Info: Theatrical AOTC Discussion Thread — Page 3

The 4K02 35mm preservation project is started now (in the other forums) with print in hand and all stuff set to go when ready. So far it has a bit under 50% funding covered to get the scan and storage done and covered.

The Aluminum Falcon said:

IIRC, Roger Ebert hinted at the time that the 35mm prints may have been deliberately struck poorly, with low brightness, density, and saturation, in order to push the thought that digital, which was then poor resolution, was ready as a theatrical format.

The funny thing is I saw amazingly rich looking 35mm prints of AOTC and when I saw it in digital it was uglier and flat and bland (maybe that theater had the digital set up poorly). When I saw TPM digitally it looked good though, really popping at both theaters (one of each projector type).

And the 35mm print of AOTC I see now has reallllly rich colors, super vibrant and saturated and really rich, deep blacks. If you read Lucasfilm stuff they were also bragging about how they had a better process for producing release prints with less film stages.

towne32 said:

Some, like this guy on movie-censorship, say the DVD was produced from the digital theatrical master. I’d really like to find more information written before the DVD was released, though, to be certain. Padme’s awful “Yes” line had to have been a later fix, after reviewers mocked it, right? If nothing else, there would have been people arguing and defending the film as they did not witness it with “yes”.

Here is something weird:

Thanks to user Phase3 for spotting a weird teal rectangle going across part of the top upper left of a transition between scenes at around the 28m mark I was then able to find the 35mm frame and note that the weird rectangle was NOT there in the original 35mm theatrical release.

This weird teal rectangle has been on all versions of AOTC going back to the UK and german HDTV broadcasts that we have caps of as well as the initial DVD (and thus very likely initial VHS) release and it has been on all releases since, all the blu-rays and the new UHD and D+. But it is not on the 35mm. It would be easy to imagine the other way around. Some IN used for a print had something dropped across the scanner a bit for a few frames and so any print from that has the blob and then everything from other IN and the digital master does not. But in this case it is like more the opposite.

So potential proof of muddling around with things post theatrical. Almost looks like teal power windows brush hah. I wonder what the story with it is.

It is not the most momentous difference ever hah! And certainly not really the sort of ‘change’ you’d expect at all, looks more like a weird mistake of some sort that apparently got backed in super early post-theatrical (perhaps even for the digital theatrical?) and has been there for at least the whole HDTV through UHD release.

Also, assuming it was not there in the digital theatrical then it also proves that the UHD was also sourced from the same modified for home versions as all the rest and not a going back to an original digital master or anything (again, assuming it was not there in the digital theatrical and I doubt anyone would possibly remember that or have even noticed it if it was there).

And with the UHD also seeming to lack some of the wide gamut insane teals/greenblues found on the 35mm and the odd trace teal blue “A long time ago…” intro text even though UHD CAN show those colors it seems like the early home revisions might have accidentally (?) been done in REC709 and then they were stuck with that gamut unless they were to go back and re-do all the little changes for home??

Here is a snap that Phse3 made of one of the home versions:

And here is the original 35mm:

So what the what is this weird blue blob??:

As someone else pointed out elsewhere, of course this sort of thing is common enough with normal productions. There are often more than one IN and IP and thus different chain paths can make different prints have different mistakes/defects/etc.

But here we had an initial digital master and we have a “clean” 35mm and a “dirty” digital set of releases.

Anyway, it seems that for AOTC they digitally printed out an original negative (ON) straight from a digital master (I guess pre-color timed to how it and the print stock would react?) and then struck the release prints from that. So release prints for AOTC went through less stages than normal no OCN->IP->IN->RP. Just digital master->ON->RP. Maybe they made more than one of these direct 1st gen digitally printed ON to produce release prints from. Whatever, that doesn’t matter since the print in question doesn’t have the weird thing.

But what did they produce the DVD/HDTV/blu-ray/UHD from? If they just directly used the initial digital master and that had no blue blob then how the heck did it get into the chain? But maybe they did not do that? Did they really go and print out a new ON and then scan it back in and then use that scan as the final true digital master? If so, I guess a blue thingy could’ve fallen in the way for a few frames when they printed out the ON for the digital theatrical release (which would’ve been produced almost two weeks later than the one(s) for the 35mm prints). And maybe the way it was printed made the ONs have virtually no grain so it wouldn’t show up much at all in the digital releases after it had been scanned back in? But do you really think they would have bothered to go digital master->directly digitally printed ON->final digital master produced from scanning back in the ON rather than just go digital master directly? If they wanted it a touch more filmic why then DNR all the home releases up? Why have the grain basically not noticeable I think even in the digital theatrical version? So what would have been the point of going DM->ON->TDM? Maybe to give the digital theatrical a more print film set of colors and contrast? Then why seem to go to a more digital set of colors and contrast for the digital home releases?

One thought is that they maybe wanted to give the digital theatrical a slight filmic touch and digitally printed out an ON for the digital version and then some blue thingy fell into the scanner for a few frames and then they scanned this ON back in to make the new final digital master and that is what the digital theatrical and all home versions are based on. The digital release of AOTC theatrically was cut so short they had like zero time to redo anything so even if they did see a blue thing fall onto a few frames they would have had no time to reprint and scan a new ON.

But since the home ones at least don’t seem to have filmic contrast or colors and they did some DNR why would they have bothered doing the above instead of straight. Also, since the digital theatrical was such a close call for timing would they have even had any time to slowly print out a digital negative and then scan it back in?? Wouldn’t they just go straight from digital master? In which case we are back to no explanation again.

Does anyone happen to know off-hand which DTS trailer(s) would have been the ones played before DTS showings of AOTC?

