hard because its basicly part of the bens hut scene or the lightsaber construction cave if you will

I don't know if you have been following any of the various takes on the fan-o-matic style restructurings but the basic idea is that Luke went back to Dagobah and completed his training with Yoda and his first scene is Yoda's death (some versions have him at the beginning but most still start with Vader) later we see Luke land on Tatooine and his conversation with Ben takes place either in his hut or outside (seeing as it would almost impossible to film the sabre construction scene it's implied to take place before or after this scene).

The droids set out the next morning.

There aren't many places where you could put Vader contacting Luke into the Death Star scenes so the ideal place would be before he arrives at the station (which explains my suggestion).

If the film was cut along the lines of the theatrical cut it could be put as Tydirium approaches the Executor.

fishmanlee said:

if followed the way it is in the "script" it would be RIGHT after death star in dissaray (sp?) (or the "The Emporer is not as forgiving as i am" scene

It couldn't fit there now because of the available footage which is why I suggested the places I did, the earliest would put it quite close.

It wouldn't be possible to totally reconstruct the early script forms but it may be possible to adapt key ideas like, Luke returning to Ben's Hut, the two Death Stars etc to fit into the existing footage and there have been a lot of suggestions along those lines if you track back (it's a fun thread to read and it links into older threads which are also brimming with ideas, well worth a read).

fishmanlee said:

it wouldnt?

there is alot of sound clips and stuff
i mean from yodas hut you could use some clips from there

It's not just the sound though, it's the vision too and it has to flow as a story and not feel forced, there might be some trimmings here and there but they would have to match up with all the other elements.

But if you can figure out a way to get it to work I would genuinely love to see it (as would a lot of people).

If you have the means try a rough cut of it yourself and the idea has legs there are people on here who would help you take it further.

Sometimes less is more, sometimes less is less, sometimes more is more.

The trick is to start out with more than you need and trim down until the story feels right.

So if someone can come up with a watchable approximation of an erstwhile lost scene I'm interested because that adds more options, it's not like Lucasfilm is going to open up the vaults and allow every element of these films out so we can work on them.

That's not the same thing as putting up lots of expositional dialogue and calling it story.

Some of the greatest pieces of cinema storytelling have had hardly any (if any, in the case of the silent era) dialogue.

It's also not the same as sticking every idea that pops into your head on screen just because you can.

However some edits (professional or amateur) don't quite work because there just isn't enough of the right material to fill in the gaps left when you take away the wrong material.

RoccondilRinon said:

I like the idea, but I have to say I prefer your earlier work on it, specifically http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KLPe_e0ZJA — the quicker edits and shorter flashbacks are much more effective.

Thanks.  I have to point out though that versions 1 and 2 didn't have clean cuts for every shot since they were both made entirely in Windows Movie Maker.  Versions 3 and 4 were made in Adobe Premier Pro.

BarBar Jinkx said:

G E Predator said:

An idea I'd like to offer for ROTJ:R is Vader having flashbacks during his duel with Luke, just like here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RulmOAeJ4c

No No NO  NO

 

HORRIBLE idea 

the one thing I HATED about RotS was the damn dream sequences' 

they were completely out off sync with the rest of the series, & would be one of the first things to go if I had the ability to do an edit.

Hey, I don't bash all over your ideas.  It was just a suggestion.  And those weren't dream sequences in my edit, those were flash backs.

ChainsawAsh said:

I'm with BarBar - this is an absolutely awful idea.  It really bashes the audience over the head in a very inappropriate way.

But it is a good excuse to loose the prequels if that is something you would like to hear.

G E Predator said:

But it is a good excuse to loose the prequels

Not really.  It worked fine in 1983 without prequels or flashbacks.  The best way to lose the prequels is to simply pretend they never happened, like I usually do.  Which would be infinitely harder if PT flashbacks were added to the OT.

On the other hand, I'm all for a "Godfather II"-style edit of the OT, incorporating the good/relevant bits of the PT as flashbacks.  It would, in all likelihood, never replace the original OT as standard viewing for me, but it would be a very intriguing alternative look at the saga.  To this end, I'm very intrigued by Asteroid-Man's "Renascent" edits.

