What Do YOU Think Star Wars Should Do Next? — Page 10

I do understand it emotionally. I don’t exactly enjoy watching the heroes I grew up with fail either, and that’s actually part of why I think continuing the story at all was probably a mistake on some level. Financially, obviously Disney was never going to leave Star Wars alone, but narratively I’m not convinced there really needed to be an Episode VII.

But once you decide to continue the story, I do expect it to challenge me emotionally. That’s something I want from movies in general, but especially from a story as character driven as Star Wars.

And that’s where I struggle with the idea that the old characters should basically be protected from serious failure or painful change. If Luke has to remain the great Jedi Master we imagined, Han and Leia have to remain happily married, and their accomplishments after ROTJ have to stay mostly intact, then at some point I start wondering what the dramatic purpose of bringing them back actually is.

I completely understand wanting that version of these characters. On an emotional level, part of me wants it too. But as storytelling, I have a hard time justifying treating them with kid gloves simply because we love them.

That doesn’t mean I think the sequels handled their failures well, very often they didn’t. But for me, “they shouldn’t have failed” and “their failures should have been written better” are two very different criticisms.

And this is also part of my problem with that idea: I’ve read some version of it a thousand times already. So many fanfics start with “Luke is now the wise Jedi Master training our new protagonist.”

Where is the drama in that? Where is the conflict? Sorry, but to me that is just boring.

And the bigger problem is that it immediately overshadows the new characters. If Luke is the powerful, experienced Jedi Master who understands the situation, drives the plot and ultimately deals with the real threat, then what exactly are the new protagonists there for?

At that point they aren’t really protagonists anymore. They’re supporting characters in another Luke Skywalker story.

That’s basically the same problem I have with the Mandalorian season 2 finale. Luke Skywalker suddenly appears out of nowhere and saves everyone. For the audience, obviously Luke is incredibly important. But from the perspective of The Mandalorian’s own story, he is basically a stranger who arrives at the end and solves the problem.

The emotional weight of that scene comes almost entirely from the audience recognizing Luke Skywalker, not from anything the story itself has built between him and these characters.

And that’s where it starts feeling less like a fully self-contained story to me and more like fanfiction: the legacy character is important because we already know he is important.

If your new story needs Luke Skywalker to walk in and make everything matter, then I’m not sure you actually created new protagonists in the first place.

I agree. The frustrating thing about the sequels is I actually like a lot of the story threads in theory, just not in execution. Luke being disconnected from the Force after failing to stave off a rising dark side threat is an interesting idea. Han and Leia’s kid turning dark is an interesting idea. Making your central protagonist a character who isn’t connected to the main lineages in saga (until TROS) is a brilliant idea and goes right to the central ethos of what this story is about. The problem is they weren’t interested in these stories beyond a surface-level gesture to the franchise’s history, and they were far too cautious (though some disagree obviously) with how they treated the OT cast. All the characters, aside from Luke )but even he I feel like isn’t as far from his old self as people say), end up being exactly where they were 30 years ago.

As for the conflict part, I’m not saying the next part of the trilogy can’t or shouldn’t have conflict and space battles. But I don’t need to see X-Wings vs. TIE Fighters piloted by Stormtroopers/Rebels v. Empire reheated for a Episode X. Maybe its another upstart faction within the NewNew Republic, maybe its smugglers or the Hutts or some other faction with a grip on a corner of the galaxy they’re trying to break. At this point, I’d rather they take a big creative swing that they really invest in and have it be bad than go back to the Anakin/Luke/Sidious well.

imezs95 said:

I do understand it emotionally. I don’t exactly enjoy watching the heroes I grew up with fail either, and that’s actually part of why I think continuing the story at all was probably a mistake on some level. Financially, obviously Disney was never going to leave Star Wars alone, but narratively I’m not convinced there really needed to be an Episode VII.

But once you decide to continue the story, I do expect it to challenge me emotionally. That’s something I want from movies in general, but especially from a story as character driven as Star Wars.

And that’s where I struggle with the idea that the old characters should basically be protected from serious failure or painful change. If Luke has to remain the great Jedi Master we imagined, Han and Leia have to remain happily married, and their accomplishments after ROTJ have to stay mostly intact, then at some point I start wondering what the dramatic purpose of bringing them back actually is.

I completely understand wanting that version of these characters. On an emotional level, part of me wants it too. But as storytelling, I have a hard time justifying treating them with kid gloves simply because we love them.

That doesn’t mean I think the sequels handled their failures well, very often they didn’t. But for me, “they shouldn’t have failed” and “their failures should have been written better” are two very different criticisms.

I didn’t say they should be protected from serious failure or painful change. But saying that that necessarily means the ONLY way to do that is to make Luke stop being a Jedi, and break up Han and Leia, is just a failure of imagination.