EDIT: actually the DTS disc for it should give it away so long as the names are not too short and cryptic

MonkeyLizard10 said:

Does anyone happen to know off-hand which DTS trailer(s) would have been the ones played before DTS showings of AOTC?

EDIT: actually the DTS disc for it should give it away so long as the names are not too short and cryptic

Like Mike and that first teaser for the Matrix sequels are two that I still remember from my opening day screening.

Total guess as to what else would be on the dts disc.

Minority Report, The Bourne Identity, and Men in Black II are other possibilities.

Fang Zei said:

MonkeyLizard10 said:

Does anyone happen to know off-hand which DTS trailer(s) would have been the ones played before DTS showings of AOTC?

EDIT: actually the DTS disc for it should give it away so long as the names are not too short and cryptic

Like Mike and that first teaser for the Matrix sequels are two that I still remember from my opening day screening.

Total guess as to what else would be on the dts disc.

Minority Report, The Bourne Identity, and Men in Black II are other possibilities.

According to the DTS disc, for DTS theaters, either the regular DTS trailer or the DTS SONIC trailer were used.

For THX it seems that many seem to think that the first theatrical (as opposed to home video) premiere of the relatively new 2001 THX Cavalcade trailer was with Attack Of The Clones.

Yeah Like Mike trailer ‘A’ is for sure that was supposed to always run as well as the built into the first reel Minrority Report trailer ‘C’. They are the two with audio on the AOTC Cinema DTS feature disc.

I was a little unsure about The Matrix Revolutions since it didn’t come out for over a year later and if it was true figured it must have been the teaser so it is cool that you confirm that you saw The Matrix Revolutions teaser.

Apparently some say the film was supposed to only run with 4 trailer max limit opening week, although it is unclear if that meant max 4 in addition to the built-in Minority Report or max in addition to that plus Like Mike so whether it was supposed to be 4 or 5 or 6 total. Most seem to think probably the limit meant max 6 total but maybe 5 total and few think it meant 4 total.

Apparently Star Trek Nemesis, Men In Black II, Die Another Day, Austin Powers Goldmember were other options.

Probably it was Minority Report ‘C’ + Like Mike ‘A’ and then some mix of 4 of: Star Trek Nemesis, Men In Black II, Die Another Day, Austin Powers Goldmember, The Matrix Reloaded teaser. There also seems to have been a Star Trek Nemesis w/Men In Black II combo trailer not sure if that was supposed to count as one or two, maybe ones that showed that then also shows The Matrix Reloaded teaser or something?

MonkeyLizard10 said:

Fang Zei said:

MonkeyLizard10 said:

Does anyone happen to know off-hand which DTS trailer(s) would have been the ones played before DTS showings of AOTC?

EDIT: actually the DTS disc for it should give it away so long as the names are not too short and cryptic

Like Mike and that first teaser for the Matrix sequels are two that I still remember from my opening day screening.

Total guess as to what else would be on the dts disc.

Minority Report, The Bourne Identity, and Men in Black II are other possibilities.

According to the DTS disc, for DTS theaters, either the regular DTS trailer or the DTS SONIC trailer were used.

For THX it seems that many seem to think that the first theatrical (as opposed to home video) premiere of the relatively new 2001 THX Cavalcade trailer was with Attack Of The Clones.

Yeah Like Mike trailer ‘A’ is for sure that was supposed to always run as well as the built into the first reel Minrority Report trailer ‘C’. They are the two with audio on the AOTC Cinema DTS feature disc.

I was a little unsure about The Matrix Revolutions since it didn’t come out for over a year later and if it was true figured it must have been the teaser so it is cool that you confirm that you saw The Matrix Revolutions teaser.

Apparently some say the film was supposed to only run with 4 trailer max limit opening week, although it is unclear if that meant max 4 in addition to the built-in Minority Report or max in addition to that plus Like Mike so whether it was supposed to be 4 or 5 or 6 total. Most seem to think probably the limit meant max 6 total but maybe 5 total and few think it meant 4 total.

Apparently Star Trek Nemesis, Men In Black II, Die Another Day, Austin Powers Goldmember were other options.

Probably it was Minority Report ‘C’ + Like Mike ‘A’ and then some mix of 4 of: Star Trek Nemesis, Men In Black II, Die Another Day, Austin Powers Goldmember, The Matrix Reloaded teaser. There also seems to have been a Star Trek Nemesis w/Men In Black II combo trailer not sure if that was supposed to count as one or two, maybe ones that showed that then also shows The Matrix Reloaded teaser or something?

To clarify, the very first teaser for the Matrix sequels went out to theaters with AotC. I still have a vague memory almost twenty-two years later of watching it in quicktime as soon as it went up online the night before. It was for both sequels, but only contained footage from Reloaded since they were probably still in the middle of filming Revolutions and didn’t want to give away too much about where the story was going anyway.

Thanks!

towne32 said:

Some, like this guy on movie-censorship, say the DVD was produced from the digital theatrical master. I’d really like to find more information written before the DVD was released, though, to be certain. Padme’s awful “Yes” line had to have been a later fix, after reviewers mocked it, right? If nothing else, there would have been people arguing and defending the film as they did not witness it with “yes”.

Can you give more context for the “yes” line? I’m not finding any references to this anywhere in my searches.
EDIT:
Right after posting, I ended up finding the answer to my own question.

After Padmé falls out of the Republic gunship, a Clone Trooper asks her if she is all right. Her original, energetic response of “Yes!” (which actually elicited laughter in some screenings) was changed to a more realistic and groggy “Uh-huh.” for the DVD.