ChainsawAsh said:On the other hand, I'm all for a "Godfather II"-style edit of the OT, incorporating the good/relevant bits of the PT as flashbacks.  It would, in all likelihood, never replace the original OT as standard viewing for me, but it would be a very intriguing alternative look at the saga.  To this end, I'm very intrigued by Asteroid-Man's "Renascent" edits.

That's exactly why I made "Vader's Redemption."  As an alternative look at the saga as well as an experiment in film editing.  I perfer ROTJ just the way it is too.  I just assumed that by the title of this forum, "ESB and ROTJ Wishlist," we would all be allowed to express what we would put in if we were making fan edits.

Dude, don't be so offended at people disagreeing with your suggestions.  Yeah, this thread is certainly for ideas for fan edits, but if you can't take some criticism about them, then don't post them here.  It's not that you're not "allowed" to do something.  Calm down.

And the way you presented the idea made it seem like you wanted to do this just for the ending of ROTJ, not for the whole thing.  I'm not saying your edit is bad by any means - I'm just saying that it wouldn't work in that context.

ChainsawAsh said:

Dude, don't be so offended at people disagreeing with your suggestions.  Yeah, this thread is certainly for ideas for fan edits, but if you can't take some criticism about them, then don't post them here.  It's not that you're not "allowed" to do something.  Calm down.

And the way you presented the idea made it seem like you wanted to do this just for the ending of ROTJ, not for the whole thing.  I'm not saying your edit is bad by any means - I'm just saying that it wouldn't work in that context.

Dude, I'm not offended.  Everyone has different opinions, and they have the rights to their opinions.  And I can more than handle criticism.

Again, I say, "it was just an experiment in editing."

G E Predator said:

ChainsawAsh said:On the other hand, I'm all for a "Godfather II"-style edit of the OT, incorporating the good/relevant bits of the PT as flashbacks.  It would, in all likelihood, never replace the original OT as standard viewing for me, but it would be a very intriguing alternative look at the saga.  To this end, I'm very intrigued by Asteroid-Man's "Renascent" edits.

That's exactly why I made "Vader's Redemption."  As an alternative look at the saga as well as an experiment in film editing.  I perfer ROTJ just the way it is too.  I just assumed that by the title of this forum, "ESB and ROTJ Wishlist," we would all be allowed to express what we would put in if we were making fan edits.

I saw that edit and I think it works in context of viewing the films as a saga. Perfect for a "saga edition". But I wouldn't want to watch it that way all the time. Some times it's nice to just sit back and watch the OT and Luke's adventure. None of this "The story of Star Wars is the tragedy of Darth Vader".

But your edit was good and would work in a larger context.

It's akin to adding the Jappor snippet necklace Anakin made for Padme into the end of ROTJ.

On it's own it's a "WTF?" moment, but intergrated into a "saga edit", it would work.

shanerjedi said:

G E Predator said:

ChainsawAsh said:On the other hand, I'm all for a "Godfather II"-style edit of the OT, incorporating the good/relevant bits of the PT as flashbacks.  It would, in all likelihood, never replace the original OT as standard viewing for me, but it would be a very intriguing alternative look at the saga.  To this end, I'm very intrigued by Asteroid-Man's "Renascent" edits.

That's exactly why I made "Vader's Redemption."  As an alternative look at the saga as well as an experiment in film editing.  I perfer ROTJ just the way it is too.  I just assumed that by the title of this forum, "ESB and ROTJ Wishlist," we would all be allowed to express what we would put in if we were making fan edits.

 

I saw that edit and I think it works in context of viewing the films as a saga. Perfect for a "saga edition". But I wouldn't want to watch it that way all the time. Some times it's nice to just sit back and watch the OT, back when it was Luke's adventure. Before the dark times. Beofre "The story of Star Wars is the tragedy of Darth Vader".

Likewise.  OT is perfect as is, and it's really cool to meet another Luke Skywalker fan.

I edited my comment above and added in another reference.