The stakes can (and should) come from the next generation of characters. There’s nothing inherently wrong with a Kylo Ren kind of story, but the way it was handled was poor. It would be more impactful if we could actually see him turn to the dark side, instead of the story beginning after it already happened. Massacring the Jedi again isn’t a plus to the story because it’s a radical change, because it’s not actually a change, it’s a regression to the status quo and what everyone already just watched in Revenge of the Sith. The Empire returning isn’t a radical change either, it’s a regression to the status quo of the original trilogy. By all means, wreck the New Republic, just do it in a compelling and creative way.

Imagine how much more emotionally compelling it would be if we got to know one or two Jedi characters really well, then had Kylo Ren betray them (or something else really bad happen to them), rather than being told in flashback that like 20-30 people we don’t know got killed.

Of course you’re absolutely right there didn’t have to be an episode 7 and it’s all kind of a big waste. But it’s fun to speculate what could have happened instead.

Yeah, I agree. I’ve had a few different versions in my head too of what I think could have worked better than what we got.

And honestly, even the versions I personally would have preferred probably would have ended up being just as divisive among Star Wars fans. That might just be unavoidable with this franchise.

Personally, I like ending the story with Return of the Jedi, because it’s such a satisfying conclusion that I don’t think any continuation could ever truly live up to it, not even the EU. However, if I wanted to continue the story after Return of the Jedi, I think the best way to do it would be to create a new six-film saga rather than another trilogy. A Sequel hexalogy would give the story much more room to breathe and allow the new conflict to develop more gradually.

I don’t have anything against the idea of one of Luke’s students falling to the Dark Side and bringing the New Jedi Order to the brink of extinction, as long as the Jedi aren’t completely wiped out and, most importantly, the student who falls isn’t another member of the Skywalker family. There shouldn’t be any more Skywalkers falling to the Dark Side. Anakin’s fall was already tragic enough, and I don’t think the Skywalker family needs another tragedy of that kind. Also, after everything they went through because of Anakin’s fall, I think Luke and Leia would do everything they could to make sure their own children stayed on the right path.

So if one of Luke’s students has to fall to the Dark Side, I’d much rather it be an original character. The main protagonists could then be the children of the original cast.

I also don’t have anything against the idea of Luke going into exile and distancing himself from everyone for a while. What I don’t like is the idea of him doing it because he feels guilty about one of his students falling to the Dark Side. I think it would be much more in character for Luke to voluntarily withdraw from the galaxy so that he can meditate, reconnect with the Force, reflect on his mistakes and search for answers. Then, once he has found those answers and the right moment comes, he would return to the fight.

So, I’m not necessarily opposed to bringing the galaxy back to a status quo that resembles the one from the Original Trilogy. I just think you would need to actually earn that status quo. You could have the first trilogy show how the galaxy gradually falls back into a situation resembling the one from the Original Trilogy, and then use the second trilogy to show how the characters finally manage to get out of that situation. That would give the Sequels a much stronger sense of progression, which is something you can’t have if you begin the story after the tragedy has already happened.

And even then, I don’t think the New Republic should be completely destroyed. It could be reduced to a small handful of worlds and severely weakened, but I don’t think it should be wiped off the map entirely. The same goes for the New Jedi Order. It can be devastated and reduced to a small number of surviving Jedi, but there should still be something left to rebuild. That way, the Sequel saga could explore both the collapse and eventual restoration of these institutions without completely undoing everything that the Original Trilogy accomplished.

But we had a film called Return of the Jedi. and the Jedi didn’t return in the Disney trilogy. What are they going to call the Rey Movie, The Return of the Return of the Jedi.

I think they are leveraging nostalgia for the prequels and the Filoni Clone Wars cartoon.

I not sure I want similar done for the OT. I’m over the deepfakes. I would probably give recast actors a watch, like the Alden Solo movie. But they are so set in their ways of wanting these cgi de-aging and deepfakes.

And Star Wars is stuck in the nostalgia and not moving forward. Is there somewhere to move foreward to in terms of story, post Rise of Skywalker?

Since the OT era is clearly over. Actors have aged out, others have died. The Gen X fans grip on the franchise isn’t forever.

it would depend on the story, the characters. though to be sure I have no faith whatsoever in Kinberg as a writer or director. or producer.

Jon Watts directing is different obviously. And is Oscar Isaac, Daisy Ridley or John Boyega back? much would have to fall into place. Like can they get Tony Daniels to reprise C-3PO. I think he is done?

I also don’t see Johnny signing on to do a whole trilogy as composer at his age.

For it to be Star Wars it has to have some Star Wars in it. If it doesn’t have the Droids or Chewie or the Millennium falcon etc. etc.

Luke Skywalker’s ghost. Maybe Adam Driver as Ben’s ghost. or even the ghost of Anakin played by Hayden.

Of course they’ll be another new Sith and another super weapon because we can’t not have conflict.